Author Topic: conditional payment feature?  (Read 3464 times)

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Offline xeroc

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2018, 04:01:17 pm »
IMHO, an escrow feature only makes sense if you allow other "conditions" to withdraw from an escrow balance.
Pretty much like what is needed for atomic cross chain swaps, where you have to provide a "secret" to claim funds.
That secret could be a signature, or could be a password, or, if you want, a mathematical condition that needs to be met (think, POW)
I'd like to have this feature to be compatible with the needs for interledger.org. That would enable quite some usecaes if you ask me.

Anyone up for creating the specs for it?
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Offline abit

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #16 on: February 26, 2018, 12:31:57 pm »
IMHO, an escrow feature only makes sense if you allow other "conditions" to withdraw from an escrow balance.
Pretty much like what is needed for atomic cross chain swaps, where you have to provide a "secret" to claim funds.
That secret could be a signature, or could be a password, or, if you want, a mathematical condition that needs to be met (think, POW)
I'd like to have this feature to be compatible with the needs for interledger.org. That would enable quite some usecaes if you ask me.

Anyone up for creating the specs for it?
I don't think that secrets need to be submitted online, that would greatly limit usage of the feature.

Just had another glance on InterLedger, I think it's for solve other issues, but not this one.
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Offline CoinHoarder

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2018, 05:07:28 pm »
Bitbay and OpenBazaar have both implemented marketplace features. It is worth taking a look at their implementations.

Seems pretty straightforward... leverage reputation-based escrow agents with simple 2 of 3 multisig addresses.

I think if you're adding this feature, then you might as well implement a full-on decentralized market for goods, services, or cryptos/fiat.

It will require a minimal amount of extra effort to make a fully featured decentralized marketplace (compared to just adding a marketplace for crypto/fiat transactions).

« Last Edit: February 26, 2018, 11:02:16 pm by CoinHoarder »
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Offline xeroc

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2018, 08:43:43 am »
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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #19 on: February 27, 2018, 09:15:35 am »
Maybe off-topic, but I think we should have some principles when discussing.

My principle:
* if an important "partner" business strongly wants a practicable feature, it gets highest priority.
* If more partners want it, it get more priority.
* requests from "potential partners" get lower priority.

Our dev resource is not unlimited, must focus on most important things.
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Offline xeroc

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #20 on: February 27, 2018, 10:53:26 am »
Considering that we want to grow the network, have limited human resources but have a governance system for funds,
how about we setup some bounties to implement features and let the shareholders decide which ones to fund:
* conditional payments (general)
* escrow system (specific)
* dividends feature (existing code)
* atomic cross-chain swaps (existing code)

Of course, we cannot ask the current set of developers to do *all* the work, but we can use the funds at our dispose (worker proposals) to find talent and let them do stuff while earning some money?!
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Offline abit

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #21 on: February 27, 2018, 11:53:46 am »
Considering that we want to grow the network, have limited human resources but have a governance system for funds,
how about we setup some bounties to implement features and let the shareholders decide which ones to fund:
* conditional payments (general)
* escrow system (specific)
* dividends feature (existing code)
* atomic cross-chain swaps (existing code)

Of course, we cannot ask the current set of developers to do *all* the work, but we can use the funds at our dispose (worker proposals) to find talent and let them do stuff while earning some money?!
That's a good idea.
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Offline Bangzi

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #22 on: February 27, 2018, 01:08:40 pm »
Considering that we want to grow the network, have limited human resources but have a governance system for funds,
how about we setup some bounties to implement features and let the shareholders decide which ones to fund:
* conditional payments (general)
* escrow system (specific)
* dividends feature (existing code)
* atomic cross-chain swaps (existing code)

Of course, we cannot ask the current set of developers to do *all* the work, but we can use the funds at our dispose (worker proposals) to find talent and let them do stuff while earning some money?!

Before submit a worker proposal for funding, dev team may try to post task requests on utopian.io, a project based on STEEM blockchain. Dev team may promise those who can deliver will get a big upvote in addition to utopian upvote bot. This will save a lot of time since workers proposals take time to get shareholder approved.
https://steemit.com/utopian-io/@deveerei/tutorial-for-utopian-task-announcements
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Offline blockchained

Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #23 on: February 27, 2018, 02:48:09 pm »
take a look at this project, it is a alfa version of a "localbitshares" that now in test by Russian community
https://www.p2p-bridge.org/

Offline Bangzi

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #24 on: February 27, 2018, 03:32:35 pm »
take a look at this project, it is a alfa version of a "localbitshares" that now in test by Russian community
https://www.p2p-bridge.org/

This is something BTS need it since very long time ago. +5+5
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Offline abit

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #25 on: February 27, 2018, 06:19:38 pm »
take a look at this project, it is a alfa version of a "localbitshares" that now in test by Russian community
https://www.p2p-bridge.org/

Quote
Sellers’ funds are allocated on p2p-bridge in BitShares blockchain only at the moment of making the deal. When the seller confirms receiving fiat, funds are sent to the buyer.
If the deal is cancelled, the funds are sent back to the wallet. Thus we serve as an escrow and guarantee safety of making the deal to both parties.
So.. theoretically, is it possible that the operator of the website disappear with the customers' funds?

The on-chain escrow feature implemented on Steem would prevent that from happening. We're talking about building a similar one in BitShares.
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Offline dexy

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #26 on: March 01, 2018, 03:58:33 am »

Quote
Sellers’ funds are allocated on p2p-bridge in BitShares blockchain only at the moment of making the deal. When the seller confirms receiving fiat, funds are sent to the buyer.
If the deal is cancelled, the funds are sent back to the wallet. Thus we serve as an escrow and guarantee safety of making the deal to both parties.
So.. theoretically, is it possible that the operator of the website disappear with the customers' funds?
... or keys will be lost or stolen. Previously, this happened with such centralized services so many times.

Quote
The on-chain escrow feature implemented on Steem would prevent that from happening. We're talking about building a similar one in BitShares.
This is the most important feature that should be implemented in BitShares, cause this will allow to do cheap, safe and decentralized fiat gates, which is so necessary for the network!

Offline bench

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #27 on: March 03, 2018, 10:26:16 pm »
An escrow system is one of the next important features. It should be designed to handle conditional payment features like Byteballs.

Offline severo

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #28 on: March 05, 2018, 02:33:42 pm »
I have already mentioned it on occasion, but I think the best solution to implement an escrow system is to use the most decentralized system that exists now to buy BTC, P2P way: Bisq. Why invent the wheel, if it already exists?

If Bisq implemented the option to change BTS or BitUSD by FIAT, then the purchase can be moved to the Bitshares DEX and the problem would be solved. There is not much danger that Bisq can remove volume from the DEX of bitshares, since the vast majority of Bisq's trade is exchange of BTC with FIAT, functionality that does not exist in the DEX. The exchange of cryptocurrencies in Bisq is wallet-to-wallet, and of very low volume. I do not think it could interfere with the type of smartcoins trade and low fees of the DEX.

Bisq can now trade with any type of cryptocurrencies, so it seems to me that the best approach for this project would be to contact the Bisq dev and propose a collaboration. Both projects would add synergies and win, so that a p2p-bridge would be available immediately. Precisely Bisq has modified its connections Tor to be able to work in mainland China and it turns out that there Bitshares has a good market. Makes sense.

Offline bench

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Re: conditional payment feature?
« Reply #29 on: March 06, 2018, 02:26:30 am »
Using the infrastructure from Bisq for FIAT exchange could give both projects huge traffic increase.
1. Integrating BTS and BitFIAT in Bisq (use BTS for security deposit and fees) https://github.com/bisq-network/docs/blob/master/exchange/howto/list-token.adoc
2. Writing a bridge to use the Bisq network for FIAT trading

There are already bitshares usere on the Bisq forum: https://bisq.community/t/add-steemusd-support-thread/340/18
« Last Edit: March 06, 2018, 03:39:14 am by bench »