Author Topic: Bitshares Tranz  (Read 3516 times)

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Offline Gentso1

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you could just do bitusd and get lower tx fees that way however going back to fiat would negate this thus they would need to stay in bitusd to do business with you and earn interest.

Issuing your own asset could be more profitable if you used the strategy I outlined earlier.. and I do believe there is interest on arbritrary assets thru dividends? so they get shares of your company profit thru dividends.

A good happy medium would be to do transactions thru bitusd and have an incentive structure to use bitusd by offering tranz shares as gift or whatnot... later on when the system is being used people will naturally want to stay in bitusd for the sole reason of using them to buy shares in a cpany with rising profits... if profits dwindle fall back to bitusd and still earn more interest than any bank.

If their was a debit card created that had no fees, that gave access to bitUSD directly their would be no tx fees.

It seems a debit card has to have fees derived from opening and closing an account/card.  This might also require customer service fees.


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I posted in another thread asking about how a, possible prepaid debit card would work fee wise as that seems to be the major difference between credit card vs debit card.
I don't know that their HAS to be a fee for opening or closing a account but the bank is going to need to make money somewhere so I am sure their will be some. The question is who pays it and how much.

Offline carpet ride

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you could just do bitusd and get lower tx fees that way however going back to fiat would negate this thus they would need to stay in bitusd to do business with you and earn interest.

Issuing your own asset could be more profitable if you used the strategy I outlined earlier.. and I do believe there is interest on arbritrary assets thru dividends? so they get shares of your company profit thru dividends.

A good happy medium would be to do transactions thru bitusd and have an incentive structure to use bitusd by offering tranz shares as gift or whatnot... later on when the system is being used people will naturally want to stay in bitusd for the sole reason of using them to buy shares in a cpany with rising profits... if profits dwindle fall back to bitusd and still earn more interest than any bank.

If their was a debit card created that had no fees, that gave access to bitUSD directly their would be no tx fees.

It seems a debit card has to have fees derived from opening and closing an account/card.  This might also require customer service fees.


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Offline Gentso1

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you could just do bitusd and get lower tx fees that way however going back to fiat would negate this thus they would need to stay in bitusd to do business with you and earn interest.

Issuing your own asset could be more profitable if you used the strategy I outlined earlier.. and I do believe there is interest on arbritrary assets thru dividends? so they get shares of your company profit thru dividends.

A good happy medium would be to do transactions thru bitusd and have an incentive structure to use bitusd by offering tranz shares as gift or whatnot... later on when the system is being used people will naturally want to stay in bitusd for the sole reason of using them to buy shares in a cpany with rising profits... if profits dwindle fall back to bitusd and still earn more interest than any bank.

If their was a debit card created that had no fees, that gave access to bitUSD directly their would be no tx fees.

Offline jsidhu

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you could just do bitusd and get lower tx fees that way however going back to fiat would negate this thus they would need to stay in bitusd to do business with you and earn interest.

Issuing your own asset could be more profitable if you used the strategy I outlined earlier.. and I do believe there is interest on arbritrary assets thru dividends? so they get shares of your company profit thru dividends.

A good happy medium would be to do transactions thru bitusd and have an incentive structure to use bitusd by offering tranz shares as gift or whatnot... later on when the system is being used people will naturally want to stay in bitusd for the sole reason of using them to buy shares in a cpany with rising profits... if profits dwindle fall back to bitusd and still earn more interest than any bank.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2014, 02:56:14 pm by jsidhu »
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Offline carpet ride

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Just use BitUSD


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Offline Gentso1

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why not just simply use bitUSD?

You could use bitUSd to pay other companies you deal with and lets not forget it pays yield which adds up when you start getting into larger amounts. I don't understand why you would want to create your own currency for shipping. When you or the people you pay go to cash out you will need to go through a extra step to turn (shipping coin we will cash it to cash) and you loose out on the yield. With bitUSD it will make conversion easy for you and your customers because when you pay a dollar they get a dollar.

Creating a DAC for your company is completely different and would just be a IPO,  bitshares work with some lawyers http://www.perkinscoie.com/en/index.html. They have experience in crypto and are the same lawyers that overstock is using to build their exchange so they would seem like a natural choice.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2014, 01:19:57 pm by Gentso1 »

Offline xeroc

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Thank you for clarification on user-issued assets.

What would determine the value of the user-issued asset in this scenario? Would the value ultimately be tied to the performance of the company? How would that be handled contractually?
If you are having an IPO you can set the price your self when selling .. pretty much the same as with classical stock exchanges ..

once shares are out in the wild they can be traded at any price .. (should be correlated to your companies performance ;-)  )

Offline thazel72

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Thank you for clarification on user-issued assets.

What would determine the value of the user-issued asset in this scenario? Would the value ultimately be tied to the performance of the company? How would that be handled contractually?

Offline xeroc

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I know about market pegged assets, but I have not heard of user-issued assets.
market pegged assets have zero supply and shares are created by shorts (being bought by someone going long) .. this is what happens in the bitUSD

in contrast, user-issued assets are similar to what we see in NXT and counterparty. A user creates a user-issued asset on the blockchain and defines a max supply. That particular user can then issue up to max supply shares from the asset and sell them as IPO in the exchange.

The assets currently available on BTSX can be seen from blockchain_list_assets in the console.
Some of them are marked with ISSUER=MARKET .. these are market-pegged .. the others are user-issued assets.

Note, that anybody can create BOTH kinds of assets on the blockchain paying a relatively high fee of currently >300k BTSX
Whether you get a pegged, or non-pegged asset can be defined with a variable in wallet_asset_create.
Here's the help to that command:
Code: [Select]
delegate (locked) >>> help wallet_asset_create
Usage:
wallet_asset_create <symbol> <asset_name> <issuer_name> [description] [data] [maximum_share_supply] [precision] [is_market_issued]   Creates a new user issued asset
Creates a new user issued asset

Parameters:
  symbol (asset_symbol, required): the ticker symbol for the new asset
  asset_name (string, required): the name of the asset
  issuer_name (string, required): the name of the issuer of the asset
  description (string, optional, defaults to ""): a description of the asset
  data (json_variant, optional, defaults to null): arbitrary data attached to the asset
  maximum_share_supply (real_amount, optional, defaults to 1000000000000000): the maximum number of shares of the asset
  precision (int64_t, optional, defaults to 1000000): defines where the decimal should be displayed, must be a power of 10
  is_market_issued (bool, optional, defaults to false): creation of a new BitAsset that is created by shorting

Returns:
  transaction_record
I recommend to NOT just play around with this command in the main net as it comes with high fees!

More questions?

Offline thazel72

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And why are they not just issuing a user-issued asset and sell their 2B shares? I don't see the need for a separated chain and I also don't see how this can be a DAC?
do you already know about the differences bitween
 - market pegged assets
 - user-issued assets
in bitshares-x?

I know about market pegged assets, but I have not heard of user-issued assets.

Offline xeroc

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And why are they not just issuing a user-issued asset and sell their 2B shares? I don't see the need for a separated chain and I also don't see how this can be a DAC?
do you already know about the differences bitween
 - market pegged assets
 - user-issued assets
in bitshares-x?

Offline thazel72

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why not just simply use bitUSD?

Because they are interested in the concept of issuing shares using blockchain technology, and they understand the value of early adopters. They would want their own set of assets to trade like the would if they were on the stock market. They are private and at some point I am sure they will go public. Why not go public with Bitshares, and leverage those assets within the transportation community?

Offline thazel72

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They wouldn't invest 50% of their revenue, but they could choose to public with 50% of the shares. To be honest I don't know what they are valued at, because they are currently a privately owned company. They are on the cutting edge of technology in the industry but I would still have to be very convincing, and present a solution with bulletproof logic. I was just using a hypothetical situation to help me understand what the correct approach would be. They would need easy exchange to fiat, and that would be a deal breaker. This is very important from a usability standpoint because the industry isn't highly technical.

Offline Shentist

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why not just simply use bitUSD?

Offline jsidhu

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If im thinking about this the right way, they would simply put a buy order at the $125 peg such that 2 million shares are worth $250 million (by buying 250 million bitUSD). Each share may be used to conduct business via btsx system, where you would have low fees and immediate transactions, even dividends if acting as a normal asset. If they wanted fiat they can sell their share (into the peg) and essentially the $250 million would be used to secure the peg should every single share be used to convert back to fiat (although this wouldn't be the case as shares are sold or given selectively based on business ventures or partnerships). Vendors or partners would need to enter btsx system by most likely buying bitUSD and then using that to exchange for tranz through the system. Since btsx doesn't deal with fiat due to being unregulated there may be some spread costs in getting tranz from bit coin and what that entails based on the amount of liquidity needed. Interesting though. Essentially $250 mill marketcap becomes a floor and speculated price would be higher, creating profit to the issuer of shares and holders/buyers.

Would they seriously be willing to use up to 50% yearly revenue to fund the venture?
« Last Edit: October 08, 2014, 05:23:12 am by jsidhu »
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