Author Topic: You should read this  (Read 24862 times)

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Offline jwiz168

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For marketing purposes, it's a GOOD thing to have a crytocurrency product COMPARE to bitcoin.  What is not good is giving a bit of your trade secrets to the one of at least we say "competitor".  Bitcoin has only its value to prove its profitability. Investors only exchange it to and from fiat to earn. Unlike the concept of bitshare where services are the main stream of profit.

Offline luckybit

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It depends on which human beings you air drop to. Just giving it to Bitcoiners who probably stole their coins in a hack? That's not cool.

How many Bitcoin hacks have we heard about lately? But I do think there are some coins where it's definitely a good idea to form initial partnerships. I think some coins are better than others.

I think if you want to change things, don't dilute anyone's shares. Find a way to do it from AGS so that everyone who already has their shares are locked in and it only affects future purchasers of AGS.

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Offline jwiz168

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[quote author=Decentralized Application link=topic=4107.msg51822#msg51822

So you are AGAINST airdropping exclusively onto wallets below a certain total number of Bitcoins?

Why would you want the people with thousands of Bitcoins in their wallet to gain a higher share of Bitshares than those with only a few?

[/quote]

I never indicate this as I only persist Im not into airdropping bitshares to bitcoin holders be it small or large quantities.


Offline donkeypong

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AIRDROPPING bitshares for bitcoin holders, I might say would lessen the value. Bitshare is the future when it comes to business perspective.

Call it marketing costs. Spend a little and it increases the value of your business. 

Offline jwiz168

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As a bitshare investor, I had to beat my ass  just to get my PTS/AGS for the Feb 28 snapshot . I believe with that alone would make bitshare VERY valuable.   Now here is a proposal of AIRDROPPING bitshares for bitcoin holders, I might say would lessen the value. Bitshare is the future when it comes to business perspective. 

Offline luckybit

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Yes, a currency and a stock are not the same.

Bitshares may be structured like a company with shares, but its "shares" are dynamic (you can either buy, hold, and forget or speculate and trade a number of crypto-equities based on the common currencies of today (dollar/gold/BTC)).  Try that with shares of Herbalife.  Bitshares is a dynamic application much like a currency (use it every day for trading, speculating, coin tossing, gambling etc).  So Bitshares is a stock that is a proxy for currencies so that it can be traded like one. In other words, it is a stock that is designed to behave like currencies. 

What does the price of Bitcoin relative to the USD have to do with anything?

What does the definition of Bitshares have to do with the fact that we want them to increase in value as much as possible?

What will happen to the "airdropped" Bitshares onto the 1ANGELwQwWxMmbdaSWhWLqBEtPTkWb8uDc address that i3 owns?  They will not get any because we will restrict our airdrop to only wallets with balances of under 10BTC.  Anybody who has more that 10BTC in a single wallet will be seen as an oligarch, and no sympathy will be given to them (nor goodwill withdrawn from us) for not airdropping our new decentralized application on the wealthy 1%.

Donkeypong has a great idea for a new poll

Which coin communities would you most want to share a beer with:

Peercoin?

or Beercoin?

I see no reason to give to Bitcoin holders at all. Especially after so many coins have been stolen.

Do the air drop carefully and strategically if you do it.
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Offline jwiz168

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What will happen to the "airdropped" Bitshares onto the 1ANGELwQwWxMmbdaSWhWLqBEtPTkWb8uDc address that i3 owns?  They will not get any because we will restrict our airdrop to only wallets with balances of under 10BTC.  Anybody who has more that 10BTC in a single wallet will be seen as an oligarch, and no sympathy will be given to them (nor goodwill withdrawn from us) for not airdropping our new decentralized application on the wealthy 1%.



I REALLY DON'T sink in on this . Too skeptical .  >:( Im beginning to question the real motive behind  this AIRDROP.

Offline luckybit

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Let's be fair though, when have shares ever been given away for free for any company? They shouldn't be, they can only be traded.

I use to be very hard-over on this perspective, but then I remembered that the 'founders' of a company always got their shares for 'free'.   Bootstrapping a decentralized company requires a large number of initial shareholders.    The idea of airdropping to create a wide initial user base is a great way to form an initial partnership. 

However, if you have investors fund the development of a company then of course they should receive more than the airdrop users get for free.

In my opinion if there should be such an air drop it should be to churches, non profits, and people outside of the Bitcoin community so that it can grow the community.

I think the way to do it would be to set it up as a charity. Not everyone deserves free Bitshares, but if they are willing to try and help others or are associated with groups who do that then maybe a case can be made.

I think the Bitcoin miners at this time are acting very greedy to the detriment of the decentralization movement. I don't want them to be rewarded just because mining Bitcoins isn't profitable. I'm not against rewarding miners if Bitshares are pumped in the background (their cpu resources would purchase Bitshares instead of Blackcoins).

Someone mentioned Ethereum? I actually think it might be wise to collaborate with Ethereum and other Bitcoin 2.0 developers. Maybe give some free Angelshares to people who own Ether and in exchange maybe let Ethereum give some Ether to people who own Angelshares. Also there is computing for good (BOINC) which can cure diseases and reward in Bitshares.

I think giveaways are good but its important to do so carefully in order to grow your strategic alliances.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2014, 02:00:15 am by luckybit »
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Offline jwiz168

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Bitcoin??? I have some reservations regarding this idea. Now that a lot of investors donated their bitcoin to crowd fund AGS,  what is the point of giving stakes to bitcoin holders? Who ever owns the address 1ANGELwQwWxMmbdaSWhWLqBEtPTkWb8uDc which has currently more than 2000 btc, is the luckiest btc holder. No mining, No POS no difficulty?
« Last Edit: April 12, 2014, 01:58:11 am by jwiz168 »

Offline luckybit

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But I don't see a point in paying the elite. I'd rather give money to those who have less than pay tribute. Give them to charity before giving them to Bitcoin miners who already have too much power over the network.

Increase adoption with who? I honestly think you'd increase adoption just as much by giving Bitshares as charity to churches around the world. Why give it to miners when Proof of Work isn't benefiting Bitshares? Let them mine for Bitshares to earn it.


Bitcoin miners are not the same as bitcoin holders.  People with wallets are people who have bought into the cryptocurrency ecosystem.  There is no reason to think they're elite.

A logarithm to multiply account balances is like the good ol US income tax.  The higher balances pay more.  So the effect of the elite will be minimized, but they'll still get more in shares.  Maybe just cap the share # given to each wallet.  I'm not sure, but I am not for supporting the "elite".  Far from it. 

Earning coins by mining ?  Ok so they turn around and sell the coins on the market and they're bought up by the same group of people.  What good does that do?

Now giving away to every church... you might have something... but the logistics !

What it does is it markets Bitshares. Miners will mine anything which is profitable. The pool is set up to mine whatever is most profitable for them, then sell it for Bitshares.

Over time the price of Bitshares goes up as it captures the value of all coins mined. Additionally it markets a primary utility of Bitshares which is as a store of value.

Miners need a place to park their wealth. Bitcoin is not a good place for that and wont be for a while, and we don't want them to cash out because thats bad for everyone.

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Offline luckybit

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The idea I put forth at least required they mine for it.

NO NO NO, mining is *WORSE* than doing nothing. It is harmful!

Mining which is going to happen regardless.

The idea I put forth is based around Blackcoin where anyone can mine for any coin and the pool automatically buys Bitshares and pays out in Bitshares. That actually makes plenty of sense.

But to say "mining is worse" in all circumstances isn't true. Some altcoins have to be mined because mining is how it's distributed. Some are going to be mined whether or not you like mining.

But just because people have to mine and some do so professionally, it doesn't mean that their mining cannot contribute to Bitshares. If miners store their value in Bitshares then Bitshares is marketed to miners. It's not directly given away, they mine some coins which get traded for Bitshares which gets paid out to them.

That is a far better way of doing it because the price of Bitshares will rise. You try giving Bitshares away for free and the price of Bitshares does not rise. As a result its better to let people mine or earn them and cpu resources are worth money.

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Offline gamey

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But I don't see a point in paying the elite. I'd rather give money to those who have less than pay tribute. Give them to charity before giving them to Bitcoin miners who already have too much power over the network.

Increase adoption with who? I honestly think you'd increase adoption just as much by giving Bitshares as charity to churches around the world. Why give it to miners when Proof of Work isn't benefiting Bitshares? Let them mine for Bitshares to earn it.


Bitcoin miners are not the same as bitcoin holders.  People with wallets are people who have bought into the cryptocurrency ecosystem.  There is no reason to think they're elite.

A logarithm to multiply account balances is like the good ol US income tax.  The higher balances pay more.  So the effect of the elite will be minimized, but they'll still get more in shares.  Maybe just cap the share # given to each wallet.  I'm not sure, but I am not for supporting the "elite".  Far from it. 

Earning coins by mining ?  Ok so they turn around and sell the coins on the market and they're bought up by the same group of people.  What good does that do?

Now giving away to every church... you might have something... but the logistics !
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Offline donkeypong

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Why Bitcoin? If I had to have a beer with some random people from one of those communities, I think I'd have a lot more in common with Peercoin folks. Cutting them in is worth considering. But Bitcoin has bigger numbers of people and the media sometimes cover it. They don't cover anything else. This drop would become a Bitcoin-related story. If we dropped only to Peercoin folks, the media would see it as two minor league teams collaborating. Bitcoin is the major leagues (and this is a stealth takeover)! Litecoin is OK, but why settle for second place? And the only reason to cut in Doge or Redd would be for the social marketing. Half the Doge community are developmentally disabled, I'm pretty sure.

Offline luckybit

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Why would it be a good idea to give Bitshares to people for nothing?

Because everyone else is doing it:

http://cryptocoinfaucets.com/
A currency and a stock are not the same. Currencies are supposed to be owned by a lot of people. Stock just has to appreciate in price over time.

I do want the stock to be held by a lot of people, I just think Litecoin and Peercoin are both a more decentralized group than Bitcoin. Why choose to give equity to Bitcoin now? The falling price is the only reason people are talking like this.

And honestly this thinking is as counter intuitive to me as rewarding bankers with bonuses right after the banking crisis.

« Last Edit: April 12, 2014, 01:40:11 am by luckybit »
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Offline luckybit

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I've noticed that most people who hate taxes/welfare etc are mostly upset that others get something free that they worked hard for.
I never claimed to hate taxes or welfare.

But I don't see a point in paying the elite. I'd rather give money to those who have less than pay tribute. Give them to charity before giving them to Bitcoin miners who already have too much power over the network.
I said we do it to increase adoption and interest in the Bitshares system as a whole.  <- This is true, longterm I am not sure what to think.
Increase adoption with who? I honestly think you'd increase adoption just as much by giving Bitshares as charity to churches around the world. Why give it to miners when Proof of Work isn't benefiting Bitshares? Let them mine for Bitshares to earn it.

But if you want to give your shares away to Mark Karpeles and friends go ahead. I see it as a tax which wont benefit anything.

Bitcoin prices are down so people are getting creative to try to pump it back up instead of actually having patience.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2014, 01:38:56 am by luckybit »
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