Author Topic: Complaint against clockwork witness  (Read 1695 times)

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Offline clockwork

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #15 on: May 14, 2019, 02:00:35 pm »


This is the feed price of clockwork?

Yes...ZBs API started timing out for me and has made the feed unstable due to limited sources...

As you can see it was readjusted a few mins later and I'm monitoring  its stability now.

Offline pc

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #16 on: May 14, 2019, 02:32:44 pm »
Perhaps we should turn the witch hunt around and publish screenshots of short positions with low collateral ratio.

These guys are the cancer of BTS and must be punished! Vote for 150% MSSR please!

</sarcasm>
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Online Thul3

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #17 on: May 14, 2019, 02:40:59 pm »
Perhaps we should turn the witch hunt around and publish screenshots of short positions with low collateral ratio.

These guys are the cancer of BTS and must be punished! Vote for 150% MSSR please!

</sarcasm>


This would be considered a direct attack to a high ranked member who wants to increase feedprice ,lower MSSR to 1 so no margin call will get eaten anymore.
You are against long debt holders.You are an enemy.Making sure margin calls won't get eaten anymore gives debt holders security and will increase debt aka liquidity /irony off.

Btw the chinese forum has a nice thread why people with low price feed gets bashed.
First lower MCR than increase price feed and at the end lower MSSR to 1.01 with final goal 1.00 .
There is also explained why.


@yamtt
@finn-bts
@ljk424
@zhouxiaobao
@ioex

I see big activity from you guys to improve bitshares.How does it come you guys are so quite about the abused USD OMO Fund ?
« Last Edit: May 14, 2019, 02:45:40 pm by Thul3 »

Offline clockwork

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #18 on: May 14, 2019, 02:51:48 pm »
Perhaps we should turn the witch hunt around and publish screenshots of short positions with low collateral ratio.

These guys are the cancer of BTS and must be punished! Vote for 150% MSSR please!

</sarcasm>


This would be considered a direct attack to a high ranked member who wants to increase feedprice ,lower MSSR to 1 so no margin call will get eaten anymore.
You are against long debt holders.You are an enemy.Making sure margin calls won't get eaten anymore gives debt holders security and will increase debt aka liquidity /irony off.

Btw the chinese forum has a nice thread why people with low price feed gets bashed.
First lower MCR than increase price feed and at the end lower MSSR to 1.01 with final goal 1.00 .
There is also explained why.


@yamtt
@finn-bts
@ljk424
@zhouxiaobao
@ioex

I see big activity from you guys to improve bitshares.How does it come you guys are so quite about the abused USD OMO Fund ?

Am I the only one that thinks the DEX and the feed should be impartial to shorts/longs?

The ONLY way to increase adoption is to make it fair. This means that we don't protect ANYONE.

I understand the logic behind protecting longs since this means we get more bitasset supply from less people with less capital

But bitAsset success depends on it being fair and treating both sides as equals. Increased supply wont help if the asset is not taken seriously and risk is transferred from borrowers to holders.

Unless your goal is to make it a niche instrument for increased leverage.

But don't expect adoption as a stable coin if you do.

Also..if any of you can't follow what I just wrote you probably shouldn't be commenting...

/rant off

Offline abit

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #19 on: May 14, 2019, 05:44:05 pm »
Perhaps we should turn the witch hunt around and publish screenshots of short positions with low collateral ratio.

These guys are the cancer of BTS and must be punished! Vote for 150% MSSR please!

</sarcasm>


This would be considered a direct attack to a high ranked member who wants to increase feedprice ,lower MSSR to 1 so no margin call will get eaten anymore.
You are against long debt holders.You are an enemy.Making sure margin calls won't get eaten anymore gives debt holders security and will increase debt aka liquidity /irony off.

Btw the chinese forum has a nice thread why people with low price feed gets bashed.
First lower MCR than increase price feed and at the end lower MSSR to 1.01 with final goal 1.00 .
There is also explained why.


@yamtt
@finn-bts
@ljk424
@zhouxiaobao
@ioex

I see big activity from you guys to improve bitshares.How does it come you guys are so quite about the abused USD OMO Fund ?

Am I the only one that thinks the DEX and the feed should be impartial to shorts/longs?

The ONLY way to increase adoption is to make it fair. This means that we don't protect ANYONE.

I understand the logic behind protecting longs since this means we get more bitasset supply from less people with less capital

But bitAsset success depends on it being fair and treating both sides as equals. Increased supply wont help if the asset is not taken seriously and risk is transferred from borrowers to holders.

Unless your goal is to make it a niche instrument for increased leverage.

But don't expect adoption as a stable coin if you do.

Also..if any of you can't follow what I just wrote you probably shouldn't be commenting...

/rant off
I feel (agree with) you.
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Offline sahkan

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #20 on: May 15, 2019, 04:25:20 am »
Perhaps we should turn the witch hunt around and publish screenshots of short positions with low collateral ratio.

These guys are the cancer of BTS and must be punished! Vote for 150% MSSR please!

</sarcasm>

This would be considered a direct attack to a high ranked member who wants to increase feedprice ,lower MSSR to 1 so no margin call will get eaten anymore.
You are against long debt holders.You are an enemy.Making sure margin calls won't get eaten anymore gives debt holders security and will increase debt aka liquidity /irony off.

Btw the chinese forum has a nice thread why people with low price feed gets bashed.
First lower MCR than increase price feed and at the end lower MSSR to 1.01 with final goal 1.00 .
There is also explained why.


@yamtt
@finn-bts
@ljk424
@zhouxiaobao
@ioex

I see big activity from you guys to improve bitshares.How does it come you guys are so quite about the abused USD OMO Fund ?

Am I the only one that thinks the DEX and the feed should be impartial to shorts/longs?

The ONLY way to increase adoption is to make it fair. This means that we don't protect ANYONE.

I understand the logic behind protecting longs since this means we get more bitasset supply from less people with less capital

But bitAsset success depends on it being fair and treating both sides as equals. Increased supply wont help if the asset is not taken seriously and risk is transferred from borrowers to holders.

Unless your goal is to make it a niche instrument for increased leverage.

But don't expect adoption as a stable coin if you do.

Also..if any of you can't follow what I just wrote you probably shouldn't be commenting...

/rant off
I feel (agree with) you.
The longs hold all the BTS and buy more with their newly created smartcoins so their voting power is skewed. The shorts hold ZERO votes, so I second that.

Offline binggo

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #21 on: May 15, 2019, 04:42:37 am »
Very very interesting,the holder of bts is guilty
« Last Edit: May 15, 2019, 04:44:11 am by binggo »

Offline Digital Lucifer

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #22 on: May 15, 2019, 07:42:53 am »
We are all guilty of few things:

-Impatience
-Intolerance
-Lack of technical knowledge (few members)
-Lack of knowledge in economics (few members)
-Lack of respect towards colleagues across the Globe or timezone they are in, families/jobs they have or things they did around.

One bad feed for one period doesn't make the witness bad. Script and API does. And whoever points the finger and its part of this organization. We should all be more united together instead of constantly being on some "witch hunt" as mentioned above.

A lot of you people here are having skills that can be useful to this ecosystem (including stakeholders), but yet everybody have their own goals/interests aligned to themselves and nobody more.

OMO USD funds or anything else that was worked on and went south... ->> no agreement, no terms, no entities, no passport copies... what did you all expect ? Why I'm so interested into reaching certain level of legality around BitShares for so long... So businesses, gateways and our employees can finally get a tight knot around the neck and stop fucking around when some responsibility is on them. It's easy to cashout all the time and have 0 responsibility, but it's hard to put a face or name to thing or a fuckup that you are cashing out from.

Please stop pointing out fingers to each other and try help each other. I haven't seen one block producer offering help with API or issues that Clockwork has, but I see a lot of people just going along with fingers.

P.S. Abitmore is excused from the sentence above, he can all teach us some manners and business ethics, even being completely anonymous person around for years. His opinion is always solid and individual, explained well in details and proved with facts/estimates done properly



Chee®s






« Last Edit: May 15, 2019, 07:44:46 am by Digital Lucifer »
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Offline binggo

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #23 on: May 15, 2019, 08:31:29 am »
We are all guilty of few things:

-Impatience
-Intolerance
-Lack of technical knowledge (few members)
-Lack of knowledge in economics (few members)
-Lack of respect towards colleagues across the Globe or timezone they are in, families/jobs they have or things they did around.

I think the problem of feed price need a whole set of role to be clearly defined.

Why we can't get a "fair“ feed price?

The argument come from the ambiguous and human factors.

But if didn't have these topics, nobody will care about what's the problem with the bitasset.

Offline sschiessl

Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #24 on: May 15, 2019, 08:34:30 am »
We are all guilty of few things:

-Impatience
-Intolerance
-Lack of technical knowledge (few members)
-Lack of knowledge in economics (few members)
-Lack of respect towards colleagues across the Globe or timezone they are in, families/jobs they have or things they did around.

I think the problem of feed price need a whole set of role to be clearly defined.

Why we can't get a "fair“ feed price?

The argument come from the ambiguous and human factors.

But if didn't have these topics, nobody will care about what's the problem with the bitasset.

Certainly, I think clockwork is one who cares a lot. But it makes a difference if you go from zero feedback to a pitchfork mob without even having a clear definition of duties and guidelines for what a fair price is, or if you choose to start constructive conversation in the matter.

Offline yamtt

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #25 on: May 15, 2019, 08:45:43 am »
@verbaletch2This is your feed price and the price of the current inner plate.



Offline binggo

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #26 on: May 15, 2019, 09:03:04 am »
Certainly, I think clockwork is one who cares a lot. But it makes a difference if you go from zero feedback to a pitchfork mob without even having a clear definition of duties and guidelines for what a fair price is, or if you choose to start constructive conversation in the matter.

I am not directed against clockwork, but this is a serious problem among some witness.

Constructive conversation? yes,for many times, but i found nobody care about it, maybe clockwork cares a lot, but where the other commitmess and witnees? especially the witnees.

I also disapproved to go at somebody, but we need to find out someway to solve these problems and prevent these things happend again and again.

Offline clockwork

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #27 on: May 15, 2019, 09:16:37 am »
We are all guilty of few things:

-Impatience
-Intolerance
-Lack of technical knowledge (few members)
-Lack of knowledge in economics (few members)
-Lack of respect towards colleagues across the Globe or timezone they are in, families/jobs they have or things they did around.

I think the problem of feed price need a whole set of role to be clearly defined.

Why we can't get a "fair“ feed price?

The argument come from the ambiguous and human factors.

But if didn't have these topics, nobody will care about what's the problem with the bitasset.

A big part of this problem is that due to crypto on-boarding limitations in China, what is fair there is not fair for everyone else.

Same way you can't find a way to buy "cheap" bts, the west can't find a way to sell BTS at the prices you pay.

We need to find ways to focus on this arbitrage shift so we have better price discovery.

Offline Digital Lucifer

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #28 on: May 15, 2019, 09:33:28 am »
Certainly, I think clockwork is one who cares a lot. But it makes a difference if you go from zero feedback to a pitchfork mob without even having a clear definition of duties and guidelines for what a fair price is, or if you choose to start constructive conversation in the matter.

I am not directed against clockwork, but this is a serious problem among some witness.

Constructive conversation? yes,for many times, but i found nobody care about it, maybe clockwork cares a lot, but where the other commitmess and witnees? especially the witnees.

I also disapproved to go at somebody, but we need to find out someway to solve these problems and prevent these things happend again and again.

I do agree with this clear and factual statement of yours 100%. And i do agree that interest on witness overall and other participants is definitely not enough. But I also agree with Stefan that Alex is the one who care, so again no reason to fud him, and at least minimum would be 48 hours to correct the problem in IT, since he is not paid for it on Premium terms and exclusive 24hrs support base.

Instead of having now dozens of workers setting up just parameters on certain bitAssets, why not just write new BSIP's for both bitCNY and bitUSD ? It could include all parameters configured individually and price feed terms (fair price, price feed recovery, fix, sources for prices, etc) for the witnesses as basic requirements for their jobs.

I think that having 2 BSIP's followed by 2 clean workers can be a good start for this issue we have. Any additional tweaks can be short workers that would be additional milestones/tweaks on current BSIP's and their respective workers.

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Offline abit

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Re: Complaint against clockwork witness
« Reply #29 on: May 15, 2019, 10:12:33 am »
The most important job for witnesses is reliably producing blocks. Other jobs, yes, they can do too. When voting, different people consider different things.

Technically, the committee is able to decide the list of feed producers for each asset, that said, if witnesses can't do the job well, let others do it. The community can discuss whether this is a better way.

Another option, technically we can change the rules via BSIPs. For example, let bitCNY holders and bitCNY debt position owners vote for feed producers of bitCNY asset, vote for the related parameters, which could be fairer. However, this is tricky as well, for example, if a whale borrows a lot but doesn't sell, so holding some bitCNY in the meanwhile holding a position, perhaps it can manipulate the whole vote then can make a disaster. Perhaps let bitCNY holders/borrowers have some weight in voting but not 100%? Perhaps let CORE in collateral have zero weight?

Just brain storming. Please discuss.
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