Author Topic: Global Settlement for BitUSD  (Read 1214 times)

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Offline Thul3

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Global Settlement for BitUSD
« on: November 25, 2018, 12:10:20 am »
BitUSD has arround 12 pm triggered global settlement.Borrowing no more possible.
I'm sorry to the people who lost money because of this event.


congrats @xeroc
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               @still
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Who were the main supporters of BSIP42 even seeing that open margin calls are not being eaten.
They just watched from the side doing NOTHING to rescue that situation but instead celebrate that BSIP42 ,Witnesses and themself as proxies have not being downvoted much because of the global settlement event and even making fun that DEX had today the highest volume.


You guys are disgusting
They made way more disgusting comments but i will make an article about it to settle up their actions and of witnesses who screwed up totaly.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2018, 01:11:29 am by Thul3 »

Offline Customminer

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2018, 01:07:47 am »
If anyone's interested in another USD pegged bitasset, you could check out Hertz https://bitsharescan.com/asset/HERTZ It's got approx 12 feeds, several fully surrendered permissions (more trustless), no market fees, a 14% amplitude oscillation applied to the feed price over 28 days & borrowing is possible (whereas it's not for bitUSD until the price increases?). https://crypto.fans/hertz

Anyone focusing on other bitassets instead? bitCNY probably? Can't borrow HERO neither I don't think..

Would anyone be interested in a BTS pegged bitasset with an applied oscillation (without external volatility)?
« Last Edit: November 25, 2018, 01:26:54 am by Customminer »
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Offline Chris4210

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2018, 05:21:49 am »
So GS happened and BitUSD is now on hold. No more new BitUSD creation. What are the options now to restart this BitAsset? Do we have an emergency plan yet to recover all GS assets on the dex?

The BTS backed stable coins are one of the BitShares Blockchain strongest USP and we should put all our forces on it to recover from GS.

Can some of the committee members and witnesses summarize our options now?
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Offline alt

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2018, 05:35:35 am »
BitUSD has arround 12 pm triggered global settlement.Borrowing no more possible.
I'm sorry to the people who lost money because of this event.


congrats @xeroc
               @bitcrab
               @still
               @abit

Who were the main supporters of BSIP42 even seeing that open margin calls are not being eaten.
They just watched from the side doing NOTHING to rescue that situation but instead celebrate that BSIP42 ,Witnesses and themself as proxies have not being downvoted much because of the global settlement event and even making fun that DEX had today the highest volume.


You guys are disgusting
They made way more disgusting comments but i will make an article about it to settle up their actions and of witnesses who screwed up totaly.
the other three support manipulation because they have heavy short position.
xeroc is the most stupid one, without any trader knowledge but gain too many support through the proxy.
It's very important that we need tell more people how stupid xeroc are, and should remove him from the vote proxy. or he will do more stupid things in the future.

by the way, do you have any idea why the witness give bitUSD's feed price to real price suddenly while keep bitCNY as before?
I have mentioned them should give a feed price higher than global settle price to give more time to eatern the margin call order, but again they screw up it.

Offline armin

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2018, 05:45:16 am »
global settlement was caused because witnesses reverted to normal feed too quickly?

Offline Peryn

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2018, 08:54:52 am »
the committee does not write that they handed out the swan, saving their asses, but in their place, few would have done otherwise? - big money saves only itself at the expense of others

Offline twitter

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2018, 03:18:22 pm »
need to work out a SOP for witnesses  to guide them how to manipulate the price in order to help to avoid the BS. I am wondering if committee  can fire a curfew to stop price feed before BS
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Offline Thul3

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2018, 03:39:54 pm »
need to work out a SOP for witnesses  to guide them how to manipulate the price in order to help to avoid the BS. I am wondering if committee  can fire a curfew to stop price feed before BS


more manipulation ?
Bitshares a decentralised exchange or a fully manipulated exchange with centralised power ?


Thanks to the idiocy settings of BSIP42 and the total lack of any actions for weeks even everyone could clearly see margins are not being filled when price is moving down you just killed the bitusd market.The few liquidity it had moved to bitcny.
You just killed a whole decent market and many investors already wrote good bye bitshares.Chinese investors threaten to leave should bitcny trigger a global settlement and still no action at all.
48h passed the global settlement price for bitcny didn't moved a single point down.
Stupid developers and commitee members talking what to change after the bear market instead of trying to lower at this moment the global settlement price of bitcny.

You just created a 150 million BTS sell wall at $0.051 which is going to surpress BTS price to recover quickly as it always did.

where are bitcrab and xeroc now ?

Giving smart advices don't risk money you are not able to lose ?
Anyone of you see them trying to save the situation which they caused with their BSIP42 settings or indirect agreement to implement it to BitUSD where the whole community was against it ?

I asked both of them weeks ago if they will take full responsability for the global settlement their actions will cause.
Of course i have not received any answer.
Instead i read now poor comments that we had been global settled earlier if not BSIP42 .

Don't understand me wrong i'm not against pegging bitassets at all but when you see that no margin call is being filled in a down move its just a matter of time getting it triggered in a bigger down move.Everyone knew it abit and bitcrab even openly said that they can't avoid it and still they didn't even tried to get the margin call filled.

But hey at least bitusd had the last couple of weeks a nice peg......which is now broken anyway

We are now so much smarter and gained know how at the expense of peoples money.
GDEX getting now full attention since its dominating the bitcny market where everyone else focused on bitUSD which market is now down.


Also you guys can now explain to me again which business you were talking about is going to implement now bitusd ?
« Last Edit: November 25, 2018, 04:46:06 pm by Thul3 »

Offline spark

Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2018, 10:09:56 pm »
So I have just learned that I am blacklisted from the GitHub repo, I am not allowed to comment and not allowed to fork any code.

So of course I feel extremely uncomfortable even approxiamting my true feelings for bitshares here.

Black Swan bitUSD 2018

Did I decode the bs correctly? Should I worry?

Offline twitter

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2018, 02:56:04 am »
anyone can brief explain what bitcrab and xeroc should do to prevent BITUSD GS ? I truly believe BITUSD BS won't do anything good to bitcny. 

should we need to fire some witnesses due to no action to the bitusd BS?

thanks
« Last Edit: November 26, 2018, 03:01:49 am by twitter »
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Offline bitcrab

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2018, 03:29:05 am »
I always recollect this day clearly:



at the day in USD market the lowest price is about 7% close to global settlement price.



at the day the lowest price is 0.293USD, there is no BSIP42.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2018, 03:43:16 am by bitcrab »

Offline bighotstar

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2018, 07:10:26 am »
I always recollect this day clearly:



at the day in USD market the lowest price is about 7% close to global settlement price.



at the day the lowest price is 0.293USD, there is no BSIP42.
Brother Crab, foreigners can't be trusted. You don't have to carry USD anymore. Let them live and die. It's enough to make BTS in CNY
蟹哥,老外靠不住的,以后你再也不必去扛USD区了,让他们自生自灭好了,能弄好CNY区BTS也够牛了。

Offline zhangweis

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2018, 08:12:54 am »
I always recollect this day clearly:
Brother Crab, foreigners can't be trusted. You don't have to carry USD anymore. Let them live and die. It's enough to make BTS in CNY
蟹哥,老外靠不住的,以后你再也不必去扛USD区了,让他们自生自灭好了,能弄好CNY区BTS也够牛了。

It's bitcrab who insisted to apply BSIP42 to BitUSD in spite of rejection from the community as he thought BSIP42 had been successful on BitCNY.  If he had left BitUSD with no BSIP42, there will be no BlackSwan on BitUSD, only BitCNY on its way. I will be very glad to see BitUSD without BSIP42 applied.

And now who will take the responsibility of BitUSD BS and the loss? What I can see is only the blame on the blackswan mechanism. It's ridiculous.
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Offline alt

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #13 on: November 26, 2018, 08:59:57 am »
too bad, do you have any ideas why have you banned from the github repo?

So I have just learned that I am blacklisted from the GitHub repo, I am not allowed to comment and not allowed to fork any code.

So of course I feel extremely uncomfortable even approxiamting my true feelings for bitshares here.

Black Swan bitUSD 2018

Did I decode the bs correctly? Should I worry?

Offline alt

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #14 on: November 26, 2018, 09:08:33 am »
I always recollect this day clearly:



at the day in USD market the lowest price is about 7% close to global settlement price.



at the day the lowest price is 0.293USD, there is no BSIP42.
nobody doubt you have do much for Bitshare,
but it can't change the fact that after BSIP42, witness manipulation the feed price, sell the margin call at unreasonable price which lead to this blackswan event directely.
even now, they still sell the margin call orders at 4.2% higher than market price.
witness should just give the real price, if 10% punish for margin call order is too much, change it to 5%, 3%, 1%, what ever, but must have a profit so others can help eat the margin call orders.
now people need to pay 4.2% to help eat it , it's unreasonable.

Offline bitcrab

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2018, 10:01:55 am »
nobody doubt you have do much for Bitshare,
but it can't change the fact that after BSIP42, witness manipulation the feed price, sell the margin call at unreasonable price which lead to this blackswan event directely.
even now, they still sell the margin call orders at 4.2% higher than market price.
witness should just give the real price, if 10% punish for margin call order is too much, change it to 5%, 3%, 1%, what ever, but must have a profit so others can help eat the margin call orders.
now people need to pay 4.2% to help eat it , it's unreasonable.

I am not showing what I do for BTS, I am just showing there is also big possibility for black swan even without BSIP42.

you guys don't care whether smartcoins peg well, whether there can be enough smartcoin supply, whether smartcoin can be widely adopted as good stable coin. that's why you do not understand why BSIP42 comes out.








Offline severo

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #16 on: November 26, 2018, 10:12:28 am »
And now what's gonna happen? at the moment it seems that the BitUSD quote with other assets remains. How will the situation evolve?

Offline alt

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2018, 10:42:29 am »
nobody doubt you have do much for Bitshare,
but it can't change the fact that after BSIP42, witness manipulation the feed price, sell the margin call at unreasonable price which lead to this blackswan event directely.
even now, they still sell the margin call orders at 4.2% higher than market price.
witness should just give the real price, if 10% punish for margin call order is too much, change it to 5%, 3%, 1%, what ever, but must have a profit so others can help eat the margin call orders.
now people need to pay 4.2% to help eat it , it's unreasonable.

I am not showing what I do for BTS, I am just showing there is also big possibility for black swan even without BSIP42.

you guys don't care whether smartcoins peg well, whether there can be enough smartcoin supply, whether smartcoin can be widely adopted as good stable coin. that's why you do not understand why BSIP42 comes out.
yes there is always a posibility for black swan, but after change the margin call to only sell part of them, the posibility is very low already.
after BSIP42 begin, it's not a posibility, it's 100% percent for black swan because you guys want to sell margin call orders 5%, 10%, even 20% higher than market price.
it's rediculous to expect others help eat the margin call orders and pay more 5% percent.
 we always need to give a profit to others help get rid of the risk.

Offline xeroc

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2018, 12:09:22 pm »
Since so many in here have no clue about what a global settlement is, let me enlighten you by pointing you to the right direction:

https://steemit.com/bitshares/@bitshares.fdn/how-global-settlements-work

Also, I am not willing to continue support insults and attacks on a personal level. Not against me, nor against any other member of that community. If you disagree with opinions, remove your vote. If you are not happy with how BitShares develops, obtain more voting power or sell and go somewhere else. I know that attacking people is much easier than working out things constructively, it really is.
Give BitShares a try! Use the http://testnet.bitshares.eu provided by http://bitshares.eu powered by ChainSquad GmbH

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2018, 01:28:09 pm »
If he had left BitUSD with no BSIP42, there will be no BlackSwan on BitUSD

To be fair, I think that with such a big downtrend a black swan on bitUSD might have happened even without BSIP-42.

Still, I think it is now proven that BSIP-42 increases the likelyhood of a black swan, due to margin calls not being eaten.

(I'm well aware that BSIP-42 can completely prevent a black swan if the witnesses keep the feed price "fake enough". This is cheating though, because it only hides the undercollaterlization from the blockchain. It will break the peg, and thus defeat the purpose of BSIP-42.)
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Offline abit

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #20 on: November 26, 2018, 05:07:52 pm »
If he had left BitUSD with no BSIP42, there will be no BlackSwan on BitUSD

To be fair, I think that with such a big downtrend a black swan on bitUSD might have happened even without BSIP-42.

Still, I think it is now proven that BSIP-42 increases the likelyhood of a black swan, due to margin calls not being eaten.

(I'm well aware that BSIP-42 can completely prevent a black swan if the witnesses keep the feed price "fake enough". This is cheating though, because it only hides the undercollaterlization from the blockchain. It will break the peg, and thus defeat the purpose of BSIP-42.)

1. A peg can stand only if debts (at least the one with least collateral ratio) are fully backed. BSIP42 doesn't change this fact. That said, BSIP42 does have a limited effective range. GS doesn't lead to a peg either.

2. BSIP42 only takes effect when borrowing is enabled. That said, avoiding GS by feeding a fake price makes it easier for bitAssets to peg again when the market bounced up or the trend changed.

3. We're well aware that risks will accumulate if margin calls not being eaten. Although admittedly BSIP42 helped the risk accumulation to an extent, I still believe it's not fully due to BSIP42. Before BSIP42, E.G. on bitcrab's image, bitUSD has a more than 15% premium, to eat the margins which are hanging at -10% you still have to pay quite a bit more than market price.

BSIP42 can be tweaked to always let margins to be able to be eaten E.G. increasing MSSR at the same time when adjusting up feed price, the thing is, in a bear market, not that many bitcrabs who will eat margin calls at the cost of themselves. However, it seems many people just want to do nothing, rather than to improve something that doesn't work very well.

4. it's always easier to blame someone else. By doing nothing you won't do anything wrong, but you won't go forward either.
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Offline zhangweis

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2018, 09:13:19 pm »

To be fair, I think that with such a big downtrend a black swan on bitUSD might have happened even without BSIP-42.

Still, I think it is now proven that BSIP-42 increases the likelyhood of a black swan, due to margin calls not being eaten.

(I'm well aware that BSIP-42 can completely prevent a black swan if the witnesses keep the feed price "fake enough". This is cheating though, because it only hides the undercollaterlization from the blockchain. It will break the peg, and thus defeat the purpose of BSIP-42.)

Well, if strictly executed as BSIP42, it might be much better than the current situation. But BSIP42 is just an excuse to manipulate the price feeds. What should be the price feed for BitCNY as per BSIP42 and what are/have been the price feeds? BSIP42 had been executed for some time, but as BitCNY was at a discount which conflicts shorter's interests, the shorter-controlled feed manipulation was no longer BSIP42.

I don't think witnesses are using BSIP42 for price feeds. BSIP42 had been dead. The proposers themselves killed BSIP42.
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Offline bitcrab

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #22 on: November 27, 2018, 06:53:19 am »
3. We're well aware that risks will accumulate if margin calls not being eaten. Although admittedly BSIP42 helped the risk accumulation to an extent, I still believe it's not fully due to BSIP42. Before BSIP42, E.G. on bitcrab's image, bitUSD has a more than 15% premium, to eat the margins which are hanging at -10% you still have to pay quite a bit more than market price.

BTS price limit the smartcoin supply, if the demand overcome the supply, either premium or system risk will arise.

will everything be OK if we adopt the dynamic MCR solution to replace BSIP42? seems not.

in MCR solution, while demand for smartcoin arise, MCR need to be adjusted downwards, say, if MCR reach 1.2, it will be easy to touch black swan if there is rapid fall of BTS price.

Offline clockwork

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Re: Global Settlement for BitUSD
« Reply #23 on: November 27, 2018, 07:36:58 am »
3. We're well aware that risks will accumulate if margin calls not being eaten. Although admittedly BSIP42 helped the risk accumulation to an extent, I still believe it's not fully due to BSIP42. Before BSIP42, E.G. on bitcrab's image, bitUSD has a more than 15% premium, to eat the margins which are hanging at -10% you still have to pay quite a bit more than market price.

BTS price limit the smartcoin supply, if the demand overcome the supply, either premium or system risk will arise.

will everything be OK if we adopt the dynamic MCR solution to replace BSIP42? seems not.

in MCR solution, while demand for smartcoin arise, MCR need to be adjusted downwards, say, if MCR reach 1.2, it will be easy to touch black swan if there is rapid fall of BTS price.

Well, if we're in danger of GS and need to adjust feed price to prevent it (as in bitCNY), peg gets broken anyways.

With that in mind, we can simply add limits to the possible extent MCR and MSSR can move.

See here: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27360.msg324958#msg324958

This will allow a tighter peg up to an extent. So better than previous situation while still controllable/predictable. Will peg break in extreme circumstances? yes...but it does that anyway.

We can also combine it with this: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27459.0

Which in the form of a penalty will allow us to effectively increase MSSR , without putting pressure in the order books.