Can somebody explain ways to make money that have something to do with bitusd? Any arbitrage opportunities somewhere?

I know there is good chance to get great deal on bitusd -> BTS on Bitshares exchange. But where to get spot price on BTS -> bitusd? Obviously I can create bitusd by borrowing it to existence. What do I have to take into account when doing it? If the price goes up or down, how I have to change my position? How much collateral I have to have?

If somebody could make a step by step explanation for trader newbies like me, that would be great. I haven't done any trading because I lack knowledge of all the risks and opportunities. I bet there are lots of people like me who could use some of their money on trading if they just had the basic information how to exactly do it.

We don't really have a great basis for measuring demand other than feedback from shareholders in countries where the fees may effect demand.

So far we've had feedback from Poland, China, Argentina and Greece that all say the minimum fee is too high. They're also not saying for them personally but in terms of adoption in their market and some like Elmato are very well placed to make that assessment. (Being someone who promotes BTS  to South American customers and has a product, LimeWallet, which would benefit from the referral programme, so would presumably welcome higher fees if he thought they were sellable.)

So far I've seen no shareholders outside of Western economies (US/Western Europe) who may not even be our key demographic and historically haven't been, saying the fee is acceptable.

Let's remember that people in those countries don't have an access to a global payment network that they can use freely. Transfers are cheap only in the national banks / payment networks. And of course the fee will go always higher when payments are made with other than national currency.

Bitshares has several different currencies, it's fast, it has stealth transfers, anybody can open account without any bureaucracy, etc. We should concentrate on the things that make Bitshares valuable and useful and not care so much about lower fees. Customers will always want cheaper stuff, no matter what, so it's usually pointless to ask them if they do want lower fees – of course they want!

That said, I'm still a little bit skeptical about the fee structure what we have now. It might be too much. But let's try it for a while and see what happens.

Quote from: Samupaha on October 18, 2015, 05:09:11 am

Is the revenue really burned or is it put to the reserve pool?

If I have understood this right, it should go to reserve pool, where it stays until it is used to pay for workers and witnesses. This means that DAC is saving money to make sure that it can pay for workers in the future.

BTS Is not money, BTS is stake. So putting it into the reserve pool as BTS is in my opinion both inefficient and also quite fatuous.

Instead it should be put into the reserve pool as BitUSD or some other basket of assets and commodities. It's effective for Bitshares to have in it's reserve pool Trade.BTC, Trade.Ether, and stakes in it's competition, as long as it can be guaranteed legally that upon a vote these stakes can be put to use.

It would allow the reserve pool to grow off of something other than BTS which isn't a currency, and also diversify it's holdings which is smarter from a business risk perspective. It's not really that smart for a company to exclusively hold stock in itself as a reserve because if they have to sell it then it dilutes it's own company.

BTS is the best option for the reserve asset because it is the only one that will exist always. Market Pegged Assets can have a black swan event and become worthless. User Issued Assets are even worse option because there is a counterparty risk.

It's smarter to diversify and invest in other DACs. Bitshares in theory should be able to hold BTC, Ether, Storj, or whatever else, as long as you set up the mechanisms to do it, and by doing it that way you can turn Bitshares 2.0 into an investment bank and exchange rather than just an exchange which makes a profit and then buys its shares back only to sell them later.

Recycling your own shares creates unnecessary volatility when you can use other networks shares. If Bitshares owned shares in other things, in other assets, then even if the BTS isn't gaining in value, if the Storjcoin or Safecoins are gaining in value then the reserve has more buying power for future investments in Bitshares. It would seem Bitshares is the only DAC capable of stuff like this which would mean first mover advantage.

I vote that we put forth a worker proposal to allow Bitshares to hold any digital asset in it's reserve. The reserve shouldn't just hold BitUSD, it should be able to hold Bitcoin or anything else. A group of people should be elected to manage the fund, and determine which assets to buy, and we could vote these people in, but they can only buy and not spend. Or we can just have a vote on what to buy and let the network automatically buy according to the percentage of votes it gets.

Traditional investing company is much more suitable for this kind of operation. It doesn't make any sense for a DAC to hire people to store cryptocurrencies (my understanding is that a blockchain cannot hold a secret, so it is impossible for it to hold private keys of other cryptos).

And why we even should buy bitcoins and other cryptos? I'm invested in BTS because it is the best one right now. Diversifying to other cryptos would be unnecessary risk without much potential upside, it would make Bitshares less valuable.

I suggest that we start to use two different terms for market cap:

Active Market Cap = (current supply of BTS) * (price of BTS)
Total Market Cap = ((current supply of BTS) + (reserve pool)) * (price of BTS)

When you talk about "market cap of Bitshares" it is probably better to use the active market cap. Although this has a little downside: when the DAC is making revenue, the active market cap is going down if the price is stable because current supply is diminishing. This is why sometimes it might be better to clarify what the total market cap means.

As far as I have understood, there is no actual burning happening right now. No BTS is burned so that is made completely unusable. Instead the revenue from fees is going to the reserve pool, where it's waiting to be used for payments for workers and witnesses.

You can think that Bitcoin has a reserve pool too. It is all the bitcoins that are not mined yet (6.3 million BTC right now). Disadvantage is that BTC can only be withdrawn from the reserve pool and not put back in. In this way Bitshares is way more better because it can make revenue and put it in the reserve pool to wait until it is used for something that the DAC needs.

And of course BTC from reserve pool is going only to miners and not to developers, which leaves the development to be funded only by charity. Bitshares is also superior in this way too, because it's development is secured for years. If the price goes up, it can fund even more development, which will attract more users, which will make more revenue and price will go up more, which can fund more development. It is a system that is made to win. It seems to me that many people haven't yet understood how significant this is.

So stop talking how "BTS is burned" (because it isn't) and start bragging how much money we are collecting for the development.

Also feel free to suggest other terms for active and total market cap if you have something better in mind.

"Revolution has to be profitable"
"Freedom has to be profitable"

Many accounts are not registered on the blockchain,  just like bitcoin addresses.

To make it clear: it's not necessary to register an account. That's why the total number of accounts is bigger than number of registered accounts. Unregistered account looks something like bitcoin address, it's not a name but a bunch of random characters.

Features aren't what increases market cap. You do need a functional Bitshares 2.0 which can scale but once you have that you need people with big money to use Bitshares.

Why would people with big money use Bitshares if it doesn't have the features they need?