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Offline zonda

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What's happening with the price?
« on: March 10, 2015, 10:03:46 PM »

Why is BTS going down?

Offline Ander

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2015, 10:26:57 PM »
Some reasons:

1) Some whales are upset, so they sell.  The whole PR gag order thing is an example of this.
2) Some BTS Developers (who you would normally expect to be strong hands during downturns), sold for tax purposes, which broke through some support levels and increased the amount of BTS out there among traders.
3) At least of the BTS inflation which is going to delegates is being sold to pay for marketing campaigns, fund development efforts, etc. 
4) Some community members got burned in the bter hack, and have withdrawn from buying.  For example, personally, I use to make regular small buys every week, but I havent bought any BTS in 4 weeks now, I've been building up BTC instead.  If/when I get my BTS out of bter I'll probably feel better about the whole thing and start buying again, probably on a different site.
5) Vesting balances of BTS becoming available from peoples PTS/DNS/etc shares means that soem of these people who had previously locked up BTS shares, but who had become bearish, have been selling them.
6) Most altcoins have been falling behind BTC in the recent rallies, with a few notable exceptions like Darkcoin, Monero, etc which had recent pumps.  BTS has dropped in satoshi terms just like most of them.


The marketing efforts and development of features like webwallet, decentralized exchange, etc, seem to be providing some community growth, but not enough yet to overcome these factors.   To see BTS go up we need to see either increasing mass adoption, or attract some new whales with plenty of money to spend, or to have some of the above negative factors go away, turning the downtrend around. 


The upside is that for those of us that believe in BTS long term, we can get very good prices right now.  Close to IPO prices, close to the lows from summer of 2014 before features like assets were even released yet.  We can buy BTS now with a full extra year or more of development work, without paying more than the people who bought long ago. 
« Last Edit: March 10, 2015, 10:29:02 PM by Ander »
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Offline Empirical1.2

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2015, 10:41:33 PM »
Our BTC high was Oct 5th and we've been declining in $ and BTC terms since.   

At first I wasn't sure if this was a good idea but the more I think about it, the more I like it.

We know that a lot of bitcoiners and altcoiners think btsx is a "crapcoin" and a ponzi scheme. So why do we really care what they say about us diluting btsx? Many of them are set in stone and won't "convert". This is why they aren't a target demographic for btsx. Our time, money and energy should be focused on people outside the crypto sphere. Those people don't care how it works, but if it works.

I think as long as this is well thought out and all other options are exhausted that we should go for it.

Kind of reminds me of the famous five monkeys experiment. 
Nobody in those communities is willing to go for the bananas any more
but no one remembers why.
;)


Kind of reminds me of the famous goose that laid the golden eggs.



Today at 0.000032  BTC, we're at a price that we haven't seen since the first few weeks BTSX was launched.

BitAssets are absolutely groundbreaking though.
If you want to take the island burn the boats

Offline Ander

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2015, 10:55:49 PM »
Yes, mistakes were made.  Large mistakes.  BTS holders at the time paid the price dearly.  Those of us who didn't realize they were mistakes and held have suffered. 

One cannot undo mistakes of the past, we can only make decisions now.
The relevant question is:

At the present time, with the features that BTS has now (Paid delegates, market assets, etc), is a price of 3200 satoshis per BTS too high, too low, or roughly correct?

Based on your available funds, and current exposure to BTS or lack thereof, is the correct move for your portfolio to increase your BTS holdings, decrease, or hold the same?
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Offline Empirical1.2

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2015, 11:47:09 PM »
Yes, mistakes were made.  Large mistakes.  BTS holders at the time paid the price dearly.  Those of us who didn't realize they were mistakes and held have suffered. 

One cannot undo mistakes of the past, we can only make decisions now.
The relevant question is:

At the present time, with the features that BTS has now (Paid delegates, market assets, etc), is a price of 3200 satoshis per BTS too high, too low, or roughly correct?

Based on your available funds, and current exposure to BTS or lack thereof, is the correct move for your portfolio to increase your BTS holdings, decrease, or hold the same?

I took a big position in BTS again at the 0.000045 BTC level we seemed to stabilise at as I thought with all the positive developments and the mistakes priced in, we'd start to grow again.  That has obviously proved to be incorrect. So I've been exiting that trade at a loss.

For what BTS technically is and how rapidly it can develop I think it's severely underpriced. However in terms of community growth, BitAsset adoption and general sentiment we've been weak & because we've been in a fairly sustained downtrend I've actually even sold a bit of my base position too.  I'm also concerned about the amount of development BTS seems to need and if it can afford it for more than a few months if the price doesn't recover.

In conclusion I would say we're cheap but I've already taken some losses so even if I miss some of the initial gains, i'll probably wait for a clear change in the direction rather than trying to call the bottom before I accumulate again.
If you want to take the island burn the boats

Offline hadrian

Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2015, 09:27:17 PM »
Yes, mistakes were made.  Large mistakes.  BTS holders at the time paid the price dearly.  Those of us who didn't realize they were mistakes and held have suffered. 

One cannot undo mistakes of the past, we can only make decisions now.
The relevant question is:

At the present time, with the features that BTS has now (Paid delegates, market assets, etc), is a price of 3200 satoshis per BTS too high, too low, or roughly correct?

Based on your available funds, and current exposure to BTS or lack thereof, is the correct move for your portfolio to increase your BTS holdings, decrease, or hold the same?

I took a big position in BTS again at the 0.000045 BTC level we seemed to stabilise at as I thought with all the positive developments and the mistakes priced in, we'd start to grow again.  That has obviously proved to be incorrect. So I've been exiting that trade at a loss.

For what BTS technically is and how rapidly it can develop I think it's severely underpriced. However in terms of community growth, BitAsset adoption and general sentiment we've been weak & because we've been in a fairly sustained downtrend I've actually even sold a bit of my base position too.  I'm also concerned about the amount of development BTS seems to need and if it can afford it for more than a few months if the price doesn't recover.

In conclusion I would say we're cheap but I've already taken some losses so even if I miss some of the initial gains, i'll probably wait for a clear change in the direction rather than trying to call the bottom before I accumulate again.

I'm not disagreeing with anything Empirical said here - it's reasonable. There is obviously risk involved with anything as groundbreaking as BitShares. One can argue that it makes sense to pull out to a degree and then come back in if there's a clear positive change. I would, however, like to describe an alternative way to view things.

I put quite a lot of money (for me) into BitShares, in large part because I want it to succeed for ideological reasons. If I only wanted to make money I may do what Empirical suggested. I didn't put more money in than I can afford to lose, so I would rather lose it all while supporting BitShares than sell to avoid personal loss. I see it as a once in a lifetime thing and I'm gonna stick to my metaphorical guns! If I decide I can reasonably afford more, I'll get more.

This isn't to criticise Empirical, I'm posting this to remind myself why I'm here. It's easy (and sometimes exciting) to get caught up in market caps, but for me there is more at stake.
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Offline roadscape

Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #6 on: March 12, 2015, 01:47:59 AM »
Yes, mistakes were made.  Large mistakes.  BTS holders at the time paid the price dearly.  Those of us who didn't realize they were mistakes and held have suffered. 

One cannot undo mistakes of the past, we can only make decisions now.
The relevant question is:

At the present time, with the features that BTS has now (Paid delegates, market assets, etc), is a price of 3200 satoshis per BTS too high, too low, or roughly correct?

Based on your available funds, and current exposure to BTS or lack thereof, is the correct move for your portfolio to increase your BTS holdings, decrease, or hold the same?

I took a big position in BTS again at the 0.000045 BTC level we seemed to stabilise at as I thought with all the positive developments and the mistakes priced in, we'd start to grow again.  That has obviously proved to be incorrect. So I've been exiting that trade at a loss.

For what BTS technically is and how rapidly it can develop I think it's severely underpriced. However in terms of community growth, BitAsset adoption and general sentiment we've been weak & because we've been in a fairly sustained downtrend I've actually even sold a bit of my base position too.  I'm also concerned about the amount of development BTS seems to need and if it can afford it for more than a few months if the price doesn't recover.

In conclusion I would say we're cheap but I've already taken some losses so even if I miss some of the initial gains, i'll probably wait for a clear change in the direction rather than trying to call the bottom before I accumulate again.

I'm not disagreeing with anything Empirical said here - it's reasonable. There is obviously risk involved with anything as groundbreaking as BitShares. One can argue that it makes sense to pull out to a degree and then come back in if there's a clear positive change. I would, however, like to describe an alternative way to view things.

I put quite a lot of money (for me) into BitShares, in large part because I want it to succeed for ideological reasons. If I only wanted to make money I may do what Empirical suggested. I didn't put more money in than I can afford to lose, so I would rather lose it all while supporting BitShares than sell to avoid personal loss. I see it as a once in a lifetime thing and I'm gonna stick to my metaphorical guns! If I decide I can reasonably afford more, I'll get more.

This isn't to criticise Empirical, I'm posting this to remind myself why I'm here. It's easy (and sometimes exciting) to get caught up in market caps, but for me there is more at stake.

Well put!

Also, http://www.businessinsider.com/investors-miss-stock-market-rallies-charts-2014-10
"In other words, investors were just fantastic at being exposed to the market only when it was sliding."
"When volatility picks up, it's tempting to trade in and out of the market with the hope you'll protect your wealth. Unfortunately, this increases the risk you'll miss some of the best days in the market. And that can be very costly."
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Offline Frodo03

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2015, 01:23:16 PM »
I haven't sold any of what I initially bought, but I must say I don't think the future for Bitshares is mass adoption. Ethereum is going to be coming out in roughly a month or so, and it can do everything Bitshares can do AND MUCH MORE. Not to mention that Ethereum's backing is much greater than Bitshares. So why settle for BitShares? Why not just wait until Ethereum is released?

Offline hpenvy2

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2015, 01:27:41 PM »
I haven't sold any of what I initially bought, but I must say I don't think the future for Bitshares is mass adoption. Ethereum is going to be coming out in roughly a month or so, and it can do everything Bitshares can do AND MUCH MORE. Not to mention that Ethereum's backing is much greater than Bitshares. So why settle for BitShares? Why not just wait until Ethereum is released?

There's a rumor it also washes you car on the weekend and makes a mean double chocolate milkshake.

Offline btswildpig

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2015, 01:41:32 PM »
I haven't sold any of what I initially bought, but I must say I don't think the future for Bitshares is mass adoption. Ethereum is going to be coming out in roughly a month or so, and it can do everything Bitshares can do AND MUCH MORE. Not to mention that Ethereum's backing is much greater than Bitshares. So why settle for BitShares? Why not just wait until Ethereum is released?

Go to Ethereum , earn some money , buy more BTS with the money you earn .  :P
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Offline xeroc

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2015, 01:43:08 PM »
I haven't sold any of what I initially bought, but I must say I don't think the future for Bitshares is mass adoption. Ethereum is going to be coming out in roughly a month or so, and it can do everything Bitshares can do AND MUCH MORE. Not to mention that Ethereum's backing is much greater than Bitshares. So why settle for BitShares? Why not just wait until Ethereum is released?

There's a rumor it also washes you car on the weekend and makes a mean double chocolate milkshake.
*reusper*:
http://www.reddit.com/r/counterparty_xcp/comments/2y0apx/contract_news/

And this is *just* the beginning .. who knows what happens if this thing has to scale ..

BTW, with ethereum doing POW .. there are NO synchronous blocks .. hence .. network propagation has to be considere for network security .. which usually leads to higher average block confirmation times ..
what POW coin do you know that has 10 secs block time? how secure are they?

With POW in ethereum and asynchronous blocks, the market pegged assets will certainly not run as nice and smoothly as in BTS ..
Give BitShares a try! Use the http://testnet.bitshares.eu provided by http://bitshares.eu powered by ChainSquad GmbH

TurkeyLeg

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #11 on: March 12, 2015, 01:49:49 PM »
I bought BTS at 5k, 6k, and 7k Satoshi (and BTC around $500) last fall. Basically, I bought in as soon as I realized the potential of this project.

I have already lost most of my investment. To sell at this point would be pointless. The difference between selling now and the price dropping to 0.00 is too close to bother with it. I'll hold for the Hail Mary and maybe I'll get lucky.

Not how I expected the last 8 months to go, that's for sure - however the web wallet is almost useful and development in general is making progress- so we will see.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2015, 03:00:11 AM by TurkeyLeg »

Tuck Fheman

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #12 on: March 12, 2015, 02:06:09 PM »
Why is BTS going down?

It's because of a few people posting their opinions on this forum. I know it sounds amazing, but that's what actually drives the price of BitShares and determines if more developers will sharedrop.

If everyone here would just say positive things and have happy thoughts about BitShares (no matter how bad things get screwed up behind the scenes), we'd all be millionaires by 2016.
 :-\
[/pointmaking]

Offline mf-tzo

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2015, 02:11:26 PM »
I bought BTS at 5, 6, and 7 Satoshi (and BTC around $500) last fall. Basically, I bought in as soon as I realized the potential of this project.

I have already lost most of my investment. To sell at this point would be pointless. The difference between selling now and the price dropping to 0.00 is too close to bother with it. I'll hold for the Hail Mary and maybe I'll get lucky.

Not how I expected the last 8 months to go, that's for sure - however the web wallet is almost useful and development in general is making progress- so we will see.

You are not the only one so don't worry...I have been around from the beginning and lost almost all my investment since I was buying whenever I can afford at whatever price. I think we will soon have a second pump. BTS just doesn't deserve to die. The world needs this more than ever..The problem is that the world doesn't know that yet..
 

TurkeyLeg

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Re: What's happening with the price?
« Reply #14 on: March 12, 2015, 02:26:04 PM »

I bought BTS at 5, 6, and 7 Satoshi (and BTC around $500) last fall. Basically, I bought in as soon as I realized the potential of this project.

I have already lost most of my investment. To sell at this point would be pointless. The difference between selling now and the price dropping to 0.00 is too close to bother with it. I'll hold for the Hail Mary and maybe I'll get lucky.

Not how I expected the last 8 months to go, that's for sure - however the web wallet is almost useful and development in general is making progress- so we will see.

You are not the only one so don't worry...I have been around from the beginning and lost almost all my investment since I was buying whenever I can afford at whatever price. I think we will soon have a second pump. BTS just doesn't deserve to die. The world needs this more than ever..The problem is that the world doesn't know that yet..

+5% I'm with you on that brother!


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