Author Topic: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD  (Read 892 times)

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Offline armin

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On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« on: September 26, 2018, 12:25:43 pm »
Fiat currencies are constantly depreciating, most prominent being CNY or USD on this exchange. Gold has been used as a store of value for hundreds+ years. It is almost always better to store your fiat in gold than fiat itself, since gold has shown that it doesn't lose its purchasing power.

Famous quote: "Gold will store its value, and you'll always be able to buy more food with your gold."

We need to boost the Bit.GOLD market volume and liquidity, it actually almost never makes sense to store in fiat bitassets (unless gold is in a massive bubble). This is very important for traders who need liquidity in a bear market.

Thoughts?

Offline binggo

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2018, 01:24:23 pm »
First, we need to improve the rule of the bitassets.

Offline armin

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2018, 02:19:00 pm »
whats wrong with them

EDIT: If you're talking about the feed price, we haven't actually had much problems with the new feeding rule. It hasn't changed much. Bitshares is still the same rank on CMC, and we haven't seen a black swan yet. Margin calls are also being eaten
« Last Edit: September 27, 2018, 12:52:33 am by armin »

Offline bench

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2018, 01:25:20 am »
To generate more bitGold somebody needs to borrow bitGold and sell it? There are no margin positions on bitGold or bitSilver now. Who wants to borrow some bitGold or bitSilver, when I can borrow bitFIAT and metal prices are already low?

Offline armin

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2018, 09:06:01 am »
Yes that's what I'm saying, it's a chicken and egg problem. But I'm asking why you would borrow bitFIAT that is depreciating over time when you can borrow bitGOLD (if we assume its liquid)

Offline pc

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2018, 12:21:25 pm »
There are no margin positions on bitGold or bitSilver now.

There are no shorts because both have black-swanned early this year. Interestingly, the markets seem to be ignoring this.
Bitcoin - Perspektive oder Risiko? ISBN 978-3-8442-6568-2 http://bitcoin.quisquis.de

Offline binggo

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2018, 01:25:34 pm »
There are no margin positions on bitGold or bitSilver now.

There are no shorts because both have black-swanned early this year. Interestingly, the markets seem to be ignoring this.

As the market believe that they have full collateral by system, not by the shorts.

Offline Thul3

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #7 on: September 27, 2018, 06:50:59 pm »
Quote
But I'm asking why you would borrow bitFIAT that is depreciating over time when you can borrow bitGOLD


You answered your own question already.
If you borrow something you need to pay it back at some point.
Would you prefer to buy back gold which price high probably will raise as its already low
or would you prefer paying back a bitasset which value has decreased which automaticly means you need to pay back less.

Offline armin

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #8 on: September 27, 2018, 10:54:45 pm »
I said it incorrectly @thul3. I meant we need to increase liquidity on Bit.GOLD so that when people want to be short crypto they can escape to Bit.GOLD. Holding Bit.GOLD is better than bitFIAT since it is not depreciating

Offline armin

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #9 on: September 27, 2018, 10:56:07 pm »
There are no margin positions on bitGold or bitSilver now.

There are no shorts because both have black-swanned early this year. Interestingly, the markets seem to be ignoring this.

can you elaborate on what you mean by "the markets seem to be ignoring this"? is there a more efficient position the market can take on bit.GOLD currently?

Offline bench

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #10 on: September 27, 2018, 11:11:32 pm »
The bitGold and bitSilver are not any longer backed by BTS or no longer need to be backed by BTS because of the black swan?
How was the black swan solved?

The black swan comes when one collateral is under the ratio of one. Are they any thoughts how we can prevent the market from an individual?
Maybe we should set the min. call ratio to 2.0 for bitSilver, bitGold and bitBTC?

How can we increase the supply of bitGold and bitSilver without borrowing?

Offline armin

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2018, 06:29:44 am »
Yes actually this will be a good idea @bench. Less liquid bitassets should have higher MCR since they are less likely to have their margin calls bought (less liquidity). The higher MCR will make black swans less likely. On the contrary, highly liquid bitassets like bitCNY should have a lower MCR.

Offline pc

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2018, 11:09:48 am »
There are no shorts because both have black-swanned early this year. Interestingly, the markets seem to be ignoring this.

can you elaborate on what you mean by "the markets seem to be ignoring this"? is there a more efficient position the market can take on bit.GOLD currently?

http://cryptofresh.com/a/GOLD

Settlement price is 4,753 BTS/GOLD, that's the exact amount of available backing collateral per bitGOLD.
However, market price is around 10,000 BTS/bitGOLD with a significant spread (highest buy is offering more than 9,500 BTS).

The bitGold and bitSilver are not any longer backed by BTS or no longer need to be backed by BTS because of the black swan?
How was the black swan solved?

Each bitGOLD is backed by 4,753 BTS. The black swan was not resolved, it still persists.


The black swan comes when one collateral is under the ratio of one. Are they any thoughts how we can prevent the market from an individual?
Maybe we should set the min. call ratio to 2.0 for bitSilver, bitGold and bitBTC?

Changing MCR at this time will not help.

How can we increase the supply of bitGold and bitSilver without borrowing?

We can't. They need to be revived first, which is unlikely to happen before BTS price recovers to the level it had earlier this year.
Bitcoin - Perspektive oder Risiko? ISBN 978-3-8442-6568-2 http://bitcoin.quisquis.de

Offline binggo

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2018, 11:39:01 am »
MCR is not the key point, how to solve the black swan is the main problem.

BSIP 18 can't solve the black swan,we need other good way to solve the black swan, let the black swan will never happen.


Offline Customminer

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #14 on: September 28, 2018, 12:17:07 pm »
MCR is not the key point, how to solve the black swan is the main problem.

BSIP 18 can't solve the black swan,we need other good way to solve the black swan, let the black swan will never happen.
BSIP 18 does offer the ability to resolve global settlement aka 'black swan'. Just follow its steps and it'll reactivate.
Hertz, Beyond Bitshares, Gridcoin!

Offline armin

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #15 on: September 28, 2018, 01:05:47 pm »
@pc I don't get your point the CER is currently 8600 and settlement price is 10300 for bitGOLD.

Also btw nobody has actually discussed my original point, why bitGOLD is more useful than bitFIAT when taking a short position on the crypto market. Please give your opinions

Offline Thul3

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #16 on: September 28, 2018, 03:30:14 pm »
Gold is a very manipulated market expecially because of the future role of gold.

Quote
I said it incorrectly @thul3. I meant we need to increase liquidity on Bit.GOLD so that when people want to be short crypto they can escape to Bit.GOLD. Holding Bit.GOLD is better than bitFIAT since it is not depreciating

I understood it correctly and bench already replied to your question

Quote
To generate more bitGold somebody needs to borrow bitGold and sell it?

Now the question who would prefer to short bitgold instead of bitfiat ?

Quote
http://cryptofresh.com/a/GOLD

Settlement price is 4,753 BTS/GOLD, that's the exact amount of available backing collateral per bitGOLD.
However, market price is around 10,000 BTS/bitGOLD with a significant spread (highest buy is offering more than 9,500 BTS).


Since bitgold is being traded wouldn't it make sense to add a trading fee which moves directly to the collateral/settlement pool ?
« Last Edit: September 28, 2018, 03:32:37 pm by Thul3 »

Offline armin

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Re: On The Importance of Bit.GOLD
« Reply #17 on: September 28, 2018, 03:43:21 pm »
Ah, so you're saying because it is preferable to be long gold, then less people are willing to short it? HMM... interesting answer