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Offline sudo

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Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« on: May 21, 2014, 01:42:47 PM »

AGS2.0 with Dpos (Liquid)
just like  PTS2.0

the market& DAC developer will choose to honor  AGS2.0 or AGS1.0

in the future   maybe  PTS2.0 valued 100$ /pcs  then   AGS2.0 maybe acceptable

Offline luckybit

Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2014, 01:45:13 PM »
AGS2.0 with Dpos (Liquid)
just like  PTS2.0

the market& DAC developer will choose to honor  AGS2.0 or AGS1.0

in the future   maybe  PTS2.0 valued 100$ /pcs  then   AGS2.0 maybe acceptable

I mentioned something like this months ago (called it awardshares). It was to be like AGS except to go to community projects which we select.

I don't think in any case should AGS be liquid, that goes against the deal.
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Offline xeroc

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Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2014, 02:03:25 PM »
I don't think in any case should AGS be liquid, that goes against the deal.
+5%

Making dac creators choose over ags1 and ags2 is also against the deal

you can go for
at least 10% pts
at least 10% ags1
x% ags2
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Offline sudo

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Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2014, 03:00:30 PM »
if AGSer agree that  AGS to be liquid  in the form of AGS2.0(DPOS)  1:1snapshot
at the same time  DAC developer honor  PTS2.0 10%,AGS2.0 10%
why against the deal?

or  the change should agreed by AGSer&PTSer both?

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Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2014, 03:02:17 PM »
I (and others) donated to ags because it will never be made liquid.

3i will for sure NEVER change that deal. and thats good!!
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Offline sudo

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Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #5 on: May 21, 2014, 03:13:29 PM »
Assuming that  someone stole your PTS wallet.dat  with AGS donation record
wallet.dat has password  but not strong enough。it can be cracked sooner or later。

PTS you can transfer to a totaly new address or new wallet at any time or regularly。make it more safe。

But  AGS, you must race with the thief when the new DACs release。Who wins when he import the wall.dat &transfer the coin to another address。
Again & Again  forever……

Offline JoeyD

Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2014, 08:16:29 PM »
Assuming that  someone stole your PTS wallet.dat  with AGS donation record
wallet.dat has password  but not strong enough。it can be cracked sooner or later。

PTS you can transfer to a totaly new address or new wallet at any time or regularly。make it more safe。

But  AGS, you must race with the thief when the new DACs release。Who wins when he import the wall.dat &transfer the coin to another address。
Again & Again  forever……
Unfortunately making AGS liquid would not fix those problems in any way, actually it would make pawning off stolen AGS a lot easier, as well as make it easier to scam people out of their AGS-shares.

So better make a secure paper copy of your donation key and do not use a hot wallet at all. (Making a secure paper copy means writing it down on paper preferably by hand, not printing it via wifi from an online windows pc)

Offline xeroc

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Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2014, 08:36:21 PM »
... windows pc ...

lol

Anyway .. truth spoken..
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Offline gamey

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Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2014, 08:50:25 PM »
Yea, Joey is right...  AGS being liquid is a double edged sword.  If you are hacked, your AGS are GONE.  If this attack is done via a malicious DAC it could really hurt Bitshares ecosystem. (As pointed out to me by Trog)

Eventually I'll probably paper wallet my AGS addresses ...  Infact, I3 should put a bounty on such a utility if the wallets do not readily support it.

One thing I'd mention though.. as I understand this stuff better and better..  Is that if a liquid AGS2 was created and DACs honored it instead.  Those with AGS1 who never sold would still own the same AGS2.  So in effect, your AGS1 would still be honored indirectly through AGS2 and thus it would meet the social contract. (?)
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Offline sudo

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Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2014, 01:16:12 AM »
Assuming that  someone stole your PTS wallet.dat  with AGS donation record
wallet.dat has password  but not strong enough。it can be cracked sooner or later。

PTS you can transfer to a totaly new address or new wallet at any time or regularly。make it more safe。

But  AGS, you must race with the thief when the new DACs release。Who wins when he import the wall.dat &transfer the coin to another address。
Again & Again  forever……
Unfortunately making AGS liquid would not fix those problems in any way, actually it would make pawning off stolen AGS a lot easier, as well as make it easier to scam people out of their AGS-shares.

So better make a secure paper copy of your donation key and do not use a hot wallet at all. (Making a secure paper copy means writing it down on paper preferably by hand, not printing it via wifi from an online windows pc)

make AGS liquid would make pawning off stolen AGS a lot easier? how?
AGS(liquid) is the same as pts,According to what you have said,Now the AGS(not liquid)is safer than Pts?


if AGS become liquid  you can transfer AGS it to a brandnew address generated offline&coldstorage。
Now  the address cotains AGS you used sometimes before, maybe under high risks。
« Last Edit: May 22, 2014, 01:18:15 AM by sudo »

Offline donkeypong

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Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #10 on: May 22, 2014, 01:52:06 AM »
Just clone the new PTS2, or whatever the PTS successor with DPOS will be called, and then air drop the AGS-linked coin to anyone with the keys to an AGS donor address. If someone wants to dump (or needs the money), they dump, for whatever the market will pay. If someone else wants to get in on the DACs, they can buy up whatever is being sold. Then use that new coin for all future DAC snapshots of AGS.

Offline gamey

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Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2014, 03:28:10 AM »
Assuming that  someone stole your PTS wallet.dat  with AGS donation record
wallet.dat has password  but not strong enough。it can be cracked sooner or later。

PTS you can transfer to a totaly new address or new wallet at any time or regularly。make it more safe。

But  AGS, you must race with the thief when the new DACs release。Who wins when he import the wall.dat &transfer the coin to another address。
Again & Again  forever……
Unfortunately making AGS liquid would not fix those problems in any way, actually it would make pawning off stolen AGS a lot easier, as well as make it easier to scam people out of their AGS-shares.

So better make a secure paper copy of your donation key and do not use a hot wallet at all. (Making a secure paper copy means writing it down on paper preferably by hand, not printing it via wifi from an online windows pc)

make AGS liquid would make pawning off stolen AGS a lot easier? how?
AGS(liquid) is the same as pts,According to what you have said,Now the AGS(not liquid)is safer than Pts?


if AGS become liquid  you can transfer AGS it to a brandnew address generated offline&coldstorage。
Now  the address cotains AGS you used sometimes before, maybe under high risks。

It depends on the nature of the attack.  If someone is targeting your AGS key and gets it then they will immediately move your AGS.  If they can't move it, you'll at least have a shot at getting your dividends from there on out. 

Now if you suspect you have been compromised and beat the intruder to the transfer then yes it is safer.
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Offline sudo

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Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2014, 03:54:51 AM »
Just clone the new PTS2, or whatever the PTS successor with DPOS will be called, and then air drop the AGS-linked coin to anyone with the keys to an AGS donor address. If someone wants to dump (or needs the money), they dump, for whatever the market will pay. If someone else wants to get in on the DACs, they can buy up whatever is being sold. Then use that new coin for all future DAC snapshots of AGS.

i think someone would do this  sooner or later

Offline JoeyD

Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #13 on: May 22, 2014, 07:26:59 PM »
Assuming that  someone stole your PTS wallet.dat  with AGS donation record
wallet.dat has password  but not strong enough。it can be cracked sooner or later。

PTS you can transfer to a totaly new address or new wallet at any time or regularly。make it more safe。

But  AGS, you must race with the thief when the new DACs release。Who wins when he import the wall.dat &transfer the coin to another address。
Again & Again  forever……
Unfortunately making AGS liquid would not fix those problems in any way, actually it would make pawning off stolen AGS a lot easier, as well as make it easier to scam people out of their AGS-shares.

So better make a secure paper copy of your donation key and do not use a hot wallet at all. (Making a secure paper copy means writing it down on paper preferably by hand, not printing it via wifi from an online windows pc)

make AGS liquid would make pawning off stolen AGS a lot easier? how?
AGS(liquid) is the same as pts,According to what you have said,Now the AGS(not liquid)is safer than Pts?


if AGS become liquid  you can transfer AGS it to a brandnew address generated offline&coldstorage。
Now  the address cotains AGS you used sometimes before, maybe under high risks。

It depends on the nature of the attack.  If someone is targeting your AGS key and gets it then they will immediately move your AGS.  If they can't move it, you'll at least have a shot at getting your dividends from there on out. 

Now if you suspect you have been compromised and beat the intruder to the transfer then yes it is safer.
Yes I meant it the way gamey described it, the problem with increased liquidity is that it also becomes impossible to prove and track ownership. 

Now even if your donation-key is stolen, you have the option of going public and claiming ownership with the will to prove it in any way you can, while a thief might not be willing to do the same. After the theft being made public, maybe then there can also be steps taken to ensure you get your fair shares.

Offline sudo

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Re: Maybe we can make AGS2.0 in the future
« Reply #14 on: May 23, 2014, 01:13:20 AM »
Assuming that  someone stole your PTS wallet.dat  with AGS donation record
wallet.dat has password  but not strong enough。it can be cracked sooner or later。

PTS you can transfer to a totaly new address or new wallet at any time or regularly。make it more safe。

But  AGS, you must race with the thief when the new DACs release。Who wins when he import the wall.dat &transfer the coin to another address。
Again & Again  forever……
Unfortunately making AGS liquid would not fix those problems in any way, actually it would make pawning off stolen AGS a lot easier, as well as make it easier to scam people out of their AGS-shares.

So better make a secure paper copy of your donation key and do not use a hot wallet at all. (Making a secure paper copy means writing it down on paper preferably by hand, not printing it via wifi from an online windows pc)

make AGS liquid would make pawning off stolen AGS a lot easier? how?
AGS(liquid) is the same as pts,According to what you have said,Now the AGS(not liquid)is safer than Pts?


if AGS become liquid  you can transfer AGS it to a brandnew address generated offline&coldstorage。
Now  the address cotains AGS you used sometimes before, maybe under high risks。

It depends on the nature of the attack.  If someone is targeting your AGS key and gets it then they will immediately move your AGS.  If they can't move it, you'll at least have a shot at getting your dividends from there on out. 

Now if you suspect you have been compromised and beat the intruder to the transfer then yes it is safer.
Yes I meant it the way gamey described it, the problem with increased liquidity is that it also becomes impossible to prove and track ownership. 

Now even if your donation-key is stolen, you have the option of going public and claiming ownership with the will to prove it in any way you can, while a thief might not be willing to do the same. After the theft being made public, maybe then there can also be steps taken to ensure you get your fair shares.

the action of public and claiming ownership,still can‘t stop the thief get DACs & tansfer  stolen goods。competition of speed。

 

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