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38PTSWarrior

  • Guest
Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« on: September 13, 2014, 06:17:57 PM »

Hi, could one of you come to the chat and walk me through a buy/short thingy? I need someone who tells me to click here, then there. And in case the ask or short wins (didn't figure this one out yet) to tell me where to click for covering with the long.

Most of what I am writing here I don't undertand. Also what the median price is (doesn't show in my client). Right now I don't want to understand, only do.

Ok, I am in the chat now, hope to see you soon.

38PTSWarrior

  • Guest
Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #1 on: September 13, 2014, 06:28:51 PM »
aloha is also in the chat and wants to .. play the market game

38PTSWarrior

  • Guest
Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #2 on: September 13, 2014, 07:19:18 PM »
Now aloha left but cryptoLynx and leon joined. Action!

38PTSWarrior

  • Guest
Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2014, 08:14:24 PM »
Update:
We are now in the middle of the walk through, waiting for a buyer

Doubtate:
That was a sucess. In case I am allowed to post the walk-through chat log here, I will do it.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2014, 08:31:29 PM by 38PTSWarrior »

Offline theoretical

Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2014, 08:33:30 PM »

Please do post the chat log.  Seeing what pain points new users have is sometimes eye opening for developers and experienced users.
BTS- theoretical / PTS- PZxpdC8RqWsdU3pVJeobZY7JFKVPfNpy5z / BTC- 1NfGejohzoVGffAD1CnCRgo9vApjCU2viY / the delegate formerly known as drltc / Nothing said on these forums is intended to be legally binding / All opinions are my own unless otherwise noted / Take action due to my posts at your own risk

Offline aloha

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Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2014, 09:13:09 PM »
It would be great if you could post chat log  :)

38PTSWarrior

  • Guest
Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2014, 09:19:29 PM »
Thanks to aloha, cryptoLynx, leon and now have some fun
(20:21:37) 38PTSWarrior: ***************Welcome to The Buy/Short Walk Through*********************
(20:21:44) 38PTSWarrior: aloha, aloha!
(20:21:52) aloha: :)
(20:22:11) 38PTSWarrior: nice that you are coming, I think you saw my thread?
(20:22:19) aloha: yes
(20:22:44) 38PTSWarrior: awesome, I am between crying and nerves breakdown but not anymore, because of you :D
(20:23:14) aloha: I was hoping to learn along with you while somebody else was explaining how to short
(20:23:20) aloha: :)
(20:23:24) 38PTSWarrior: hahaha
(20:23:27) 38PTSWarrior: ahhh!
(20:23:41) 38PTSWarrior: ok good, let’s see if someone else will come in
(20:24:13) 38PTSWarrior: no explanations aloha
(20:24:16) aloha: Sorry I am not the one :)
(20:24:44) 38PTSWarrior: this is here do session. No explanation only click here click there :P
(20:25:35) 38PTSWarrior: No I am happy that you are here, you remind me of Hawaii
(20:25:52) aloha: I have been trying to short myself yesterday without any success, spent about 6 BTSX on the fees cancelling my transaction :)
(20:26:14) aloha: Glad to remained you of something nice :)
(20:26:36) 38PTSWarrior: I easily get in psycho-mode and then click here and there, I need to stop this
(20:29:52) 38PTSWarrior: I never was in Hawaii but in the TV.. it’s almost like being there ;)
(20:32:17) aloha: I have never been there myself, but love aloha as it has very positive meaning :)
(20:33:46) 38PTSWarrior: E hele ka ‘elemakule, ka luahine,
a me na kamali’i a moe i ke ala
‘a’ohe mea nana e ho’opilikia.
(20:34:10) 38PTSWarrior: (Let the old men, the old women, and the children go
and sleep on the wayside; let them not be molested.)
(20:34:51) 38PTSWarrior: An old Hawaiian proverb I just googled
(20:35:26) aloha: :)
(20:36:01) 38PTSWarrior: In what country are you?
(20:36:23) aloha: England
(20:36:31) aloha: You
(20:36:40) 38PTSWarrior: Britannia rules the waves.. niiiice
(20:36:53) 38PTSWarrior: germany..
(20:37:05) aloha: Nice :)
(20:37:16) 38PTSWarrior: haha ok
(20:38:34) 38PTSWarrior: today was so grey and rainy
(20:39:11) aloha: usual english weather :)
(20:39:54) aloha: when did you start with Bitshares
(20:40:33) 38PTSWarrior: I am sure it came from england, it was a very polite grey and the wind smelled like fishNchips :D
(20:40:49) 38PTSWarrior: end of 2013
(20:41:39) 38PTSWarrior: I didn’t want to spend money on the Keyhotee ID
(20:41:41) aloha: great so you joined on time
(20:42:22) 38PTSWarrior: I saw someone writing about protoshares in the ghash.io chat
(20:42:54) 38PTSWarrior: I think that is the name. Where you could buy some ghash for btx and they were mining for you
(20:43:13) 38PTSWarrior: for BTC sorry
(20:43:21) aloha: :)
(20:43:59) aloha: I started with BTC last year when they were $1000
(20:44:46) aloha: Luckily invested 30% of my BTC in to AGS and PTS
(20:45:20) 38PTSWarrior: nice!
(20:45:49) 38PTSWarrior: It took so long until the client came out
(20:46:09) aloha: So we could worry :)
(20:46:33) 38PTSWarrior: For the first time since many years I get a feeling of easyness or positive future feeling if you know what I mean
(20:47:29) aloha: I started feeling like that since I discovered BTC, but now feeling is even better :)
(20:49:04) 38PTSWarrior: ' ' w e a r e t h e g e n e s i s ' ‘
(20:49:14) aloha: Still don’t understand things fully but more I read forum more understanding I get.
(20:49:29) 38PTSWarrior: I pray every day that I have AGS
(20:49:37) aloha: :)
(20:50:09) aloha: I will be off now, nice typing with you
(20:50:16) aloha: aloha :)
(20:50:25) 38PTSWarrior: yes, what a shame no one came
(20:50:30) 38PTSWarrior: aloha!
(20:54:44) 38PTSWarrior: ***************Welcome to The Buy/Short Walk Through********************
(20:54:51) 38PTSWarrior: Hi leon
(20:56:14) 38PTSWarrior: Welcome to the walk through! Are you already trading or do you want to learn?
(20:56:25) leon: hi everyone )))
(20:56:30) 38PTSWarrior: hi
(20:56:49) leon: yeah I’m trying to....but still not sure 100%
(20:57:20) 38PTSWarrior: Have a seat, we are waiting for the guru who will do us the click n fun show!
(20:57:33) leon: :-):-):-):-)
(20:57:35) 38PTSWarrior: the experience
(20:57:38) 38PTSWarrior: :D
(20:57:40) leon: would be nice
(20:58:16) 38PTSWarrior: aloha just left, we had a nice chat
(20:58:44) leon: yeah,I know him)) he’s cool guyB)B)B)...
(20:59:09) leon: could you tell me what kind of questions do you have ?
(20:59:21) leon: i mean what is clear what is unclear ?
(20:59:23) leon: :):):)
(20:59:24) 38PTSWarrior: ah nice. I have no questions
(20:59:41) 38PTSWarrior: Here is only the do-do space
(21:00:12) 38PTSWarrior: I cannot handle any of the following words anymore: cannot write the words otherwise I flip hehe
(21:00:43) leon: ;););)
(21:02:19) 38PTSWarrior: guess a number between 1 and 10
(21:02:27) 38PTSWarrior: is it 6?
(21:02:34) leon: no
(21:02:37) leon: it’s 3
(21:02:41) 38PTSWarrior: darn..
(21:02:51) 38PTSWarrior: .. sometimes i am wrong
(21:03:05) 38PTSWarrior: 5!
(21:03:25) 38PTSWarrior: still 3?
(21:03:28) 38PTSWarrior: :D
(21:03:47) leon: cool game )))
(21:04:00) 38PTSWarrior: yeah
(21:04:01) leon: tell me any number
(21:04:09) 38PTSWarrior: 7
(21:04:20) leon: 8 , I won
(21:04:29) 38PTSWarrior: congrats,
(21:04:39) leon: :-)
(21:05:23) 38PTSWarrior: 2 aliens are landing on planet earth
(21:05:29) 38PTSWarrior: in a desert
(21:05:36) 38PTSWarrior: they are injured and start walking
(21:05:50) 38PTSWarrior: until they reach an abandoned fuel station
(21:06:25) 38PTSWarrior: they walk up to the gas pump and one of them says:"Tell me your name earthling"
(21:06:43) 38PTSWarrior: But the gas pump doesn’t reply
(21:07:01) 38PTSWarrior: He says:"Tell me your name or I will shoot you!)
(21:07:16) 38PTSWarrior: And again, no reaction from the gas pump
(21:07:37) cryptoLynx: lulz
(21:07:40) 38PTSWarrior: He takes out his phaser and points at the gas pump. His friend sees it and runs away
(21:07:48) 38PTSWarrior: hi :D..
(21:07:50) cryptoLynx: BitShares falling abit?
(21:07:58) cryptoLynx: hey-
(21:07:58) leon: wait wait..
(21:08:01) 38PTSWarrior: The alien shoots and there is a huge explosion!
(21:08:08) leon: continue please
(21:08:36) 38PTSWarrior: He is even more hurt and screams to his friend: “ you knew about the explosion, you ran way without telling me anything, that’s not friendship, go"
(21:09:31) 38PTSWarrior: and his friend says:” I didn’t know anything about an explosion, but you should know that I am not the kind of guy who messes with people who can swing their dick three times around their bodies and stick it in heir ears!"
(21:10:00) 38PTSWarrior: ***************Welcome to The Buy/Short Walk Through********************
(21:10:06) leon: :D
(21:10:11) 38PTSWarrior: cryptoLynx!
(21:10:36) cryptoLynx: B)
(21:10:58) 38PTSWarrior: I am a bit tired, that was a lot of text haha
(21:11:35) 38PTSWarrior: Tell us crypto, are you here for learning or do you want to give aus the guru walk through?
(21:11:45) cryptoLynx: lol
(21:11:53) cryptoLynx: questions ihave
(21:12:05) 38PTSWarrior: questions are illegal :D
(21:12:11) 38PTSWarrior: only do-do!
(21:12:17) cryptoLynx: bitUSD volumes, are they increasing atall?
(21:12:27) 38PTSWarrior: but hey, if you have questions, it’s ok
(21:12:43) cryptoLynx: searching for any sign of utility
(21:13:45) cryptoLynx: BitShares seems MOST likely to transition from speculative value to some actual utility value on bitUSD/bitCNY
(21:14:12) cryptoLynx: so searching hard to find some confirmation of that
(21:14:45) cryptoLynx: bytemaster ever in chat?
(21:14:46) 38PTSWarrior: I hope someone will come and answer your question
(21:15:17) 38PTSWarrior: I never met anyone in the chat over 6 months, maybe 1 or 2 times
(21:15:34) cryptoLynx: ah k true, yea same-
(21:15:58) cryptoLynx: iguess that’s abit of improvement :)
(21:15:59) 38PTSWarrior: would be nice if there would be a beer shop so we could get a beer while we wait
(21:16:05) cryptoLynx: lol
(21:16:12) 38PTSWarrior: here in chat land :D
(21:16:25) cryptoLynx: :idea:
(21:16:57) leon: bitbeer
(21:17:48) cryptoLynx: gulp 8o
(21:17:57) cryptoLynx: 8)
(21:18:05) 38PTSWarrior: I can see a wave coming, bit for bit the users are coming in the chat. there are already 6 chat members. 9, 12, and then 45 and everything starts to blink
(21:18:28) 38PTSWarrior: it’s the beginning :D
(21:19:19) cryptoLynx: :warning: :error: :important:
(21:19:26) leon: chat is cool...
(21:19:36) 38PTSWarrior: yeah
(21:19:38) leon: i’ll be more often here with you guys))
(21:20:02) 38PTSWarrior: nice, i have no real life flesh contacts
(21:20:21) leon: nothing is real
(21:20:31) 38PTSWarrior: sry
(21:20:40) cryptoLynx: :-(
(21:20:48) 38PTSWarrior: I was just saying it
(21:20:52) cryptoLynx: O:-D
(21:20:55) 38PTSWarrior: without thinking my dear
(21:20:58) leon: it’s all just a game
(21:20:58) cryptoLynx: lol k gotta run for abit->
(21:21:06) leon: :-):-):-)
(21:21:07) cryptoLynx: ttyl fellas
(21:21:07) 38PTSWarrior: awww, sad!
(21:21:12) 38PTSWarrior: laterz!!
(21:21:22) leon: sad? it’s beautiful
(21:21:47) leon: never mind
(21:21:59) 38PTSWarrior: yes, cryptoLynx is now on the way to a beaiful task
(21:22:23) 38PTSWarrior: just for a second I felt coldness in my heart when he said, that he is leaving
(21:22:46) leon: my short was just matched at the price 23.5
(21:23:06) 38PTSWarrior: w h a t?? I wanna do the same
(21:23:25) leon: but wait...the price now is 26
(21:23:30) leon: no point covering
(21:23:38) leon: it will be a loss
(21:24:07) 38PTSWarrior: ok
(21:24:35) 38PTSWarrior: are u trading btsx/bitusd?
(21:25:00) leon: shorting is kind of easy ...just not sure if it’s working for me yet
(21:25:01) leon: yes
(21:26:58) 38PTSWarrior: How do you short my friend? When I do this: 1000 btsx buy bitusd, 1000 btsx short. Now there will be a statement like this one: fill ask @ 0.03846. Fill ask. Does this mean it is the ask order and not the short order that “won”.
(21:29:00) 38PTSWarrior: Or could you write the steps for the buy/short thing. Like the build instructions!
(21:29:32) 38PTSWarrior: do this, go there, in case of fill ask, do this.. :(
(21:32:12) 38PTSWarrior: Oh wait, would you like to guide me through?
(21:36:14) 38PTSWarrior: or tell me anythig
(21:36:21) 38PTSWarrior: *n
(21:37:03) 38PTSWarrior: 25.95 lowest short
(21:37:39) 38PTSWarrior: 25.50 lowest buy
(21:38:41) 38PTSWarrior: Do you know the median price?
(21:43:01) 38PTSWarrior: “...just not sure if it’s working for me yet” , ahhh, got it
(21:43:35) leon: hey...i’m back
(21:43:56) 38PTSWarrior: nice
(21:44:41) 38PTSWarrior: do you smoke the cheeba?
(21:45:08) 38PTSWarrior: sry maybe unpolite to ask
(21:45:33) leon: all right ....so you short ,let’s say 20 usd at the price 26
(21:45:42) leon: there you need 520 btsx
(21:45:54) 38PTSWarrior: wait... doing it
(21:45:58) leon: no..it’s all cool...
(21:46:26) leon: O:-DO:-DO:-D
(21:46:38) 38PTSWarrior: done :D
(21:47:06) 38PTSWarrior: so, you are cool.. i see hehe
(21:47:13) leon: so you see your short in open orders ,right?
(21:47:17) leon: hah))
(21:47:20) 38PTSWarrior: now the shorting?
(21:47:21) leon: how you see it?
(21:47:24) leon: 8o8o
(21:47:24) 38PTSWarrior: sure
(21:47:45) leon: and it’s a red button “cancel”?
(21:48:35) leon: so now you wait until your order is matched (you short ,you create bitusd...now one has to buy your sort
(21:48:38) 38PTSWarrior: same numbers, 20 and 26 right? ok, now i could click them both. i mean confirm
(21:48:55) leon: oh...i thought you confirmed it
(21:49:05) 38PTSWarrior: ok i clicked confirm
(21:49:14) 38PTSWarrior: i did :)
(21:49:30) leon: great
(21:49:35) 38PTSWarrior: now we are waiting. nice
(21:50:12) leon: now you you basically wait ,and after you order was matched ...you’ll be able to cover your position
(21:51:13) 38PTSWarrior: can you try to talk like this: “When this happens, click ther” please? :)
(21:52:20) leon: when you short...you freeze a particular amount of bitusd at some price (26 in our case) ...doing that you create bitusd
(21:52:29) leon: no one has to buy it
(21:52:32) 38PTSWarrior: I did this already. I bought bitUSD but have no idea if I covered because I don’t know how that works
(21:52:41) leon: wait
(21:52:46) leon: i’ll explain
(21:53:11) leon: so you created bitsud ...and let’s say I bought your short
(21:53:24) 38PTSWarrior: the 20? ok
(21:53:53) leon: after that you’ll have a green button saying “cover"
(21:54:05) 38PTSWarrior: oh! ok
(21:54:31) leon: so you’ll be able to cover....buy paying off your debt
(21:54:41) leon: which will be 20 bitusd
(21:55:08) 38PTSWarrior: So all I have to do is click the button?
(21:55:35) leon: but if you shorted ...and the price of btsx went up...so you’ll be able to buy same amount of bitusd but for less btsx
(21:55:52) leon: and there you have profit
(21:56:28) leon: cause you pay your debt and system releases the amount of btsx frozen
(21:56:36) leon: and the difference is your profit
(21:56:44) leon: this is what i understand so far
(21:56:56) leon: in my case i shorted at 23.5
(21:57:23) leon: so now if i cover ,i lose money
(21:57:50) leon: B)B)
(21:58:07) 38PTSWarrior: when i read your sentence with the word shorted, then i think: fuck, i don’t understand what he means, all i want is someone to tell me the first time, where to click. it is too much info you know. lets keep it baby-style
(21:58:33) 38PTSWarrior: I know you mean it good!
(21:58:38) leon: cool...no problem
(21:58:48) leon: tell me where to start from?
(21:59:49) 38PTSWarrior: what happens when the short order got bought. Now i can see both orders as green and pending. How will it look after someone bought the short?
(22:00:50) 38PTSWarrior: You know that bubble that pops up? what does it say in the bubble when someone buys the short?
(22:01:58) leon: what bubble? you mean the buy/sell graphs ?
(22:03:28) 38PTSWarrior: no, when someone buys it will show a bubble that said last time:"fill ask, ask sent you this and that"
(22:03:48) 38PTSWarrior: and i had bitUSD
(22:04:20) 38PTSWarrior: I believe someone bought the “buy” thing?
(22:04:26) leon: oh...
(22:04:29) leon: yes
(22:04:42) 38PTSWarrior: ah ok
(22:04:47) leon: it just says that somebody bought your short
(22:05:33) leon: do you see green button saying cover?
(22:07:22) 38PTSWarrior: where is it located?
(22:07:37) leon: in open orders
(22:07:48) leon: next to the numbers
(22:07:50) 38PTSWarrior: No, there are only 2 red fields
(22:08:08) 38PTSWarrior: “cancel"
(22:08:13) leon: oh
(22:08:15) leon: right
(22:08:30) leon: so you wait until somebody will buy your bitsud
(22:08:31) 38PTSWarrior: :)
(22:08:43) 38PTSWarrior: ok
(22:09:04) leon: when it happens you’ll have green “cover” button
(22:09:13) 38PTSWarrior: when someone buys the bitusd,ah ok!
(22:09:20) leon: yes
(22:09:23) 38PTSWarrior: oh sweet
(22:09:35) 38PTSWarrior: then i click it?
(22:09:56) leon: wait......now...this bitusd were not yours
(22:10:09) 38PTSWarrior: aha ok
(22:10:19) leon: so for you to claim back your “frozen” bitsx
(22:10:31) leon: you’ll need to pay back
(22:10:35) leon: this 20 bitsud
(22:10:45) leon: bitusd*
(22:11:05) ChatBot: Error: Connection status: 500
(22:11:12) 38PTSWarrior: test 12
(22:11:29) 38PTSWarrior: I will just accept this as a rule in the game
(22:11:46) 38PTSWarrior: I guess I don’t need to know why at the moment
(22:12:14) leon: what exactly ? how the shorting works ?
(22:12:19) 38PTSWarrior: Someone buys the “buy” or aka “fill ask"
(22:12:40) leon: yes
(22:12:53) 38PTSWarrior: To be exact: yes, how the borrowing and paying back works, the logic behnind it
(22:13:19) 38PTSWarrior: so someone buys the buy. then i have to pay back the amount. roger sir!
(22:15:36) leon: the logic is...you know that the price of btsx/bitusd will go up...so let’s say now the price is 1 bitusd 26 btsx...so when the price of btsx grows,it’ll be 1 bitusd/ 23 btsx...you want to short,which means that you freeze an amount of 520 btsx for creating 20 bitusd
(22:16:07) leon: now one has to buy this 20 bitusd
(22:16:44) leon: and when the price goes up...you buy 20 bitusd and repay it
(22:17:10) leon: the logic is that you buy let;s say 20 bitusd for 500 btsx
(22:17:17) leon: so your profit will be 20 btsx
(22:17:58) leon: i don’t know...it’s quiet simple for me ...but it’s really hard to explain ))))
(22:18:15) leon: i’m sorry if i’m not clear
(22:18:39) 38PTSWarrior: No, I just cannot compute that right away.
(22:19:15) 38PTSWarrior: Now if you could be so friendly and tell me what I have to do when someone buys the short?
(22:19:44) 38PTSWarrior: will there be a green light?
(22:19:47) leon: ok...you’ll have green cover button
(22:19:50) leon: yes
(22:19:55) 38PTSWarrior: ok
(22:20:24) leon: so ,if you see that you’re able to buy same amount of bitusd but for less btsx
(22:20:27) leon: than cover
(22:21:09) 38PTSWarrior: the green light says cover on it?
(22:21:15) leon: yep
(22:21:28) 38PTSWarrior: ok, i click it. and then?
(22:22:08) 38PTSWarrior: sry, i think then i have to..
(22:22:15) leon: it will say something like “payoff your debt
(22:22:19) 38PTSWarrior: buy ..
(22:22:23) leon: yes
(22:22:24) leon: yes
(22:22:28) 38PTSWarrior: i see
(22:22:40) 38PTSWarrior: and then click on payoff?
(22:22:59) leon: man...i’m gonna have some pasta with meatballs ))) so i’ll be back shortly))
(22:23:02) leon: yes
(22:23:14) 38PTSWarrior: awesome, wait one sec
(22:23:22) leon: and watch your balance of btsx increasing
(22:23:27) 38PTSWarrior: the process of clicking green and red is for both the same!!!!
(22:23:38) 38PTSWarrior: hooray, happy meal, i mean enjoy your meatballs!
(22:23:58) leon: thanks ));)
(22:24:17) leon: i hope that helped you a little
(22:24:34) 38PTSWarrior: whats your btsx adress if you want to give it to me?
(22:24:49) leon: leonx
(22:24:56) 38PTSWarrior: thx!

38PTSWarrior

  • Guest
Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2014, 09:47:12 PM »
Just somebody bought the bid but there is no green button.
Is everything groovy? Now only the short order is left and says cancel

There are 213 Dollars before my short. Waiting(?)
« Last Edit: September 13, 2014, 09:50:20 PM by 38PTSWarrior »

Offline theoretical

Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #8 on: September 13, 2014, 10:15:43 PM »

Let's say you short 100 BitUSD at a price of 30 BTSX / BitUSD.  Then:

- To place the order, you need to put up 30 x 100 = 3000 BTSX
- To fill the order, a bidder must put up 30 x 100 = 3000 BTSX

When the orders are matched, the following happens:

- Your 3000 BTSX goes into a "pot"
- The 3000 BTSX from the buyer goes into the same "pot", so it has total 6000 BTSX in it
- The system creates 100 brand new BitUSD and gives them to the buyer as compensation for his 3000 BTSX
- The whole pot (6000 BTSX) is now attached to your account
- The pot is now in debt 100 BitUSD to the system
- The BTSX in the pot will be locked as long as the pot is in debt to the system
- In order to unlock the pot, you have to somehow obtain 100 BitUSD and press the Cover button to repay the debt

Those are the basics.  Will post more in a bit.
BTS- theoretical / PTS- PZxpdC8RqWsdU3pVJeobZY7JFKVPfNpy5z / BTC- 1NfGejohzoVGffAD1CnCRgo9vApjCU2viY / the delegate formerly known as drltc / Nothing said on these forums is intended to be legally binding / All opinions are my own unless otherwise noted / Take action due to my posts at your own risk

Offline theoretical

Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2014, 10:29:43 PM »

Here's what happens if the price goes down:

- If the price of BitUSD goes down from 30 to 25, then you can buy 100 BitUSD for 25 BTSX, pay 2500 BTSX to cover and unlock the pot of 6000 BTSX.
- You originally paid 3000 BTSX when you did the short sale.  When you bought the BitUSD to cover, you had to pay 2500 BTSX -- but as soon as you hit the Cover button, you unlocked the 6000 BTSX from the pot.  So you made 500 BTSX profit on the deal.

Here's what happens if the price goes up:

- If the price of BitUSD goes up from 30 to 35, then you can buy 100 BitUSD for 35 BTSX, pay 3500 BTSX to cover and unlock the pot of 6000 BTSX.
- You originally paid 3000 BTSX when you did the short sale.  When you bought the BitUSD to cover, you had to pay 3500 BTSX -- but as soon as you hit the Cover button, you unlocked the 6000 BTSX from the pot.  So you lost 500 BTSX on the deal.

If the BitUSD price goes all the way up to 60 BTSX, then you would never want to cover -- if you had 100 BitUSD, you could simply sell it for more than 6000 BTSX instead of covering.  The system really doesn't want this to happen, it essentially means people would be defaulting on their debts to the system which would wreck the whole economic theory it's based on.  People like me talking about "underwater shorts" on this forum are referring to this situation, not what we wear in the swimming pool :)

So to prevent underwater shorts, when the price rises to 45 BTSX -- halfway from the beginning (30 BTSX) to the "waterline" (60 BTSX) -- the system will reach into the pot, pull out some collateral, buy BitUSD with it, and cover.  This is referred to as "margin call," it is basically the system foreclosing on the debt.  The system will assess you a big 5% fee when this happens, so you might want to monitor the prices and hit the Cover button yourself when the price is getting close to the margin call price of 45 BTSX.

The GUI will helpfully tell you the margin call price.  You can also hit the Cover button to pay back some of the debt -- no collateral will be unlocked until the debt is paid in full, but a partial payment will increase the margin call price.
BTS- theoretical / PTS- PZxpdC8RqWsdU3pVJeobZY7JFKVPfNpy5z / BTC- 1NfGejohzoVGffAD1CnCRgo9vApjCU2viY / the delegate formerly known as drltc / Nothing said on these forums is intended to be legally binding / All opinions are my own unless otherwise noted / Take action due to my posts at your own risk

Offline aloha

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Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2014, 08:45:45 AM »
Thanks drltc  :)

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Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2014, 09:36:17 AM »

Here's what happens if the price goes down:

- If the price of BitUSD goes down from 30 to 25, then you can buy 100 BitUSD for 25 BTSX, pay 2500 BTSX to cover and unlock the pot of 6000 BTSX.
- You originally paid 3000 BTSX when you did the short sale.  When you bought the BitUSD to cover, you had to pay 2500 BTSX -- but as soon as you hit the Cover button, you unlocked the 6000 BTSX from the pot.  So you made 500 BTSX profit on the deal.

Here's what happens if the price goes up:

- If the price of BitUSD goes up from 30 to 35, then you can buy 100 BitUSD for 35 BTSX, pay 3500 BTSX to cover and unlock the pot of 6000 BTSX.
- You originally paid 3000 BTSX when you did the short sale.  When you bought the BitUSD to cover, you had to pay 3500 BTSX -- but as soon as you hit the Cover button, you unlocked the 6000 BTSX from the pot.  So you lost 500 BTSX on the deal.

If the BitUSD price goes all the way up to 60 BTSX, then you would never want to cover -- if you had 100 BitUSD, you could simply sell it for more than 6000 BTSX instead of covering.  The system really doesn't want this to happen, it essentially means people would be defaulting on their debts to the system which would wreck the whole economic theory it's based on.  People like me talking about "underwater shorts" on this forum are referring to this situation, not what we wear in the swimming pool :)

So to prevent underwater shorts, when the price rises to 45 BTSX -- halfway from the beginning (30 BTSX) to the "waterline" (60 BTSX) -- the system will reach into the pot, pull out some collateral, buy BitUSD with it, and cover.  This is referred to as "margin call," it is basically the system foreclosing on the debt.  The system will assess you a big 5% fee when this happens, so you might want to monitor the prices and hit the Cover button yourself when the price is getting close to the margin call price of 45 BTSX.

The GUI will helpfully tell you the margin call price.  You can also hit the Cover button to pay back some of the debt -- no collateral will be unlocked until the debt is paid in full, but a partial payment will increase the margin call price.

You should definitely work on harder explanation, for all that have never places an order in their lifes  :)
I did not even read the whole thing to see if it's factually correct.
It was not so badly written IMHO ... I could follow and actually like that different people have different ways of looking at things and describing them
so: +5%
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38PTSWarrior

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Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #12 on: September 14, 2014, 10:24:14 AM »
Let's say the government gave everyone 1000 btsx. You made already 2000 by using the market and your ability to think and make decissions.

But there is also your brother. He he has a brain problem. You signed 5 years in Antarctica for a research project about ice and you want to help him make some money, so he will not fall behind in society and must sleep on the street where they steal his 1000 btsx.

Imagine you have to tell him in the chat what to do. This is what I mean with walk-through. Thanks of course for all the advice and the detailed explanations ;) 



Offline oco101

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Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #13 on: September 14, 2014, 08:39:38 PM »

Here's what happens if the price goes down:

- If the price of BitUSD goes down from 30 to 25, then you can buy 100 BitUSD for 25 BTSX, pay 2500 BTSX to cover and unlock the pot of 6000 BTSX.
- You originally paid 3000 BTSX when you did the short sale.  When you bought the BitUSD to cover, you had to pay 2500 BTSX -- but as soon as you hit the Cover button, you unlocked the 6000 BTSX from the pot.  So you made 500 BTSX profit on the deal.

Here's what happens if the price goes up:

- If the price of BitUSD goes up from 30 to 35, then you can buy 100 BitUSD for 35 BTSX, pay 3500 BTSX to cover and unlock the pot of 6000 BTSX.
- You originally paid 3000 BTSX when you did the short sale.  When you bought the BitUSD to cover, you had to pay 3500 BTSX -- but as soon as you hit the Cover button, you unlocked the 6000 BTSX from the pot.  So you lost 500 BTSX on the deal.

If the BitUSD price goes all the way up to 60 BTSX, then you would never want to cover -- if you had 100 BitUSD, you could simply sell it for more than 6000 BTSX instead of covering.  The system really doesn't want this to happen, it essentially means people would be defaulting on their debts to the system which would wreck the whole economic theory it's based on.  People like me talking about "underwater shorts" on this forum are referring to this situation, not what we wear in the swimming pool :)

So to prevent underwater shorts, when the price rises to 45 BTSX -- halfway from the beginning (30 BTSX) to the "waterline" (60 BTSX) -- the system will reach into the pot, pull out some collateral, buy BitUSD with it, and cover.  This is referred to as "margin call," it is basically the system foreclosing on the debt.  The system will assess you a big 5% fee when this happens, so you might want to monitor the prices and hit the Cover button yourself when the price is getting close to the margin call price of 45 BTSX.

The GUI will helpfully tell you the margin call price.  You can also hit the Cover button to pay back some of the debt -- no collateral will be unlocked until the debt is paid in full, but a partial payment will increase the margin call price.

Very clear, wiki material

Offline tonyk

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Re: Buy/Short Walk me through in the chat
« Reply #14 on: September 15, 2014, 06:08:20 AM »

Here's what happens if the price goes down:

- If the price of BitUSD goes down from 30 to 25, then you can buy 100 BitUSD for 25 BTSX, pay 2500 BTSX to cover and unlock the pot of 6000 BTSX.
- You originally paid 3000 BTSX when you did the short sale.  When you bought the BitUSD to cover, you had to pay 2500 BTSX -- but as soon as you hit the Cover button, you unlocked the 6000 BTSX from the pot.  So you made 500 BTSX profit on the deal.

Here's what happens if the price goes up:

- If the price of BitUSD goes up from 30 to 35, then you can buy 100 BitUSD for 35 BTSX, pay 3500 BTSX to cover and unlock the pot of 6000 BTSX.
- You originally paid 3000 BTSX when you did the short sale.  When you bought the BitUSD to cover, you had to pay 3500 BTSX -- but as soon as you hit the Cover button, you unlocked the 6000 BTSX from the pot.  So you lost 500 BTSX on the deal.

If the BitUSD price goes all the way up to 60 BTSX, then you would never want to cover -- if you had 100 BitUSD, you could simply sell it for more than 6000 BTSX instead of covering.  The system really doesn't want this to happen, it essentially means people would be defaulting on their debts to the system which would wreck the whole economic theory it's based on.  People like me talking about "underwater shorts" on this forum are referring to this situation, not what we wear in the swimming pool :)

So to prevent underwater shorts, when the price rises to 45 BTSX -- halfway from the beginning (30 BTSX) to the "waterline" (60 BTSX) -- the system will reach into the pot, pull out some collateral, buy BitUSD with it, and cover.  This is referred to as "margin call," it is basically the system foreclosing on the debt.  The system will assess you a big 5% fee when this happens, so you might want to monitor the prices and hit the Cover button yourself when the price is getting close to the margin call price of 45 BTSX.

The GUI will helpfully tell you the margin call price.  You can also hit the Cover button to pay back some of the debt -- no collateral will be unlocked until the debt is paid in full, but a partial payment will increase the margin call price.

You should definitely work on harder explanation, for all that have never places an order in their lifes  :)
I did not even read the whole thing to see if it's factually correct.
It was not so badly written IMHO ... I could follow and actually like that different people have different ways of looking at things and describing them
so: +5%


Here's what happens if the price goes down:

- If the price of BitUSD goes down from 30 to 25, then you can buy 100 BitUSD for 25 BTSX, pay 2500 BTSX to cover and unlock the pot of 6000 BTSX.
- You originally paid 3000 BTSX when you did the short sale.  When you bought the BitUSD to cover, you had to pay 2500 BTSX -- but as soon as you hit the Cover button, you unlocked the 6000 BTSX from the pot.  So you made 500 BTSX profit on the deal.

Here's what happens if the price goes up:

- If the price of BitUSD goes up from 30 to 35, then you can buy 100 BitUSD for 35 BTSX, pay 3500 BTSX to cover and unlock the pot of 6000 BTSX.
- You originally paid 3000 BTSX when you did the short sale.  When you bought the BitUSD to cover, you had to pay 3500 BTSX -- but as soon as you hit the Cover button, you unlocked the 6000 BTSX from the pot.  So you lost 500 BTSX on the deal.

If the BitUSD price goes all the way up to 60 BTSX, then you would never want to cover -- if you had 100 BitUSD, you could simply sell it for more than 6000 BTSX instead of covering.  The system really doesn't want this to happen, it essentially means people would be defaulting on their debts to the system which would wreck the whole economic theory it's based on.  People like me talking about "underwater shorts" on this forum are referring to this situation, not what we wear in the swimming pool :)

So to prevent underwater shorts, when the price rises to 45 BTSX -- halfway from the beginning (30 BTSX) to the "waterline" (60 BTSX) -- the system will reach into the pot, pull out some collateral, buy BitUSD with it, and cover.  This is referred to as "margin call," it is basically the system foreclosing on the debt.  The system will assess you a big 5% fee when this happens, so you might want to monitor the prices and hit the Cover button yourself when the price is getting close to the margin call price of 45 BTSX.

The GUI will helpfully tell you the margin call price.  You can also hit the Cover button to pay back some of the debt -- no collateral will be unlocked until the debt is paid in full, but a partial payment will increase the margin call price.

Very clear, wiki material


OK, not the first I am the only seeing the things as I see them.
 Deleted!
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

 

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