Author Topic: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%  (Read 7388 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline abit

  • Committee member
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3302
    • View Profile
    • Steemit Blog
  • BitShares: abit
  • GitHub: abitmore
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #60 on: November 15, 2017, 12:52:22 pm »
I am curious how witnesses get their feeds... The only centralized exchange trading bts is poloniex and  AEX.
Normally the feed should be according to the weighted volume of each exchange including the internal DEX trading. I hope you do this.

Now that Poloniex has issues with bts withdrawals and deposits I believe feed SHOULD NOT take into account at all the price from Poloniex until the issue is resolved. If you guys take feeds from Polo now then this is extremely dangerous!!!

I can not comment on AEX yet..

Feed should be endogenous and not exogenous now until polo fix its problems and should be based from the internal DEX trading imho..

In regards to this proposal I have not decided if it should have been approved but my initial thought says that force settlement should not have been raised by 5% and instead the feed should have been adjusted accordingly..

Finally, does anyone has an update of what is the status with Polo and when the issue is expected to be resolved?


Not only  aex,but  also  zb.com,it's  former  Chbtc.com.Zb.com  is  leading  all  the market in  BTS  price because it  keeps   RMB   deposit  channel in  a  delicate way.There are  also  some small exchanges like coinegg.com(former jubi.com) and  xbrick.io (former  19800.com) which have a  place to  trade  BTSs.
Thanks.
coinegg seems working and has API, but the trading volume is low right now.
xbrick hasn't started trading?
BTS account: abit
BTS committee member: abit
BTS witness: in.abit

Offline Crypto Kong

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 42
    • View Profile
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #61 on: November 15, 2017, 12:57:20 pm »
Hopefully we can be kept updated here on how this change pans out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Offline pc

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1376
    • View Profile
    • Bitcoin - Perspektive oder Risiko?
  • BitShares: cyrano
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #62 on: November 15, 2017, 04:07:05 pm »
I think our bitCNY problem is caused by people in China moving from CNY into (other) cryptos, using bitCNY and BTS as intermediates. I. e. CNY -> (via magicwallet) -> bitCNY -> (via forced settlement) -> BTS -> BTC (or other cryptos).

That would explain why CNY:bitCNY is trading above the peg, while at the same time BTS:bitCNY is trading below - if there was real demand for bitCNY, people would buy it on the DEX. In reality, people are dumping bitCNY for BTS either on the DEX or via forced settlement.
I think changing the settlement offset will not change this situation - it would only continue on a different level. (It seems the proposal has been accepted by now - we will see if it helps.)

BTS has been in an uptrend during the past couple of days. It is normal that during a BTS uptrend bitassets trade below the peg, because the settlement delay means that the bitasset is actually pegged to the expected price one day in the future.

Some people are arguing that the price feed is off, because the indirect price CNY->bitCNY->BTS doesn't match the feed price. I think that argument is invalid because of the abovementioned dependency between the bitCNY->BTS price as seen on the DEX and the feed price. The feed price must not be calculated as a function of the internal trade price, because that would create a feedback loop, and feedback loops are inherently unstable.​
Please vote for my BitShares witness "cyrano" and for my STEEM witness "cyrano.witness"!
Bitcoin - Perspektive oder Risiko? ISBN 978-3-8442-6568-2 http://bitcoin.quisquis.de

Offline abit

  • Committee member
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3302
    • View Profile
    • Steemit Blog
  • BitShares: abit
  • GitHub: abitmore
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #63 on: November 15, 2017, 04:53:39 pm »
I think our bitCNY problem is caused by people in China moving from CNY into (other) cryptos, using bitCNY and BTS as intermediates. I. e. CNY -> (via magicwallet) -> bitCNY -> (via forced settlement) -> BTS -> BTC (or other cryptos).

That would explain why CNY:bitCNY is trading above the peg, while at the same time BTS:bitCNY is trading below - if there was real demand for bitCNY, people would buy it on the DEX. In reality, people are dumping bitCNY for BTS either on the DEX or via forced settlement.
I think changing the settlement offset will not change this situation - it would only continue on a different level. (It seems the proposal has been accepted by now - we will see if it helps.)

BTS has been in an uptrend during the past couple of days. It is normal that during a BTS uptrend bitassets trade below the peg, because the settlement delay means that the bitasset is actually pegged to the expected price one day in the future.

Some people are arguing that the price feed is off, because the indirect price CNY->bitCNY->BTS doesn't match the feed price. I think that argument is invalid because of the abovementioned dependency between the bitCNY->BTS price as seen on the DEX and the feed price. The feed price must not be calculated as a function of the internal trade price, because that would create a feedback loop, and feedback loops are inherently unstable.​
I've thought of this as a possible factor. That said, some people are using BTS as an indirect fiat ramp. They buy BTS with fiat in the Dex, then dump BTS for BTC or other crypto currencies in other exchanges. Since Poloniex disabled BTS withdrawal, people who bought cheap BTS there can not sell in Dex for a profit, the arbitrage loop now is not closed. That's why there is disparity.
BTS account: abit
BTS committee member: abit
BTS witness: in.abit

Offline yvv

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1181
    • View Profile
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #64 on: November 15, 2017, 05:50:33 pm »
I think our bitCNY problem is caused by people in China moving from CNY into (other) cryptos, using bitCNY and BTS as intermediates. I. e. CNY -> (via magicwallet) -> bitCNY -> (via forced settlement) -> BTS -> BTC (or other cryptos).


Exactly, this is pretty evident. They need market makers to create a flow of money in opposite direction to fix this problem.

binggo

  • Guest
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #65 on: November 15, 2017, 09:39:11 pm »
I think our bitCNY problem is caused by people in China moving from CNY into (other) cryptos, using bitCNY and BTS as intermediates. I. e. CNY -> (via magicwallet) -> bitCNY -> (via forced settlement) -> BTS -> BTC (or other cryptos).


Exactly, this is pretty evident. They need market makers to create a flow of money in opposite direction to fix this problem.

you always avoid to mention the wrong feed price from poloniex, just want the market makers to do something, i dont know why?!
What BTS is?!
ls there anything wrong people moving CNY into other cryptos and use BITCNY and BTS as intermediates?
People chose the market, not the market chose people.
The force settlement make the market to balance, but the wrong feed price make the force settlement to the wrong direction, do you think how much time needed to fix the wrong feed price?! do you have the timeline? one day,one week,one month or one year?
Do you think the malicious force settlement is good for the market?! the wrong feed price not need to be fixed?
or  you think the market wiill fix the problem itself?
Economic liberalism need a fair market, not a malicious market.
When the Satan come, we cant just say "GOD,HELP ME,GOD WILL SAVE US!", we need help ourself.
Do somthing, not just talk.
Maybe 5% is not the best idea, but some problems must fix now, not wait somebody to fix it at a long long long time, or wait the BTS DEX dieing slowly!
« Last Edit: November 16, 2017, 01:49:31 pm by binggo »

Offline fav

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4241
  • No Pain, No Gain
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: fav
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #66 on: November 16, 2017, 04:03:28 pm »


what a strange coincidence, isn't it
► How-to Buy BitShares: https://goo.gl/i9j2YZ

binggo

  • Guest
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #67 on: November 16, 2017, 07:19:02 pm »


what a strange coincidence, isn't it
We want to know who and when to fix the wrong feed price, how to solove the poloniex problem?!
It seems no one care these problems and care other things?! what a strange thing, isn't it? FORUM ADMINISTRATOR?!  Which line do you stand?!

Offline mf-tzo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1734
    • View Profile
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #68 on: November 16, 2017, 09:01:42 pm »
[member=31]fav[/member]  I don't understand why you attack [member=23]bitcrab[/member]... You do realize that the guy has millions of bitshares in collateral and helps creating millions in bitassets right? I mean no matter what is the price of bts he stills holds the collateral even if he gets margin called when the bts was falling..Now he is creating GDEX and you see this as something bad?? Give him a break..

Secondly I would really like to know also what is happening with Polo and even if many people are asking what is happening no one answers.. This is much more important than raising by 5% the bitcny force settlement. If raising the bitcny force settlement doesn't work, we can and will change it back to where it was. If polo delists bts like bittrex did there will be no recovery of the price after that...

Seriously...Can we concentrate on important issues? Where are these bitshares spokespersons now??What are they doing??

Online dirnet

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 53
    • View Profile
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #69 on: November 17, 2017, 01:24:06 am »
Seriously...Can we concentrate on important issues? Where are these bitshares spokespersons now??What are they doing??

Offline rnglab

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 171
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: rnglab
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #70 on: November 17, 2017, 03:41:46 am »
only reasonable solution is asking witnesses to fix their feeds. that's what they get paid for

that was the first step taken as you should know, and the reasons why it was not enough were discussed in depth.

I'll just leave this here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_triviality

Offline xeroc

  • Board Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12636
  • ChainSquad GmbH
    • View Profile
    • ChainSquad GmbH
  • BitShares: xeroc
  • GitHub: xeroc
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #71 on: November 17, 2017, 08:07:58 am »
Seriously...Can we concentrate on important issues? Where are these bitshares spokespersons now??What are they doing??
Read the spokesperson proposal to understand what the spokesperson is there for ...
It will *NOT* make or lead political decisions within the blockchain ... that's up to the shareholders to do
Give BitShares a try! Use the http://testnet.bitshares.eu provided by http://bitshares.eu powered by ChainSquad GmbH

binggo

  • Guest
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #72 on: November 17, 2017, 09:37:46 am »
Seriously...Can we concentrate on important issues? Where are these bitshares spokespersons now??What are they doing??
Read the spokesperson proposal to understand what the spokesperson is there for ...
It will *NOT* make or lead political decisions within the blockchain ... that's up to the shareholders to do

So, for protecting shareholders' interests, who will discuss with Poloniex?! Committee members or someone?

Offline xeroc

  • Board Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12636
  • ChainSquad GmbH
    • View Profile
    • ChainSquad GmbH
  • BitShares: xeroc
  • GitHub: xeroc
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #73 on: November 17, 2017, 11:44:06 am »
So, for protecting shareholders' interests, who will discuss with Poloniex?! Committee members or someone?

The 5% debate: Not going to be discusses by the spokesperson
The Poloniex issue: Going to be descissed by the spokesperson - BBF has reached out to poloniex, but hasn't heard back from them
Give BitShares a try! Use the http://testnet.bitshares.eu provided by http://bitshares.eu powered by ChainSquad GmbH

binggo

  • Guest
Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #74 on: November 17, 2017, 02:34:42 pm »
So, for protecting shareholders' interests, who will discuss with Poloniex?! Committee members or someone?

The 5% debate: Not going to be discusses by the spokesperson
The Poloniex issue: Going to be descissed by the spokesperson - BBF has reached out to poloniex, but hasn't heard back from them

Glad to hear these news.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 02:38:16 pm by binggo »