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Offline hpenvy

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UPDATE

I'm recommending a web wallet, not integration into the official client.



Stan, when you started talking about checking and savings account, that caught my attention. I've been beating my head against the wall trying to figure a way to pull in the moderate to casual Bitcoin user. You nailed it with BitUSD being the checking account and BTS is the savings account.  I would go one step further:

1. Forget 'Litecoin the Silver to Bitcoin’s Gold' the comparison should be 'BitUSD is the checking to Bitcoins investments' .  If you didn't like the breakdown, 'BitUSD is the checking to Bitcoin's savings'.
2. This gives a very easy message to the moderate to the casual Bitcoin holder.
3. The wallet allows for BTS, BitUSD and Bitcoin
4. The wallet is designed with few options and very user friendly

This allows us access to the different Bitcoin circles because it adds benefit to Bitcoin. The wallet hitting the mass market is what we're doing for Bitcoin.  The wallet is targeted away from cryptonerds and more for the causal user.  Litecoin plays little brother to Bitcoin with the silver references.  In our scenario, bitUSD takes it place as not a director competitor but something that is strong on its own and enhances Bitcoin.

If you want the investment and associated volatility, you'll work out of that tab of the wallet.  If you want to make day to day transaction, you will pull from your checking tab.

I know we're going after other markets such as high risk merchants, however, I feel there's value in aligning ourselves along giants to help our exposure and media blackout.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2014, 11:30:36 PM by hpenvy »
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Offline gamey

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2014, 02:52:20 AM »

This isn't a real suggestion, but just something to ponder.  Assume the development work wasn't super involved, would it make sense to put a legitimate BTC wallet alongside a BTS wallet? 

Assuming you could make the best BTC/BTS wallet..  would that even have value?  At first it strikes me as a good idea (if you don't consider resources required).  Or is it a bad idea?  If it was as good as any wallet, and you could give people something to use it.  Then once they are using the wallet, BTS onramp/offramp is integrated right there somehow?
I speak for myself and only myself.

Offline hpenvy

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2014, 03:14:28 AM »

This isn't a real suggestion, but just something to ponder.  Assume the development work wasn't super involved, would it make sense to put a legitimate BTC wallet alongside a BTS wallet? 

Assuming you could make the best BTC/BTS wallet..  would that even have value?  At first it strikes me as a good idea (if you don't consider resources required).  Or is it a bad idea?  If it was as good as any wallet, and you could give people something to use it.  Then once they are using the wallet, BTS onramp/offramp is integrated right there somehow?

Yup, we're on the same page with the onramp/offramps.  I don't think it even needs to be the best feature wise, rather, our user friendly entry into a more mainstream market. We're giving BTC a real context and help it combat the volatility criticisms by inserting our own products.  We talk about ourselves as equals solving a different problem.

Nobody wants to hear how bad Chevy sucks when they are driving a Ford.  In other markets, our marketing will be different and targeted.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2014, 03:17:23 AM by hpenvy »
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Offline Stan

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2014, 03:45:17 AM »
"Both" is good.  Combined checking-and-savings  or combined checking-and-investment or any other novel product that bridges between the familiar and the ground-breaking.

Anything that gets people to do a side-by-side comparison is good.

"A Bitcoin wallet that pays yield"  ...er, whaat?

... (Yes! Just use it to switch your BTC into a BitAsset for yield and then back to BTC to pay at the touch of a button.)

Then realize you never need to switch back.   8)

Training wheels!  Scaffolding! 

Entrepreneurs.  You can do this.  Everything is there but the glue!
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract of any kind.   These are merely my opinions which I reserve the right to change at any time.

Offline hpenvy

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2014, 03:53:01 AM »

Anything that gets people to do a side-by-side comparison is good.

"A Bitcoin wallet that pays yield"  ...er, whaat?


Wow! Tell me this is something you guys have been considering. When I read your bank account/savings account post, I figured there was something behind it.
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julian1

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2014, 04:13:28 AM »
Bitcoin users are living in a cult. They need to discover their own way out, without realizing they're being gently guided, else they'll feel antagonized and become suspicious of our intentions. 'Both is good' is awesome, because they immediately sense we're on their side.

Offline hpenvy

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2014, 04:19:54 AM »
Bitcoin users are living in a cult. They need to discover their own way out, without realizing they're being gently guided, else they'll feel antagonized and become suspicious of our intentions. 'Both is good' is awesome, because they immediately sense we're on their side.

I like what you said about not antagonizing. I don't even want to try to fight against the hardcore Bitcoin or nothing crowd. For every one of them that posts for hours each day on the well known forums, there's a large number of more moderate to casual users viewing the posts. Those are the users that would benefit from this approach almost immediately.  Bitcoin is great for speculation, we're not telling supporters they made a bad choice. We're showing them how their own product should be seen compared to better options for checkings/savings.

Nobody wants to be told their girlfriend is ugly.

I understand we're reaching out to markets outside of crypto. Heck, I'm one of the big supporters of high risk merchants like the adult industry.  I'm saying there's a way to get people that would help evangelize the product if we position it correctly. Let them help spread the Bitcoin wallet that pays yield. Their network effect benefits both of us.  I'd even recommend a landing page targeting the above. Reach out to ever reporter that's ever written a Bitcoin story in the last 6 months. Post on Bitcointalk Bitcoin sections, Reddit, Twitter, Facebook on and on.  Any merchant that's even remotely familiar with Bitcoin could understand how this solves a problem with volatility. 

Hey merchant (that already accepts Bitcoin), Bitcoin is a proven solution for investing. For your daily transactions, bitUSD .........
« Last Edit: November 15, 2014, 04:37:41 AM by hpenvy »
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Offline hpenvy

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2014, 05:54:07 AM »
Even if we decide not to pursue a dual wallet, I like the marketing angle when approaching Bitcoin supporters. 

Bitshares checking to Bitcoins investing (or savings)

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sumantso

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2014, 08:45:22 AM »
Why not just promote BitBTC? 'BTC with interest'

Offline hpenvy

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2014, 08:53:26 AM »
Why not just promote BitBTC? 'BTC with interest'

"novel product that bridges between the familiar and the ground-breaking." - Stan

This plan is around the familiar.  It's the same thing they are doing right now, just adding the Bitshares checking/savings.  If that's not possible in one wallet, I see the bitBTC being another option.
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sumantso

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2014, 09:16:12 AM »
Why not just promote BitBTC? 'BTC with interest'

"novel product that bridges between the familiar and the ground-breaking." - Stan

This plan is around the familiar.  It's the same thing they are doing right now, just adding the Bitshares checking/savings.  If that's not possible in one wallet, I see the bitBTC being another option.

Thing is in Crypto community BTC is positioned as a store of value. They even have nice term (born out of a drunken mistake) for it - HODL.

HODLing this BitBTC means earnings on their stores, and I think a better sell right now than BitUSD.

Offline Xeldal

Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2014, 05:11:31 PM »
Bitcoin Wallet (powered by bitshares)  Transmute your coins and earn interest in Bitcoin, Gold, Oil, or USDollars.

Keeping bitcoin as the focus would be important to gain bitcoin purists interest without creating opposition or defensiveness.

Primarily as a bitcoin wallet, you wouldn't even need to mention BTS/bitUSD/bitBTC but that is how it works in the background.  They would still be able to send receive bitUSD etc but it wouldn't be billed as a bitshares wallet.  (perhaps an advanced feature where you could change the wallets 'Focus' from default-bitcoin to BTS or bitUSD etc)

In addition, once we have some automated BTC<>bitBTC transmutation, users of this wallet could then gain all the benefits of named accounts, faster confirmation times, lower transaction fees, etc. between BTC users of this wallet and not even realize they're using the bitshares network.

There's no reason to try and replace bitcoin and we have more to gain by embracing and including bitcoin.   

....  "bitshares makes it better"

Offline hpenvy

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2014, 05:19:05 PM »
Bitcoin Wallet (powered by bitshares)  Transmute your coins and earn interest in Bitcoin, Gold, Oil, or USDollars.

Keeping bitcoin as the focus would be important to gain bitcoin purists interest without creating opposition or defensiveness.

Primarily as a bitcoin wallet, you wouldn't even need to mention BTS/bitUSD/bitBTC but that is how it works in the background.  They would still be able to send receive bitUSD etc but it wouldn't be billed as a bitshares wallet.  (perhaps an advanced feature where you could change the wallets 'Focus' from default-bitcoin to BTS or bitUSD etc)

In addition, once we have some automated BTC<>bitBTC transmutation, users of this wallet could then gain all the benefits of named accounts, faster confirmation times, lower transaction fees, etc. between BTC users of this wallet and not even realize they're using the bitshares network.

There's no reason to try and replace bitcoin and we have more to gain by embracing and including bitcoin.   

....  "bitshares makes it better"

Love it!
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julian1

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2014, 08:29:50 PM »
For online-merchants (bitUSD) -> avoid recalculating prices everyday, instant confirmation, no chargebacks.

For Bitcoin (bitBTC) -> embrace ideology and terminology/memes - "to the moon" etc, extend, extinguish.

Positioning needs to be different for different end-users.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2014, 08:32:16 PM by julian1 »

sumantso

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Re: Stan - Bitcoin is not the gold, it's an investment account - Marketing
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2014, 09:04:43 PM »
For online-merchants (bitUSD) -> avoid recalculating prices everyday, instant confirmation, no chargebacks.

For Bitcoin (bitBTC) -> embrace ideology and terminology/memes - "to the moon" etc, extend, extinguish.

Positioning needs to be different for different end-users.

Thats what I felt. The focus has been too much on BitUSD, but BitBTC has a very different, and more ready market.

The best part is that BitBTC enhances Bitcoin, and so is not a competitor. BitBTC allows people to effectively use BTC with faster transaction times, anonymity and also earn interest.

 

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