Author [EN] [ZH] [ES] [PT] [IT] [DE] [FR] [NL] [TR] [SR] [AR] [RU] [EN] [ZH] [ES] [PT] [IT] [DE] [FR] [NL] [TR] [SR] [AR] [RU] [EN] [ZH] [ES] [PT] [IT] [DE] [FR] [NL] [TR] [SR] [AR] [RU] Topic: Please treat your supporters better  (Read 1777 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline liberman

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 85
    • View Profile
Please treat your supporters better
« on: November 14, 2013, 10:33:33 AM »

Recent increases in PTS mining difficulties means bassically that many of the supporters of this project are going to get practically nothing.
With a modern CPU (i7) we can now get around 2-5 PTS a day. That is NOTHING.
Now tell me how we could operate on bitshares or keyhotee if even to acquire a simple name you need 100PTS?
And if we have to exchange or buying anything using Bitcoin, oh boy, this is the most expensive service ever created. 0.25BTC for a single name or 0.01BTC for 1PTS?

There is no way this can work, and you're now starting to lose supporters because of your greed.

Online fav

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4075
  • No Pain, No Gain
    • View Profile
    • BitShares 2.0 SmartCoin
  • BTS: fav
Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #1 on: November 14, 2013, 12:03:07 PM »
Who do you think is responsible for the difficulty change? Invitcus?

No, the miners.

Also, Keyhotee Pre-Order has been reduced to 10PTS
► How-to Buy BitShares: https://goo.gl/i9j2YZ

Offline bytemaster

Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2013, 07:26:06 PM »
We tried to make it available for all with the initial difficulty set at about 1 block per day per user... that didn't last long :(
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline liberman

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 85
    • View Profile
Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2013, 07:30:29 PM »
We tried to make it available for all with the initial difficulty set at about 1 block per day per user... that didn't last long :(

Would you consider returning to less difficulty?

Offline bytemaster

Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2013, 07:45:32 PM »
We tried to make it available for all with the initial difficulty set at about 1 block per day per user... that didn't last long :(

Would you consider returning to less difficulty?

Can't too many miners and blocks are already flowing 10x faster than they should.   
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline Lighthouse

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 376
  • Making a Market in PTS since 11/06/2013
    • View Profile
    • Lighthouse Bulk Orders and Trusted Escrow (Closed)
Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2013, 08:08:21 PM »
Recent increases in PTS mining difficulties means bassically that many of the supporters of this project are going to get practically nothing.
With a modern CPU (i7) we can now get around 2-5 PTS a day. That is NOTHING.
Now tell me how we could operate on bitshares or keyhotee if even to acquire a simple name you need 100PTS?
And if we have to exchange or buying anything using Bitcoin, oh boy, this is the most expensive service ever created. 0.25BTC for a single name or 0.01BTC for 1PTS?

There is no way this can work, and you're now starting to lose supporters because of your greed.

I think you've misunderstood the Keyhotee Founder program - If you DONATE (was 100) 10PTS to Invictus, you get your first pick of names and you never have to mine it.  But you can still have a name in Keyhotee without buying it if you just wait until the Nameshares chain launches, then you'll be able to mine whatever name you want with about an hour of time on your computer per year.

So that's not the price of a name, there is no price - you can't buy them, you mine for them.  Or you donate to Invictus and get put in the Genesis block.
Before you say the price of PTS is too high, take a look at theThe Reason.  Protoshares are an entirely new type of Cryptocurrency, one that pays to hold.

Offline Lighthouse

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 376
  • Making a Market in PTS since 11/06/2013
    • View Profile
    • Lighthouse Bulk Orders and Trusted Escrow (Closed)
Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2013, 08:10:15 PM »
Also, before you gawk at the price too much or complain about only making 5pts per day with your desktop computer, look at what you get from PTS and think of ANY other cryptocurrency out there that offers ANYTHING like it

I am going to chime in here with some clarity for all involved. 

1) All chains Invictus launches will be derived from ProtoShares with a 1:1 mapping and 10% of the ultimate money supply of that chain.
2) ProtoDomains may Split from ProtoShares prior to the Launch of DomainShares so that it can be traded and valued separately.   
3) Keyhotee ID is not a currency, there is no way to map ProtoShares into Keyhotee ID (the name chain)
4) There will be many BitShares based chains, not one, and all of them will be 1:1 with ProtoShares
5) We reserve the right to release ProtoShares v2 that honors 100% of ProtoShares v1 with 100% of the money supply allocated. 
6) Associated Press, DAC would honor ProtoShares

Exceptions to the ProtoShares honoring would be if we decided to release a true competitor to be used as a money-only coin and not a trading platform.  In this case we may choose to honor the initial positions in ALL existing *-coin chains proportional to their market cap. 

I want to make it very clear that at no time will we 'reset the clock' for a new chain and owning ProtoShares today does get you ownership in everything we do in the future either directly or indirectly.
Before you say the price of PTS is too high, take a look at theThe Reason.  Protoshares are an entirely new type of Cryptocurrency, one that pays to hold.

Offline barwizi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 764
  • Noirbits, NoirShares, NoirEx.....lol, noir anyone?
    • View Profile
    • Noirbitstalk.org
Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2013, 08:28:16 PM »
i think thats rather unkind, i haven't seen a team this proactive in a long time. instead of a wait and see approach they've been working almost 24/7 to keep this project up and fluid. Don't judge the value of pts by these small exchanges, remember it has enough traction to garner attention from larger ones, also they are a guaranteed investment, this is a crypto with a future.

and just as a thought, could u try applying that logic to BTC? i think it makes sense to have a small fraction of high value commodity than to have tons of useless crap. see infinitecoin, PTS already broke the million dollar mark, that's not an achievement to just brush off.
--Bar--  PiNEJGUv4AZVZkLuF6hV4xwbYTRp5etWWJ

The magical land of crypto, no freebies people.

Offline bytemaster

Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2013, 08:39:58 PM »
i think thats rather unkind, i haven't seen a team this proactive in a long time. instead of a wait and see approach they've been working almost 24/7 to keep this project up and fluid. Don't judge the value of pts by these small exchanges, remember it has enough traction to garner attention from larger ones, also they are a guaranteed investment, this is a crypto with a future.

and just as a thought, could u try applying that logic to BTC? i think it makes sense to have a small fraction of high value commodity than to have tons of useless crap. see infinitecoin, PTS already broke the million dollar mark, that's not an achievement to just brush off.

We broke the 2 Million mark and are closing in on 3 :)
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline phoenix

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
    • View Profile
Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2013, 08:44:52 PM »
I honestly think that this project is incredible. The value of each protoshare you can mine out is so much more than just a fraction of a BTC, it's worth one share in every DAC released by invictus innovations, and possibly some DACs released by their competitors. Anything you can mine out is going to become VERY valuable as these DACs are released. Obviously many of us want more than we can mine with our home computers, but it's still worth mining!
Protoshares: Pg5EhSZEXHFjdFUzpxJbm91UtA54iUuDvt
Bitmessage: BM-NBrGi2V3BZ8REnJM7FPxUjjkQp7V5D28

Offline carisma

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 8
    • View Profile
Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2013, 09:16:11 PM »
I agree with all people said above. I had no mining facilities myself, so hired a few people to mine PTS from day one and bought them. Now they are well involved in the project too. This initiative is really good in my opinion, they are striving to buy wealth for the community. Of course there are problems along the way. This is not a state-backed debt bond, this is free market.

Offline bitshirehashaway

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2013, 11:14:19 PM »
Recent increases in PTS mining difficulties means bassically that many of the supporters of this project are going to get practically nothing.
With a modern CPU (i7) we can now get around 2-5 PTS a day. That is NOTHING.
Now tell me how we could operate on bitshares or keyhotee if even to acquire a simple name you need 100PTS?
And if we have to exchange or buying anything using Bitcoin, oh boy, this is the most expensive service ever created. 0.25BTC for a single name or 0.01BTC for 1PTS?

There is no way this can work, and you're now starting to lose supporters because of your greed.

2-5 PTS/day at current prices is on a low end $6-15/day. A modern i7 CPU Haswell k costs $330 + barebones for the rest of the system costs $300 as a high end estimation.

So your telling me worst case a 130 day return is a bad investment. Lets assume even you pay $0.50/kw and your system uses 200 watts. That is $2.40 in electricity a day on an extremely high end assumption. So your making worst case $4.40/day with $630 of costs + lets assume $100 in other costs for taxes on purchases ect.

Thats still a 6 month return = still an amazing return.

Offline ruletheworld

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 162
    • View Profile
    • BTC Geek
Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2013, 11:49:09 PM »
Recent increases in PTS mining difficulties means bassically that many of the supporters of this project are going to get practically nothing.
With a modern CPU (i7) we can now get around 2-5 PTS a day. That is NOTHING.
Now tell me how we could operate on bitshares or keyhotee if even to acquire a simple name you need 100PTS?
And if we have to exchange or buying anything using Bitcoin, oh boy, this is the most expensive service ever created. 0.25BTC for a single name or 0.01BTC for 1PTS?

There is no way this can work, and you're now starting to lose supporters because of your greed.

2-5 PTS/day at current prices is on a low end $6-15/day. A modern i7 CPU Haswell k costs $330 + barebones for the rest of the system costs $300 as a high end estimation.

So your telling me worst case a 130 day return is a bad investment. Lets assume even you pay $0.50/kw and your system uses 200 watts. That is $2.40 in electricity a day on an extremely high end assumption. So your making worst case $4.40/day with $630 of costs + lets assume $100 in other costs for taxes on purchases ect.

Thats still a 6 month return = still an amazing return.
Not that I really agree with the OP, but your analysis is flawed by the fact that the difficulty isn't going to remain at these levels for 130 days/6 months. Besides, the prices can fluctuate wildly in that period of time. 6 months is too long for an idea like Protoshares.
PTS: PYRqARWMGQ1PeZvjJM6iWJxf2ouwYcueHF
BTC: 1NeRoAKp137GTDUEBaonbu5BUGPN17Xw5n
http://btcgeek.com

Offline bitshirehashaway

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2013, 01:28:06 AM »
True, but the OP is complaining about how things are right now, and I am saying that if things stay the same as they are right now - and he doesn't know whether they will get better or worse, he will be ok. He shouldn't expect say $100/day in case things suddenly get bad.

Offline liberman

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 85
    • View Profile
Re: Please treat your supporters better
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2013, 10:01:21 AM »
I was hoping to help the project with my programming skills, but at the actual rate I'm getting almost nothing, so I'm thinking about just giving up just because I don't like to work for free in this kind of programs.
I entered too late, after the mining difficulty was artificially increased by 32x, so I lost the train.

Good luck in your adventure, but don't expect much more people to enter your project right now. What you have now is what you'll get. And I suspect most of the people into your project are more motivated by greed than actually understanding of the good points of your ideas.

 

Google+