Cass deserves a second delegate.

[matt608]

There are lots of people working full time who are being under-paid and some part timers getting no pay at all, should all the devs be given an extra delegate?  Of course cass deserves a second one but if we vote in second full pay delegates for every full time worker we'll be broke.  I'll just say yes, he does deserve one, and leave it at that.

Many of the developers are huge BTS holders so they can / should sell some of their shares to pay for whatever lifestyle they're acclimated to. Perhaps a good compromise for Cass would be to publicly state "I will retire delegate number 2 when market cap reaches X for Y time".

That sounds reasonable, I was thinking it largely depends on the size of the individuals BTS holdings, the earlier they were here the less they need now.

[Method-X]

There are lots of people working full time who are being under-paid and some part timers getting no pay at all, should all the devs be given an extra delegate?  Of course cass deserves a second one but if we vote in second full pay delegates for every full time worker we'll be broke.  I'll just say yes, he does deserve one, and leave it at that.

Many of the developers are huge BTS holders so they can / should sell some of their shares to pay for whatever lifestyle they're acclimated to. Perhaps a good compromise for Cass would be to publicly state "I will retire delegate number 2 when market cap reaches X for Y time".

[matt608]

There are lots of people working full time who are being under-paid and some part timers getting no pay at all, should all the devs be given an extra delegate?  Of course cass deserves a second one but if we vote in second full pay delegates for every full time worker we'll be broke.  I'll just say yes, he does deserve one, and leave it at that.

[CryptoPrometheus]

Cass x 2  +5%

[fuzzy]

I think Cass is only one of a few delegates who need a second delegate. 
I support Cass having a second delegate and also support a number of core developers having them.  I simply hope that they will, at a certain marketcap, promise to turn them off.

[edilliam]

You don't necessarily have to spend money to make money. Bitcoin didn't. Yes it's definitely better if we can, but I'm just trying to make the point that it isn't 100% necessary. I've been working full time for free for months now and I'm aware of several others in similar positions. I really dislike these kind of "we need something, anything" type posts like we haven't got a light wallet on the way, or multiple bridges, or a zero click shopping cart, or a massive decentralized marketing effort or multiple media projects or about 20 different teams working on other awesome stuff. If you want to increase the cap, bring attention to these things and highlight them! If you keep pretending nothing is going on then you will decrease the cap.

:'(

You make good points also. Maybe the bear market's just getting to me. I just hate the thought of something this awesome dropping into oblivion due to mistakes that can possibly be avoided. And I hate seeing long-standing forum members such as sumantso giving up hope.

I still believe BTS has a bright future, and will hold my stake until the bitter end.

I feel you man. I strongly believe it's times like this that we need to come together and work together. We need to focus on all the positive stuff, because there is so much of that! Just look at the newsletter for example: https://bitshares.org/newsletter/2015/nullstreet/the_nullstreet_journal_0-1.pdf

[nomoreheroes7]

You don't necessarily have to spend money to make money. Bitcoin didn't. Yes it's definitely better if we can, but I'm just trying to make the point that it isn't 100% necessary. I've been working full time for free for months now and I'm aware of several others in similar positions. I really dislike these kind of "we need something, anything" type posts like we haven't got a light wallet on the way, or multiple bridges, or a zero click shopping cart, or a massive decentralized marketing effort or multiple media projects or about 20 different teams working on other awesome stuff. If you want to increase the cap, bring attention to these things and highlight them! If you keep pretending nothing is going on then you will decrease the cap.

:'(

You make good points also. Maybe the bear market's just getting to me. I just hate the thought of something this awesome dropping into oblivion due to mistakes that can possibly be avoided. And I hate seeing long-standing forum members such as sumantso giving up hope.

I still believe BTS has a bright future, and will hold my stake until the bitter end.

As a dev delegate I am expected to take a haircut in terms of pay but I also expect to work part-time because it won't pay the bills... I have a full-time job and work on this stuff on the side so this is the kind of person that would fit the description for a developer delegate right now... when things change maybe you can have full-time devs once price rises but I expect this to be an early adoption phase so I'm holding as many as I can get assuming they are worth alot more in the future... to me its not the amount of fiat I am making but the amount of BTS and the amount I am happy with for the project I work on. Just like its not enough right now there will be a time when its TOO much.. so if we stay the line now.. we will reap the benefits later.

Also once a dev has enough experience he/she becomes a perfectionist.. and usually wants to do good work, automatically putting more hours in to make sure they release good tools, especially ones that may change the world... usually will make up for the fact that the pay is less (atleast for me). Usually devs are good at holding because they know they can raise value by developing.

So in summary, the devs that are delegates now are not depending on the pay to put food on the table.. but ones that fit the bill are the ones who are holding now to be "whales" in the future. If I was to interview a dev for a delegate job I would make sure they fit this personality trait, it will bring the most benefit in the least amount of time(time is of essence)

+5%

This is the kind of developer BTS needs more of. How the hell do you not yet have a delegate??

I too support a second delegate for cass, btw.

[jsidhu]

As a dev delegate I am expected to take a haircut in terms of pay but I also expect to work part-time because it won't pay the bills... I have a full-time job and work on this stuff on the side so this is the kind of person that would fit the description for a developer delegate right now... when things change maybe you can have full-time devs once price rises but I expect this to be an early adoption phase so I'm holding as many as I can get assuming they are worth alot more in the future... to me its not the amount of fiat I am making but the amount of BTS and the amount I am happy with for the project I work on. Just like its not enough right now there will be a time when its TOO much.. so if we stay the line now.. we will reap the benefits later.

Also once a dev has enough experience he/she becomes a perfectionist.. and usually wants to do good work, automatically putting more hours in to make sure they release good tools, especially ones that may change the world... usually will make up for the fact that the pay is less (atleast for me). Usually devs are good at holding because they know they can raise value by developing.

So in summary, the devs that are delegates now are not depending on the pay to put food on the table.. but ones that fit the bill are the ones who are holding now to be "whales" in the future. If I was to interview a dev for a delegate job I would make sure they fit this personality trait, it will bring the most benefit in the least amount of time(time is of essence)

[edilliam]

At current market cap, he's not making much

This was expected, and for me a big part of the reason why BTS is going to fail. Developers and others need to be paid, some of them have only this as their job, and with ever decreasing we would need more dilution causing more lowering in price; while other groups can happily fork the efforts and with good marketing can become successful. I only hope they sharedrop on us too.

BTS is NOT going to fail! You are leaving out of the equation the value being added by the delegates which is soon going to become more and more apparent. You are therefore, for whatever your personal reason (fear of success?), just spreading FUD.

+5%
And this is not first time of sumantso spreading FUD
Yes for cass second delegate  :)

FUD or not, he makes good points. We won't get anywhere by just telling each other that all is well and good and ignoring the fact that we're kind of dangling over a cliff at the moment. You need to spend money to make money, and with every drop in market cap this gets more difficult. Just as DAC self-funding can be explosively helpful in a rising market, the opposite also holds true: a falling market cap is a death spiral.

Something, anything to boost the market cap is needed ASAP, or we will begin losing developers who aren't willing to put their livelihoods on the line to chase a dream.

You don't necessarily have to spend money to make money. Bitcoin didn't. Yes it's definitely better if we can, but I'm just trying to make the point that it isn't 100% necessary. I've been working full time for free for months now and I'm aware of several others in similar positions. I really dislike these kind of "we need something, anything" type posts like we haven't got a light wallet on the way, or multiple bridges, or a zero click shopping cart, or a massive decentralized marketing effort or multiple media projects or about 20 different teams working on other awesome stuff. If you want to increase the cap, bring attention to these things and highlight them! If you keep pretending nothing is going on then you will decrease the cap.

Edit: I am in support of cass getting a 2nd delegate btw.

[nomoreheroes7]

At current market cap, he's not making much

This was expected, and for me a big part of the reason why BTS is going to fail. Developers and others need to be paid, some of them have only this as their job, and with ever decreasing we would need more dilution causing more lowering in price; while other groups can happily fork the efforts and with good marketing can become successful. I only hope they sharedrop on us too.

BTS is NOT going to fail! You are leaving out of the equation the value being added by the delegates which is soon going to become more and more apparent. You are therefore, for whatever your personal reason (fear of success?), just spreading FUD.

+5%
And this is not first time of sumantso spreading FUD
Yes for cass second delegate  :)

FUD or not, he makes good points. We won't get anywhere by just telling each other that all is well and good and ignoring the fact that we're kind of dangling over a cliff at the moment. You need to spend money to make money, and with every drop in market cap this gets more difficult. Just as DAC self-funding can be explosively helpful in a rising market, the opposite also holds true: a falling market cap is a death spiral.

Something, anything to boost the market cap is needed ASAP, or we will begin losing developers who aren't willing to put their livelihoods on the line to chase a dream.

[mitao]

What if BTS marketcap falls to 5m, do the devs deserve 5 delegates each? What if BTS falls to 2m?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[vegolino]

At current market cap, he's not making much

This was expected, and for me a big part of the reason why BTS is going to fail. Developers and others need to be paid, some of them have only this as their job, and with ever decreasing we would need more dilution causing more lowering in price; while other groups can happily fork the efforts and with good marketing can become successful. I only hope they sharedrop on us too.

BTS is NOT going to fail! You are leaving out of the equation the value being added by the delegates which is soon going to become more and more apparent. You are therefore, for whatever your personal reason (fear of success?), just spreading FUD.

+5%
And this is not first time of sumantso spreading FUD
Yes for cass second delegate  :)

[onceuponatime]

At current market cap, he's not making much

This was expected, and for me a big part of the reason why BTS is going to fail. Developers and others need to be paid, some of them have only this as their job, and with ever decreasing we would need more dilution causing more lowering in price; while other groups can happily fork the efforts and with good marketing can become successful. I only hope they sharedrop on us too.

BTS is NOT going to fail! You are leaving out of the equation the value being added by the delegates which is soon going to become more and more apparent. You are therefore, for whatever your personal reason (fear of success?), just spreading FUD.

[sumantso]

At current market cap, he's not making much

This was expected, and for me a big part of the reason why BTS is going to fail. Developers and others need to be paid, some of them have only this as their job, and with ever decreasing we would need more dilution causing more lowering in price; while other groups can happily fork the efforts and with good marketing can become successful. I only hope they sharedrop on us too.

[cass]

Does Cass work full time for BitShares?

The second delegate should be run at a different location, and preferably by someone else, otherwise it defeats the idea of delegates.

yup that would be our intend! Other Continent, other maintaining team!

Thank you all for your trust in my work!
I'm working full time for BitShares, yes...