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Offline emski

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Latenight Analysis At Merge Proposals
« on: October 20, 2014, 10:46:21 PM »

I tried to find "fair" mechanics for merge between BTSX, AGS and PTS. I've put some random thoughts and ideas and I've reached to *something*.
This completely ignores the price of any asset at any time. It concentrates only on promises.

Let A,B,C,D,E are people who bought 1% each of AGS/PTS/BTSX at pre feb28 and post feb28 like this:

pre feb28
PTS      AGS
A-1%   B-1%

post feb28
PTS      AGS      BTSX
C-1%   D-1%   E-1%

Each person was rewarded stake as follows:

BTSX Chain
A = 0.5%
B = 0.5%

DNS/NOTE/VOTE (too complex to even include them)

Each person was promised the following stake:
BTSX Chain Descendant
A = 0.5%
B = 0.5%
C = 0%
D = 0%
E = 1%
DEV = 0% (dilution inevitable)

DAC
A = 0.1%
B = 0.1%
C = 0.1%
D = 0.1%
E = 0%
DEV = 80% (no dilution?)

BM's proposal essentially tries to combine DACs and BTSX Descendants into one MERGED DAC.
Given the different stakes for each party this is very difficult to be done "fair".
However we can attempt to imagine how the merge would look like. Lets first transform the idea of DAC so that there are no development funds (all the funds are allocated to PTS/AGS).
Lets imagine the dev decides to reward A,B,C,D with ALL his shares and rely on dilution for development.
This should equal to what feb28 snapshot did - 50%/50% to AGS/PTS.
It should look like this:
DAC NO-DEV
A = 0.5%
B = 0.5%
C = 0.5%
D = 0.5%
E = 0%
DEV = 0% (dilution inevitable)

We want to combine DACs and BTSX descendants into one.
Lets merge the DAC NO-DEV and BTSX Chain Descendant into one COMBINED DAC while keeping all the promises.
Lets assume both future DACs and BTSX Descendants have equal potential for growth.
Then we can average out the stake for every actor.
This is more or less a combination of past promises to PTS/AGS/BTSX holders:
MERGED DAC NO-DEV and BTSX Chain Descendant (=AKA merged promises)
A = 0.5%
B = 0.5%
C = 0.25% (C & D were not getting any stake in BTSX Descendants but had 0.5% in DACs)
D = 0.25% (C & D were not getting any stake in BTSX Descendants but had 0.5% in DACs)
E = 0.5% (E was not getting any stake in DACs but was getting 1% in BTSX descendants)
DEV = 0% (dilution inevitable)

The above shows what each actor should get if the AGS/PTS/BTSX promise is kept merged/averaged out.

What does BM's proposal looks like (using current prices):

DAC & BTSX Chain Descendant (BM's PROPOSAL)
A = 0.5% (0.4% (BTSX rewarded by feb28, diluted by 20%) + 0.1% (total PTS stake))
B = 0.5% (0.4% (BTSX rewarded by feb28, diluted by 20%) + 0.1% (total AGS stake))
C = 0.1%
D = 0.1%
E = 0.8% (1% diluted by 20%)
DEV = 0% (dilution inevitable)

It is too late for me to properly distinguish between bullshit and sanity so please ignore it if it is the first kind.

UPDATE: The conclusion is:
If we average the promise and keep all groups of investors in balance we should have this:
DAC & BTSX Chain Descendant
A = 0.5% (0.25% (BTSX rewarded by feb28, diluted by 50%) + 0.25% (total PTS stake))
B = 0.5% (0.25% (BTSX rewarded by feb28, diluted by 50%) + 0.25% (total AGS stake))
C = 0.25%
D = 0.25%
E = 0.5% (1% diluted by 50%)
DEV = 0% (dilution inevitable)

Meaning 1B shares should be issued and distributed to PTS/AGS stakeholders.

As a summary:
Proposal: Issue 1B new BTSX shares and distribute them to AGS/PTS holders (500 mil to AGS, 500 mil to PTS). This should result in consolidating AGS/PTS/BTSX into BTS.

Explanation:

Issuing 1B new shares will not change the stake of AGS and PTS buyers before feb28.

Issuing 1B new shares will compensate buyers of AGS/PTS post feb28 as follows:
These users were not supposed to have stake in BTSX descendant DACs but they were supposed to have 50%/50% stake in 3rd party DACs (assuming no dev allocated funds). Now they are given  25% of their PTS/AGS stake in all future DACs. (meaning if they had 1% stake in PTS/AGS they will have 0.25% stake in BTS)

Issuing 1B new shares will compensate buyers of BTSX as follows:
BTSX buyers were promised the opportunity to participate in BTSX descendant DACs with 100% of their stake. However they had no stake in any 3rd party DACs. With the merge of 3rd party DACs and BTSX Descendants BTSX owners are given 50% of their BTSX stake in ALL future DACs. (meaning if they had 1% stake in BTSX they will be given 0.5% stake in BTS).
« Last Edit: October 21, 2014, 03:04:24 PM by emski »

Offline Ander

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Re: Latenight Analysis At Merge Proposals
« Reply #1 on: October 20, 2014, 11:13:51 PM »
I cant understand what your conclusions are at all.  Percentages of distributions need to add up to 100% to make sense.
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Offline roadscape

Re: Latenight Analysis At Merge Proposals
« Reply #2 on: October 20, 2014, 11:15:19 PM »
Get some sleep  :)
http://cryptofresh.com  |  witness: roadscape

Offline emski

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Re: Latenight Analysis At Merge Proposals
« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2014, 11:16:40 PM »
I cant understand what your conclusions are at all.  Percentages of distributions need to add up to 100% to make sense.

The percentages represent what stake a person who had bought 1% of respective asset should get.

Offline emski

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Re: Latenight Analysis At Merge Proposals
« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2014, 11:17:28 PM »
Get some sleep  :)

Just to finish my drink...

Offline Ander

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Re: Latenight Analysis At Merge Proposals
« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2014, 11:28:17 PM »
emski, go read my post about this:
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=10219.0

:)
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Offline emski

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Re: Latenight Analysis At Merge Proposals
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2014, 11:42:38 PM »
emski, go read my post about this:
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=10219.0

:)

I've read it. I dont think any of the options produce the above-mentioned percentages. Though one of them might be close.

Offline GaltReport

Re: Latenight Analysis At Merge Proposals
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2014, 11:49:03 PM »
I tried to find "fair" mechanics for merge between BTSX, AGS and PTS. I've put some random thoughts and ideas and I've reached to *something*.
This completely ignores the price of any asset at any time. It concentrates only on promises.

Let A,B,C,D,E are people who bought 1% each of AGS/PTS/BTSX at pre feb28 and post feb28 like this:

pre feb28
PTS      AGS
A-1%   B-1%

post feb28
PTS      AGS      BTSX
C-1%   D-1%   E-1%

Each person was rewarded stake as follows:

BTSX Chain
A = 0.5%
B = 0.5%

DNS/NOTE/VOTE (too complex to even include them)

Each person was promised the following stake:
BTSX Chain Descendant
A = 0.5%
B = 0.5%
C = 0%
D = 0%
E = 1%
DEV = 0% (dilution inevitable)

DAC
A = 0.1%
B = 0.1%
C = 0.1%
D = 0.1%
E = 0%
DEV = 80% (no dilution?)

BM's proposal essentially tries to combine DACs and BTSX Descendants into one MERGED DAC.
Given the different stakes for each party this is very difficult to be done "fair".
However we can attempt to imagine how the merge would look like. Lets first transform the idea of DAC OLD so that all the funds are allocated to PTS/AGS.
Lets imagine the dev decides to reward A,B,C,D with ALL his shares and rely on dilution for development.
This should equal to what feb28 snapshot did - 50%/50% to AGS/PTS.
It should look like this:
DAC NO-DEV
A = 0.5%
B = 0.5%
C = 0.5%
D = 0.5%
E = 0%
DEV = 0% (dilution inevitable)

We want to combine DACs and BTSX descendants into one.
Lets merge the DAC NO-DEV and BTSX Chain Descendant into one COMBINED DAC while keeping all the promises.
Lets assume both future DACs and BTSX Descendants have equal potential for growth.
Then we can average out the stake for every actor.
This is more or less a combination of past promises to PTS/AGS/BTSX holders:
MERGED DAC NO-DEV and BTSX Chain Descendant (=AKA merged promises)
A = 0.5%
B = 0.5%
C = 0.25% (C & D were not getting any stake in BTSX Descendants but had 0.5% in DACs)
D = 0.25% (C & D were not getting any stake in BTSX Descendants but had 0.5% in DACs)
E = 0.5% (E was not getting any stake in DACs but was getting 1% in BTSX descendants)
DEV = 0% (dilution inevitable)

The above shows what each actor should get if the AGS/PTS/BTSX promise is kept merged/averaged out.

What does BM's proposal looks like (using current prices):

DAC & BTSX Chain Descendant (BM's PROPOSAL)
A = 0.5% (0.4% (BTSX rewarded by feb28, diluted by 20%) + 0.1% (total PTS stake))
B = 0.5% (0.4% (BTSX rewarded by feb28, diluted by 20%) + 0.1% (total AGS stake))
C = 0.1%
D = 0.1%
E = 0.8% (1% diluted by 20%)
DEV = 0% (dilution inevitable)

It is too late for me to properly distinguish between bullshit and sanity so please ignore it if it is the first kind.

Not sure about all the math but I'll accept the end result!

Offline emski

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Re: Latenight Analysis At Merge Proposals
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2014, 01:26:24 PM »
As a summary:
Proposal: Issue 1B new BTSX shares and distribute them to AGS/PTS holders (500 mil to AGS, 500 mil to PTS). This should result in consolidating AGS/PTS/BTSX into BTS.

Explanation:

Issuing 1B new shares will not change the stake of AGS and PTS buyers before feb28.

Issuing 1B new shares will compensate buyers of AGS/PTS post feb28 as follows:
These users were not supposed to have stake in BTSX descendant DACs but they were supposed to have 50%/50% stake in 3rd party DACs (assuming no dev allocated funds). Now they are given  25% of their PTS/AGS stake in all future DACs. (meaning if they had 1% stake in PTS/AGS they will have 0.25% stake in BTS)

Issuing 1B new shares will compensate buyers of BTSX as follows:
BTSX buyers were promised the opportunity to participate in BTSX descendant DACs with 100% of their stake. However they had no stake in any 3rd party DACs. With the merge of 3rd party DACs and BTSX Descendants BTSX owners are given 50% of their BTSX stake in ALL future DACs. (meaning if they had 1% stake in BTSX they will be given 0.5% stake in BTS).


Offline Bitty

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Re: Latenight Analysis At Merge Proposals
« Reply #9 on: October 24, 2014, 11:34:51 AM »
As a summary:
Proposal: Issue 1B new BTSX shares and distribute them to AGS/PTS holders (500 mil to AGS, 500 mil to PTS). This should result in consolidating AGS/PTS/BTSX into BTS.

Explanation:

Issuing 1B new shares will not change the stake of AGS and PTS buyers before feb28.

Issuing 1B new shares will compensate buyers of AGS/PTS post feb28 as follows:
These users were not supposed to have stake in BTSX descendant DACs but they were supposed to have 50%/50% stake in 3rd party DACs (assuming no dev allocated funds). Now they are given  25% of their PTS/AGS stake in all future DACs. (meaning if they had 1% stake in PTS/AGS they will have 0.25% stake in BTS)

Issuing 1B new shares will compensate buyers of BTSX as follows:
BTSX buyers were promised the opportunity to participate in BTSX descendant DACs with 100% of their stake. However they had no stake in any 3rd party DACs. With the merge of 3rd party DACs and BTSX Descendants BTSX owners are given 50% of their BTSX stake in ALL future DACs. (meaning if they had 1% stake in BTSX they will be given 0.5% stake in BTS).

+1
issuing some new shares would be solution for everybody

 

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