EASY FIX to improve user experience on DEX

[tbone]

We need the orderbook to show offers to trade your OPEN.ETH for OPEN.BTC via BTS as a bridge currency. Then liquidity for ETH:BTC would be at least as deep as the ETH:BTS & BTC:BTS markets.

I don't see how this will help.

OPEN.BTC:OPEN.ETH is at least as active as BTS:OPEN.ETH now. There are only 10 people holding OPEN.ETH, the markets are invisible to random user. Why is there so little activity with ETH? 1m+ (in ETH) volume on Polo vs ~120 on DEX. It's not that people are not trading, they just don't know they can trade ETH on DEX.

The problem as it relates to the GUI is two-fold.  First, as you say, people using the DEX are not seeing that market.  Second, many people just don't use the DEX to begin with because they feel lost.  Organizing the markets in an intelligent way will go a long way toward alleviating these issues.  And if we combine that with a) at least some basic liquidity measures and b) adding newly launched currencies that aren't trading on Poloniex, I think we'll really start getting some traction.  What are we waiting for?

[tbone]

We need the orderbook to show offers to trade your OPEN.ETH for OPEN.BTC via BTS as a bridge currency. Then liquidity for ETH:BTC would be at least as deep as the ETH:BTS & BTC:BTS markets.

This is a liquidity measure.  That's very important but this is the wrong thread for such discussion. 

[krondix]

We need the orderbook to show offers to trade your OPEN.ETH for OPEN.BTC via BTS as a bridge currency. Then liquidity for ETH:BTC would be at least as deep as the ETH:BTS & BTC:BTS markets.

I don't see how this will help.

OPEN.BTC:OPEN.ETH is at least as active as BTS:OPEN.ETH now. There are only 10 people holding OPEN.ETH, the markets are invisible to random user. Why is there so little activity with ETH? 1m+ (in ETH) volume on Polo vs ~120 on DEX. It's not that people are not trading, they just don't know they can trade ETH on DEX.

[tbone]

I feel, we can make an even simpler change to improve user experience and, hopefully, liquidity.

We have fairly active BTS:USD and BTS:CNY markets. But USD:CNY is completely dead, no one ever goes there. Why? Because it's close to impossible for a random user to stumble upon this market unless she or he explicitly wants to do so.

Also, there's nothing one can do with USD but sell it for BTS. You can't buy OBITS or OPEN.MUSE or BTC or anything else.

What if instead of single link "Market" leading to BTS:XXX market, we put several links like "Markets: BTS, BTC, USD, CNY"? Very simple change, but it may lead to creating and sustaining several active USD:XXX markets, what should immediately make USD much more attractive for everyone.

YES!  I was thinking about this and it finally occurred to me that the markets need to be grouped by the dominant assets.  Poloniex does something like this with their grouping of markets by BTC, XMR and USDT (see link below).  We should do something similar right away.  We can group by BTS, BTC, and USD markets (or whichever fiat is preferred by the user).  Then each group of markets can be sorted by the volume of the main asset, so the most relevant markets will be at the top of each group (again, see Poloniex screenshot).  This way of organizing the markets will be a HUGE improvement and should be done ASAP. 

[oldmine]

We need the orderbook to show offers to trade your OPEN.ETH for OPEN.BTC via BTS as a bridge currency. Then liquidity for ETH:BTC would be at least as deep as the ETH:BTS & BTC:BTS markets.

[krondix]

Regarding market volume, right now it's listed by asset volume which is not very useful at all when it comes to sorting in the markets tab on the trading page.  It should really be sorted by BTS, BTC, USD, or CNY volume, specified by the user.

Yes! Even better would be to have separate tabs for different currencies (like on Polo BTC, XMR, USDT). That way, people holding OPEN.BTC, for example, will be able to see relatively active OPEN.BTC:OPEN.ETH market. And people holding OPENMUSE will see big volume at OPENMUSE:OPEN.MUSE and exchange their assets.

And overall visibility of many non BTS markets will improve greatly.

[tbone]

It's a good idea, but I think having specialized exchange page is better, i.e. exchange.openledger.org, with pre-selected asset pairs (in this example, Openasset market and smartcoin market). If newbie want to buy bitshares, can we tell to him how to use wallet exchange in 1 min? No... we have to start with "what is IOU" first and how to find gateway and openassets and on and on... It's much easier to say, "go poloniex.com"

We have to be simple to sell our products.

I think both are important.  Don't forget, although some specialized front ends are in the works, most will not appear immediately.   And when they do appear, some will use the current wallet as is, but just re-skin it and host it on their domain. 

OpenLedger is the best example.  They have the most users and they use the default wallet.  Maybe that will change.  But in the meantime we need a quick solution for a better, more intuitive UI so we can gain and keep ACTIVE users, otherwise much of the efforts are wasted. 

I think we should do this immediately.  It wouldn't take a whole lot.  @svk: do you have thoughts on this?

I totally agree. I think when the new APIs added, we will have "Featured market" by volume, by the way.

I always appreciate for your great inputs.

Can you explain a little more what you mean by "featured market by volume"?  Also, how is that feature related to the API?

Regarding market volume, right now it's listed by asset volume which is not very useful at all when it comes to sorting in the markets tab on the trading page.  It should really be sorted by BTS, BTC, USD, or CNY volume, specified by the user.   

By the way, I'm glad to help where I can.  Actually, I've been meaning to offer additional GUI input since the last major round of changes, but didn't have the chance to go through and type it up at the time .  Then it kind of fell off my radar.  Will try to pick that back up, although organizing the markets properly would probably have a huge impact by itself.

[krondix]

Yes, but there are maybe 10 people total who had ever opened USD:OBITS market. I've tried to hold some buy/sell orders at good price on several non BTS markets and no one filled them.

Just compare activity in BTS:USD, BTS:BTC and USD:BTC markets. No one knows about USD:BTC because it's hidden in GUI, you have to manually type it in the All Markets.

[openledger]

I feel, we can make an even simpler change to improve user experience and, hopefully, liquidity.

We have fairly active BTS:USD and BTS:CNY markets. But USD:CNY is completely dead, no one ever goes there. Why? Because it's close to impossible for a random user to stumble upon this market unless she or he explicitly wants to do so.

Also, there's nothing one can do with USD but sell it for BTS. You can't buy OBITS or OPEN.MUSE or BTC or anything else.

What if instead of single link "Market" leading to BTS:XXX market, we put several links like "Markets: BTS, BTC, USD, CNY"? Very simple change, but it may lead to creating and sustaining several active USD:XXX markets, what should immediately make USD much more attractive for everyone.

Who is to say yopu cant buy OBITS, OPEN.MUSE or BTC with USD. Its alla question of setinig of some buy orders on each market and tell aboyut it, and its live

[krondix]

I feel, we can make an even simpler change to improve user experience and, hopefully, liquidity.

We have fairly active BTS:USD and BTS:CNY markets. But USD:CNY is completely dead, no one ever goes there. Why? Because it's close to impossible for a random user to stumble upon this market unless she or he explicitly wants to do so.

Also, there's nothing one can do with USD but sell it for BTS. You can't buy OBITS or OPEN.MUSE or BTC or anything else.

What if instead of single link "Market" leading to BTS:XXX market, we put several links like "Markets: BTS, BTC, USD, CNY"? Very simple change, but it may lead to creating and sustaining several active USD:XXX markets, what should immediately make USD much more attractive for everyone.

[clayop]

It's a good idea, but I think having specialized exchange page is better, i.e. exchange.openledger.org, with pre-selected asset pairs (in this example, Openasset market and smartcoin market). If newbie want to buy bitshares, can we tell to him how to use wallet exchange in 1 min? No... we have to start with "what is IOU" first and how to find gateway and openassets and on and on... It's much easier to say, "go poloniex.com"

We have to be simple to sell our products.

I think both are important.  Don't forget, although some specialized front ends are in the works, most will not appear immediately.   And when they do appear, some will use the current wallet as is, but just re-skin it and host it on their domain. 

OpenLedger is the best example.  They have the most users and they use the default wallet.  Maybe that will change.  But in the meantime we need a quick solution for a better, more intuitive UI so we can gain and keep ACTIVE users, otherwise much of the efforts are wasted. 

I think we should do this immediately.  It wouldn't take a whole lot.  @svk: do you have thoughts on this?

I totally agree. I think when the new APIs added, we will have "Featured market" by volume, by the way.

I always appreciate for your great inputs.

[tbone]

It's a good idea, but I think having specialized exchange page is better, i.e. exchange.openledger.org, with pre-selected asset pairs (in this example, Openasset market and smartcoin market). If newbie want to buy bitshares, can we tell to him how to use wallet exchange in 1 min? No... we have to start with "what is IOU" first and how to find gateway and openassets and on and on... It's much easier to say, "go poloniex.com"

We have to be simple to sell our products.

I think both are important.  Don't forget, although some specialized front ends are in the works, most will not appear immediately.   And when they do appear, some will use the current wallet as is, but just re-skin it and host it on their domain. 

OpenLedger is the best example.  They have the most users and they use the default wallet.  Maybe that will change.  But in the meantime we need a quick solution for a better, more intuitive UI so we can gain and keep ACTIVE users, otherwise much of the efforts are wasted. 

I think we should do this immediately.  It wouldn't take a whole lot.  @svk: do you have thoughts on this?

[clayop]

It's a good idea, but I think having specialized exchange page is better, i.e. exchange.openledger.org, with pre-selected asset pairs (in this example, Openasset market and smartcoin market). If newbie want to buy bitshares, can we tell to him how to use wallet exchange in 1 min? No... we have to start with "what is IOU" first and how to find gateway and openassets and on and on... It's much easier to say, "go poloniex.com"

We have to be simple to sell our products.

[tbone]

The DEX has a serious flaw that is killing user adoption.  It is simply way too confusing with all of the different versions of the same assets (primarily BTC, USD, CNY), and all of the associated different versions of the same markets.  It's a major mess and I can't prove it but I would bet my life that adoption and usage are suffering dramatically. 

But there's a relatively easy fix.  What if we had the concept of "primary" and "secondary" markets...and each registrar could specify for their own users which markets fall into which category.  So right now on the trading page we have 2 markets tabs: 1) My Markets and 2) All Markets.  What I'm proposing instead is that we could have a "Markets" header with 3 tabs labeled: 1) Favorites, 2) Primary, 3) Secondary.  The "Primary" markets would be a short list of markets designated as primary by the registrar.  "Secondary" markets would be everything else.  And "Favorites" would obviously be those starred by the user.  This way the list of markets can be "cleaned up" so it's not confusing for users. 

This solution would be very easy to implement yet would help improve adoption, and hopefully inch us a tiny bit further into the adoption/liquidity virtuous cycle we're painstakingly striving toward.  Thoughts?