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Offline CoinaDay

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Hello + block rate question
« on: January 09, 2015, 06:14:33 PM »

Hi,

I'm doing a series on /r/CryptoCurrency with a "Coin a day", hence the name, and my topic for today is BitShares. I'm a little crunched for time with leaving town tonight and various things to take care of, so I'll cut to the chase with my question for now:

Is the block rate for BitShares 5 minutes? I vaguely recall a reference somewhere to 10 second transaction times being possible on BTS but I also seem to recall 5 minute block rate. Please provide me with as authoritative of a source (link) as possible, as I like to be able to footnote my articles with a reference to something conclusive.

Thank you, and I may be updating this thread throughout the day with more questions as I hit them, so I would greatly appreciate it if people can keep an eye on this.  :)

Cheers! I'm looking forward to diving in here!

Offline toast

Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2015, 06:22:02 PM »
Block times are ten seconds. The source is github.com/bitshares/bitshares, because all our documentation is terrible.

Why don't you try out the client?  I'll send you some bitUSD to play around with.
Do not use this post as information for making any important decisions. The only agreements I ever make are informal and non-binding. Take the same precautions as when dealing with a compromised account, scammer, sockpuppet, etc.

Offline muse-umum

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Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2015, 06:26:05 PM »
Welcome on board.

http://bitshares.org/the-value-proposition-of-bitsharesx-part-i-core-technology/

Quote
Speed and scalability.
BitShares reduces Bitcoin’s 10-minute confirmation time to 10 seconds and users can be 100% sure that a transaction is finally settled after 51 delegates have produced a block. BitShares is more secure after 1 block (10 seconds) than Bitcoin is after 6 blocks (1 hour).
BitShares is designed to handle thousands of transactions per second.

Offline CoinaDay

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Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2015, 07:16:12 PM »
Damn, you guys are fast lol. Thanks!

Okay, so it looks like there's no *nix client, at least no obvious download on that site? That's unfortunate. Oh, well, I've already got a Windows laptop up for playing with the Windows NYAN client (long story), so I downloaded and started it there. Nice thing about this system is that the clients are all light clients, so no big blockchain download.

I don't know how much I'll play around with it today, just trying to get the minimum together for the article and move onto other things I need to prepare in the few hours before I go, but I expect I'll continue checking out BTS later. So...I'll take whatever shares you want to give. ;-) And I'll note it in my disclosure. Fair warning: I've been accused of being a DOGE shill by the RDDheads and it's basically true. Don't expect that my endorsement will carry a lot of weight.

Hm...the create a new wallet seems to be taking a long time or stuck. I'm on Windows XP, possibly unsupported? Ah, never mind, just took a little bit. Oh, and I guess I was wrong: it looks like it does need to get the whole blockchain? I'm surprised; since only delegates process transactions I would have expected a light-wallet to be possible/default.

The Create New Account button doesn't seem to do anything. Ah, never mind, just took a little bit again. Are these slight delays waiting for blocks to confirm them?

The account key, which I'm guessing is the address, is:

BTS5U5ZJTfiebxXJdwTNXEArsdq4jiXG3AkM1apAvUhYu9PZUrUxq

At least I think it is. Manually copied between the computers. Quick visual inspection looks right. Ah, had one lowercase swapped for uppercase; okay, I think it's right.

The last block synced is 156 days ago but I have ten network connections; will that resolve itself shortly?

Edit: Now it says 148 days ago; I guess it is syncing a whole block chain and just very stutter-step about it?

Edit 2: Yep, slowly syncing: 137 days back now. Works.

Okay, so another question: any links to a good source on a maximum transaction rate with the current code? This doesn't seem to be a bitcoin fork, so my typical methods don't apply. Basically: any source on how many transactions can fit into a block? Thanks!

Edit 3: As long as I'm having you guys do my "homework" (no, not a school project just to be clear; personal project, but it's what I'd have to find otherwise for my standard summary I do): any good source on the transaction fees? (That is, for standard BTS transfer, not bitAsset stuff) the wiki isn't very helpful as usual: http://wiki.bitshares.org/index.php/Transaction_Fees

Oh, and I see my transaction rate question was actually included in the link/quote above. Never mind; thanks! Although I would still appreciate a technical link explaining how that works. This means that tens of thousands of transactions can be in a block? So then is there no upper limit to block size, since all the transaction processors are trusted?
« Last Edit: January 09, 2015, 07:28:44 PM by CoinaDay »

Offline mint chocolate chip

Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2015, 07:27:16 PM »
It will not take too long, lightweight clients are one of the top priorities and should be out soon.

Offline biophil

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Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2015, 07:31:23 PM »
Hm...the create a new wallet seems to be taking a long time or stuck. I'm on Windows XP, possibly unsupported?
Yep, probably.

Quote
it looks like it does need to get the whole blockchain?

Yes, there is no lightweight client yet. Delegates process transactions, but the anonymity features in BitShares aren't completely straightforward to implement in lightweight clients.

Quote
Are these slight delays waiting for blocks to confirm them?

The GUI is pretty slow. Work in progress.

Quote
The account key, which I'm guessing is the address, is:
BTS5U5ZJTfiebxXJdwTNXEArsdq4jiXG3AkM1apAvUhYu9PZUrUxq

Yes, but BitShares doesn't really use addresses. When the blockchain has completely synced, register your account on the blockchain and then forget about the account key. Once your account name is registered, you can have people send to the name rather than to the key. You can register an account here: http://faucet.bitshares.org

Quote
Okay, so another question: any links to a good source on a maximum transaction rate with the current code? This doesn't seem to be a bitcoin fork, so my typical methods don't apply. Basically: any source on how many transactions can fit into a block? Thanks!

That is correct, this is not a bitcoin fork and your bitcoin intuition doesn't typically apply here. They talk about very high transactions-per-second in Bitshares, but I don't have numbers or references off the top of my head. There is a lot of information here: http://wiki.bitshares.org/index.php/Main_Page
« Last Edit: January 09, 2015, 07:39:48 PM by biophil »

Online svk

Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2015, 07:38:02 PM »
Hi,

I'm doing a series on /r/CryptoCurrency with a "Coin a day", hence the name, and my topic for today is BitShares. I'm a little crunched for time with leaving town tonight and various things to take care of, so I'll cut to the chase with my question for now:

Is the block rate for BitShares 5 minutes? I vaguely recall a reference somewhere to 10 second transaction times being possible on BTS but I also seem to recall 5 minute block rate. Please provide me with as authoritative of a source (link) as possible, as I like to be able to footnote my articles with a reference to something conclusive.

Thank you, and I may be updating this thread throughout the day with more questions as I hit them, so I would greatly appreciate it if people can keep an eye on this.  :)

Cheers! I'm looking forward to diving in here!
Welcome, you can also watch the blocks as they come in on www.bitsharesblocks.com/blocks.

You might also find some other interesting info there :)
Worker: dev.bitsharesblocks

Offline CoinaDay

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Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2015, 08:07:54 PM »
I really appreciate the responses guys.

For right now though, the transaction fees and the transaction rate limit (maximum transactions in a block) are what I'm most curious about.

I have looked at the wiki, and frankly I'm not impressed. It seriously needs work. This is a criticism but not a condemnation. I think BTS has a lot of great stuff, but documentation is not one of them. I'll be busy for the next couple of weeks, but hopefully I'll find the time (somehow) to start contributing later on and if so, working on improving the documentation would be where I would start.

With that said, I see no place on there to find information about transaction fees (I linked the page and it doesn't have what I need: transaction fees for moving BTS themselves) or transaction rate limits.

This is all very fascinating though, or I wouldn't be putting the time in to engage. I was pretty skeptical (one of my first readings was the bitmarmot stuff which I found hilarious) but I'm starting to see how it can work.


Offline CoinaDay

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Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #9 on: January 09, 2015, 09:14:22 PM »
Awesome; thanks! And I registered with the faucet. And bought 1900 shares on BTER. I'll withdraw from there once I've got my client synced and I can confirm the account is registered.

Should be coin-a-day.

So...anyone have a good source showing a maximum limit on transactions per block, or stating that there isn't one?

Thanks for the help everyone! I'll really looking forward to digging into this more deeply once I'm back from my trip.

Offline toast

Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2015, 09:21:16 PM »
Awesome; thanks! And I registered with the faucet. And bought 1900 shares on BTER. I'll withdraw from there once I've got my client synced and I can confirm the account is registered.

Should be coin-a-day.

So...anyone have a good source showing a maximum limit on transactions per block, or stating that there isn't one?

Thanks for the help everyone! I'll really looking forward to digging into this more deeply once I'm back from my trip.

Right now the maximum block size is 50k while transactions are about 250 bytes on average. There is also a soft limit of 10 transactions per second enforced at the network layer.
Do not use this post as information for making any important decisions. The only agreements I ever make are informal and non-binding. Take the same precautions as when dealing with a compromised account, scammer, sockpuppet, etc.

Offline testz

Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2015, 09:24:09 PM »
Awesome; thanks! And I registered with the faucet. And bought 1900 shares on BTER. I'll withdraw from there once I've got my client synced and I can confirm the account is registered.

Should be coin-a-day.

So...anyone have a good source showing a maximum limit on transactions per block, or stating that there isn't one?

Thanks for the help everyone! I'll really looking forward to digging into this more deeply once I'm back from my trip.

Please check table here, maybe it's helps you: http://wiki.bitshares.org/index.php/BitShares/Why_BitShares

Offline CoinaDay

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Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2015, 09:49:05 PM »
Thank you both very much!

So if I understand this correctly, the design is intended to scale to thousands of transactions per second relatively easily, while it currently could reach 20 transactions per second with a truly tiny tweak, and 10 transactions per second is just written in for convenience / stability at this point.

And it looks like it's nowhere near this right now, so not a major concern in any way. I just always find out because "transaction limit (current)" is one of the items I have for my summary. :-)

Okay, I think I can pretty well do the write-up now. I'll let you guys know if I have any further questions, and I'll link in this thread once I post.

Cheers!

Edit: One additional note: sadly, the client is not working for me. It was syncing and getting close and looked really pretty, but then it up and crashed and I haven't been able to get it to load again. I know XP probably isn't considered supported these days, but it's still disappointing. And I didn't see *nix support for pre-compiled clients on the site. I'm not going to have time to compile my own *nix client today, so it'll be a week or two before I can use the client. Oh well; it's disappointing, but I review most of my "coins" without a client. Still, this and the low transaction volume and the state of the documentation show me a project in its infancy. That's not a horrible thing; it leaves upside potential just from getting basic development going, but there is work to be done. Hopefully I'll end up contributing.

Edit 2: I can't find a source giving transaction rates for the last 24 hours (number of transactions and total value of the transactions). I'd definitely appreciate if someone could link me to something like this; otherwise I'll just have to estimate from http://www.bitsharesblocks.com/blocks as best I can.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2015, 10:10:24 PM by CoinaDay »

Offline testz

Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2015, 10:13:34 PM »
Edit 2: I can't find a source giving transaction rates for the last 24 hours (number of transactions and total value of the transactions). I'd definitely appreciate if someone could link me to something like this; otherwise I'll just have to estimate from http://www.bitsharesblocks.com/blocks as best I can.

Please check here: http://www.bitsharesblocks.com/charts

Offline CoinaDay

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Re: Hello + block rate question
« Reply #14 on: January 09, 2015, 10:16:30 PM »
Edit 2: I can't find a source giving transaction rates for the last 24 hours (number of transactions and total value of the transactions). I'd definitely appreciate if someone could link me to something like this; otherwise I'll just have to estimate from http://www.bitsharesblocks.com/blocks as best I can.

Please check here: http://www.bitsharesblocks.com/charts

Yep; that's it exactly. Thanks!

I don't suppose you know of a rich list anywhere? I like to get % held by top 100 addresses.

 

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