Author Topic: 关于4.0的几点说明  (Read 1640 times)

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Offline abit

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关于4.0的几点说明
« on: August 19, 2020, 04:35:00 pm »
我知道我会因为 4.0 投票机制修改的事情而遭到指责、背负骂名,但我并不后悔,因为我问心无愧。为了 BitShares 的长远健康发展,我个人愿意承担责任,以及付出经济代价。

社区苦投票机制之弊病久矣。
关于规则优化的讨论,已经进行了很多年,也形成了 BSIP-22 、 BSIP-24 等几个文档。
然而,原有规则的既得利益者不会放弃口中的蛋糕,会动用一切力量来阻挠改革。希望通过投票来修改投票规则,本身就是个笑话。 BSIP-22 投票了,但并没有通过,可见一斑。而这次补丁分叉事件就是更好的例子。
改良不成,唯有革命。

不用拿“程序正义”这几个字来压我。即使在法学界,程序正义也不是唯一标准。追求程序正义的最终目的是结果正义。只是因为结果正义的判断标准通常难以确定,才有程序正义这个词的生存空间。
Quote
一个疯子把五个无辜的人绑在电车轨道上。一辆失控的电车朝他们驶来,并且片刻后就要碾压到他们。幸运的是,你可以拉一个拉杆,让电车开到另一条轨道上。然而问题在于,那个疯子在另一个电车轨道上也绑了一个人。考虑以上状况,你是否应拉拉杆?

我并不认为 4.0 引入的投票规则是完美的,但至少朝合理的方向迈出了一步,后面还可以继续优化。
锁仓获得投票权,对于一个平台的治理决策来说,是很重要的,这样投票者(决策者)和平台利益更可能保持一致。长时间的锁仓,决策时会更看重长期利益,而不是只看短期利益。
反过来说,如果让一个随时可能跑路的人来决策,是不怎么靠谱的。
我本人仍然看好 BitShares 后期发展,并且也愿意贡献自己的力量、推动发展,所以在 4.0 激活后就锁仓了我持有的 900 万 BTS ,期限两年起。
其他有意贡献力量共同发展的社区成员,或多或少也锁了一些。也就是说,这个规则,在社区内是有共识基础的。

巨蟹曾言,“灵魂拷问:我有必要继续和一个个人可以控制的链呆在一起吗?”
确实,一个承载数亿、曾经数百亿人民币价值的开源软件,没有人关注代码,是很悲哀的。
幸运的是, BitShares 还远没有那么糟糕。
4.0的投票功能确实是我一人独立开发,并未告知任何人(包括核心开发团队其他成员),除了提交代码。
但是,据我所知,在 4.0 版本生效之前,除我之外,至少有 5 位独立开发者审核过代码,知晓并认可了修改内容。最早的一位在我提交代码后一个星期之内就发现了。
我相信大部分开发者是“善”的。
如果我做的是什么见不得人的事情,恐怕早就被揪出来了。
巨蟹的言论还算客观。
而那些宣称我可以随意修改代码、甚至随意给自己发币的言论,实在不值一驳。

区块链的魅力,就在于每个节点运行者都有权选择运行什么软件。
当所有人都运行包含同样规则的软件,就产生了共识。
如果有一部分人选择运行不同规则的软件,不管出于什么原因,结果就是分叉。
当无法达成共识,分叉是自然而然、不可避免的。
任何节点都有分叉的自由。
缺乏支持的分叉会慢慢消亡,这也是自然选择。


下面,针对公会的公告,我简要的回复一下。

在我看来,公会已经不是以前的那个公会了。公会曾经是以推动 BitShares 发展为第一目标的。但自从教授退出、文华离开,而 星在飘 等人的影响力逐渐提升,公会已经失去初心。我曾经也是公会的一员,也曾为公会推动 BitShares 社区发展献策献力。然而,当公会把小团体利益置于 BitShares 整体利益之上的那一天起,我也选择了离开。公会的票数,从最高点超过 3 亿,到现在 2.2 亿,可以看出端倪。

公会在公告中声称代表“整个社区”、“大票仓达成一致意见”、“多数见证人支持”,明显是夸大事实。事实是,公会 2.2 亿票,占总流通币量 30 亿的 7% ;公会 600 多个代理帐号,占系统内总帐号数量(200万左右)的 0.03% ;所谓的大票仓, b-dex ,其代理票权完全来自于 alt ,而 alt 本人已发帖明确声明不支持分叉( alt 言行不一的情况另说 );所谓多数见证人支持,是因为公会威胁独立见证人群体不成功、把一些傀儡投上去了而已,况且很多其他票仓都还没有表态,最终投票结果如何还不一定。

公会补丁的主要开发者,在我看来,是有些技术实力的。此人我也曾极力争取,希望其能为 BitShares 贡献力量,而不是走歪路。但想依靠他来独立支持一条链,我的个人观点,说难听点,还差得远。如果公会能找到其他资深开发者加盟,可能还差不多。我在微信群里也说过,如果公会和平分叉,不干扰当前链的正常运行,分叉方面我愿意免费提供一段时间的技术支持。

关于公会声称我“拒不交出” github 权限的问题,我在微信里的原文是这样的:“github权限,可以给有能力有责任的人 ... 有能力的随时可以一起帮忙管理,我很乐意 ... baip 库给你们管了,管成什么样了?”
我的 github 权限,是通过长时间做贡献、获得社区认可,才获得的,而不是张口要来的。我要对这个权限负责,不可能随便转让,否则就是对社区不负责任。
我一直在找寻合适的开发者参与开发和管理社区项目。遇到有能力有责任的开发者,最大化授权也是常态。
任何人想要权限,请先做贡献。
BTS account: abit
BTS committee member: abit
BTS witness: in.abit

Offline dirnet

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Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2020, 05:55:20 pm »
我也曾经在工会群,但是发现暗藏私心甚至坏心的不少,所以没过多久就退出了

Offline EuropaSH

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Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #2 on: August 19, 2020, 08:59:30 pm »
BitShares community, infrastructure participants, holders and myself have been looking forward to your message.

Thanks.

As you know, we are a Bitshares-based XBTS exchange and develop useful APPs for the DPoS blockchain. We have a strong team. We truly loved the Bitshares community. The spirit of decentralization is close to us. We love what we do.

What happened in August was shocking and pretty bad for our nerves.

First of all, as an XBTS exchange, we strive to provide our users with a stable trading tool. After the closure of OL and CB exchanges, those who remained on the Bitshares need to work even harder to earn trust points.

After the announcement of the CN-vote about the patch, we immediately said that we were sticking to the updates of the official github BitShares and would not install the patch.
After this statement, votes were removed from our witness and we dropped out of the top witnesses.

We examined the CN-vote patch code, and found errors there that could lead to fatal consequences for the blockchain.
In the event of an update on August 20, the Bitshares network could stop. The nodes could fall and not rise. And it could take a week, 2 weeks or more to restore the network.
Stop blockchain - Invalid for infrastructure !!!! This shouldn't happen !!!
We reported this to the CN-vote community.

We hope that all the BitShares community will show awareness and make the right choice!

BitShares can be great! Read our proposal, what we want to do and what we are doing now  https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=32472.0 
This is an offer from one witness who is in love with BitShares, and if there are more such enthusiasts, we can do even more together!
XBTS DEX EXCHANGE FOR TRADERS AND GAMERS https://xbts.io

Offline gghi

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Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2020, 12:30:50 am »
         革命是要付出代价的,指望投票革命旧的投票规则是不现实的,ABIT的确做了别人不敢做也做不了的事情,您才是真汉子!如果说4.0投票优化,个人建议可以加上5年锁仓16倍票权,10年锁仓32倍票权,甚至20年64倍票权。见证人一票一投规则,挂单的仓位以及抵押的仓位降低票权,甚至无票权。因为挂单的仓位以及抵押的仓位都属于不稳定仓位。
          意见不和,分叉即可,成功失败交给市场。旧的投票规则和4.0的规则,明白人一看便知。旧的投票规则已经极度腐败!票仓互相勾结,控制见证人,控制理事会,控制提案,这已经是不争的事实。
          希望您能顶住压力,继续为BTS做贡献,否则BTS真的看不到希望了。很长一段时间对BTS 的治理模式已经失去信心了,直到4.0的推出又燃起了心中的热情,看到了希望。
           见证人必须一票一投,只有见证人摆脱控制,不做傀儡,独立工作,才可以保证链的正常运行。目前很多垃圾见证人提供的公共节点,要么打不开,要么很慢。区块链的节点如果不能正常工作,那么这种链谈何前途?
« Last Edit: August 20, 2020, 01:07:28 am by gghi »

Offline binggo

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Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2020, 12:48:06 am »
对一个正常的DAO治理而言,我认为锁仓进行投票是一个保证基本公平的基础。

票权代码更改我提前就知道,国外社区也很多人知道,票权变动的代码早也已经贴了出来,大家都选择不吭声也是有原因的。

想要“程序正义”,那要看打造“程序正义”的基础是不是正义才能断定这个程序是不是正义的,如果不看基础只看程序,那把“白玫瑰”送上断头台算不算程序正义?

而且这些票权改动对长期看好bts的持有者是有益的(当然要是碰上了大周期,照样嗝屁),让bts的发展方向可以由长期持有者来部分主导而不是被投机主义者与严重的利己行为处处绑架,这些票权改动也并没有灭失不想锁仓的短期持有者的投票权,依然会有大量的自由票权存在。唯一剥离掉的就是抵押票权,这种抵押票权在DAO治理中是严禁允许存在的,一个很基本的常识与公平问题。

我对于锁仓倍数虽有不同意见,但不影响整体性,虽然最开始的提出这个方案的时候我是怼过的,因为其中的“通缩有利于上涨”之类的说法相当的不靠谱。

题外话:

在我看来,DPOS治理从起始就不是一个公平性与去中心化的设计,一个由票仓完全控制的见证人体系,终将滑向财阀与寡头化的深渊,这次公会控制见证人的行为不过是一个前兆而已,而steemit也提前坐实了这一结局。


Quote
公会 2.2 亿票,占总流通币量 30 亿的 7%

剔除抵押票权,仅有3千万的自由票权,当然这是以前统计的,现在可能更少一些。


我可能曾经也算是公会的一员,但公会各种群至多呆了两周就退了,因为我对加入各种组织其实并没有太大的兴趣,不仅影响屁股,而且还影响脑袋。

再者, 公会的所谓公告与宣言其实可以总结为这几个字:
Quote
fight for cnvote !

« Last Edit: August 20, 2020, 01:29:53 am by binggo »

Offline twitter

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Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2020, 01:27:32 am »
LOL.  Obviously rape must be said to be lucky。 good move abit

我知道我会因为 4.0 投票机制修改的事情而遭到指责、背负骂名,但我并不后悔,因为我问心无愧。为了 BitShares 的长远健康发展,我个人愿意承担责任,以及付出经济代价。

社区苦投票机制之弊病久矣。
关于规则优化的讨论,已经进行了很多年,也形成了 BSIP-22 、 BSIP-24 等几个文档。
然而,原有规则的既得利益者不会放弃口中的蛋糕,会动用一切力量来阻挠改革。希望通过投票来修改投票规则,本身就是个笑话。 BSIP-22 投票了,但并没有通过,可见一斑。而这次补丁分叉事件就是更好的例子。
改良不成,唯有革命。

不用拿“程序正义”这几个字来压我。即使在法学界,程序正义也不是唯一标准。追求程序正义的最终目的是结果正义。只是因为结果正义的判断标准通常难以确定,才有程序正义这个词的生存空间。
Quote
一个疯子把五个无辜的人绑在电车轨道上。一辆失控的电车朝他们驶来,并且片刻后就要碾压到他们。幸运的是,你可以拉一个拉杆,让电车开到另一条轨道上。然而问题在于,那个疯子在另一个电车轨道上也绑了一个人。考虑以上状况,你是否应拉拉杆?

我并不认为 4.0 引入的投票规则是完美的,但至少朝合理的方向迈出了一步,后面还可以继续优化。
锁仓获得投票权,对于一个平台的治理决策来说,是很重要的,这样投票者(决策者)和平台利益更可能保持一致。长时间的锁仓,决策时会更看重长期利益,而不是只看短期利益。
反过来说,如果让一个随时可能跑路的人来决策,是不怎么靠谱的。
我本人仍然看好 BitShares 后期发展,并且也愿意贡献自己的力量、推动发展,所以在 4.0 激活后就锁仓了我持有的 900 万 BTS ,期限两年起。
其他有意贡献力量共同发展的社区成员,或多或少也锁了一些。也就是说,这个规则,在社区内是有共识基础的。

巨蟹曾言,“灵魂拷问:我有必要继续和一个个人可以控制的链呆在一起吗?”
确实,一个承载数亿、曾经数百亿人民币价值的开源软件,没有人关注代码,是很悲哀的。
幸运的是, BitShares 还远没有那么糟糕。
4.0的投票功能确实是我一人独立开发,并未告知任何人(包括核心开发团队其他成员),除了提交代码。
但是,据我所知,在 4.0 版本生效之前,除我之外,至少有 5 位独立开发者审核过代码,知晓并认可了修改内容。最早的一位在我提交代码后一个星期之内就发现了。
我相信大部分开发者是“善”的。
如果我做的是什么见不得人的事情,恐怕早就被揪出来了。
巨蟹的言论还算客观。
而那些宣称我可以随意修改代码、甚至随意给自己发币的言论,实在不值一驳。

区块链的魅力,就在于每个节点运行者都有权选择运行什么软件。
当所有人都运行包含同样规则的软件,就产生了共识。
如果有一部分人选择运行不同规则的软件,不管出于什么原因,结果就是分叉。
当无法达成共识,分叉是自然而然、不可避免的。
任何节点都有分叉的自由。
缺乏支持的分叉会慢慢消亡,这也是自然选择。


下面,针对公会的公告,我简要的回复一下。

在我看来,公会已经不是以前的那个公会了。公会曾经是以推动 BitShares 发展为第一目标的。但自从教授退出、文华离开,而 星在飘 等人的影响力逐渐提升,公会已经失去初心。我曾经也是公会的一员,也曾为公会推动 BitShares 社区发展献策献力。然而,当公会把小团体利益置于 BitShares 整体利益之上的那一天起,我也选择了离开。公会的票数,从最高点超过 3 亿,到现在 2.2 亿,可以看出端倪。

公会在公告中声称代表“整个社区”、“大票仓达成一致意见”、“多数见证人支持”,明显是夸大事实。事实是,公会 2.2 亿票,占总流通币量 30 亿的 7% ;公会 600 多个代理帐号,占系统内总帐号数量(200万左右)的 0.03% ;所谓的大票仓, b-dex ,其代理票权完全来自于 alt ,而 alt 本人已发帖明确声明不支持分叉( alt 言行不一的情况另说 );所谓多数见证人支持,是因为公会威胁独立见证人群体不成功、把一些傀儡投上去了而已,况且很多其他票仓都还没有表态,最终投票结果如何还不一定。

公会补丁的主要开发者,在我看来,是有些技术实力的。此人我也曾极力争取,希望其能为 BitShares 贡献力量,而不是走歪路。但想依靠他来独立支持一条链,我的个人观点,说难听点,还差得远。如果公会能找到其他资深开发者加盟,可能还差不多。我在微信群里也说过,如果公会和平分叉,不干扰当前链的正常运行,分叉方面我愿意免费提供一段时间的技术支持。

关于公会声称我“拒不交出” github 权限的问题,我在微信里的原文是这样的:“github权限,可以给有能力有责任的人 ... 有能力的随时可以一起帮忙管理,我很乐意 ... baip 库给你们管了,管成什么样了?”
我的 github 权限,是通过长时间做贡献、获得社区认可,才获得的,而不是张口要来的。我要对这个权限负责,不可能随便转让,否则就是对社区不负责任。
我一直在找寻合适的开发者参与开发和管理社区项目。遇到有能力有责任的开发者,最大化授权也是常态。
任何人想要权限,请先做贡献。
witness:

Offline xixi002020

Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2020, 04:04:12 am »
你这个说明有点晚,
现在重点是 不能让工会继续瞎搞了, 拉票怼吧,获得大户的支持是一部分,散户韭菜的支持也很重要。仍有大量认同4.0的投票规则或不认同现在工会行为的散户 韭菜!现在这部分人的票 没去处。
巨蟹 大山 abit 或其他人  建群 宣传 拉票 怼吧!
« Last Edit: August 20, 2020, 04:08:22 am by xixi002020 »

Offline matle85

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Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2020, 05:59:43 am »
I'm glad you took this step and think the changes are beneficial for Bitshares governance.

I would have preferred change by consensus but consensus was broken and corrupted by debt voting.

As stated I think the staking vote multiplier should be lower but all the other changes are clear and dramatic improvements to consensus mechanism.

Offline juhni

Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2020, 06:31:57 am »
Just out of curiosity I investigated a bit of the cn-vote collateral voting.

Top 100 proxied to cn-vote
Voting power: 200 705 215,96 BTS
BTS balance: 35 289 778,49 BTS
So 165 415 437,47 of current cn-vote voting power comes from collateral.

Offline callmeluc

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Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #9 on: August 20, 2020, 08:10:38 am »
旗帜鲜明支持Abit。你们这群智障看明白点,蛇鼠一窝,党同伐异,无所不用其极,有能力想做事的一个个都被排挤走了,哪个王朝不是这样的剧本,被一帮奸佞之人搞烂的?要是这次Abit都被你们搞伤了,那可就真的只剩下自己玩泥巴了。

现在跑去找工会要票支持的见证人,你们挨个查一查,他们自己手里都有多少币?别被人卖了还帮人数钱,什么公平正义,抢的只是见证人每个月那点币子。

特别是星飘这种表演艺术家,你们自己查查,他到底有多少BTS?我敢保证,他肯定闪烁其词,跟你绕弯子,任谁也问不出有多少,他一定不会告诉任何人他的币在哪个地址,因为他压根没多少,不然也不会来捞见证人那点,哈哈哈哈。

这点招数还看不明白?带节奏歪曲事实,故意制造矛盾冲突,挑起民愤,然后接机收走不明真相群众的代理票权,然后见证人能捞点就捞点,就这么回事。想啥呢?

不管别人怎么看,如果硬分叉成功,我第一个站出来全部清仓。
« Last Edit: August 20, 2020, 08:13:50 am by callmeluc »
BTS_自扯自淡

Offline lochaling

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Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #10 on: August 20, 2020, 08:35:06 am »
个人建议可以加上5年锁仓16倍票权,10年锁仓32倍票权,甚至20年64倍票权。


这个建议好,有利于外部资金进来。
若这个规则生效,散户有个小二十万,买上100万BTS,再锁仓10年,3200万的票权就有一定的影响力了。
当然,衰减期限得调整一下,不能两年就衰减完了,不然人也没积极性。


制造条件,让外部资金进来参与系统建设,BTS才会越来越好。


锁两年八倍票权,锁四年16倍票权,锁8年32倍票权,锁16年64倍票权。


Offline Thul3

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Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #11 on: August 20, 2020, 09:22:21 am »
I'm glad you took this step and think the changes are beneficial for Bitshares governance.

I would have preferred change by consensus but consensus was broken and corrupted by debt voting.

As stated I think the staking vote multiplier should be lower but all the other changes are clear and dramatic improvements to consensus mechanism.


You guys are really funny and all the lies you spread on chats are just a shame.

First of all who was and still is the most corrupted member on bitshares?
Who broke any consensus and caused that community said bitshares is corrupted and governance failed ?
Was it the action of Abit who gave a total fuck about community opinion or consensus ?
Did he installed workers as BAIP which were normal workers to get it done destroying the governance and voting system even the whole community were against it ?
Was it Abit who supported scam workers and gave a total fuck that the western community where against it and called him a scammer ?
All the abuses that people left bitshares and now you guys are saying he did good because  now workers will be voted in?

You post BS like TnT will be voted and and other important workers.
Let me tell you Mr Brain who voices always his opinion with wrong facts.It was Abit and Bitcrab who refused TnT and people like me tried to push it forward.
So claiming he will now able to push it forward is a blatant lie.He could have done it anytime.
You say core prelude worker was a good worker fixing many small issues.
Thats the next big BS claim.It was said we should work on p2p and other defi.
I even insistet to get it done quickly to not lose the train.
What we got is an inside deal between Abit,Bitcrab,DL who took the support of BEOS and CN-Vote convincing them about their BS.DL even attacking defi .You can read it on forum or chats.Its not hidden i had a dispute with DL for not working on DEFI.
All we got thanks to the core prelude worker is peanuts.Wasted half a year for getting taxation features mainly.
People asking why we are not on DEFI pump and why bitshares gets ignored.
Is that progress ?
Who is responsible for it ?Abit ,Bitcrab,DL ?

And you with your never ending BS claims support exectly these people who refused to get pegg back,who changed the core worker into total BS,Who broke any consensus and act like kings of BTS deciding in closed groups where noone else can participate.
Its basicly their view or no other.

MM contest was called a scam and corruption and proof of lack of governance.
Who did it ?Abit ?


Who gets soon 70 Million voting power ?The most corrupted member on bitshares whoo gave till today a total fuck about communities demand and decission.

So who the fuck are you supporting again ?The most corrupted guy who you accused before to destroy bitshares?


Telegram chat demanding daily from him to unban all people.
Does he care?

So how do you come to the conclusion he gives today a fuck about communities demand ?
Has any corruption stopped because of him?Or because of the actions of others who are trying to kick out all corrupted people from key positions ?

Seriously would Abit succeed you would have maybe a new voting system (instead of waiting a bit and doing it the right way without the benefit stacking for a special group) but you would have the old corrupted people in power where you demanded changes.

Think once again who were the most corrupted people in bitshares who gave a fuck about community voting.

All it is about is keeping old corrupted people in position and key functions.

You have more votes ?Who gives a fuck if you have more vote now if they fuck any consensus like befor when holding key positions.


Funny now all BEOS supporters come out from their wholes

Even Liondani and Evangelist were able to make a post in committee after so long

Funny they were not able to make noice in committee when corruption happened or suggestions what to change or were even able to vote to get pegg back.
That was a problem for them.
But now they promote to support Abit so they will restore pegg which they could have done before but refused.

Sorry but if you want to support corruption you can go on.Foreigners are tired of Abit and a trojan horse won't change this sentiment.
To limit corrupted people like Abit it's difficult.You see the fight arround the centralization arround him.
CN-Vote has 210 million votes.No big deal to get workers voted in which really has support of majority.

However soon you will have  people like Abit who will have 70 million votes who blocked TNT,Pegg,Real core worker (defi),Fresh DEV's,
supported scam workers and all other staff  i won't repeat 100 times.


You remember Abits reply to everyone who accused him of supporting scams ?
GET MORE BTS.
It will be no diffrent just that you put these corrupted people back in power including DL and BEOS

Also the misleading BS propaganda that CN-Vote used CEX votes to block workers.ZB's votes where in control of Bitcrab who supports Abit and not CN-Vote.

So you support total corruption and nothing else when supporting Abit
« Last Edit: August 20, 2020, 09:50:07 am by Thul3 »

Offline lilianwen

Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #12 on: August 20, 2020, 11:48:17 am »
I'm glad you took this step and think the changes are beneficial for Bitshares governance.

I would have preferred change by consensus but consensus was broken and corrupted by debt voting.

As stated I think the staking vote multiplier should be lower but all the other changes are clear and dramatic improvements to consensus mechanism.


You guys are really funny and all the lies you spread on chats are just a shame.

First of all who was and still is the most corrupted member on bitshares?
Who broke any consensus and caused that community said bitshares is corrupted and governance failed ?
Was it the action of Abit who gave a total fuck about community opinion or consensus ?
Did he installed workers as BAIP which were normal workers to get it done destroying the governance and voting system even the whole community were against it ?
Was it Abit who supported scam workers and gave a total fuck that the western community where against it and called him a scammer ?
All the abuses that people left bitshares and now you guys are saying he did good because  now workers will be voted in?

You post BS like TnT will be voted and and other important workers.
Let me tell you Mr Brain who voices always his opinion with wrong facts.It was Abit and Bitcrab who refused TnT and people like me tried to push it forward.
So claiming he will now able to push it forward is a blatant lie.He could have done it anytime.
You say core prelude worker was a good worker fixing many small issues.
Thats the next big BS claim.It was said we should work on p2p and other defi.
I even insistet to get it done quickly to not lose the train.
What we got is an inside deal between Abit,Bitcrab,DL who took the support of BEOS and CN-Vote convincing them about their BS.DL even attacking defi .You can read it on forum or chats.Its not hidden i had a dispute with DL for not working on DEFI.
All we got thanks to the core prelude worker is peanuts.Wasted half a year for getting taxation features mainly.
People asking why we are not on DEFI pump and why bitshares gets ignored.
Is that progress ?
Who is responsible for it ?Abit ,Bitcrab,DL ?

And you with your never ending BS claims support exectly these people who refused to get pegg back,who changed the core worker into total BS,Who broke any consensus and act like kings of BTS deciding in closed groups where noone else can participate.
Its basicly their view or no other.

MM contest was called a scam and corruption and proof of lack of governance.
Who did it ?Abit ?


Who gets soon 70 Million voting power ?The most corrupted member on bitshares whoo gave till today a total fuck about communities demand and decission.

So who the fuck are you supporting again ?The most corrupted guy who you accused before to destroy bitshares?


Telegram chat demanding daily from him to unban all people.
Does he care?

So how do you come to the conclusion he gives today a fuck about communities demand ?
Has any corruption stopped because of him?Or because of the actions of others who are trying to kick out all corrupted people from key positions ?

Seriously would Abit succeed you would have maybe a new voting system (instead of waiting a bit and doing it the right way without the benefit stacking for a special group) but you would have the old corrupted people in power where you demanded changes.

Think once again who were the most corrupted people in bitshares who gave a fuck about community voting.

All it is about is keeping old corrupted people in position and key functions.

You have more votes ?Who gives a fuck if you have more vote now if they fuck any consensus like befor when holding key positions.


Funny now all BEOS supporters come out from their wholes

Even Liondani and Evangelist were able to make a post in committee after so long

Funny they were not able to make noice in committee when corruption happened or suggestions what to change or were even able to vote to get pegg back.
That was a problem for them.
But now they promote to support Abit so they will restore pegg which they could have done before but refused.

Sorry but if you want to support corruption you can go on.Foreigners are tired of Abit and a trojan horse won't change this sentiment.
To limit corrupted people like Abit it's difficult.You see the fight arround the centralization arround him.
CN-Vote has 210 million votes.No big deal to get workers voted in which really has support of majority.

However soon you will have  people like Abit who will have 70 million votes who blocked TNT,Pegg,Real core worker (defi),Fresh DEV's,
supported scam workers and all other staff  i won't repeat 100 times.


You remember Abits reply to everyone who accused him of supporting scams ?
GET MORE BTS.
It will be no diffrent just that you put these corrupted people back in power including DL and BEOS

Also the misleading BS propaganda that CN-Vote used CEX votes to block workers.ZB's votes where in control of Bitcrab who supports Abit and not CN-Vote.

So you support total corruption and nothing else when supporting Abit

you pile of shit did't do anything right,why should others follow your shit rules? we will make a better one which refuse people like you.

Offline twitter

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Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #13 on: August 20, 2020, 01:43:41 pm »
翻译成中文:

您支持abit就是支持彻头彻尾的腐败
                                        Thurl3  --这次abit像特洛伊木马一样的对付比特股也不会改变这种厌倦情绪
  
  你们真的很有趣,您在聊天中散布的所有谎言都太可笑了。

  首先,谁曾经是,现在仍然是,比特股上最腐败的成员? 谁打破了任何共识并导致社区表示比特股已损坏且治理失败? 难道不是Abit完全不顾社区意见和共识的举动吗? 难道不是abit他设置了BAIP工人破坏了整个社区的治理和投票系统? 难道不是Abit支持了骗局的做市机器人项目,并且彻底搞砸了,整个西方社区反对他并称他为骗子? 人们现在留下的所有辱骂都是比特股,现在你们都说abit他做得很好,因为现在所有需要使用资金池的工人将在新的规则下轻松获得投票。


让我告诉你Brain先生,Abit总是以错误的事实表达自己的观点。Abit和Bitcrab拒绝了TnT,是我这样的人试图将其推向前进。 Abit声称自己现在能够推动这一进步是一个公然的谎言,他是可以随时做到的,但就是不做。abit说核心开发者是解决许多小问题的好工作者(就是混日子领工资的意思)。 当初我们核心开发团队应该致力于p2p和其他defi。 我坚持要尽快完成它,不要失去上车的机会。 但我们得到的是Abit,Bitcrab,DL之间的内部交易, DL甚至攻击了defi。您可以在论坛或聊天中阅读当初的争论,我与DL有争议但他一直拒绝开发DEFI,因为他要做做市机器人dexbot。正是因为这个dexbox让我们无法有资金开发defi。浪费了半年,只完成税收功能。 人们问为什么我们bts不在DEFI上,为什么比特股份额会被忽略。 那是进步吗? 谁负责?Abit,Bitcrab,DL? 而abit您却以永无止境的声称完全支持这些拒绝让锚定恢复的人,他们将核心工作人员变成了全部狗屎,他们打破了任何共识,并像BTS的国王一样,决定了没有其他人可以参加的封闭小组。 从根本上说,他们要主宰bts。


挂单竞赛被称为骗局,腐败和缺乏治理的证明。 是谁做的? abit。谁将很快获得7000万投票权?Abit这个比特股上最腐败的成员,直到今天,他还是对社区的需求和决定视而不见。
那么,你们又该支持谁呢?你们之前指控破坏比特股最腐败的家伙abit? 电报聊天每天都要求他不要踢所有反对他的人。 他在乎吗?


您现在知道abit他今天对社区需求的看法了吧? 是否因为他而停止了任何腐败行为?还是因为其他人试图将所有腐败人士逐出关键职位而采取的行动? abit会成功的话,您可能会拥有一个新的投票系统(肯定不是以正确的方式进行选举的系统),但是您将拥有老派腐败的人掌权,迫使您做出改变。 再想一想,谁是比特股中最腐败的人,他们对社区投票感到不满。 abit所要做的就是让腐败的老人们保持职务和关键职能。如果abit他们现在拥有更多的投票权,他们在担任关键职位时像以前一样的共识失败。 有趣的是,现在所有BEOS的支持者全都出来了。即使很长时间之后,Liondani和Evangelist都能够在委员会中任职。有趣的是,当腐败发生或提出更改或建议投票的建议时,他们不愿意行使委员会职权同意支持让锚定回来,因为这对他们来说是个问题。但是现在他们却站出来了对abit表示支持,因此他们将恢复以前可以做但被拒绝的恢复锚定,为了在社区换取美好的声誉。 抱歉,如果您想支持腐败,您可以继续进行。西方人对abit感到厌倦,这次abit像特洛伊木马一样的对付比特股也不会改变这种厌倦情绪。 想要让像Abit这样腐败的人有起码的道德是很难的。您将会看到围绕他的斗争白热化。


CN-Vote仅拥有2.1亿张选票,要让你的工人在投票中真正获得多数支持不是很困难的事情。 但是很快您将拥有像abit这样腐败透顶的人,他们将获得7,000万票,这些人阻止了TNT,Pegg,真正的核心defi工作人员(defi),新的开发人员,支持的骗子工作人员(如理事在核心团队吃的空饷)。。。。您还记得Abit对所有指责他支持欺诈的人的答复吗? “我是上帝,你对我有什么办法”。 让包括DL和BEOS在内的这些腐败人士重新掌权,比特股今后不会有什么不同,而且CN-Vote使用CEX投票阻止工人的狗屎宣传也具有误导性.ZB的投票控制着巨蟹而巨蟹支持Abit而不是CN-Vote的 。 因此,您支持abit就是支持彻头彻尾的腐败



I'm glad you took this step and think the changes are beneficial for Bitshares governance.

I would have preferred change by consensus but consensus was broken and corrupted by debt voting.

As stated I think the staking vote multiplier should be lower but all the other changes are clear and dramatic improvements to consensus mechanism.


You guys are really funny and all the lies you spread on chats are just a shame.

First of all who was and still is the most corrupted member on bitshares?
Who broke any consensus and caused that community said bitshares is corrupted and governance failed ?
Was it the action of Abit who gave a total fuck about community opinion or consensus ?
Did he installed workers as BAIP which were normal workers to get it done destroying the governance and voting system even the whole community were against it ?
Was it Abit who supported scam workers and gave a total fuck that the western community where against it and called him a scammer ?
All the abuses that people left bitshares and now you guys are saying he did good because  now workers will be voted in?

You post BS like TnT will be voted and and other important workers.
Let me tell you Mr Brain who voices always his opinion with wrong facts.It was Abit and Bitcrab who refused TnT and people like me tried to push it forward.
So claiming he will now able to push it forward is a blatant lie.He could have done it anytime.
You say core prelude worker was a good worker fixing many small issues.
Thats the next big BS claim.It was said we should work on p2p and other defi.
I even insistet to get it done quickly to not lose the train.
What we got is an inside deal between Abit,Bitcrab,DL who took the support of BEOS and CN-Vote convincing them about their BS.DL even attacking defi .You can read it on forum or chats.Its not hidden i had a dispute with DL for not working on DEFI.
All we got thanks to the core prelude worker is peanuts.Wasted half a year for getting taxation features mainly.
People asking why we are not on DEFI pump and why bitshares gets ignored.
Is that progress ?
Who is responsible for it ?Abit ,Bitcrab,DL ?

And you with your never ending BS claims support exectly these people who refused to get pegg back,who changed the core worker into total BS,Who broke any consensus and act like kings of BTS deciding in closed groups where noone else can participate.
Its basicly their view or no other.

MM contest was called a scam and corruption and proof of lack of governance.
Who did it ?Abit ?


Who gets soon 70 Million voting power ?The most corrupted member on bitshares whoo gave till today a total fuck about communities demand and decission.

So who the fuck are you supporting again ?The most corrupted guy who you accused before to destroy bitshares?


Telegram chat demanding daily from him to unban all people.
Does he care?

So how do you come to the conclusion he gives today a fuck about communities demand ?
Has any corruption stopped because of him?Or because of the actions of others who are trying to kick out all corrupted people from key positions ?

Seriously would Abit succeed you would have maybe a new voting system (instead of waiting a bit and doing it the right way without the benefit stacking for a special group) but you would have the old corrupted people in power where you demanded changes.

Think once again who were the most corrupted people in bitshares who gave a fuck about community voting.

All it is about is keeping old corrupted people in position and key functions.

You have more votes ?Who gives a fuck if you have more vote now if they fuck any consensus like befor when holding key positions.


Funny now all BEOS supporters come out from their wholes

Even Liondani and Evangelist were able to make a post in committee after so long

Funny they were not able to make noice in committee when corruption happened or suggestions what to change or were even able to vote to get pegg back.
That was a problem for them.
But now they promote to support Abit so they will restore pegg which they could have done before but refused.

Sorry but if you want to support corruption you can go on.Foreigners are tired of Abit and a trojan horse won't change this sentiment.
To limit corrupted people like Abit it's difficult.You see the fight arround the centralization arround him.
CN-Vote has 210 million votes.No big deal to get workers voted in which really has support of majority.

However soon you will have  people like Abit who will have 70 million votes who blocked TNT,Pegg,Real core worker (defi),Fresh DEV's,
supported scam workers and all other staff  i won't repeat 100 times.


You remember Abits reply to everyone who accused him of supporting scams ?
GET MORE BTS.
It will be no diffrent just that you put these corrupted people back in power including DL and BEOS

Also the misleading BS propaganda that CN-Vote used CEX votes to block workers.ZB's votes where in control of Bitcrab who supports Abit and not CN-Vote.

So you support total corruption and nothing else when supporting Abit
« Last Edit: August 20, 2020, 02:55:13 pm by twitter »
witness:

Offline gghi

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Re: 关于4.0的几点说明
« Reply #14 on: August 21, 2020, 08:45:13 am »
      BTS4.0版本是巨大的进步,无论一票一投还是锁仓增加票权都是优越的治理模式。呼吁BTS持仓者支持4.0规则,抵制分叉行为,推进4.0规则进一步优化。从大局考虑BTS的价格上涨才是持仓者最大的利益,仅仅为了支持见证人挣点矿工费,不过是蝇头小利而已。