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Offline toast

Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2014, 12:32:58 AM »
Potentially very cool!
Honors AGS/PTS? I'm guessing no because "proof-of-stake system, without pre-distribution", what does that mean?
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Offline SatoshiFantasy

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Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2014, 12:56:10 AM »
Potentially very cool!
Honors AGS/PTS? I'm guessing no because "proof-of-stake system, without pre-distribution", what does that mean?

No pre-distribution, no pump and dump, all fantasybits are generated by NFL players playing football. there a some  other potential ways for a return on equity. no real business plan here, system designed to grow organically. 

Offline santaclause102

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Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2014, 02:48:17 AM »
Potentially very cool!
Honors AGS/PTS? I'm guessing no because "proof-of-stake system, without pre-distribution", what does that mean?

No pre-distribution, no pump and dump, all fantasybits are generated by NFL players playing football. there a some  other potential ways for a return on equity. no real business plan here, system designed to grow organically.
So the ones that gable early on will hold the shares?

Offline SatoshiFantasy

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Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2014, 03:54:05 AM »
Potentially very cool!
Honors AGS/PTS? I'm guessing no because "proof-of-stake system, without pre-distribution", what does that mean?

No pre-distribution, no pump and dump, all fantasybits are generated by NFL players playing football. there a some  other potential ways for a return on equity. no real business plan here, system designed to grow organically.
So the ones that gable early on will hold the shares?
there are no shares.. kinda like currency, but predictions instead if mining. 

Offline toast

Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2014, 03:57:18 AM »
currency, shares, whatever - they are constantly generated as a reward for people making bets?
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Offline SatoshiFantasy

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Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #6 on: April 16, 2014, 04:02:39 AM »
Payton Manning throws a TD, this creates 400 fantasybits. Gets distributed among best predictions for Payton Manning in this game.

Two phases here:

Phase1: no betting, no transferring.. just earning bits... from predictions

Phase2: buy and sell season contracts, win and lose bits.. and normal currency transactions.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2014, 04:05:26 AM by SatoshiFantasy »

Offline bytemaster

Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2014, 01:10:52 PM »
I really like this.  What feed would you use for the data?
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Offline fuzzy

Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2014, 05:46:07 PM »
Yum...any way to explain this in detail and answer questions from the community after our next mumble session?
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Offline SatoshiFantasy

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Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2014, 07:03:47 PM »
I really like this.  What feed would you use for the data?
there are multiple well known feeds for data. stats inc, fantasydata.com

Yum...any way to explain this in detail and answer questions from the community after our next mumble session?

sure.

Offline dxtr

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Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #10 on: June 26, 2014, 10:09:34 PM »
So it all comes down to a consensus of how a value is being created - if you create an algorithm that rewards majority of people just by honestly following a "decalog" for what is meaningful for them, then you have a succesfull DAC attracting beliefs driven people.
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Offline SatoshiFantasy

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Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2014, 04:07:04 PM »
  ;) when and where is this mumble session and how does it work?

Ive been working on reframing the concept over the past couple of months.  The fantasybit implementation would be designed to appeal mostly to domain experts. So the expectation is that 99% of stake holders over the first year will not be running full nodes. This is a case of "centralization due to implementation complexity".

Quote
One example of "centralization due to implementation complexity" is merged mining. Merged-mining may cost "nothing" during actual mining/hashing. However, maintaining each coin has implementation complexity. So merged-mining would end up causing even more centralization and an even smaller group of profitable miners.

bytemaster,  fuznuts , toast :  please email or pm, to discuss current implementation plans. I know there is lots of overlap with bitshares, but I think they can work together.

jaybny  .a.t.  satoshifantasy .d.o.t. .c.o.m.

Offline emski

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Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #12 on: June 27, 2014, 04:23:42 PM »
Fascinating! Good work!

Offline SatoshiFantasy

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Proof of Bergstake
« Reply #13 on: August 05, 2014, 06:30:10 AM »
http://satoshifantasy.com/bergstake-2/

Bergstake – distributed consensus

Bergstake represents the right to sign blocks in crypto-currency block-chains. Block signers receive rewards for securing the network. Rewards can be new coins and/or transaction fees. Bergstake differs from typical coin-stake, in that bergstake is non-transferable and lasts-forever *.

The bergstake concept is a generalization of “Proof-of-Skill” described by Jay Berg in the Satoshi Fantasy whitepaper (1). As each coin is created, whether by proof-of-work, pre-mine, or fantasy football points, the private-key holder of those new coins, automatically receives and equal amount of bergstake. Even if those new coins are transferred away, the bergstake remains.

Bergstake is an alternative distributed consensus mechanism, to Bitcoins proof-of-work mining. Bergstake attempts to solve known issues in all proof-of-stake blockchains.

Bergstake blockchains have knowledge of alternative forks. This enables a “proof-of-double-mining”, which has ability to destroy bergstake and its recent block reward. The risk of losing bergstake and recent virgin coins, is incentive to mine on only the “real” blockchain fork.  This core feature fixes the “nothing-at-stake” flaw in proof-of-stake blockchains.

The algorithm that chooses the next block-signer can be gamed in other proof-of-stake blockchains. This technique, known as “costless simulation” or “stake-grinding”, entails a type of “mining” of the block data until its produces a hash that gives rights to sign the next block. Since all bergstakers are known in advance, a block-signer selection algorithm that mitigates grinding can be used. One technique, employed by Nxt, is to use the hash of the previous two signers to select the next signer. Another technique involves choosing the next N signers based on current signer and a pseudorandom number.

Other problems arise, as Peter Todd asks, “can I use stake to get more stake”.  Bergstake can only be used to generate coins, not more bergstake.

Bergstake is currently being developed within the new upcoming Breakoutcoin. There will be a proof-of-work period where block signers will get bergstake in addition to the normal Breakoutcoin reward. After the initial phase, Breakoutcoin will be secured and will reach distributed consensus using pure “bergstaking”. Block signers will continue to receive the same new coin reward as in the proof-of-work phase. Once all coins have been distributed, bergstakers will be rewarded with transaction fees only.

*bergstake can be lost by Proof-of-double-mining. Bergstake can be transferred, as an inheritance for example, by providing the original private-key

(1)   http://satoshifantasy.com/media/satoshifantasy.pdf  – Distributed Engineered Autonomous Agents : Satoshi Fantasy

Offline xeroc

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Re: [new DAC] Satoshi Fantasy - Fantasybits
« Reply #14 on: August 05, 2014, 07:55:20 AM »
awesome idea +5%
need to read that whitepaper
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