Author Topic: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits  (Read 3133 times)

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sumantso

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #15 on: January 17, 2015, 10:56:09 am »
One of the problems is that the people who like to shout (in ány community) shout very loudly, up to the point where communities look like they are made up of a group of shouting baboons at time.

Please don't try to dress it up. I have visited Nxtforums back when I was interested, and I saw members, including higher ranking ones supporting and backslapping each other over CoolSchool's antics. I didn't see any of your non-baboons say anything to the contrary.

Before here I was with Worldcoin (was one of the interim committee members) because of the vibrant community. Here I was drawn to BM's vision and philosophy. Maybe you'll think that me souring over NXT for the community was a stupid move for any investor, but I like to be involved in projects which are positive.

Offline Damelon

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #16 on: January 17, 2015, 11:19:42 am »
One of the problems is that the people who like to shout (in ány community) shout very loudly, up to the point where communities look like they are made up of a group of shouting baboons at time.

Please don't try to dress it up. I have visited Nxtforums back when I was interested, and I saw members, including higher ranking ones supporting and backslapping each other over CoolSchool's antics. I didn't see any of your non-baboons say anything to the contrary.

Before here I was with Worldcoin (was one of the interim committee members) because of the vibrant community. Here I was drawn to BM's vision and philosophy. Maybe you'll think that me souring over NXT for the community was a stupid move for any investor, but I like to be involved in projects which are positive.

Indeed, we dó have a good laugh when 2kool posts. Mostly because of the outrageous way he puts criticism over the top. I myself rather enjoy that, especially because it's so utterly way over the top that it's hard to take with anything else than a pinch of salt. We also remove posts that go way over the top to our trash part of the forums. However, usually we don't, not even if they are critical of Nxt.

We have a few trolls on both BCT and Twitter who do exactly the same about Nxt. Most of óur people also go up in flames when that happens. I've never really understood that reaction. What do they think is going to happen? That they are going to convince someone who took the time to craft such outrageous posts? Seems rather unlikely.

I see both the good and the bad in our community. My own experience obviously is more positive than negative, otherwise I wouldn't be around anymore. For you, the balance tips the other way. And that's fine.

As to posting criticisms to our respective projects by going to each other's forums: I see that as an exercise in futility. That's like going onto a building site where people are hard at work, pointing to the artists rendition of the project and shouting "Your building sucks!". At that point it would be better to run, and with good reason.

Offline vegolino

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #17 on: January 17, 2015, 01:06:05 pm »
It makes you look desperate and threatened.

Dan's blog posts were intended to communicate structural problems he saw in nubits. Everyone else took it as a green light to start more or less slandering their project.

It is clear they don't have malicious intent. You might disagree about whether their stuff can work or not, heck you might even feel a moral obligation to protect investors, but the right answer is to calmly point out structural problems.

Here is a positive example:  http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/2smt81/proof_that_nubits_fractional_reserve_get_out_now/cnr0gke

Here is a negative example:  http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/2smt81/proof_that_nubits_fractional_reserve_get_out_now/cnr1z0g
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Offline cass

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #18 on: January 17, 2015, 05:39:15 pm »
To get a 1st-hand perspective of what our recent NuBits-bashing is like, go over to the Nxt forum and try to start a discussion on BitShares. The mindless tribalistic hatred you will experience is something we should be very careful not to dish out to our competitors.

Well-thought-out criticism is great, but whatever we do, we should never act like the Nxt folks.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2

Sorry, but that's álso a generalisation :)
Some obviously do, and that's their problem.

Others (which is most probably the silent majority) are interested in both Nxt, Bitshares and a few others systems, too.

One of the problems is that the people who like to shout (in ány community) shout very loudly, up to the point where communities look like they are made up of a group of shouting baboons at time.

That happens on Bitcointalk, Nxt forum and no doubt you at times have the same.

I am admin on the Nxt forum, and no, I do not hate Bitshares. Neither do any of my colleagues. I may have my doubts about some things, but am open to being persuaded, like any sane person would be. I lurk here and also read along. It's only normal to do so.

"the Nxt folks" do not exist. Any community is diverse and will include nice and less nice people.

Welcome Damelon on board!
Nice you're around! :)


█║▌║║█  - - -  The quieter you become, the more you are able to hear  - - -  █║▌║║█

Offline MrJeans

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #19 on: January 17, 2015, 07:14:29 pm »
It really pushed my buttons when I saw the Bitshares logo when they said "so how are Nubits better than other digital currencies". >:( I would like to see them do a comparison between Nubits and bitUSD.

Offline fuzzy

Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #20 on: January 17, 2015, 10:41:37 pm »
It makes you look desperate and threatened.

Dan's blog posts were intended to communicate structural problems he saw in nubits. Everyone else took it as a green light to start more or less slandering their project.

It is clear they don't have malicious intent. You might disagree about whether their stuff can work or not, heck you might even feel a moral obligation to protect investors, but the right answer is to calmly point out structural problems.

Here is a positive example:  http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/2smt81/proof_that_nubits_fractional_reserve_get_out_now/cnr0gke

Here is a negative example:  http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/2smt81/proof_that_nubits_fractional_reserve_get_out_now/cnr1z0g
+5%  for cooperation and fear rejection

What makes us look weak is apologizing for saying what is right and bowing into social pressures to be politically correct.  I think we really need to recognize that conflict to a degree is a natural thing to have when competing in any way. The only thing we should ever apologize for isnlying to others about a competitor and spreading real FUD (not FUD based on truth). 

When I call out technologies that are potentially harmful to other people it is not because they are competition but because if they are widely adopted they stand to hurt many people and enrich a select few whoknow the truth and choose not to say it to benefit themselves or out of sheer ignorance. 

There are other solid competitors out there. NXT has respectable tech, for instance, but NHZ is a fork of NXT that has a far better distribution overall.  I like both of them and actually think the level of centralization of NXT makes it grow faster...but carries with it other risks. 

NXT and NHZ are solid investments that are unlikely in the long term to hurt investors (user issued assets are different here).  Accordingly I am invested in those techs.  However we really need to remember that remaining silent about investments we wouldnt touch with a ten foot pole only hurts everyone in the long run.

I honestly dont even agree that it is a bad thing to call someone out because they are pushing people to invest in dangerous tech...

We need to be careful in this place.  There is a reason why beyond bitcoin hangouts are open town hall style events...because they are meant to ensure even critical opinions on the bitshares project are voiced. What if I told people not to complain about justified concerns during these hangouts to avoid the perception of us warring amongst ourselves?  How many issues would have never been resolved and how much further behind would we be? Even more....how much less would you trust bytemaster?
« Last Edit: January 17, 2015, 10:45:19 pm by fuzzy »
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Offline hpenvy2

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #21 on: January 18, 2015, 12:59:40 am »
I'm not looking to be the Robinhood of crypto, I'm looking for consistent action that increases value to investors. BM's revised blog about NuBits was fine, bigger fish to fry than draw more attention to competitors.

I've always dismissed NuBits until this community started constantly talking about them. I've now dug through their forum and found a few FUTURE proposals interesting. Not enough to diversify, but still makes me wonder how much traffic we are are pushing that way.

Everyone is free to do as they please, I just see it as a low value activity.  If we saw the same passion in the Open Challenge to BM thread as we do talking about competitors, we would be in a very different place.

« Last Edit: January 18, 2015, 01:03:15 am by hpenvy2 »

TurkeyLeg

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #22 on: January 18, 2015, 12:11:41 pm »
Community Members are going to say a lot of different things in a lot of different places...that's the nature of each of us being a community member...

If anything, this just reinforces the need for someone (or someones) with professional PR experience to run a delegate and be responsible for delivering the official (read: polished, pc) Bitshares message.

If we want mass adoption and wild success, our community needs to do many, many more of the things a real company would do.

Offline liondani

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #23 on: January 18, 2015, 01:01:39 pm »
To get a 1st-hand perspective of what our recent NuBits-bashing is like, go over to the Nxt forum and try to start a discussion on BitShares. The mindless tribalistic hatred you will experience is something we should be very careful not to dish out to our competitors.

Well-thought-out criticism is great, but whatever we do, we should never act like the Nxt folks.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2

Sorry, but that's álso a generalisation :)
Some obviously do, and that's their problem.

Others (which is most probably the silent majority) are interested in both Nxt, Bitshares and a few others systems, too.

One of the problems is that the people who like to shout (in ány community) shout very loudly, up to the point where communities look like they are made up of a group of shouting baboons at time.

That happens on Bitcointalk, Nxt forum and no doubt you at times have the same.

I am admin on the Nxt forum, and no, I do not hate Bitshares. Neither do any of my colleagues. I may have my doubts about some things, but am open to being persuaded, like any sane person would be. I lurk here and also read along. It's only normal to do so.

"the Nxt folks" do not exist. Any community is diverse and will include nice and less nice people.

Welcome Damelon on board!
Nice you're around! :)

 +5% +5% +5%

Welcome Damelon  ;)

PS because of nice guys like him we never should shut our mouths when we recognize big risks on other projects...

Offline btswildpig

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #24 on: January 18, 2015, 01:42:37 pm »
Community Members are going to say a lot of different things in a lot of different places...that's the nature of each of us being a community member...

If anything, this just reinforces the need for someone (or someones) with professional PR experience to run a delegate and be responsible for delivering the official (read: polished, pc) Bitshares message.

If we want mass adoption and wild success, our community needs to do many, many more of the things a real company would do.

The thing about PR is that , assuming I'm the PR manager , I released a statement  which can be viewed as PC .  Then someone in the core dev team post a different story  .  Then both of the story will be "official" in the eyes of the world , no matter how many time we stress that "this is personal opinion" .
这个是私人账号,表达的一切言论均不代表任何团队和任何人。This is my personal account , anything I said with this account will be my opinion alone and has nothing to do with any group.

TurkeyLeg

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #25 on: January 18, 2015, 02:06:13 pm »

Community Members are going to say a lot of different things in a lot of different places...that's the nature of each of us being a community member...

If anything, this just reinforces the need for someone (or someones) with professional PR experience to run a delegate and be responsible for delivering the official (read: polished, pc) Bitshares message.

If we want mass adoption and wild success, our community needs to do many, many more of the things a real company would do.

The thing about PR is that , assuming I'm the PR manager , I released a statement  which can be viewed as PC .  Then someone in the core dev team post a different story  .  Then both of the story will be "official" in the eyes of the world , no matter how many time we stress that "this is personal opinion" .

Part of being the PR delegate would be communicating with Bytemaster and the core devs very closely on a regular basis so that the message from any one of them is uniform - even in off the cuff posts.

Offline btswildpig

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #26 on: January 18, 2015, 02:07:54 pm »

Community Members are going to say a lot of different things in a lot of different places...that's the nature of each of us being a community member...

If anything, this just reinforces the need for someone (or someones) with professional PR experience to run a delegate and be responsible for delivering the official (read: polished, pc) Bitshares message.

If we want mass adoption and wild success, our community needs to do many, many more of the things a real company would do.

The thing about PR is that , assuming I'm the PR manager , I released a statement  which can be viewed as PC .  Then someone in the core dev team post a different story  .  Then both of the story will be "official" in the eyes of the world , no matter how many time we stress that "this is personal opinion" .

Part of being the PR delegate would be communicating with Bytemaster and the core devs very closely on a regular basis so that the message from any one of them is uniform - even in off the cuff posts.

tried , couldn't work , unless I don't sleep for 24 hours and don't spend time on toilet  .  :P
这个是私人账号,表达的一切言论均不代表任何团队和任何人。This is my personal account , anything I said with this account will be my opinion alone and has nothing to do with any group.

Offline Damelon

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Re: Guys can we stop shitting on nubits
« Reply #27 on: January 18, 2015, 05:48:43 pm »
PS because of nice guys like him we never should shut our mouths when we recognize big risks on other projects...

Never!

I've been known to go head to head with our devs and members myself if I consider something a bad idea.
Pointing out flaws and asking questions is important.
Of course it's not nice to hear someone pointing out something you hadn't considered. Needs to be done, sometimes, though.