Author Topic: Dan is doing the right thing .. again!  (Read 24234 times)

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Offline Empirical1.2

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You don't get it. You are worried about the crypto-community. We are building this for 99.999% of the population who don't know and may never know what crypto is. But they will still be able to enjoy the benefits of what crypto brings.

Exactly what I have been telling people.

yes.  +5% +5% +5% +5% +5%

... the gamers do not even have to understand cryptocurrencies, they are biz as usual but now using them and not even knowing.

People do not care about how a cell phone works, they just wanna snapchat dick pics. 

Likewise, explaining crypto to them is pointless, turn crypto into things they are familiar with and they will use it.

If  99.999% of the population won't understand or value decentralisation, doesn't that mean you're better off making a private centralised Cryptonomex blockchain which will be cheaper to run and which you and the developers have a much larger stake in?
If you want to take the island burn the boats

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We are building this for 99.999% of the population who don't know and may never know what crypto is.

 +5%

The crypto-community/anarchist/voluntarist are the easy sell, that's why we no longer bother with them and began targeting those that have no clue what cryptocurrency/blockchain technology is. It took it's toll on our blog traffic since we made the switch, but in the end we believe it will be worth the effort.

Offline Murderistic

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You don't get it. You are worried about the crypto-community. We are building this for 99.999% of the population who don't know and may never know what crypto is. But they will still be able to enjoy the benefits of what crypto brings.
Ok Bitcoin.

The 99% is going to trade their current comfortable Evil Wall St. banks for a single Cryptonomex? How you gonna sell that?

The point is for Cryptonomex to power a bunch of third party services, which bring the consumers.  Such as the gaming partnership - the gamers do not even have to understand cryptocurrencies, they are biz as usual but now using them and not even knowing.

People do not care about how a cell phone works, they just wanna snapchat dick pics. 

Likewise, explaining crypto to them is pointless, turn crypto into things they are familiar with and they will use it.

Offline NewMine

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You don't get it. You are worried about the crypto-community. We are building this for 99.999% of the population who don't know and may never know what crypto is. But they will still be able to enjoy the benefits of what crypto brings.

Exactly what I have been telling people.

yes.  +5% +5% +5% +5% +5%

Do you have link to the cryptocurrency infomercial you and Kevin Harrignton were going to work on?

Offline NewMine

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You don't get it. You are worried about the crypto-community. We are building this for 99.999% of the population who don't know and may never know what crypto is. But they will still be able to enjoy the benefits of what crypto brings.
Ok Bitcoin.

The 99% is going to trade their current comfortable Evil Wall St. banks for a single Cryptonomex? How you gonna sell that?

Offline Murderistic

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You don't get it. You are worried about the crypto-community. We are building this for 99.999% of the population who don't know and may never know what crypto is. But they will still be able to enjoy the benefits of what crypto brings.

Exactly what I have been telling people.

yes.  +5% +5% +5% +5% +5%

Offline Ben Mason

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You don't get it. You are worried about the crypto-community. We are building this for 99.999% of the population who don't know and may never know what crypto is. But they will still be able to enjoy the benefits of what crypto brings.

 this +5%

Offline Pheonike

You don't get it. You are worried about the crypto-community. We are building this for 99.999% of the population who don't know and may never know what crypto is. But they will still be able to enjoy the benefits of what crypto brings.

Offline NewMine

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Newmine, how much would BTS benefit if a competitor stole the "free" code?   

Your attitude of "no one may profit" is pure jealousy and insanity.   You would rather we "burn the whole place down" than let anyone walk away with some theoretical profit.

Bitcoin is doing fine. That seems to have worked quite well and thousands of people tried to copy it and still are.

"Burn the place down", come on. You sound like a CNN/Fox news broadcaster. Scare them into your beliefs. Instead you should point out a project that failed and had some one else profit off an exact replica of a software free and open source licensed.

And yes I am jealous. You guys are creating a new pie based on the ingredients we paid for and not sharing. If you would have said you would airdrop something (can't say stock in Cryptonomex yet)or burn X millions of shares for rights in the future, I might be okay. But you are double dipping and compromising the future of the entire project by making the software proprietary in some way. The path to mass adoption just got bumpier because you are in control of something where control was to be limited and distributed amongst the masses. And a majority of first users are anti control. Decentralized was the key to everything in the beginning and you are going so far away from it now.

The future of Bitshares will rest in your hands and no one, no one can say that in 5 years whether that is truly good or truly bad. I am mainly prodding because a lot of you seem to blindly follow the whimsical cavalier decisions made by I3 errrr Cryptonomex. Plus, I want a piece of that pie.  ;)
You have a few points but it would be helpful if you would get a bit more specific: What would you suggest BM should do now? Make graphene open source? Then there might be no incentive for the devs to continue to work on graphene (because they have no valuable shares in Cryptonomex or because an investor in cryptonomex is not there to pay their loans). It is not BM's decision to decide what the indidivual core devs should do. He can just make them offers.
Also when you complain about the past: At what specific time should BM have done what specific thing differently?
Overall you critique refuses to accept that it was not possible to build Bitshares to be usable with the money from AGS. Each of your sentences rejects this reality.

Graphene is a new, I guess better, incarnation of the Bitshares Toolkit idea that was ditched during the merger. So what did they have planned back then? The incentive is to make their BTS shares worth a lot more and keep their 100% delegates. I imagine by now there is no need for 10 or however many Devs to be putting in 40+ hours a week. No need for office rent. It needs to be a hobby until it gets to a point where a Dev can live off delegate pay. Then by all means, work 80hours a week for all I care and quit your job. What are the Devs going to do if the entire crypto community disowns or ignores the rather more centralized structure being put into place by Cryptonomex? A lot worse off, I imagine than if they all had a real job and were tinkering around on their spare netflix time.

Offline NewMine

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Newmine, how much would BTS benefit if a competitor stole the "free" code?   

Your attitude of "no one may profit" is pure jealousy and insanity.   You would rather we "burn the whole place down" than let anyone walk away with some theoretical profit.

Bitcoin is doing fine. That seems to have worked quite well and thousands of people tried to copy it and still are.

"Burn the place down", come on. You sound like a CNN/Fox news broadcaster. Scare them into your beliefs. Instead you should point out a project that failed and had some one else profit off an exact replica of a software free and open source licensed.

And yes I am jealous. You guys are creating a new pie based on the ingredients we paid for and not sharing. If you would have said you would airdrop something (can't say stock in Cryptonomex yet)or burn X millions of shares for rights in the future, I might be okay. But you are double dipping and compromising the future of the entire project by making the software proprietary in some way. The path to mass adoption just got bumpier because you are in control of something where control was to be limited and distributed amongst the masses. And a majority of first users are anti control. Decentralized was the key to everything in the beginning and you are going so far away from it now.

The future of Bitshares will rest in your hands and no one, no one can say that in 5 years whether that is truly good or truly bad. I am mainly prodding because a lot of you seem to blindly follow the whimsical cavalier decisions made by I3 errrr Cryptonomex. Plus, I want a piece of that pie.  ;)

I suggest you focus on earning brownie points, it will be healthier for everyone involved.

Nicely skirted.

Offline santaclause102

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Newmine, how much would BTS benefit if a competitor stole the "free" code?   

Your attitude of "no one may profit" is pure jealousy and insanity.   You would rather we "burn the whole place down" than let anyone walk away with some theoretical profit.

Bitcoin is doing fine. That seems to have worked quite well and thousands of people tried to copy it and still are.

"Burn the place down", come on. You sound like a CNN/Fox news broadcaster. Scare them into your beliefs. Instead you should point out a project that failed and had some one else profit off an exact replica of a software free and open source licensed.

And yes I am jealous. You guys are creating a new pie based on the ingredients we paid for and not sharing. If you would have said you would airdrop something (can't say stock in Cryptonomex yet)or burn X millions of shares for rights in the future, I might be okay. But you are double dipping and compromising the future of the entire project by making the software proprietary in some way. The path to mass adoption just got bumpier because you are in control of something where control was to be limited and distributed amongst the masses. And a majority of first users are anti control. Decentralized was the key to everything in the beginning and you are going so far away from it now.

The future of Bitshares will rest in your hands and no one, no one can say that in 5 years whether that is truly good or truly bad. I am mainly prodding because a lot of you seem to blindly follow the whimsical cavalier decisions made by I3 errrr Cryptonomex. Plus, I want a piece of that pie.  ;)
You have a few points but it would be helpful if you would get a bit more specific: What would you suggest BM should do now? Make graphene open source? Then there might be no incentive for the devs to continue to work on graphene (because they have no valuable shares in Cryptonomex or because an investor in cryptonomex is not there to pay their loans). It is not BM's decision to decide what the indidivual core devs should do. He can just make them offers.
Also when you complain about the past: At what specific time should BM have done what specific thing differently?
Overall you critique refuses to accept that it was not possible to build Bitshares to be usable with the money from AGS. Each of your sentences rejects this reality.

Offline bytemaster

Newmine, how much would BTS benefit if a competitor stole the "free" code?   

Your attitude of "no one may profit" is pure jealousy and insanity.   You would rather we "burn the whole place down" than let anyone walk away with some theoretical profit.

Bitcoin is doing fine. That seems to have worked quite well and thousands of people tried to copy it and still are.

"Burn the place down", come on. You sound like a CNN/Fox news broadcaster. Scare them into your beliefs. Instead you should point out a project that failed and had some one else profit off an exact replica of a software free and open source licensed.

And yes I am jealous. You guys are creating a new pie based on the ingredients we paid for and not sharing. If you would have said you would airdrop something (can't say stock in Cryptonomex yet)or burn X millions of shares for rights in the future, I might be okay. But you are double dipping and compromising the future of the entire project by making the software proprietary in some way. The path to mass adoption just got bumpier because you are in control of something where control was to be limited and distributed amongst the masses. And a majority of first users are anti control. Decentralized was the key to everything in the beginning and you are going so far away from it now.

The future of Bitshares will rest in your hands and no one, no one can say that in 5 years whether that is truly good or truly bad. I am mainly prodding because a lot of you seem to blindly follow the whimsical cavalier decisions made by I3 errrr Cryptonomex. Plus, I want a piece of that pie.  ;)

I suggest you focus on earning brownie points, it will be healthier for everyone involved.
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline NewMine

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Newmine, how much would BTS benefit if a competitor stole the "free" code?   

Your attitude of "no one may profit" is pure jealousy and insanity.   You would rather we "burn the whole place down" than let anyone walk away with some theoretical profit.

Bitcoin is doing fine. That seems to have worked quite well and thousands of people tried to copy it and still are.

"Burn the place down", come on. You sound like a CNN/Fox news broadcaster. Scare them into your beliefs. Instead you should point out a project that failed and had some one else profit off an exact replica of a software free and open source licensed.

And yes I am jealous. You guys are creating a new pie based on the ingredients we paid for and not sharing. If you would have said you would airdrop something (can't say stock in Cryptonomex yet)or burn X millions of shares for rights in the future, I might be okay. But you are double dipping and compromising the future of the entire project by making the software proprietary in some way. The path to mass adoption just got bumpier because you are in control of something where control was to be limited and distributed amongst the masses. And a majority of first users are anti control. Decentralized was the key to everything in the beginning and you are going so far away from it now.

The future of Bitshares will rest in your hands and no one, no one can say that in 5 years whether that is truly good or truly bad. I am mainly prodding because a lot of you seem to blindly follow the whimsical cavalier decisions made by I3 errrr Cryptonomex. Plus, I want a piece of that pie.  ;)

Offline Ben Mason

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Unfortunately Bm has said he must pay child support which means if he doesn't get paid he could go to jail. 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


BM is not as smart as I thought if he took this on knowing the probability of success was rather small while having life obligations and responsibilities as you claim.

Of all the things you could have responded to, you choose this?  Newmine, you are a great conversation starter but you have created the impression with me that you are unable to see beyond the points you make.  You never seem to open your mind to a broader context.  And finally, you seem to resort to discourtesy too readily.  If you can't let this go, you will miss the enjoyment of the successes to come (should they arrive.)  Don't live with bitterness, life is too short.

Pretty sure I responded to all BM's points and questions.

To be fair, yes you did....I just mean't there were several other points you could have responded to and i was hoping that one of them may have engendered something positive.  Never mind though.

Which point? You have had two posts to call me on it exactly, but you haven't.  Why?  Oh, never mind though.

Ok.  As long as 2.0 is delivered and works as stated, i'm more than happy with how they accomplished that feat....there was not enough funding and i'm glad they rebuilt the toolkit rather than trying to adjust the original. I don't feel threatened by cryptonomex (i did at first) because I want the devs to be rewarded for the new code and to continue to build partnerships, bringing them to Bitshares.  I believe that will be very good for Bitshares. I don't believe they have ever or will ever let down Bitshares or the members of this community.  I can accept that some of this is subjective and based on trust but no more so than your beliefs.  Perhaps we'll never agree because we have different perspectives and sense of context, so be it.  You have done everything you can to alert the community to potential harm and wrongdoing, but at some point you have to accept many of us (those that post anyway) don't see it in the same way.  Please, let's look to the future, continue building and if one day you are proven correct, i'll be the first to apologise to you.  I won't offer more than that because we have all taken risks to build this better world.  Of far greater importance to me than the money (despite our work to align positively reinforcing incentives within the network).....is the analysis of ourselves and our societies, the reaching out and connecting of like-minded people, the explosion in innovation of new technology and the passion being inspired.  If anyone on this forum or in the development team becomes wealthy by one way or another, i believe they will use that wealth to enrich as many around them as possible.  If not, then they haven't learn't very much form being here.  So considering the grey areas and the subjective nature of most of the arguments around graphene, really, what does it matter?

Offline bytemaster

Newmine, how much would BTS benefit if a competitor stole the "free" code?   

Your attitude of "no one may profit" is pure jealousy and insanity.   You would rather we "burn the whole place down" than let anyone walk away with some theoretical profit.   
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.