Author Topic: how about to raise block reward?  (Read 37324 times)

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Offline ripplexiaoshan

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I agree that the wage of witness now is too low, but I suggest that the income should be adjusted automatically according to the current network load, say"work more, get more".
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Offline bitcrab

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I tend to disagree to increase witness pay, on the opposite, perhaps it's better to decrease it. Witnesses are investing into the system, they're not pure employees.

In many cases higher wage doesn't bring higher performance.

We need a HR department to review every employee's performance, including witnesses' and workers' and perhaps committee members', say, give them a basic wage, then a bonus depending on their performance.

An HR department type setup is something I have been encouraging for a while. Put the hiring, firing, management of the workers in their hands so that real measures can be done, and greater accountability.

I think the pay pressure is going to increase the need for accountability.. I think there will be less tolerance for 'lazy witnesses' after this while at the same time heating up the competition. If the objective is to get new blood, better feed data, and make being a witness something that people are striving to be best at because there is a clear reward for it, then this will help accomplish that. I think the change in the rate is going to change the culture significantly.

I worry that introducing HR may introduce some other issues, this is a DAC, there are high infomaiton asymmetry and no solid company rules, so there is unignorable risk for collusion.

raising block reward may also lead to some interesting results other than better witness service.  in my imagination,  witness will mean competence+reputation+responsibility+profit, however, people need to compete for a witness position. and shareholders can fire the witness at any time if they judge he does not deserve, this machanism can work together with worker proposal as ways to encourage contributors.
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Offline BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode

I tend to disagree to increase witness pay, on the opposite, perhaps it's better to decrease it. Witnesses are investing into the system, they're not pure employees.

In many cases higher wage doesn't bring higher performance.

We need a HR department to review every employee's performance, including witnesses' and workers' and perhaps committee members', say, give them a basic wage, then a bonus depending on their performance.

An HR department type setup is something I have been encouraging for a while. Put the hiring, firing, management of the workers in their hands so that real measures can be done, and greater accountability.

I think the pay pressure is going to increase the need for accountability.. I think there will be less tolerance for 'lazy witnesses' after this while at the same time heating up the competition. If the objective is to get new blood, better feed data, and make being a witness something that people are striving to be best at because there is a clear reward for it, then this will help accomplish that. I think the change in the rate is going to change the culture significantly.
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Offline abit

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By the way, currently total budget is about 350K BTS per day, or say 12 BTS per block. Giving more to witnesses means less budget for workers, because witness pay has higher priority.
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Offline abit

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I tend to disagree to increase witness pay, on the opposite, perhaps it's better to decrease it. Witnesses are investing into the system, they're not pure employees.

In many cases higher wage doesn't bring higher performance.

We need a HR department to review every employee's performance, including witnesses' and workers' and perhaps committee members', say, give them a basic wage, then a bonus depending on their performance.
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BitShares witness: in.abit

Offline bitcrab

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I vote for steem like witness payouts to attract steem witnesses.

For several months they have developed a very strong witness following. Very few have ventured into bitshares in some part due to the lack of incentives to do so. Many witneses there are skilled developers and have contributed significant apps to the steem in order to win their approval.

I believe if rewards were high we would see the likes of @arhag come back.. and other new witnesses in steem who could take some of what they have done with steem and reapply it to bitshares.

I am quite confident this could be a significant turnaround.. it does however require more communication from the Chinese. If it is an uphill battle to gain votes from the chinese proxies who control the majority of voting power then they could be turned off.

Aside from attracting new blood, this provides considerable funds to consider incorporating paid price feed data from various sources. So with this I also think it raises the bar for witnesses in bitshares to improve on what they provide. This was what I talked about recently when there was discussion surrounding the feed data.

Raise the standards for bitshares, we raise the quality and increase our value prop.

So with that, as a Committee member, at present I am supporting a raise of 8BTS per /block payout for these reasons given primarily. If you wish to also support these types of reasons, then set your vote for Committee member to Bunkerchainlabs-com.

If the increase is only a doubling or a half measure, I don't believe we will see any significant changes at all. You can't catch your breath only making half effort from being underwater. We either go all the way to effect results or not get above the water at all.

This is my current thinking on the matter. I am open to listening to others take on this and to be swayed otherwise to be shown some other amount being able to breath air into bitshares.

interesting, DPOS means the one that contribute more will be more easily voted, this will effectively encourage contribution.
I like the word "Raise the standards for bitshares, we raise the quality and increase our value prop."
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Offline BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode

I vote for steem like witness payouts to attract steem witnesses.

For several months they have developed a very strong witness following. Very few have ventured into bitshares in some part due to the lack of incentives to do so. Many witneses there are skilled developers and have contributed significant apps to the steem in order to win their approval.

I believe if rewards were high we would see the likes of @arhag come back.. and other new witnesses in steem who could take some of what they have done with steem and reapply it to bitshares.

I am quite confident this could be a significant turnaround.. it does however require more communication from the Chinese. If it is an uphill battle to gain votes from the chinese proxies who control the majority of voting power then they could be turned off.

Aside from attracting new blood, this provides considerable funds to consider incorporating paid price feed data from various sources. So with this I also think it raises the bar for witnesses in bitshares to improve on what they provide. This was what I talked about recently when there was discussion surrounding the feed data.

Raise the standards for bitshares, we raise the quality and increase our value prop.

So with that, as a Committee member, at present I am supporting a raise of 8BTS per /block payout for these reasons given primarily. If you wish to also support these types of reasons, then set your vote for Committee member to Bunkerchainlabs-com.

If the increase is only a doubling or a half measure, I don't believe we will see any significant changes at all. You can't catch your breath only making half effort from being underwater. We either go all the way to effect results or not get above the water at all.

This is my current thinking on the matter. I am open to listening to others take on this and to be swayed otherwise to be shown some other amount being able to breath air into bitshares.
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Offline JonnyB

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I agree.

Accurate price feeds are essential to bitshares and witnesses are not paid enough. Double it to at least 3bts per block
I run the @bitshares twitter handle
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Offline bitcrab

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with the growing of the ecosystem, the community begin to demand more on witnesses.

one thing is price feeding, while the DEX trading volume keep on growing, the price feeding become more important than before, shorters need witnesses to provide high quality price feeding service to avoid man made margin call or force settlement transactions.

and to keep the growing network healthy, there are also requirements for witness to imporve hardware.

however, as @rnglab has summarized at https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,23607.msg301580.html#msg301580, comparing to the demand to witnesses, witnesses is at a very low profit and do not have enough incentive to upgrade their service, we even can see some witnesses have forgotten their witness nodes.

these are reluctant, a blockchain platform should depend not only on the enthusiasm of volunteers, but also on some business model that can guarntee the basic service to continue, and to attract new comers, we do not like the energy wasting mining of Bitcoin, but at the business model side it is effective to keep the ecosystem growing, we can learn something from the mining model of Bitcoin. 

so now I propose to raise the block reward, currently the reward is 1.5BTS/block, now three options are given: 3BTS/block, 5BTS/block, 8BTS/block. each correspond to an annual dilution ratio of 1.22%, 2.04%, 3.22%, completely acceptable.

what we can forcast is, after the block reward rise, witnesses will more positively upgrade their hardware and service, more new comers will join the witnesses group and we will have a bigger node pool to choose the best witnesses. and I believe some interesting thing will happen.

I have proposed this in China community, up to now the response is mainly positive. now I propose here, hope everyone can express your opinion on this, I believe we now need to seriously consider and evaluate this proposal.

please also consider that the system has daily budget (witness+worker), today the budget is 349297 BTS, which means 12 BTS/block if they are totally paid to witnesses, and the daily budget is dynamic and shrinking if I am correct.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2017, 03:29:55 pm by bitcrab »
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