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Offline Rococo

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Solving the just-dice investor problem
« on: June 03, 2014, 04:42:14 PM »

I'm curious if there are any solutions out there to secure investor funds (and player funds) on a site like https://just-dice.com/.

I asked dooglus, the sites founder, if some type of multisig would be possible and this was his response: "I'm not sure how that would work, if you mean the investors should keep control of one of the private keys.  An investor could withhold their key and refuse to pay out a winner on the site.".

There are currently 41 000 BTC invested in the site with absolutely nothing stopping the operator of leaving with the funds.

If no solutions are currently possible, it would be nice if we started a discussion on how we could solve this problem.

Offline HackFisher

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Re: Solving the just-dice investor problem
« Reply #1 on: June 03, 2014, 05:09:22 PM »
The site owner's response is correct to some extend, because dice process data seems not on chain, e.g. chance to win, bet size etc.

But if the dice info is part of transaction which will be on DAC/BTC chain, you can play without necessary to deposit, you are the owner of the privkey.

For comparison, you can have a look of classic satoshi dice, but any way, there are other potential issues with their random seed.
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Offline Rococo

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Re: Solving the just-dice investor problem
« Reply #2 on: June 03, 2014, 09:43:27 PM »
Hack,

You're saying it would be possible to have both the player balances and "investor" balances not needed to be deposited if the game was played on chain ?

Offline toast

Re: Solving the just-dice investor problem
« Reply #3 on: June 03, 2014, 10:24:24 PM »
Hack,

You're saying it would be possible to have both the player balances and "investor" balances not needed to be deposited if the game was played on chain ?

For players yes, but in the case of just-dice I don't think you would be able to do the "investor" part on the Bitcoin (or its clones) blockchain. You could if you had a custom chain, of course.
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Offline HackFisher

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Re: Solving the just-dice investor problem
« Reply #4 on: June 04, 2014, 12:24:44 AM »
Hack,

You're saying it would be possible to have both the player balances and "investor" balances not needed to be deposited if the game was played on chain ?

I do not get your meaning of "investor balance", they seem do not have things like onchain shares.

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Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline gamey

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Re: Solving the just-dice investor problem
« Reply #5 on: June 04, 2014, 04:19:43 AM »

Opentransactions would work AFAIK.  Look into "voting pools".  Their solution is that you have to implement the service in "smart contracts" for it to work, but those dice sites are simple enough that it seems relatively easy. (relative to a more complicated system)
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Offline Rococo

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Re: Solving the just-dice investor problem
« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2014, 11:03:43 AM »
Hack,

You're saying it would be possible to have both the player balances and "investor" balances not needed to be deposited if the game was played on chain ?

I do not get your meaning of "investor balance", they seem do not have things like onchain shares.

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The sites bankroll from which players play against is fully funded by the investors. Go to the investors tab on : https://just-dice.com/ You'll have a better explanation.

 

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