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Offline bitcoinerS

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Delegate team - bitcoiners

Introduction
After a great deal of consideration, hours of discussion and several nights of ‘sleeping on it’, we have decided to relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC. We recognize that our community has been through quite a whirlwind as of late, and we are mindful of not causing additional concerns. To that end we will make every effort to present a clear picture of what we hope to achieve and why.

The Vision
We feel that there’s a strong case to be made for a ‘stand alone’ BitShares DNS DAC, which in all reality, is not fully independent from the main DAC, but coexists with it in a symbiotic relationship.  We recognize the importance of the strategic decision to form the BitShares Super DAC at this time, and the benefits that will inevitably bring to BitShares community.  At the same time, we feel there is so much room for development within the DNS space itself and huge potential for symbiosis and co-evolution of independent blockchains.

BitShares DAC diversity can only strengthen BitShares community,providing another playground for experimentation in organizational structures, business plans,and governance models.  Multiple BitShares DACs sub-communities may take different approaches and learn from, and collaborate with one another. BitShares DNS DAC will aim to reach a complementary development path with BitShares, each working on features beneficial to the other, but focusing on different applications and user groups within this large field.

BitShares DNS DAC will position as a “web 2.0” DAC, and may have a different regulation and oversight profile from BitShares super DAC, potentially providing some extra insulation from external threats.

We foresee BitShares DNS DAC accepting some BitAssets from the main BitShares DAC, such as BitUSD as payment for offered services, adding liquidity to the main BitShares DAC.

Our primary allegiance being to the BitShares community and vision, we are compelled by the possibilities of keeping the BitShares DNS dream alive in it’s own right and seeking out areas of collaboration between the chains.

Immediate goals:

  • Seek broad consensus from the community based on the merits of this proposal.
  • Seek agreement on pushing out KeyID blockchain end-of-life a month or more into the future to allow adequate preparation for re-launch as BitShares DNS and to reduce disruption to existing participants.
  • To continue listing KeyID’s DNS tokens on exchanges past November 5, as “proto-shares” in the upcoming BitShares DNS until the new DAC is launched.
  • Give community members the opportunity to take a position and make a choice on whether they wish to participate in the project based on the new plan.
  • Discuss blockchain symbiosis.


Midterm goals:

  • Discuss organizational and funding considerations
  • Assemble team with all the necessary skills and expertise to preparate smooth and secure launch of the new DNS DAC.
  • Write new BitShares DNS White Paper


Come with us! Lets build the “Web 2.0” DAC!
« Last Edit: November 01, 2014, 05:13:25 PM by toast »
>>> approve bitcoiners

Offline Rune

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Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2014, 04:29:36 PM »
The harsh reality is, if you're open source (which is a requirement to most), then BTS shareholders will vote to copy every single feature you implement that works at creating value for your DAC in some way.

Offline toast

Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2014, 04:31:09 PM »
+1  I support this if it can be executed smoothly.

What do you want to do with dev fund? Are there any other developers working with you?
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Offline biophil

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Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2014, 04:42:59 PM »
The harsh reality is, if you're open source (which is a requirement to most), then BTS shareholders will vote to copy every single feature you implement that works at creating value for your DAC in some way.

People always say this, but I suspect it's far less true than you'd expect. The reality is that people get emotionally attached to their pet ideas and this makes them very resistant to copying effective approaches from different communities. Take Nxt's stance on bitAssets, which can mostly be summarized by "scam ponzi scam the Larimers hate babies!" Nxt's entrenched ideas about how crypto should work kept them from recognizing the power of the bitAsset, so they're missing their chance to implement something similar.


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Offline nomoreheroes7

Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2014, 04:46:53 PM »
Hmmm....so will this in effect be competing with the SuperDAC's implementation of DNS? Sounds confusing to me...

Offline biophil

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Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2014, 04:47:07 PM »
As far as BitcoinerS's proposal, I'm all for it. I'm skeptical that you'll be able to effectively compete with BTS (I just can't bring myself to say the word "superDAC" - it's way too jl777 for me), but I don't see any harm in trying. If you actually can pull off this symbiosis, it could be pretty great. I will plan on picking up some cheap post-snapshot shares, anyway.

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Offline matt608

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Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2014, 04:50:01 PM »
:s  I don't understand.  DNS holders have just been airdropped BTS to include them and some of the 3i team spent their own funds compensating DNS holders who got a raw deal.  Now you're going back on it?  So DNS will have its own competing shares and delegates?  Will you snapshot BTS?  Have an IPO? This is insane.  The market is in turmoil and people just keep changing things.

So who is it exactly who is now 100% focused on BTS?  Sorry but I don't know who you are bitcoinerS. 

It's a relief to see you will use bitassets from BTS at least.  I don't know how that will work, won't holders of DNS want you to use their own in house bitassets to increase DNS value?

I follow everything that is said on this forum and I still have no idea what is going on.  What does "a different regulation and oversight profile" mean?

This is what happens when there are no contracts, developers just do whatever they want and don't finish things.

If DNS can just splinter off, what's stopping VOTE doing the same thing?  I thought these were things BM had agreed with you.

Offline graffenwalder

Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2014, 04:50:48 PM »
Really? This is just what we need right now. DNS getting a pump, and BTSX losing some more value.

I still support the Bitshares community, but Al these sudden announcements/proposals could be interpreted as some cheeky money scams.

Buy up DNS at all time low, then announce/propose to continue.

Offline matt608

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Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2014, 04:51:41 PM »
Really? This is just what we need right now. DNS getting a pump, and BTSX losing some more value.

I still support the Bitshares community, but Al these sudden announcements/proposals could be interpreted as some cheeky money scams.

Buy up DNS at all time low, then announce/propose to continue.

Yeah its almost as if new proposals are made deliberately to spread confusion.

Offline Rune

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Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2014, 04:58:23 PM »
The harsh reality is, if you're open source (which is a requirement to most), then BTS shareholders will vote to copy every single feature you implement that works at creating value for your DAC in some way.

People always say this, but I suspect it's far less true than you'd expect. The reality is that people get emotionally attached to their pet ideas and this makes them very resistant to copying effective approaches from different communities. Take Nxt's stance on bitAssets, which can mostly be summarized by "scam ponzi scam the Larimers hate babies!" Nxt's entrenched ideas about how crypto should work kept them from recognizing the power of the bitAsset, so they're missing their chance to implement something similar.


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There's a very big difference between "people" and "capital holders". In a blockchain ecosystem where consensus is primarily determined through forums "witch hunt style" (ie the developers can do whatever they want but if they do something that goes viral and pisses netizens off there is hell to pay), then people most definitely attach to memes and cultural ideals, because that's how you express yourself through forums most effectively. So we get this culture where bitcoiners freak out at anything they consider "centralized" or "premined" etc.

When we start to see a system where it is capital holders only that makes decisions (through stake voting), then we will rapidly move towards a decision culture where the only thing that will be taken into consideration is profit. Initially there might be some ideology involved, but capital will always move from those who allocate it based on ideology, to those who allocate it based on expected profit. The large capital holders of bitshares will be very experienced at analyzing what will be profitable for them, and once the meme culture that used to dominate most internet communities is fully replaced, profit will be the only thing that matters in all our business/DAC related communication.

I think most people will come to the logical conclusion that maximizing ethical behaviour of the DAC is the most profitable strategy in the very long term. But copying features from other open source projects is by the definition of open source not unethical, and I don't think our shareholders will hold their breath for even a second before voting to do it.

Offline Empirical1.1

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Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2014, 05:04:10 PM »
 +5% Good luck guys  :)

So PTS & AGS are kind of carrying on separately, DNS is carrying on separately. Vote was never really started... 30 day rewind anyone?

Edit: I really like one simple focused BitShares, but yeah big month
« Last Edit: November 01, 2014, 05:06:28 PM by Empirical1.1 »

Offline graffenwalder

Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2014, 05:06:21 PM »
+5% Good luck guys  :)

So PTS & AGS are kind of carrying on separately, DNS is carrying on separately. Vote was never really started... 30 day rewind anyone?
+5% this is getting silly now.

Offline gamey

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Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2014, 05:08:41 PM »
+5% Good luck guys  :)

So PTS & AGS are kind of carrying on separately, DNS is carrying on separately. Vote was never really started... 30 day rewind anyone?
+5% this is getting silly now.

Lots of people had interest in a DNS DAC.  Honestly, I don't think DNS should ever be a feature of superDAC anyway.  We'd be losing focusing and bringing attention of authorities.  It is about finding a developer willing and capable of doing the work.

edit - Also, these are third parties.  No longer I3 DACs.  Can't really expect everyone to sit around and do nothing while BTS grows.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2014, 05:10:40 PM by gamey »
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Offline xeroc

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Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2014, 05:10:41 PM »
+5% Good luck guys  :)

So PTS & AGS are kind of carrying on separately, DNS is carrying on separately. Vote was never really started... 30 day rewind anyone?

Edit: I really like one simple focused BitShares, but yeah big month
+5%
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Offline toast

Re: Proposal: To Relaunch KeyID as new BitShares DNS DAC
« Reply #14 on: November 01, 2014, 05:13:14 PM »
Just to be clear I am pretty confident nobody will actually revive it. BTC38 wants to de-list it.
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