DAC Concept: Item certification

[emski]

No TITAN for this. Infact you could still have TITAN but you need to be able to prove ownership. And the history of the bottle should be revealed to each new buyer. I doubt anyone would want to buy from an anonymous owner.

[santaclause102]

What about this?
The wine is consumed. Then the wine consumer has an incentive to sell his certificate to a counterfeiter who labels a cheap wine like the expensive one that has been consumed and sells this with the token he acquired.

You can still track who owned the item.
You can buy only from retailers with good reputation.
Anyone who consumes the item (another blockchain transaction) can rate all on the supply chain back to the manufacturer.
Very quickly counterfeiters will be exposed and anyone selling his wine.
You would want to buy a bottle that has been only in reputable distributors/owners. And if you happen to buy a fake you can consume it (using special transaction that allows you to rate) and downvote anyone on the chain. This will decrease the value of all their products.

+5%  good points emski

There is also an answer on that other project's site:

The situation that will still exist is that of drinking the contents of a bottle and then refilling and selling.  However, for this type of fraud to occur you will need to have the money to buy the wines and the bitcoin token in the first place.  You will then need to be willing to transfer the bottle to a new collector using your public signature.  In an environment where buyers are asking for the bitcoin to be transferred along with the sale, fraud will become a 1 to 1 relationship, verses the 1 to many fraud opportunity that exists today.

But, would TITAN be a problem in that it would not allow to track the token back to the originator?

[emski]

Unless the private key is is ingrained into the item somehow, i don't see how this prevents fraud. There would have to be some kind of unique signature that the object produces.

If you possess the item you might be able to fake it. It doesn't matter what you use to protect it. Some fake money, others fake paintings.
This only provides proof how that specific item was stored and distributed. A single person can fake a bottle and sell it... once.
However if you see someone that posses multitude of bottles and has good ratings then it will be more likely that he is honest.
The fact that only the person that consumes the bottle can rate will greatly improve rating system.
Once you rate you cannot sell again.

[G1ng3rBr34dM4n]

What about this?
The wine is consumed. Then the wine consumer has an incentive to sell his certificate to a counterfeiter who labels a cheap wine like the expensive one that has been consumed and sells this with the token he acquired.

You can still track who owned the item.
You can buy only from retailers with good reputation.
Anyone who consumes the item (another blockchain transaction) can rate all on the supply chain back to the manufacturer.
Very quickly counterfeiters will be exposed and anyone selling his wine.
You would want to buy a bottle that has been only in reputable distributors/owners. And if you happen to buy a fake you can consume it (using special transaction that allows you to rate) and downvote anyone on the chain. This will decrease the value of all their products.

+5%  good points emski

[G1ng3rBr34dM4n]

What about this?
The wine is consumed. Then the wine consumer has an incentive to sell his certificate to a counterfeiter who labels a cheap wine like the expensive one that has been consumed and sells this with the token he acquired.

Last week when my wife and I were picking up a bottle of Malbec, we learned several winemakers currently use holographic labels to ensure authenticity.  The reason I bring this up is perhaps the authentication process of fine wines has the potential to be multi-factor..? (kind of like 2 factor authentication for wallets)

[emski]

What about this?
The wine is consumed. Then the wine consumer has an incentive to sell his certificate to a counterfeiter who labels a cheap wine like the expensive one that has been consumed and sells this with the token he acquired.

You can still track who owned the item.
You can buy only from retailers with good reputation.
Anyone who consumes the item (another blockchain transaction) can rate all on the supply chain back to the manufacturer.
Very quickly counterfeiters will be exposed and anyone selling his wine.
You would want to buy a bottle that has been only in reputable distributors/owners. And if you happen to buy a fake you can consume it (using special transaction that allows you to rate) and downvote anyone on the chain. This will decrease the value of all their products.

[Pheonike]

Unless the private key is is ingrained into the item somehow, i don't see how this prevents fraud. There would have to be some kind of unique signature that the object produces.

[G1ng3rBr34dM4n]

I'm a farmer (small acreage) and have been trying to devise uses for the blockchain in farming. The fact that you are focused on the future of food is awesome and needed. My goal is uses to get traditional small scale farms connected through a block chain using the current infrastructure available to most of them.  I wonder if Baker Creek Heirloom seeds would be interested in this as a means of verifying their seed stock as they are almost militantly against GMOs.

FTF looks to have good potential, but it really gives me the impression of being better used in large warehouse grows where the machines are all under control of one structure, network, security system.

Curious to know more!  PM sent.

Great idea with Baker Creek Heirloom seeds too.

[G1ng3rBr34dM4n]

@G1ng3rBr34dM4n
The concept is explained in vinfolio's blog:
http://blog.vinfolio.com/2014/10/06/the-future-of-wine-provenance-is-bitcoin/
It is basically the same idea realised using bitcoin blockchain.
I think I remember a site mentioning a possible investor. But I was unable to find it so there might be no ongoing projects after all.

Thank you! That is pretty awesome, I skimmed it but will definitely dive in when I get out of work.

[santaclause102]

What about this?
The wine is consumed. Then the wine consumer has an incentive to sell his certificate to a counterfeiter who labels a cheap wine like the expensive one that has been consumed and sells this with the token he acquired.

Edit: Found the answer:

The situation that will still exist is that of drinking the contents of a bottle and then refilling and selling.  However, for this type of fraud to occur you will need to have the money to buy the wines and the bitcoin token in the first place.  You will then need to be willing to transfer the bottle to a new collector using your public signature.  In an environment where buyers are asking for the bitcoin to be transferred along with the sale, fraud will become a 1 to 1 relationship, verses the 1 to many fraud opportunity that exists today.

Also, would TITAN be a problem in that it would not allow to track the token back to the originator?

[JWF]

JWF, great idea!  This is what we're working on with Future Tech Farm (Link to bitsharestalk post here).  One of our goals is to have the ability to track every single plant grown with proof of: No GMO, No Pesticide Utilization, etc...  Publicly verifiable and an objectively better system than "Certified Organic" by at least an order of magnitude.


I'm a farmer (small acreage) and have been trying to devise uses for the blockchain in farming. The fact that you are focused on the future of food is awesome and needed. My goal is uses to get traditional small scale farms connected through a block chain using the current infrastructure available to most of them.  I wonder if Baker Creek Heirloom seeds would be interested in this as a means of verifying their seed stock as they are almost militantly against GMOs.

FTF looks to have good potential, but it really gives me the impression of being better used in large warehouse grows where the machines are all under control of one structure, network, security system.

[emski]

@G1ng3rBr34dM4n
The concept is explained in vinfolio's blog:
http://blog.vinfolio.com/2014/10/06/the-future-of-wine-provenance-is-bitcoin/
It is basically the same idea realised using bitcoin blockchain.
I think I remember a site mentioning a possible investor. But I was unable to find it so there might be no ongoing projects after all.

[G1ng3rBr34dM4n]

I believe there is similar project that is in execution but it uses bitcoin blockchain. I'm more towards technical stuff so I don't have time and connections to get the producers onboard. It could work for other valuable items too. Rolex was a good example.

+5%

Any chance you have a link to the similar project using btc blockchain?

Use for:
coin grading
certificates of authenticity
GMO labeling could be done this way in that a person would be able to track all ingredients that went into a product to ensure no GMOs?
The marijuana industry has a seed to sale tracking system that could utilize this as well

JWF, great idea!  This is what we're working on with Future Tech Farm (Link to bitsharestalk post here).  One of our goals is to have the ability to track every single plant grown with proof of: No GMO, No Pesticide Utilization, etc...  Publicly verifiable and an objectively better system than "Certified Organic" by at least an order of magnitude.

[JWF]

Use for:
coin grading
certificates of authenticity
GMO labeling could be done this way in that a person would be able to track all ingredients that went into a product to ensure no GMOs?
The marijuana industry has a seed to sale tracking system that could utilize this as well

[emski]

Emski, I really like the idea!  Specific to the industry of wine, we could really get buy in if we were able to get the Master Sommeliers on board.  I'm guessing this is a problem they're trying to solve, might be worthwhile to reach out and validate that hypothesis.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I believe there is similar project that is in execution but it uses bitcoin blockchain. I'm more towards technical stuff so I don't have time and connections to get the producers onboard. It could work for other valuable items too. Rolex was a good example. I'd be really happy if I can visit the shop and buy a cigar signed by the original Cuban manufacturer. And if I have a complaint it will be extremely easy to track the dishonest parties.

@Chuckone that might not be very useful for UPS/FedEX as their tracking database and services are mostly important for them. There is no incentive for anyone to run a node processing  UPS/FedEX's tracking system. Also they need to modify any entry at any time so the decentralised model shouldn't benefit them.