Author Topic: A bit of a change . . .  (Read 7461 times)

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Offline fuzzy



Contrary to all of ABL's assertions, centralized media is a bad thing.  It gives a lot of power into very few.  I've already had Adam threatening Bitshares media community because of my response s (and/or fuznuts) to him.  His insists he is right and we are wrong.  (Whatever I am wrong about, I have no clue.)

So let me clarify one last time.

6) Adam keeps wanting to say all this is because everyone is a blind choir member fanboy for Bitshares and thus no one has a valid opinion. (As if we disagree with Adam about I3 missing shipping dates !?!?!)  Adam creates these fantasies in his head so he can write off any valid criticism.  It is pathetic.  Yes, I am a fan of bitshares but I am also a fan of all the related techs.  When you disagree with someone it isn't an all or nothing proposition.  With Adam it is, no one can have a valid dissenting opinion.  EVERY dissenting opinion here he labels as being because people are Bitshares fanboys.  What nonsense.

7) So much of this happened because legendface apparently acted unilaterally and caused a lot of bad blood initially.  And in his defense, he may very well have had valid reasons.  Even if he had already made the decision he shoud have approached fuz and at least tried to get him onboard.

That about sums it up.  "Stupid f***ing internet drama".


 6.  Imo gamey is right about this...

 7. Pretty much true, but that was not legends intent. I suspect this is somethig that kind of had to happen...things like this are chaotic and honestly the experience has made me realize I have some thinking to do with regard to the central issues around the intial frustration both legend and I certainly felt (for different reasons mind you)

At adam...admit for once you could have gone about it in a better way or dont...really doesnt matter. As for you inviting me to "your" platform, this is precisely the reason i didnt want to be a part of it.  Nothing against you...just the truth. About the quality of my work or sycophantic nature of my questions...im humbly helping invictus who seems often wholly incapable of marketing themselves, for the community and because I believe in dan and the true potential of what he is doing. The community mostly asks questions and i serve to relay them.  You are always more than welcome to ask dan hard questions during a hangout...otherwise I really dont care how I come off.

I leave my "mistakes" in the content because it happened and it is real. Someday I might do my own self edits and make a "show" for the kicks of it. People might someday make funny remixes of my fuck ups--who knows? I want to show noobies they do not need to fear speaking up and learning to give voice to the communities they believe in; to know everyone fucks up and not to be afraid to try.  If someone like you wants to take that content and mix it in a certain fashion it is there...for humor or to get at the points you feel are important and under covered...then use it as your own, I say do it...but recognize it started in the bitshares community.

Finally, about your earning money from your project and reinvestment into platforms, adam, that makes you very similar to a journalist AND venture capitalist.  It is a good BUSINESS to be in those niches...especially this early on.  To say you are not running a business, then, feels a bit of a stretch.  I consider "your" platform to be as decentralized as it can be until DACs finally come online to change the paradigm...I did not want to be part of lets talk bitcoin simply because I felt there needed to be a competitor of sorts in every
community, and that I wanted to help invictus by starting it there...learnin my strengths, weaknesses collaborating with people who are passionate and see what (i believe) many of the positives of their project. I then wanted to do the same in a other community...later down the road, to help prepare them to provide people like you with more unedited, open sourced content.

@legend none of this conversation has changed my willingness to help you...if we as a group cannot overcome misunderstandings then we should question our ability to inform people.  This thread must have gotten pretty heated way after I simmered down, rethought things and pretty much chalked it up to a misunderstanding.  Id personally like to chat sometime offline to see how we can most fairly construct the policies.  Perhaps youmcan invite people to join up and give their thoughts on the matter...

@gamey...I am glad you disagree with adam.  Im also glad when you disagree with me.  Calling eachother names though does just demean ourselves as much as it demeans those who call them.  I say this because ive learned it on more than a few occasions personally.  Though I sometimes think both side feel like they are banging their heads on each other...there is a LOT of energy behind both sides' beliefs...this means we should explore further


Lastly...all I want to do is organize things for people who want to create content and help them.  Legend has seen what I can do (thanks to dans support) and has directly benefitted.  There will be others who do as well. And I will never require a damn thing other than repsect for the work im attempting to do.

« Last Edit: May 24, 2014, 12:43:44 am by fuznuts »
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Offline gamey

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Contrary to all of ABL's assertions, centralized media is a bad thing.  It gives a lot of power into very few.  I've already had Adam threatening Bitshares media community because of my response s (and/or fuznuts) to him.  His insists he is right and we are wrong.  (Whatever I am wrong about, I have no clue.)

So let me clarify one last time.

1) I never said Adam has bad intentions, just that I have no interest in supporting centralized media.  Previously I had suggested helping legendface's website when I thought it was just him and fuz trying to make a go of it on their own.

2) In my explanation of my view,  I went out of my way to say I have NO reason to believe Adam was acting in bad faith.  It just doesn't follow that the LTB network will always be under the control of a benevolent actor.

3) There is a real battle for which technology will win and which won't.  Having completely independent media is a healthy thing.  Adam apparently disagrees, because he thinks everything should be under LTB and to even suggest centralized media is bad is insulting towards him apparently.

4) Again, there are no guarantees with centralized media.  It is better to just keep it decentralized.  Incentives creep into systems that aren't there are the start.  What we have now is not what we have in a year.

5) I was wrong in the assumption that Adam had something to do with the LTB rebranding of Legendface's show, but Adam has been wrong with his assumptions and miscategorizations what people say.

6) Adam keeps wanting to say all this is because everyone is a blind choir member fanboy for Bitshares and thus no one has a valid opinion. (As if we disagree with Adam about I3 missing shipping dates !?!?!)  Adam creates these fantasies in his head so he can write off any valid criticism.  It is pathetic.  Yes, I am a fan of bitshares but I am also a fan of all the related techs.  When you disagree with someone it isn't an all or nothing proposition.  With Adam it is, no one can have a valid dissenting opinion.  EVERY dissenting opinion here he labels as being because people are Bitshares fanboys.  What nonsense.

7) So much of this happened because legendface apparently acted unilaterally and caused a lot of bad blood initially.  And in his defense, he may very well have had valid reasons.  Even if he had already made the decision he shoud have approached fuz and at least tried to get him onboard.

That about sums it up.  "Stupid f***ing internet drama".

I speak for myself and only myself.

Offline gamey

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Who are you lol?  Did I *ever* talk to you before you attacked me?

I'm not even sure what game you are playing.  Yes, you've talked to me.  About media, no.  Is that a right answer ?


When did I ever say or suggest I wanted to work with you?  What the hell are you even talking about?  This thread was just Arthur announcing a decision he made about a show he produces.  I am totally confused what your problem is outside of not liking me, which is obvious.

Well I had offered to help legendface.  I rescinded and then he was asking for a 'webmaster'.  I think my wording as to why caused more issues than rescinding my offer.  I think he'd like help on the website and I just lost interest working on a site with the LTB brand.  Nothing more.  It really doesn't even directly involve you.

You asked me to expound on my basic issue, I did, which then you then went and appeared to misrepresent elsewhere.  Just not a fan of how you conduct yourself.
I speak for myself and only myself.

Offline AdamBLevine

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It's the ecosystem that develops when you have the core of the project in an indefensible position (Bitshares has not performed to development spec or internal expectations), after the dissenters realized their voices were not being heard, left.

 What's left is a defensive guard that's stuck whether for ideological (don't understand the mechanics but like the words used to describe them and the idea it'll make them rich) or mechanical (All-in AGS investors who have 100% tied their investments financial future to whether Invictus delivers something worthwhile... or not)

I'm hoping when Invictus delivers there will be a rush of rational investors, but again that requires them to deliver.

Your whole problem is your assumption in motivations.  My motivations do not align 100% with that of Bitshares.  There are other motivations going on here that are not readily quantified.  You, ABL, being the pompous person you are, assume you know what motivates everyone.  You simply don't.  You do not know what motivates me.  You seem to think your invitation should have everyone jump all over it.

So what you do is blame it all on Bitshares, because you don't want to confront the fact that I personally don't particularly like you or want to get involved in a media project under your umbrella organization.   I probably should have worded it different originally, but I troll the trolls and you took the bait.  My apologize for starting out the negativity and sending it down this path. W

I have not put enough into Bitshares to spend that much of my life in it.  Yet you've been making this claim that all my decisions are about Bitshares, and because of that, I am irrational to not wish to work with LTB.  WHatever you want to tell yourself buddy..

These posts alone show why I wouldn't want to work with you.  I basically think to highly of myself.

Quote
It's insulting that you haven't taken this away from my body of work, or the people I choose to share the platform with.   It's insulting you need me to explain this to you.

Oh yea, rule #88 in life.  Always know the history of Adam B Levine. Sorry Adam, we missed that one.  No, you're not exceptionally pompous.  Why would i ever question wanting to work on an LTB branded project?

Good grief.  I'll stop it here.

Who are you lol?  Did I *ever* talk to you before you attacked me?

I was interested, but I can't say I have much interest in working with stuff on LTB network. I was more interested in seeing a 100% independent media source that was not beholden to projects who put ads on the show.

You may not like my perspective on this project but I'd challenge you to support this statement.

When did I ever say or suggest I wanted to work with you?  What the hell are you even talking about?  This thread was just Arthur announcing a decision he made about a show he produces.  I am totally confused what your problem is outside of not liking me, which is obvious.
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Offline gamey

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It's the ecosystem that develops when you have the core of the project in an indefensible position (Bitshares has not performed to development spec or internal expectations), after the dissenters realized their voices were not being heard, left.

 What's left is a defensive guard that's stuck whether for ideological (don't understand the mechanics but like the words used to describe them and the idea it'll make them rich) or mechanical (All-in AGS investors who have 100% tied their investments financial future to whether Invictus delivers something worthwhile... or not)

I'm hoping when Invictus delivers there will be a rush of rational investors, but again that requires them to deliver.

Your whole problem is your assumption in motivations.  My motivations do not align 100% with that of Bitshares.  There are other motivations going on here that are not readily quantified.  You, ABL, being the pompous person you are, assume you know what motivates everyone.  You simply don't.  You do not know what motivates me.  You seem to think your invitation should have everyone jump all over it.

So what you do is blame it all on Bitshares, because you don't want to confront the fact that I personally don't particularly like you or want to get involved in a media project under your umbrella organization.   I probably should have worded it different originally, but I troll the trolls and you took the bait.  My apologize for starting out the negativity and sending it down this path. W

I have not put enough into Bitshares to spend that much of my life in it.  Yet you've been making this claim that all my decisions are about Bitshares, and because of that, I am irrational to not wish to work with LTB.  WHatever you want to tell yourself buddy..

These posts alone show why I wouldn't want to work with you.  I basically think to highly of myself.

Quote
It's insulting that you haven't taken this away from my body of work, or the people I choose to share the platform with.   It's insulting you need me to explain this to you.

Oh yea, rule #88 in life.  Always know the history of Adam B Levine. Sorry Adam, we missed that one.  No, you're not exceptionally pompous.  Why would i ever question wanting to work on an LTB branded project?

Good grief.  I'll stop it here. 
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Offline santaclause102

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I think you both need to stop discussing the issue on a level where on doubts the other one's intentions and/or skills.... That makes it a personal issue not a professional, content related issue that would be relevant for others...

Offline AdamBLevine

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lol.   Did you really say i'm a "businessman"?  You guys are hilarious.   

Whatever you need to say to make yourselves feel better!
How do u put food on the table adam?..my point is that people have to make a living.

Id love to have a better understanding but it seems I was left out of discussions so perhaps I am incorrect on my assessment.  If so please tell me why.


I've been living a monkish life for the last two years. I view LTB as a long term project and both don't want to take outside investors and have not sought to profit from it in the short term since I have a long term vision to achieve.  I'm well on my way to that but it's why the charge I sometimes get of "only talking to people who sponsor" is so funny - If that was true, there wouldn't have been more than 10 interviews the whole time :)    I built things in this way exactly because I'm not a businessman but instead am an evangelist for decentralization who has built a platform to empower everybody, and am proving the model so others can follow in our wake.

All the funds that've been earned through my work on LTB have been re-invested into this and other projects building platforms to empower people to do whatever they want if people want to validate them.  Between the web portal, deployable blog/store/Q&A system, and first generation iOS app we've put 30BTC into continuing to build the platform.   I do LTB because I think it's important to have the conversation and I've decided to leverage my success to help others achieve their own. 

It's insulting that you haven't taken this away from my body of work, or the people I choose to share the platform with.   It's insulting you need me to explain this to you.

Fuz, do you not remember that I not only suggested you do the community show, I suggested the name and invited you to my platform?   You said no.     I didn't exclude you, I just talked with Legend also when I listened to his work and thought it was worth highlighting.  I don't care who you are, I care about the quality of your work.   

Although if we're being frank, I did mention to him that your questioning of daniel on the recent episode came off as apologetic and sycophantic (not sure if that was my exact word) and that I thought the content Legend had created was more interesting because it was more challenging.  He's free to share the emails we exchanged, I think you'll find that I'm quite supportive of everyone and just as I offered that support to you so do I offer it to pretty much all people who I feel like would do good work with a bigger platform.   

All decisions made about the show at 100% his own, I didn't even suggest splitting up the show.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2014, 04:37:09 pm by AdamBLevine »
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Offline fuzzy

lol.   Did you really say i'm a "businessman"?  You guys are hilarious.   

Whatever you need to say to make yourselves feel better!
How do u put food on the table adam?..my point is that people have to make a living and you have to pay for travel expenses...etc.  Do you not make money off of LTB? Im actually ignorant on this...

Id love to have a better understanding of all this but it seems I was left out of discussions so perhaps I am incorrect on my assessment.  If so please tell me why.
As for the entire situation. I am no longer flustered...a misunderstanding between myself and legend asking me for the email and attached accounts needed to be resolved and the seeming secrecy (at the time) between the rollout of these requests and the jetison to LTB (again with little time to digest it all) caused a bit of confusion regarding intentions.  It is over now as far as im concerned adam...and I hope u understand I never feel u deserve too much shit ;)
« Last Edit: May 23, 2014, 04:02:19 pm by fuznuts »
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Offline AdamBLevine

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 It's the ecosystem that develops when you have the core of the project in an indefensible position (Bitshares has not performed to development spec or internal expectations), after the dissenters realized their voices were not being heard, left.

 What's left is a defensive guard that's stuck whether for ideological (don't understand the mechanics but like the words used to describe them and the idea it'll make them rich) or mechanical (All-in AGS investors who have 100% tied their investments financial future to whether Invictus delivers something worthwhile... or not)

I'm hoping when Invictus delivers there will be a rush of rational investors, but again that requires them to deliver.
Email me at adam@letstalkbitcoin.com

Offline xeroc

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Lets just remembers what happening here - I invited the Beyond Bitcoin show onto the LTB platform, and this is the response I get :)
i am grateful for that offer!!
Agree! Especially for the friendly undertone :)
The goal is not to support any side here. The goal is to figure out why that negativity came up in the first place and get together again.
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Offline santaclause102

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Lets just remembers what happening here - I invited the Beyond Bitcoin show onto the LTB platform, and this is the response I get :)
i am grateful for that offer!!
Agree! Especially for the friendly undertone :)
The goal is not to support any side here. The goal is to figure out why that negativity came up in the first place and get together again.

Offline xeroc

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Lets just remembers what happening here - I invited the Beyond Bitcoin show onto the LTB platform, and this is the response I get :)
i am grateful for that offer!!

Offline AdamBLevine

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Lets just remembers what happening here - I invited the Beyond Bitcoin show onto the LTB platform, and this is the response I get :)
Email me at adam@letstalkbitcoin.com

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lol.   Did you really say i'm a "businessman"?  You guys are hilarious.   

Whatever you need to say to make yourselves feel better!

Analysis: with that response, you are also saying something to make yourself feel better.

Conclusion: ABL is neither an accurate introspective nor a valid conscientious person



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Offline AdamBLevine

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lol.   Did you really say i'm a "businessman"?  You guys are hilarious.   

Whatever you need to say to make yourselves feel better!

Email me at adam@letstalkbitcoin.com

Offline gamey

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Legendface -

This is a big mess.  TBH I wasn't even aware of what all you had done.  I just showed up to listen to some of the dev hangouts as they were recorded.  It seemed like you guys had nothing behind you, so I was offering what would be the equivalent of free consulting. A webmaster I do not wish to be, but I just think you could leverage a Drupal distribution and have an nice modern looking turnkey website made for your needs.  No one saw the renaming/rebranding with LTB coming except you. I would have expected a bit of discussion with Fuznuts at least beforehand. That didn't happen, direction changed, so I changed my mind before I even got started. Adam then comes in here and challenges me on my basic belief and it ends up hurting feelings all over the place.  I didn't really feel a need to expound on my change in heart, but Adam requested it from me.

If I had known it was going in the LTB direction and not what I consider "independent" (such a loaded word)  I would have never brought anything up.  It just changes the dynamic and TBH I have other things I would rather do.  I can still tell you what you might wish to try.  If you can setup Joomla from a default installation then you could do what I was suggesting.  Just have to learn a new CMS.  I might even change my mind down the road when I feel like I wish to commit to the project.  I love underdogs, have a huge spot in my heart for them.  Now when you're name has the LTB network on the end it just doesn't have the same appeal. There is nothing personal here. I wasn't even aware of all your contributions recently.  I was just attending some of the dev hangouts in the background and got pulled into suggesting things.

  I was hoping to talk to you in some manner before all this, but it just changed things for now.  Really, best of luck to you. I might very well work with you in some manner going forward. I feel like when Adam came in here, he forced me to take a stronger stance than is probably actually how I feel.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2014, 09:15:58 am by gamey »
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Offline fuzzy

I have kicked it around a good bit and agree a little on both sides to be honest.  Though I will definitely say this is not seeming like it is getting in the way of my efforts to produce content and build relationships with communities so they all have a voice.  With that said, I would love for other people to pick up the content and make it more decentralized and oriented toward specific industries...  and remix content to be a collaborator/competitor to Legend.

@Adam is a businessman--and this was a good business move.  It actually helps Beyond Bitcoin as a brand, too. 

@Legend--I wish we could have had a conversation about it, but in the end nothing matters except you doing what you do and me doing what I do, and trying to build something that others trust is open and honest, and most importantly enables others to build their own stuff without a single "owner".  I agree it takes some of the "innovative" feel out of it to be part of the LTB network in some fashion--I was frustrated when I looked at it from this point of view.  A slight change to my point of view (after MUCH thinking) was that WE NEED REPS from every different network we can get.  Legend has definitely become our first Beyond Bitcoin LTB Rep/Host.

@Gamey--it will be great when new people come online and create their own meetup-styled from content anyone can record during events in the Beyond Bitcoin Mumble Server (or some other means).  I urge you to do the same man...really...even if it is in disagreement with what is going on.  I will provide you the most I can to help.

So @Legend, please do not think I am trying to dodge you or neglecting your concerns (they exist).  Just as you have your BeyondBitcoin.fm site, I secured the BeyondBitcoinShow.com site, and we can cross link from each site, which = net gain for all involved.  BeyondBitcoin.org is a domain owned by Invictus...so someday they could hold their Beyond Bitcoin Conventions using Mumble and a mixture of other technologies (like google hangouts)
This stuff all came on me pretty quickly, and without being included by Adam (not that I needed to be included, but it would have been a courtesy I think) and wouldn't have been anxiety-inducing with regard to perceived motives.  I had a LOT of thinking to do and had no clue what the motivation was for all of it (and still didn't get to read the conversation that brought us to this point).  It would have been nice to see it, but then again it is none of my business if others feel they want to exclude me from the parley...I only do this free of charge, though, so it would definitely have felt good to have a conversation as opposed to being told what was going to happen. 

As for access to the Beyond Bitcoin accounts currently tied to the gmail account--I do not (yet) feel comfortable giving full access (on par with ownership) to anyone.  Though if anyone were in a better position to earn that trust over time, it very well might be you.  I mean you are a founding member of this.  Just please do not forget that a good bit of work has gone into this already--you are working hard and producing good solid content, but my job is to make it possible for more people who want to do the same --and keep you on your toes.  As such I do not want to enable anyone to have full access to these things (except, perhaps, a future DAC...), I am simply a steward until it gets to that point. 

With that said, there is nothing (absolutely nothing) stopping you from getting a twitter account set up (hell, i'd even do it for you) in addition to a Beyond Bitcoin G+ and twitter account.  We will eventually have widgets on the site to enable quick posting to the internet directly from the content--so this will make it easier for all of us to make something "viral" under the Beyond Bitcoin Umbrella using multiple media accounts.  LetsTalkBitcoin already has some of those widgets!
Having different content creators, mixers, editors...etc with Beyond Bitcoin Show accounts also helps ensure malevolent actors will not go out and make alternate accounts to slander the name. 
There are many ways this can be done and we can even set something up with a standard naming convention, if necessary, so individuals from different communities can be easily found and contacted in a more personalized fashion and their social media accounts are shown to represent a Beyond Bitcoin REPS point of view as opposed to the Beyond Bitcoin community--Adam has already figured this out.  Social Media can empower us with numbers to build something really cool...then both you and I can go to both BeyondBitcoin.fm, BeyondBitcoinShow.com, and LetsTalkBitcoin.com to tweet and comment on content. Cross link and help each other build relationships in the industry that enable us to enrich the community with a deeper understanding of the technologies and their Potential. 

So with that said, I am keeping the email--you could easily make a beyondbitcoin@ymail account.  I already tried to but cant make it for you without your mobile phone number...if you want to volunteer that mobile phone number please let me know and I'll send you an already-put together email addy.  I will gladly help you create new twitter and social media accounts if you so choose and ask nothing in return but your understanding that there was a better way to do this--and it would have set me into less of a tailspin of "wtf is going on?", while enabling me to feel like my work has been appreciated.  The words "squatting" were used...I don't know that was fair, but there is still a great deal of talking and planning that needs done.


Well this was a nice Storming Stage. 



Looking forward to when the forming and norming have occurred on this particular front. 



 

« Last Edit: May 23, 2014, 06:47:35 am by fuznuts »
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Offline legendface66

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Well for the benefit of those who may read this at a later date -  the LTB Network is a publishing platform. It's a great soap box to stand on. And like most good soap boxes, it doesn't do the talking.

Beyond Bitcoin is and always will be by every conceivable definition of the word, Independent.

There.

« Last Edit: May 23, 2014, 05:38:49 am by legendface66 »

Offline gamey

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I think the idea here Gamey is to contribute to a common resource - the LTB Network. Fans of every show can be exposed to all other content there. I joined so that Listeners of MMM and S&S could be exposed to my work too. Together we bring value to the network and that will reflected in the LTBC token experiment. The LTBN is an experiment in decentralized communities, not centralised ones. Remember also that A)this is opt in, and B) centralisation always refers to either influence or exposure. Neither Adam nor anyone else exerts influence over the content (apart from the request that it be clean) creation is decentralised. And the centralised exposure is a good thing. that's why I chose to opt in.

The LTB Network has its own thing and own brand and makes a lot of great stuff.  I have nothing against it.  It doesn't follow that I, a fan of decentralization, want to put my effort behind the LTBNetwork.  You start from the assumption that I should.  I start from the assumption that I have no interest.  There is a list of rules etc you have to abide by for their content.  Just not my thing.  Not that I couldn't easily abide by them and not that they don't ask very little of submitted content, I just don't really care.

Competition is healthy.  Beyond wanting more immediate exposure, I am not sure why you rebrand your show to have LTB on it.  Good luck with the tokens and all, I just have no interest. Again, I am no one.  You don't even have the case of a guy "quitting" because of this. I just lost my interest in some aspects before I started.  If my name had not been mentioned publicly in this thread you would have not hear a peep from me and we would have 0 need for this conversation.

Quote
And while BB germinated here it's stated goal is to be a common ground for all communities. Not just Bitshares. We already know each other - what good would that do?

As for corruption. All primary resources - hangouts, interviews etc are posted on the BBS site. At worst, the podcast on the network is an advertisement for the real meat. Though I'd like to give myself a bit more credit than that :-)

I agree joining LTB will give you immediate increase in visibility and therefore listeners.  That is 100% a good thing from your perspective.  I disagree otherwise.  Things happening now do not predict the future.  Corruption creeps in.  I like competition.  That is all.  Competition in the free market is a form of decentralization.  It is all related.
I speak for myself and only myself.

Offline legendface66

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I think the idea here Gamey is to contribute to a common resource - the LTB Network. Fans of every show can be exposed to all other content there. I joined so that Listeners of MMM and S&S could be exposed to my work too. Together we bring value to the network and that will reflected in the LTBC token experiment. The LTBN is an experiment in decentralized communities, not centralised ones. Remember also that A)this is opt in, and B) centralisation always refers to either influence or exposure. Neither Adam nor anyone else exerts influence over the content (apart from the request that it be clean) creation is decentralised. And the centralised exposure is a good thing. that's why I chose to opt in.

And while BB germinated here it's stated goal is to be a common ground for all communities. Not just Bitshares. We already know each other - what good would that do?

As for corruption. All primary resources - hangouts, interviews etc are posted on the BBS site. At worst, the podcast on the network is an advertisement for the real meat. Though I'd like to give myself a bit more credit than that :-)

Offline gamey

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I was interested, but I can't say I have much interest in working with stuff on LTB network. I was more interested in seeing a 100% independent media source that was not beholden to projects who put ads on the show.

You may not like my perspective on this project but I'd challenge you to support this statement.

Why is the name of a Bitshares community decided brand now followed with "on the LTB network".  Why not just keep the original name ?  That right there is enough to support my statement. 

Going beyond that,  we (Bitshares and the larger ecosystem) are a community supporting decentralization.  Centralization breeds corruption at all levels.  Media included.  I have no interest in working on building what I consider a burgeoning centralized media source.  You can claim you have no input currently on his show and I don't even begin to doubt you, but then I still have to ask why is he rebranding his show with your show/network's name?  Even when you claim to have no control over his decisions, that is no guarantee going forward.

Lots of people don't really get centralization as a concept and how it breeds corruption.  I am not casting stones at you Adam, or your network.  It is just the product of my philosophy and thoughts on the matter.
I speak for myself and only myself.

Offline AdamBLevine

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I was interested, but I can't say I have much interest in working with stuff on LTB network. I was more interested in seeing a 100% independent media source that was not beholden to projects who put ads on the show.

You may not like my perspective on this project but I'd challenge you to support this statement.
Email me at adam@letstalkbitcoin.com

Offline legendface66

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Hi guys, so, first up, thanks to fuz for the emails!

The podcast is itself an RSS feed of links to audio files. So mixing the content up confuses the issue. Now the two content types are separated - processed content goes to LTB as weekly BB podcast and the primary resourses go to BBH. This includes the hangouts and light edits of interviews.

Second, there is no necessary relationship between LTB and the content on the site - It's just a blog site. BB is perfectly independent. Anything you hear in the podcasts, the authors put there. I'm a big appreciator of them but I agree that there is a gaping hole where technical content could fit.

The only way to get other communities involved - and we need communities, not just speaking devs - is to get involved with them, learn about their projects, answer questions on their boards. If we push our agenda too much we risk alienating folks. The first order of business has to be to make friends and understand the angles. This is community building and we have all the tools, skills and know how we need. The different approaches to answering the 2.0 question are sometimes philosophical and sometimes target market driven but each is experiencing success because it appeals to a value set and view of the future. For this reason they will all continue to experience success - there is simply more than one way to skin the proverbial cat.

that's my bit. I have some editing to do but one final thing we need is a web developer. We need some groovy juice to help with curating what may quickly turn into a large amount of archive content, a separate module for a project news blog on the front page (I can do this actually I guess) and there has to be some cool stuff we're not thinking of that a UX dev could dream up. Stuff to think about anyway while we peruse the WWW of crypto

catchya later guys, keep it cranking

Offline gamey

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I was interested, but I can't say I have much interest in working with stuff on LTB network. I was more interested in seeing a 100% independent media source that was not beholden to projects who put ads on the show. I only wished to help to that end. Best of luck. I had little time to offer as it is and have yet to find a way to listen to all the content produced.

I 100% agree that the dev hangouts are a bit too one sided and need to be corrected and reoriented.  I can not blame you legendface for wanting more of a real show if that is your desire. I was hoping for that to be addressed with a change in direction, just not this one. 
I speak for myself and only myself.

Offline fuzzy

It might be about that time for you to step up and be one of the reps to take on conversations with BM.  I know gamey was also interested.
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Offline santaclause102

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I like the idea. The goal anyway would be to make this whole bb effort one for all innovative crypto projects.
Branding: BB - a platform for discussion for all innovative crypto 2.0 projects.

What did you mean by "feed"?

I would welcome it though if the mumble sessions and its possibilities for all communities are advertised (via a link and via voice) on the LTB show. Both parts of bb will profit from each other... It could become a big thing this way. There are a lot of shows without focus on real innovation.... And with respect to mumble the physical conference panels are a lot of blabla, low quality and much like advertisement shows... 
« Last Edit: May 20, 2014, 04:33:41 pm by delulo »

Offline legendface66

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This project has been steadily evolving as fuz and I have worked on it and it's reached a point where a major shift needs to take place, rather than the incremental ones we've been making.

Things have been quiet for a while because I've been repackaging Beyond Bitcoin into two different podcasts:

Beyond Bitcoin on the LTB Network: this is a new, radio show style podcast.

Beyond Bitcoin: Hangouts : this will be lightly edited releases of the mumble hangouts.

I just can't have the podcast I would like to make and the hangouts published in the same feed without severely compromising one or the other. The mumble hangouts are supposed to be a primary resource. To turn them into a "Marketable" podcast requires too much editing. Joining the LTB Network with a show will bring attention and hopefully more devs to the mumble server.

Tell me what you think of the change, I'd be more verbose but I'm getting a twitch from so much time staring at this screen. Talk to you guys later :-)