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Offline bytemaster

Default Vote for Core Devs???
« on: January 03, 2015, 05:30:37 PM »

Many of the core developers are critical to the success of BTS and they are implicitly trusted by everyone who downloads the wallet. 

For this reason I would like to suggest that the next release of the BTS wallet set the "default" approval for the following core developers:

Me, Toast, Nathan, Vikram, Valentine, James, Ben, Dan N., Eric F.   

Each of these guys is implicitly trusted and contributing directly to the github source.    This would really help the core team to get and keep the votes necessary without having to worry much about their salary.   Users could always "unvote" them.   

Thoughts? 
« Last Edit: January 03, 2015, 07:17:09 PM by Stan »
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Offline btswildpig

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Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2015, 05:33:45 PM »
bad idea .
You can release a "readme.txt" file with the wallet , states that these are the developer who is working on the wallet , suggest people to vote for them .

But do not set it on default on the software ..

Bad PR .
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Offline btswildpig

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Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #2 on: January 03, 2015, 05:39:43 PM »
Or a "slate list" after open the wallet for the first time

Dialog :  Which build in voting slate you like to use ?
1\I don't want to choose any of these 
2\core developers
3\Xeroc's
4\xxxxxxxx's
5\yyyyyy's

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Offline Thom

Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2015, 05:42:14 PM »
For now I think it's OK, but not so much in the future. Although you're absolutely correct that trust is implicit since they're the one's creating the wallet, the problem I see with it is the inherent bias or conflict of interest it represents. It weakens the minority shareholder representation by giving advantage to those that already have a strong influence.

Let the shareholders wishes be purely represented.

As I said, it's OK for now, and, as a default (for those who don't vote? what does default mean in this context exactly?) it makes perfect sense.
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Offline davidpbrown

Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #4 on: January 03, 2015, 05:43:18 PM »
Fixing the vote?.. It's unclear why that would be necessary. If default atm adds nothing and votes follow from stakes voting, I can't see where the risk is. It would be adding in politics where it might not be needed?.. Better everyone is on the inside.

If you do go that route then avoid doing it in a way that users are unaware of, as such moves are known to irritate.

It could be made an explicit upfront acknowledgement of default slate, like terms and conditions often are.. suggesting in the absence of you choosing others, these are our core developers and they are recommended to you.. click to vote for these.. implicit then perhaps that users should be voting for someone. The thought then is don't take power from people but appeal to them.

I'd suggest either way, voting needs to be made more obvious in the GUI with perhaps a pop-up introduction that details what the process is and has pointers where to find more information could help encourage people to engage with voting.

I suppose on the upside it weights voting against any kind of future conspiracy but would that not be short lived if it did occur.  :-\
« Last Edit: January 03, 2015, 05:46:34 PM by davidpbrown »
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Offline Troglodactyl

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Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2015, 05:47:44 PM »
I'd just go with a yes/no dialog in the next wallet version on first launch.

"Would you like default votes set to support the developer team?"

Or something to that effect.  Doing it silently could be bad PR.

EDIT: This is largely a problem because there's a lot of stake currently defaulted to voting for init delegates, correct?
« Last Edit: January 03, 2015, 05:49:39 PM by Troglodactyl »

Offline santaclause102

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Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2015, 05:49:50 PM »
I'd just go with a yes/no dialog in the next wallet version on first launch.

"Would you like default votes set to support the developer team?"

Or something to that effect.  Doing it silently could be bad PR.
That sounds reasonable and would achieve the same goal.

Offline btswildpig

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Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2015, 05:49:54 PM »
I would say :

The OP that sets a single default option is bad PR and all the FUD would outweigh the potential benefit of securing votes for the devs .
And bad PR shakes confidence in the market , thus affects the price .
Thus , affects the delegate income .
Thus , devs won't have good income after all .


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Offline Rune

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Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2015, 05:51:38 PM »
Please don't do this, it's gonna be a PR nightmare. I used to think default voting was a good solution but bitcoiners and our competitors are going to turn it into a giant circlejerk that comes up in every single discussion or news piece about bitshares until the end of time.

I don't think we should even have optional slates bundled in the client like btswildpig is suggesting. Influencing votes directly through the client is just one of those things that people will get worked into a frenzy about.

The best solution is to get the wallet working so people can vote safely, and perhaps have offline voting or some of the other features suggested to prevent voting apathy. Even without this I don't think there's a big probability that current core devs will not be voted in relatively fast, and once they're in they'll never get voted out unless they actually deserve it.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2015, 06:06:43 PM by Rune »

Offline callmeluc

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Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2015, 05:55:47 PM »
Many of the core developers are critical to the success of BTS and they are implicitly trusted by everyone who downloads the wallet. 

For this reason I would like to suggest that the next release of the BTS wallet set the "default" approval for the following core developers:

Me, Toast, Nathan, Vikram, Valentine, James, Ben, Dan N., Eric F.   

Each of these guys is implicitly trusted and contributing directly to the github source.    This would really help the core team to get and keep the votes necessary without having to worry much about their salary.   Users could always "unvote" them.   

Thoughts?

Bad idea.
We all trust these guys, who have done a great job already. But what if someone don't deserve a delegate position anymore, or maybe just don't want this job anymore, for family reason or whatever it is, do we need a required upgrade to kick him out?

The easier BTS wallet becoming to use,  the less "default" there will be, the more vote they will get. No need to worry about that.

BTS_自扯自淡

Offline Gentso1

Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2015, 05:56:40 PM »
While I am for this in principle, a slate might be a friendly comprise.

BTS wildpig brings up a good point that if a default YES vote for devs was included in the client it might help to continue to draw parallels between this project and memory coin.

A yes/no dev vote during installation would also be a good solution.

Its transparent and offers the same support.

It should be stated though how many delegates each Dev is requesting support for 

Offline mf-tzo

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Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2015, 05:59:09 PM »
I think that this is a terrible idea leading to a very bad PR and I would delete this thread before many people see that proposal and start spreading unnecessary FUD. We cannot afford any more BTS dumping and if you go down that road this will undoubtedly happen.

 

Offline davidpbrown

Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2015, 06:01:01 PM »
As per Rune.. keeping the controversy outside the client might be best. Pointers on how to in the wiki and have the forum host detail of slates, with perhaps a sticky slate detail of the core devs by way of strong indicator.

I think there is some advantage in making the core devs more apparent.. perhaps biographies, even if fictional can help their getting votes. Are the ~business cases put somewhere easy to navigate?.. Perhaps could add those to the wiki.


There's a rather good exhibition on at the London V&A about political movements and identity Disobedient Objects, which had me wonder that part of the way community and identity is encouraged is by tokens that acknowledge roles. Perhaps the forum could acknowledge people's roles in some way, so devs are less anonymous among the crowd.
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Offline speedy

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Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2015, 06:04:51 PM »
I think that this is a terrible idea leading to a very bad PR and I would delete this thread before many people see that proposal and start spreading unnecessary FUD. We cannot afford any more BTS dumping and if you go down that road this will undoubtedly happen.

+5%

How many core developers are not getting voted in anyway?

Offline fluxer555

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Re: Default Vote for Core Devs
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2015, 06:05:54 PM »
I support a dialog on initial load, giving the user the ability to see who are in the slate, and a link to a thread describing the roles of each dev.

 

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