Quote from: chryspano on May 29, 2016, 10:16:02 AM

Quote from: Shentist on May 28, 2016, 11:33:53 PM
Just as a reminder. Go to STEMMIT.com click on the left sidebar and click "buy steem" you will be not be redirected to Openledger but to Bittrex. So, the creator of BitShares is not linking and supporting his own plattform. Words can say everything, but you will see what the people really feel if you watch closly.

You are missing the part that STEEM has a broader audience than the bitshares supporters, the average crypto-fan has no idea what an OPEN.BTC or OPEN.STEEM is and how to use openledger, If you think that the best time to educate them is on the instant that a new coin launces then good luck with that. Btw Coinmarketcap lists all exchanges as usual.

BM can't easily and anonymously dump his premined Steem on OpenLedger without it becoming a big deal. Much better for him to get buyers going to Bittrex.

Quote from: Shentist on May 28, 2016, 11:33:53 PM
Just as a reminder. Go to STEMMIT.com click on the left sidebar and click "buy steem" you will be not be redirected to Openledger but to Bittrex. So, the creator of BitShares is not linking and supporting his own plattform. Words can say everything, but you will see what the people really feel if you watch closly.

You are missing the part that STEEM has a broader audience than the bitshares supporters, the average crypto-fan has no idea what an OPEN.BTC or OPEN.STEEM is and how to use openledger, If you think that the best time to educate them is on the instant that a new coin launces then good luck with that. Btw Coinmarketcap lists all exchanges as usual.

It feels like be stabbed in the back   :( :(

Quote from: Shentist on May 28, 2016, 11:33:53 PM
i do not undestand where the demand for STEEM is coming from, when you don't need it to post. It is like right now in BitShares. The fees are low and the products who would increase the market cap (pegged assets) are not widly in use.

STEEM is maybe a good trade, because of the small amount of available shares, but i do not believe in more.
BitShares? At the moment with no "core" team in place with targets the market cap will not move and the userbase will not grow much.

Just as a reminder. Go to STEMMIT.com click on the left sidebar and click "buy steem" you will be not be redirected to Openledger but to Bittrex. So, the creator of BitShares is not linking and supporting his own plattform. Words can say everything, but you will see what the people really feel if you watch closly.

Just as a reminder. Go to STEMMIT.com click on the left sidebar and click "buy steem" you will be not be redirected to Openledger but to Bittrex. So, the creator of BitShares is not linking and supporting his own plattform. Words can say everything, but you will see what the people really feel if you watch closly.



+5% +5% +5% +5% +5% +5% +5%

QuoteJust as a reminder. Go to STEMMIT.com click on the left sidebar and click "buy steem" you will be not be redirected to Openledger but to Bittrex. So, the creator of BitShares is not linking and supporting his own plattform. Words can say everything, but you will see what the people really feel if you watch closly.

+5% +5% +5%

Cry whale dumper

Bitshares mentioned  8) bitshares father, dao son.

http://www.coindesk.com/can-new-social-operating-system-fix-dao/

Quote from: Empirical1.2 on May 28, 2016, 11:25:23 PM

Quote from: lil_jay890 on May 27, 2016, 02:32:12 PM
From the mumble today according to Dan:

Bitshare's network won't die... but it's hard to find justification for the bitshares token to have a higher market cap, even if the network does continue to grow.

Congrats bitshares holders, please tell me how bullish this is!

Your vision of a bussiness impressed me.  Hanks for share

Well it's hard to have a justification till Nov 5th when they, the largest holders of PTS & AGS and therefore merger shares are likely selling.

However the primary business model for BTS continues to be SmartCoins imo but they do require BTS to introduce liquidity subsidies and continue to make the DEX as user friendly as possible. (I'm also in favour of Yield subsidies for the period of time SmartCoin growth outpaces it.)

If demand for Smartcoins (Backed by BTS) grow over time then demand for BTS will grow with it until such time as the SmartCoin market reaches maturity. (Possibly many years in the future.) At that stage you would monetize your customer base through transaction fees in order to generate a return for shareholders like a more a traditional business. (As well as sell them other related products and services on BTS.)



Another business model on BTS is also a pure DEX model with trading fees for a range of user issued assets. While less lucrative imo, with CEX's like Coinbase valued at >$500 million there's also some potential there by growing that market to become the leading DEX & monetizing that customer base.

This is stark contrast to Steemit, which I see as being sub $1 million/uninvestable.

QuoteReddit hypothesized that its platform would be improved if everyone who contributed to reddit.com by posting stories, adding comments or voting were rewarded with a fair share in Reddit, Inc1. Steem aims to support social media and online communities by returning much of its value to the people who provide valuable contributions

It has an almost guaranteed constant loss making business model by paying users to subscribe and paying them again for content while having limited potential for future monetization as demonstrated by Reddit.

QuoteAs of 2015, Reddit had 542 million monthly visitors (234 million unique users), ranking 14th most visited web-site in US and 36th in the world.[6] Across 2015, Reddit saw 82.54 billion pageviews, 73.15 million submissions, 725.85 million comments, and 6.89 billion upvotes from its users.[7]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reddit

Even with those stunning metrics Reddit only generated $8 million in ad revenue in 2014 and less than $1 million from their subscription service I believe.

http://www.recode.net/2014/3/3/11624114/still-in-the-red-reddit-to-donate-one-tenth-of-ad-revenue-to-charity

Even after 10 years REDDIT is still in the RED. (It costs them more to operate Reddit than they gain in revenue.)  Imagine if they had to pay for all the good/popular content on top of that... (Try some numbers, it's scary :) )

So it will take many years of work to get to a fraction of Reddit's size and even then the opportunity is not very lucrative plus their, (Steem) model adds a lot of additional costs.

(Reddit users are also fickle and attempts to monetize further have been met with resistance and loss of userbase. Reddit also donate 10% to charity for positive PR. This indicates not only the difficulty of monetizing something similar to a Reddit type platform but also the fickleness of the users and the importance of positive PR. Given the unpopularity with the way they launched it's unlikely Steem will have the positive public perception needed among crypto-currency users (which may make up a large part of its initial userbase/target market) to gain strong initial traction either. You could hope that adoption of your currency outpaces costs but again it would be unpopular and viewed perhaps rightly as centralized so is unlikely to be adopted to any meaningful degree in it's own right either.)

I.REALLY LIKED YOUR VISION!

i do not undestand where the demand for STEEM is coming from, when you don't need it to post. It is like right now in BitShares. The fees are low and the products who would increase the market cap (pegged assets) are not widly in use.

STEEM is maybe a good trade, because of the small amount of available shares, but i do not believe in more.
BitShares? At the moment with no "core" team in place with targets the market cap will not move and the userbase will not grow much.

Just as a reminder. Go to STEMMIT.com click on the left sidebar and click "buy steem" you will be not be redirected to Openledger but to Bittrex. So, the creator of BitShares is not linking and supporting his own plattform. Words can say everything, but you will see what the people really feel if you watch closly.

Quote from: lil_jay890 on May 27, 2016, 02:32:12 PM
From the mumble today according to Dan:

Bitshare's network won't die... but it's hard to find justification for the bitshares token to have a higher market cap, even if the network does continue to grow.

Congrats bitshares holders, please tell me how bullish this is!

Well it's hard to have a justification till Nov 5th when they, the largest holders of PTS & AGS and therefore merger shares are likely selling.

However the primary business model for BTS continues to be SmartCoins imo but they do require BTS to introduce liquidity subsidies and continue to make the DEX as user friendly as possible. (I'm also in favour of Yield subsidies for the period of time SmartCoin growth outpaces it.)

If demand for Smartcoins (Backed by BTS) grow over time then demand for BTS will grow with it until such time as the SmartCoin market reaches maturity. (Possibly many years in the future.) At that stage you would monetize your customer base through transaction fees in order to generate a return for shareholders like a more a traditional business. (As well as sell them other related products and services on BTS.)



Another business model on BTS is also a pure DEX model with trading fees for a range of user issued assets. While less lucrative imo, with CEX's like Coinbase valued at >$500 million there's also some potential there by growing that market to become the leading DEX & monetizing that customer base.

This is stark contrast to Steemit, which I see as being sub $1 million/uninvestable.

QuoteReddit hypothesized that its platform would be improved if everyone who contributed to reddit.com by posting stories, adding comments or voting were rewarded with a fair share in Reddit, Inc1. Steem aims to support social media and online communities by returning much of its value to the people who provide valuable contributions

It has an almost guaranteed constant loss making business model by paying users to subscribe and paying them again for content while having limited potential for future monetization as demonstrated by Reddit.

QuoteAs of 2015, Reddit had 542 million monthly visitors (234 million unique users), ranking 14th most visited web-site in US and 36th in the world.[6] Across 2015, Reddit saw 82.54 billion pageviews, 73.15 million submissions, 725.85 million comments, and 6.89 billion upvotes from its users.[7]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reddit

Even with those stunning metrics Reddit only generated $8 million in ad revenue in 2014 and less than $1 million from their subscription service I believe.

http://www.recode.net/2014/3/3/11624114/still-in-the-red-reddit-to-donate-one-tenth-of-ad-revenue-to-charity

Even after 10 years REDDIT is still in the RED. (It costs them more to operate Reddit than they gain in revenue.)  Imagine if they had to pay for all the good/popular content on top of that... (Try some numbers, it's scary :) )

So it will take many years of work to get to a fraction of Reddit's size and even then the opportunity is not very lucrative plus their, (Steem) model adds a lot of additional costs.

(Reddit users are also fickle and attempts to monetize further have been met with resistance and loss of userbase. Reddit also donate 10% to charity for positive PR. This indicates not only the difficulty of monetizing something similar to a Reddit type platform but also the fickleness of the users and the importance of positive PR. Given the unpopularity with the way they launched it's unlikely Steem will have the positive public perception needed among crypto-currency users (which may make up a large part of its initial userbase/target market) to gain strong initial traction either. You could hope that adoption of your currency outpaces costs but again it would be unpopular and viewed perhaps rightly as centralized so is unlikely to be adopted to any meaningful degree in it's own right either.)   

Assuming liquidity etc are in place, then as a less volatile store of wealth .. and for payments, for the same reason (less volatile than, say, bitcoin).

Many times in the past I've held to bitcny for months because i was more interested in keeping the btc stash worth as much as when I decided to do the trade than risking bitcoin moving down vs cny.

Quote from: karnal on May 28, 2016, 12:24:57 PM

Quote from: lil_jay890 on May 27, 2016, 02:32:12 PM
From the mumble today according to Dan:

Bitshare's network won't die... but it's hard to find justification for the bitshares token to have a higher market cap, even if the network does continue to grow.

Congrats bitshares holders, please tell me how bullish this is!

If bitassets were actually used, wouldn't the BTS market cap necessarily have to be higher? The collateral has to be more valuable.

Problem is finding a reason to create assets other than pure speculation that bts will rise vs the dollar...

In my opinion, the Best reason to own bitusd and bitcny was the yield it paid in btsx. Now it's hard to justify getting into a position as the costs are high and the liquidity is low.  Just getting into bitshares from fiat is laden with fees.

Quote from: lil_jay890 on May 27, 2016, 02:32:12 PM
From the mumble today according to Dan:

Bitshare's network won't die... but it's hard to find justification for the bitshares token to have a higher market cap, even if the network does continue to grow.

Congrats bitshares holders, please tell me how bullish this is!

If bitassets were actually used, wouldn't the BTS market cap necessarily have to be higher? The collateral has to be more valuable.

Xeroc n stan you boh give me.confidence to stay strong n I shares both of you view....Im a little bit down right now but Im not scared, prety confident insted

Quote from: crypto4ever on May 28, 2016, 06:05:05 AM
How would a major whale "suddenly" realize BitShares was the best technology?

If no one is promoting BitShares, and we're just aimlessly drifting around, that doesn't sound like a great way of becoming noticed.

How come you think no one is promoting BitShares?

Quote
The equivalent of that is a small burger joint with the best burger in your neighborhood hoping that "suddenly" a whale investor will happen to walk in, eat the burger, and then buy out the business and turn it into a franchise for millions.

We make you the best burger the fastest ..

Do you think a whale would just through money into projects that are
most present in the media? How do you think they made their money?
Whales don't buy high and sell low. Whales don't join a pump. Whales do
their due diligence and don't decide from the marketing, but from the
tech and the people. Hope they won't find the trolls in here!

Quote from: Stan on May 28, 2016, 03:12:18 AM
Example:  White Swan #3 - A major whale suddenly picks BitShares as the best technology upon which to base its own planned offerings

How would a major whale "suddenly" realize BitShares was the best technology?

If no one is promoting BitShares, and we're just aimlessly drifting around, that doesn't sound like a great way of becoming noticed.

The equivalent of that is a small burger joint with the best burger in your neighborhood hoping that "suddenly" a whale investor will happen to walk in, eat the burger, and then buy out the business and turn it into a franchise for millions.

Problem is, there's plenty of small burger joints, that rarely get whales in like this..  The ones on Dragons Den and Shark Tank seem to do well, but that's only after being broadcasted to millions on TV

This suddenly scenario doesn't seem realistic or plausible by the business marketing plan "let's just do nothing different, and wait and hope for success"