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Offline mike623317

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Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« on: April 19, 2015, 01:43:10 AM »


For those of us that have to work during the 10-11am EST mumble with BM its a little frustrating that the recording is not available. Wouldanyone be willing to share their recording for a small tip?

Thanks
Mike

Offline carpet ride

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Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2015, 01:54:57 AM »
I also can't get in on Fridays due to work and gotta say it's tough not being there.  Anyway we can get the raw?  Seems like delegate pay could
subsidize it


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Offline onceuponatime

Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2015, 01:58:42 AM »

Offline fuzzy

Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2015, 02:16:54 AM »
Could this be a solution for you?

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15804.msg203030.html#new

Of course anyone interested in writing for us would be given access and eventually our tokens as well.

Not a bad idea...and there is nothing stopping those people from asking for tips to gain access to raw content too from writers.

*edit* this includes bitshares/crypto blogs as well so long as you let us post a snippet and link to your content.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2015, 02:33:18 AM by fuzzy »
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Offline roadscape

Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2015, 02:34:17 AM »
What if we put the raw recording on cryptofresh for $0.99 :D
http://cryptofresh.com  |  witness: roadscape

Offline arhag

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Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2015, 02:35:14 AM »
fuzzy, are you trying out some economic experiment with Mumble?

This is what it looks like to me. You are running a free public concert out on the street where anyone can join and listen and even has permission to record it with their cameras. And then you try to somehow align incentives so that all the people (and it really could be any stranger) recording the live concert in public are somehow economically motivated to not give out the recording to someone else unless the person requesting the recording happens to possess a special sticker that you sell.

It's an interesting experiment I guess, but I think the end result will be that the economic motivation won't work out and someone (even if it is just one person) who recorded the live event will just stick it up online thereby making the stickers worthless.

Edit: My view is that if this raw recording is a public good (which it is) that we as a community value, then the community should fund that public good the same way we fund other BitShares-related public goods: delegate pay. Obviously any extra funds you can receive from ads in the final edited shows or just from donations would be useful in offsetting the delegate funds necessary. However, if this is truly something we value as a community, it should be possible to fund it entirely from delegate pay without relying on altruism or the effectiveness of advertisements (which can be bypassed).
« Last Edit: April 19, 2015, 02:40:13 AM by arhag »

Offline fuzzy

Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2015, 02:44:12 AM »
What if we put the raw recording on cryptofresh for $0.99 :D

That would be fine. I just think it's important start trying things out that help increase internal liquidity and also incentivize people to help share our content.

We are still learning,  so it will likely not be perfect initially.  But we are noticing that it is hard to get  people to share our content on a regular basis and it is necessary that we find a way to incentivize the community to do so. ..it helps us all.

I am always  open for ideas as well so please use this thread to talk about how we could best work it.  As always, I'm trying to help. ..so  if something is doing the opposite,  I would  love to hear solutions that are better.  :)
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Offline fuzzy

Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2015, 02:49:58 AM »
fuzzy, are you trying out some economic experiment with Mumble?

This is what it looks like to me. You are running a free public concert out on the street where anyone can join and listen and even has permission to record it with their cameras. And then you try to somehow align incentives so that all the people (and it really could be any stranger) recording the live concert in public are somehow economically motivated to not give out the recording to someone else unless the person requesting the recording happens to possess a special sticker that you sell.

It's an interesting experiment I guess, but I think the end result will be that the economic motivation won't work out and someone (even if it is just one person) who recorded the live event will just stick it up online thereby making the stickers worthless.

Edit: My view is that if this raw recording is a public good (which it is) that we as a community value, then the community should fund that public good the same way we fund other BitShares-related public goods: delegate pay. Obviously any extra funds you can receive from ads in the final edited shows or just from donations would be useful in offsetting the delegate funds necessary. However, if this is truly something we value as a community, it should be possible to fund it entirely from delegate pay without relying on altruism or the effectiveness of advertisements (which can be bypassed).

Thank you arhag. I appreciate the input. I feel this way too, but at the same time it seems most people want to get us  away from using delegate pay and become profitable on our own...so I'm doing very much what you are saying.  Testing it.

Now with that said. ..the average LTB show takes over a week to get to the public from the recording date and we are shooting for,  at most 48 hours. ..and if someone else attends, they can all record it too. Ultimately I want to see more of one thing: open participation.

I hope people who have been around long enough to know the crew members and myself know that we are trying our best to figure out the best way moving forward and try to have some patience with us. If they know our past actions,  that should be a good way to understand our current intentions.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2015, 02:52:56 AM by fuzzy »
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Offline arhag

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Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2015, 03:03:02 AM »
Thank you arhag. I appreciate the input. I feel this way too, but at the same time it seems most people want to get us  away from using delegate pay and become profitable on our own...so I'm doing very much what you are saying.  Testing it.

Now with that said. ..the average LTB show takes over a week to get to the public from the recording date and we are shooting for,  at most 48 hours. ..and if someone else attends, they can all record it too. Ultimately I want to see more of one thing: open participation.

It is unfortunate if people aren't willing to vote for a delegate to fund such an important function (IMHO) in our community as the Mumble hangouts. The costs aren't even that high (are they?). I am not talking about the cost of editing, creating transcripts, etc. I am only concerned about the cost of the infrastructure to allow people to run public hangout sessions, and the cost of recording those sessions and posting a raw recording (in MP3 or Ogg Vorbis format) on the internet for the people we weren't able to attend live. The cost of running a conversion from wav to mp3 or ogg is virtually nothing. The cost of upload and hosting is incredibly small these days. Mumble has functionality to record the wav file already in there. Anyone attending the hangout can do the recording, conversion, and uploading (they may just need a lesson on how to do it). The only significant cost is the cost of actually running the Mumble servers. How much do the servers cost? I doubt people aren't willing to fund delegates to pay for that (your 100% pay fuzzy.beyondbitcoin delegate is already elected after all).

Now all the other costs (your time as moderator, editing, etc.) are costs that can be covered through other means that you are attempting to develop (if the BTS community for some reason doesn't think it is worth covering those costs with delegate pay). But I don't think those costs should be paid for by attempting to hold the raw recording hostage. These are value added services on top of the raw recording. So the final edited audio is what you should be attempting to monetize (say through ads, or exclusive early access of the edited audio / convenient transcripts to UIA holders before it is eventually released to the public to maximize exposure to BitShares). 

zerosum

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Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2015, 03:10:06 AM »
..., but at the same time it seems most people want to get us  away from using delegate pay and become profitable on our own...so I'm doing very much what you are saying.  Testing it.

 The only person (that I am aware of) that thinks  you need to get away from delegate pay is the guy in your own head fuzz...

Offline fuzzy

Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2015, 03:19:17 AM »
Thank you arhag. I appreciate the input. I feel this way too, but at the same time it seems most people want to get us  away from using delegate pay and become profitable on our own...so I'm doing very much what you are saying.  Testing it.

Now with that said. ..the average LTB show takes over a week to get to the public from the recording date and we are shooting for,  at most 48 hours. ..and if someone else attends, they can all record it too. Ultimately I want to see more of one thing: open participation.

It is unfortunate if people aren't willing to vote for a delegate to fund such an important function (IMHO) in our community as the Mumble hangouts. The costs aren't even that high (are they?). I am not talking about the cost of editing, creating transcripts, etc. I am only concerned about the cost of the infrastructure to allow people to run public hangout sessions, and the cost of recording those sessions and posting a raw recording (in MP3 or Ogg Vorbis format) on the internet for the people we weren't able to attend live. The cost of running a conversion from wav to mp3 or ogg is virtually nothing. The cost of upload and hosting is incredibly small these days. Mumble has functionality to record the wav file already in there. Anyone attending the hangout can do the recording, conversion, and uploading (they may just need a lesson on how to do it). The only significant cost is the cost of actually running the Mumble servers. How much do the servers cost? I doubt people aren't willing to fund delegates to pay for that (your 100% pay fuzzy.beyondbitcoin delegate is already elected after all).

Now all the other costs (your time as moderator, editing, etc.) are costs that can be covered through other means that you are attempting to develop (if the BTS community for some reason doesn't think it is worth covering those costs with delegate pay). But I don't think those costs should be paid for by attempting to hold the raw recording hostage. These are value added services on top of the raw recording. So the final edited audio is what you should be attempting to monetize (say through ads, or exclusive early access of the edited audio / convenient transcripts to UIA holders before it is eventually released to the public to maximize exposure to BitShares).

Its funny.  I would ultimately love to see others setting up and running hangouts.  I'd also like mumble to be a place where people coordinating local meetups could direct those who are interested in them but unable to physically attend. 

The difficult thing, however is that not all holders of our bts want to spend the 15 seconds it would take to share the beautiful, organic gem we have here.  People join to talk and listen, but sharing our community's gem is something that one would think would be an easy thing...yet for some reason it is not happening.  This inaction hurts all of us.

In addition to this, we are currently working on making it easy for people providing services to schedule times to actually give lectures and recognize time (recorded) walk-throug to utilizing those services as I suspect this is a severely underestimated problem in the ecosystem.

I greatly appreciate proposed solutions as opposed to trolling because we really think that beyond bitcoin should be a platform that is more of a community hub that empowers and rewards everyone who actively partivipates.  If there is a way to make this happen...I want to do my best to help it.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2015, 03:23:04 AM by fuzzy »
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Offline roadscape

Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2015, 03:22:06 AM »
Our mumbles are a public good.. perfect candidate for delegate funds. E.g. we're not trying to make the forums profitable.

That said, post it already :) dying to hear it.. with the rate at which things move, its relevance halves each passing day :P
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Offline fuzzy

Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2015, 03:24:27 AM »
Our mumbles are a public good.. perfect candidate for delegate funds. E.g. we're not trying to make the forums profitable.

That said, post it already :) dying to hear it.. with the rate at which things move, its relevance halves each passing day :P

I'm so thankful for everyone's constant support. Let me get in touch with the crew and point them to this thread so we can figure this out.

I've always wanted these to be more like CSPAN as opposed to fox or msnbc...I think it serves YOU better this way...
But these are not easy decisions...on one end it's incentivizing sharing, on another it is monetization (wife don't like me doing it for free anymore), and another is not letting profit bias us and hurt the community. 

A difficult balance to strike...maybe I should have opened this up to the community before we started messing around with the model.

« Last Edit: April 19, 2015, 03:29:49 AM by fuzzy »
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Offline Stan

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Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2015, 03:46:29 AM »
Brilliant!

I'd pay .99 to get the edited version which definitely has a value-add for me!

Make the unedited free and earn compensation for the value you add.

Added value:  adds more to the cryptofresh web site - supporting its traffic.

Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract of any kind.   These are merely my opinions which I reserve the right to change at any time.

Offline fuzzy

Re: Friday's Mumble with BM for a tip?
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2015, 04:24:57 AM »
Brilliant!

I'd pay .99 to get the edited version which definitely has a value-add for me!

Make the unedited free and earn compensation for the value you add.

Added value:  adds more to the cryptofresh web site - supporting its traffic.


The problem with this is that no one will buy the edited hangout (except a few generous souls like you) if we put the unedited content out because they would prefer to have it right now (unedited).  This would then also mean that noone will want to have advertisements  on the edited hangouts because very few people will listen.  History has actually shown this.  Not trying to sound foul here of course but it is just the way things are.

That would mean I'd eventually be back to paying people like aj out of pocket... :/
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