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Offline coinking

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How to Make a New DAC
« on: January 01, 2014, 09:02:09 AM »

I would like to clarify I am an entrepreneur not a programmer. I have a basic understanding of the technologies involved but not more.

1 - As an entrepreneur who wants to start a new DAC, what are the first steps required to create my own shares and to raise funds?

2 - Do I need to fork protoshares, start a new blockchain, new wallet, new mining algo?

If this is the case it's very difficult for an entrepreneur without a team of programmers to start a new company using the DAC technology and network.

3 - In this new blockchain (if indeed it's required), am I expected as part of the social consensus to give 10% of the new shares to Protoshare holders, and 10% to Angelshare holders?

How is the price of New DAC shares/Protoshares and Angelshares is set?

4 - What does it mean Technically that Protoshares are the granddaddy of new DACs? Does it relate only to Invictus DACs or others (as me)?


Offline bytemaster

Re: How to Make a New DAC
« Reply #1 on: January 01, 2014, 04:25:38 PM »
Honoring PTS holders is a requirement if you build your DAC from Invictus Software and otherwise optional.

Many people I have talked to want to honor PTS because it gives their coin more exposure / marketing than most also-ran alts.

As an entrepreneur without technical skills I would recommend you start by describing your DACs business model.  You can do this by looking at the business model of existing companies and trying to adapt it to the world of DACs.

DACs have some limitations, namely they cannot rely on secret data and their primary method of learning information is via price discovery of one form or another (auction or market).   They must be designed to eliminate trust.

For most people, a hybrid approach is probably easier.  Create a currency your centralized business takes and then create demand for your own currency.  I think you should be focused on the business plan before thinking about raising funds.
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline Stan

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Re: How to Make a New DAC
« Reply #2 on: January 01, 2014, 04:58:08 PM »
I would like to clarify I am an entrepreneur not a programmer. I have a basic understanding of the technologies involved but not more.

1 - As an entrepreneur who wants to start a new DAC, what are the first steps required to create my own shares and to raise funds?

2 - Do I need to fork protoshares, start a new blockchain, new wallet, new mining algo?

If this is the case it's very difficult for an entrepreneur without a team of programmers to start a new company using the DAC technology and network.

3 - In this new blockchain (if indeed it's required), am I expected as part of the social consensus to give 10% of the new shares to Protoshare holders, and 10% to Angelshare holders?

How is the price of New DAC shares/Protoshares and Angelshares is set?

4 - What does it mean Technically that Protoshares are the granddaddy of new DACs? Does it relate only to Invictus DACs or others (as me)?

DAC Entrepreneur's Cookbook:

Suggest you start at http://invictus-innovations.com/links/, especially DACs that Spawn DACs.

Then read the newsletters at http://invictus-innovations.com/news/, especially #3 DAC Angels Rising

Then read visit http://invictus-innovations.com and read up on AngelShares and the Social Consensus.

Then go to the Alternative DACs thread on this forum and describe your idea.  Perhaps you will attract constructive comments on technical approach and start to build an enthusiastic group of believers. (Especially if you are promising to honor their PTS and AGS stakes.)   :)

When you start picking up momentum, perhaps you can create a version of AngelShares (i.e. "DAC Shares") to crowd-fund your specific idea.   Use those funds to post bounties to get development help from this community.

By building on the PTS community expertise and the AGS-funded DAC Developer's Toolkit you get a big head start.  That's what your honorable DAC should promise to recognize with a 10% stake for each of the two founding communities.  Then the last 80% can be used to raise funds for your specific DAC or to be mined and/or given away to attract the attention of your DAC's specific customers.  Get feedback from this forum on what the right social consensus ought to be for your DAC's business model and marketing strategy.

Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract of any kind.   These are merely my opinions which I reserve the right to change at any time.

Offline coinking

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Re: How to Make a New DAC
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2014, 08:15:22 AM »
Thanks @stan and @bytemaster  :)

I read all the links and have a better understanding now.

I a curious and fascinated to know more about the Technological and Technical aspects of starting a new DAC both as a developer and as a user.

I wonder how much plug-n-play this can be, and how to minimize the technical efforts and focus on the idea and the business itself.

I want to utilize the
Quote
PTS community expertise and the AGS-funded DAC Developer's Toolkit
and wish to break it down into practical steps.

So here are my questions:

1- To start a new DAC do we have to open our own new Blockchain and create a new currency?

(I am more involved in the mastercoin community, and as far as I understand creating new coins is built in the protocol an doesn't require the user to open a new blockchain, wallet, mining etc.)

2- Do we have to create a new wallet which will receive the new coins?
This is something I would like to avoid for minimizing the hassle on the user side, can a new DAC connect to Keyhotee?

3- How to Technically manage the allocation of the new coins and sending them to Investors?
I wonder how Invictus are managing Angelshares IPO right now?

Maybe I am perceiving the technicalities behind such operation as bigger than what they really are.

Imagine a time in which starting a new DAC does not require more technical understanding than setting up a corporation in the real world....



 


Offline bytemaster

Re: How to Make a New DAC
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2014, 08:36:55 AM »
A DAC is more than just issuing coins, it is about building business rules into the blockchain to produce a result.  Mastercoin allows you to issue coins easily and we could create a DAC that does what mastercoin does with ease once we have the basic building blocks in place.

You cannot build a DAC without coding something new. 

For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline coinking

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Re: How to Make a New DAC
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2014, 10:21:00 AM »
I understand coding is necessary.
So only pure internet businesses can benefit from that?
What is the minimum I need to do to start a new DAC?
And which tools Invictus are providing to make it easier?

Offline Stan

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Re: How to Make a New DAC
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2014, 03:21:52 PM »
Thanks @stan and @bytemaster  :)

I read all the links and have a better understanding now.

I a curious and fascinated to know more about the Technological and Technical aspects of starting a new DAC both as a developer and as a user.

I wonder how much plug-n-play this can be, and how to minimize the technical efforts and focus on the idea and the business itself.

I want to utilize the
Quote
PTS community expertise and the AGS-funded DAC Developer's Toolkit
and wish to break it down into practical steps.

So here are my questions:

1- To start a new DAC do we have to open our own new Blockchain and create a new currency?

(I am more involved in the mastercoin community, and as far as I understand creating new coins is built in the protocol an doesn't require the user to open a new blockchain, wallet, mining etc.)

2- Do we have to create a new wallet which will receive the new coins?
This is something I would like to avoid for minimizing the hassle on the user side, can a new DAC connect to Keyhotee?

3- How to Technically manage the allocation of the new coins and sending them to Investors?
I wonder how Invictus are managing Angelshares IPO right now?

Maybe I am perceiving the technicalities behind such operation as bigger than what they really are.

Imagine a time in which starting a new DAC does not require more technical understanding than setting up a corporation in the real world....

You have just described an entrepreneurial opportunity in its own right:  Drag and Drop DACs!   :)

Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract of any kind.   These are merely my opinions which I reserve the right to change at any time.

Offline coinking

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Re: How to Make a New DAC
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2014, 04:36:19 PM »
Yes I am aware of the opportunity 8)
But can you please answer my questions?

Offline luckybit

Re: How to Make a New DAC
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2014, 11:46:12 AM »
I understand coding is necessary.
So only pure internet businesses can benefit from that?
What is the minimum I need to do to start a new DAC?
And which tools Invictus are providing to make it easier?

The first step would be to come up with an algorithm. It does not require any programming knowledge at all to do this just some basic math sense.

Start with the problem. Exit with the solution. The solution is the goal which your algorithm seeks to find by using some step by step process to getting there. The more efficient the process the less you'll have to compromise on issues like centralization of trust (you can have trust but it must be distributed), single points of failure (you don't wan't a hierarchy because that is exactly why the current economic system is prone to failure), vulnerability to identity theft (you have to figure out how to have identity without it easily being stolen), then you have all the side issues like 51% attacks, Sybil attacks, scams, cheats, bugs, etc.

Every DAC algorithm is ultimately just a set of rules which solve the above problems efficiently. By having a tool kit you can solve these problems using cook book solutions and algorithms so that you don't have to invent anything new and so that you know where to look. Depending on the needs of your DAC you may choose one algorithm over another and in many cases there is more than one algorithm to solve any particular problem.

The programmers don't have to care about algorithms. What you do is you write a spec or description of your DAC and then once it is peer reviewed and established that it is possible to make you crowd fund it. Once it is crowd funded you use the crowd funded resources to pay the bounties to the programmers, artists, documentation writers, translators, etc.

Over time we will automate the process and I have some algorithms which can automate a DAC so that it posts bounties on its own by Proof of Stake voting mechanism of the crowd. For certain DACs that solution is the best and in my opinion it should be part of a DAC tool kit under the category "autopoietic DACs". Over time better and smarter algorithms will emerge allowing for DACs to build themselves with the least amount of human involvement.

So for anyone who likes to build algorithms it is an open challenge to come up with the most efficient algorithm for an autopoietic DAC (self generating/self creating). The ideal autopoietic DAC would simply have to start as a seed (an instruction set), be watered (crowd funded), and be provided sunlight (given the light of day so people know about it).

So every autopoietic DAC will need an instruction set, crowd funding, and community participation/attention/support from marketing.

Simplified as a metaphor: seed, water, sunlight (SWS).
« Last Edit: January 03, 2014, 12:47:51 PM by luckybit »
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Offline coinking

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Re: How to Make a New DAC
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2014, 12:25:03 PM »
Thanks @luckybit

I will look into the algorithm aspects more deeply.

I still don't understand what are the ways for Funding?

Is it wise to use the same work-plan as MMC, meaning fork a new blockhain, mining, wallets. Mine them early, and offer them at a later stage as representing shares of the DAC?
Surely I plan to give 10% to PTS and AGS holders in the genesis block.

Or does the PTS protocol is actually freeing me from all the technical hassles above and I can simply create my new shares Over the Existing PTS network? (or over the Bitshares future network)

Thanks



Offline luckybit

Re: How to Make a New DAC
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2014, 02:22:21 PM »
Thanks @luckybit

I will look into the algorithm aspects more deeply.

I still don't understand what are the ways for Funding?

Is it wise to use the same work-plan as MMC, meaning fork a new blockhain, mining, wallets. Mine them early, and offer them at a later stage as representing shares of the DAC?
Surely I plan to give 10% to PTS and AGS holders in the genesis block.

Or does the PTS protocol is actually freeing me from all the technical hassles above and I can simply create my new shares Over the Existing PTS network? (or over the Bitshares future network)

Thanks

Angelshares is still being developed. It seems that Angelshares will be the method of crowd funding a DAC. It's similar to an exodus address where people send coins to it and then get shares in the DAC sent back to them at some point just like how Mastercoin did things.

I don't know the details on how Angelshares will work. It might or might not work well as things are now. Right now we only have Invictus Innovations with the kind of reputation where people are willing to send money so they are going to host the initial bounties to build the initial DACs. In 3-6 months time there will be a lot of activity and money flooding in here and provided that the infrastructure is in place that would be the optimal time to launch a DAC. You could try and do it sooner but I don't know anyone who is except MMC and that altcoin does not make much sense yet.

I suppose what you could do is just launch similar to MMC and give 10% to PTS holders and 10% to Angelshare holders in the initial allocation of your DACShares coin altcoin. I would actually advise you to go a bit higher than the minimum of 10% because you want to win the trust in the community for crowdfunding later DAC ideas you might have.

« Last Edit: January 03, 2014, 02:27:41 PM by luckybit »
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