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Offline ronald

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The FINCEN fine to Ripple keeps me thinking and worrying how the old sovereign money system will defend their position

Lets assume Gavin Andersen and the other four core developers who have acces to the live code inside the Bitcoin protocol are (coordinated) arrested on arbitrary grounds (like  Julian Assagne) and captive for days/weeks/months and have no access to computers. What would be the impact?

Lets assume that they give NOT the live code into the core protocol to their prosecutors; the result would be that the Bitcoin protocol is defacto beheaded (ISIS scenario)
Lets assume that they give the live code; it would be devastating for Bitcoin? (i am no computer expert; so i ask this question)
Lets assume only 2 or 3 persons are arrested/captive.   Multisig solutions are counterproductive

Am i correct?


What in case of Bitshares? If DL is arrested with six core developers BitShares is beheaded? How must (and can) they defend them  against high payed lawyers and prosecutors from the old sovereign money system? If you have no back up money or lawyers you are toasted.

How funerable are Daniel Larimar and the other six core developpers?
Are they living in the same country?
Is the USA the 'safest' place to be for a core developer?

In Holland (i am Dutch) they say something as: 'to be right' is something else than 'get it right'

So my point is: the old sovereign money system can behead (like ISIS) the initiatives like Bitcoin and BitShares if they arrest/captive the key players. ISIS scenario
I hope a have it wrong.
Please your thoughts on this
« Last Edit: May 08, 2015, 11:35:33 AM by ronald »

Offline fuzzy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K73gNKjFx0I
^ I think they are insane and are the types of personalities that would choose to be "Kings in a world of Ash" as opposed to "Citizens in a world of Plenty".  And they have a strangle hold on our entire ecosystem. 

I think we should do everything we can to help protect them.

"There is nothing good that can come by going through their mechanisms" ~Catherin Austin Fitts~

« Last Edit: May 08, 2015, 11:29:28 AM by fuzzy »
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Offline cass

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Guess most of the core devs are located in US!
I don't think this is best location for our movement  ... but this just my personal view!
█║▌║║█  - - -  The quieter you become, the more you are able to hear  - - -  █║▌║║█

Offline fuzzy

Guess most of the core devs are located in US!
I don't think this is best location for our movement  ... but this just my personal view!

The problem is world-wide.  The banking cartels only use individual nations to:
A) syphon value through debt
B) to pass the blame away from them

We need to be VERY careful.  This stuff is very real.  Please watch the video I posted Cass (and everyone else).  She ties together the surveillance grid with the economic warfare and really shows the dangers of the system. 

This is why I get so frustrated...people blame the U.S. but we are just really being victimized (just like the rest of the world).  The ILLUSION is that we brought it on ourselves.  The truth is that the population has no choice because if they try to fight back...there are only a few choices:
1) Peacefully disobey laws (and therefore face imprisonment and hefty fines)
2) Do nothing and become slowly enslaved
3) Fight back physically (which is possibly the worst course of action because then it legitimizes the force the state uses against us)
« Last Edit: May 08, 2015, 11:44:29 AM by fuzzy »
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Offline Permie

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the Frankenstein that Dan released into the wild would crowdfund the world's best lawyers for his defense, while the bitcoin community would be blogging and ranting in their forums for somebody to help (like they are doing with their "development").

ISIS scenario would finally prove to the crypto community at large that BitShares is the most awesome MEMBERSHIP ORGANIZATION of which Dan is merely just another member with no more control than anybody else.

This is a great advantage of DPOS but if all 6(?) core devs got arrested and needed legal funds do you think that the delegate system would be able to handle it?

Is there the bitsharestalk forum viewed widely enough by the shareholders to see that a new emergency delegate is needed to be voted in?
Would current delegates donate their pay to the legal fund?

I'm sure the community would find a way to make it work but I think it would be a good idea for there to be some kind of established procedure or some kind of plan
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Offline maqifrnswa

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This is a great advantage of DPOS but if all 6(?) core devs got arrested and needed legal funds do you think that the delegate system would be able to handle it?

Is there the bitsharestalk forum viewed widely enough by the shareholders to see that a new emergency delegate is needed to be voted in?
Would current delegates donate their pay to the legal fund?

I'm sure the community would find a way to make it work but I think it would be a good idea for there to be some kind of established procedure or some kind of plan

if it happened, bitshares value would be tanked as there is a panic sale, and no number of 100% delegates would raise enough for legal fees.
It would be better to save up the legal war chest ahead of time, and do be constantly working with lawyers now (which is what the core devs have been doing).

Instead of being reactionary, why not just go forward with compliance once a "product" is viable and stabilized? Put in all the regulatory features in to the blockchain, and someone can file to be an official gateway/asset issuer ( like itBit did in bitcoin http://www.coindesk.com/itbit-25-million-series-a/) using bitshares as an alternative trading system (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_trading_system). That will make marketcap explode, as it is decentralized and removes this legal liability. That is WAY cheaper (and will make money) compared to destroying bitshares market cap and paying legal defense fees.
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Offline bytemaster

This is a great advantage of DPOS but if all 6(?) core devs got arrested and needed legal funds do you think that the delegate system would be able to handle it?

Is there the bitsharestalk forum viewed widely enough by the shareholders to see that a new emergency delegate is needed to be voted in?
Would current delegates donate their pay to the legal fund?

I'm sure the community would find a way to make it work but I think it would be a good idea for there to be some kind of established procedure or some kind of plan

if it happened, bitshares value would be tanked as there is a panic sale, and no number of 100% delegates would raise enough for legal fees.
It would be better to save up the legal war chest ahead of time, and do be constantly working with lawyers now (which is what the core devs have been doing).

Instead of being reactionary, why not just go forward with compliance once a "product" is viable and stabilized? Put in all the regulatory features in to the blockchain, and someone can file to be an official gateway/asset issuer ( like itBit did in bitcoin http://www.coindesk.com/itbit-25-million-series-a/) using bitshares as an alternative trading system (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_trading_system). That will make marketcap explode, as it is decentralized and removes this legal liability. That is WAY cheaper (and will make money) compared to destroying bitshares market cap and paying legal defense fees.

+1
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Offline liondani

This is a great advantage of DPOS but if all 6(?) core devs got arrested and needed legal funds do you think that the delegate system would be able to handle it?

Is there the bitsharestalk forum viewed widely enough by the shareholders to see that a new emergency delegate is needed to be voted in?
Would current delegates donate their pay to the legal fund?

I'm sure the community would find a way to make it work but I think it would be a good idea for there to be some kind of established procedure or some kind of plan

if it happened, bitshares value would be tanked as there is a panic sale, and no number of 100% delegates would raise enough for legal fees.
It would be better to save up the legal war chest ahead of time, and do be constantly working with lawyers now (which is what the core devs have been doing).

Instead of being reactionary, why not just go forward with compliance once a "product" is viable and stabilized? Put in all the regulatory features in to the blockchain, and someone can file to be an official gateway/asset issuer ( like itBit did in bitcoin http://www.coindesk.com/itbit-25-million-series-a/) using bitshares as an alternative trading system (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_trading_system). That will make marketcap explode, as it is decentralized and removes this legal liability. That is WAY cheaper (and will make money) compared to destroying bitshares market cap and paying legal defense fees.

+1



That is tonyk's magic hand...




The  rumour is it is actually itBit !!! https://www.itbit.com/

Nice try. :P 

But, itbit is pretty bullish for Bitcoin and the whole sector imo.

I do not know...judge for yourself.

Ever since the time when we all thought the on/off ramps are in the pipeline last year, BM is saying that "the problem with all partners is they are startup(s) too, so they have to go through regulation step and licensing. The current once do not want extra trouble...and I do not blame them." 
UIA allowing regulatory compliance of future partners is arguable the most heavily developed feature for the last what?... any way a lot of months...
Stan start talking about an exiting times this summer, but he cannot actually talk about them. BM is exited about affiliate program + privatized bitAssets (and I guess the said UIAs).
BM talked about a week or so ago with somebody integrating BTS on their (exchange/gateway do not remember exactly).
BM gives the firs clue (in a   ;) form) it is a gateway (at least partly).
bitBIT gets its license.
I become aware of this this rumour - itBit is the partner BM is hinting about and Stan can't talk about....
  https://bitshares.OPENLEDGER.info/?r=GREECE  | You are in Control | BUY | SELL | SHORT | SWAP | LOAN | TRADE |  

Offline speedy

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This speculation is ridiculous. No one gets arrested for simply writing software. No one could possibly prove in court that Dan or Andresen or even Satoshi are a financial intermediary.

Offline kenCode

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No one gets arrested for simply writing software. No one could possibly prove in court that Dan or Andresen or even Satoshi are a financial intermediary.

They don't have to. They have unlimited resources.
Let's render them obsolete.
kenCode - Let's Agorise the world!

Offline Thom

Damn I sure hope BitShares doesn't grow into itBit!!!!! Can you say elite takeover? I want BItShares to stay as far away from itBit as possible.

I consider working with itBit to be the equivalent to working with the FED, or Rockefeller or Rothchild -- the elite, who have enslaved us and wish to maintain their control over us.

For any of you that have not looked into the movers & shakers of itBit I encourage you to do so. They are people who are NOT friends to the BitShares mission.

WE MUST NOT LET THAT HAPPEN!!!!!!
« Last Edit: May 08, 2015, 07:13:47 PM by Thom »
Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere - MLK |  Verbaltech2 Witness Reports: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,23902.0.html

Offline kenCode

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Damn I sure hope BitShares doesn't grow into itBit!!!!! Can you say elite takeover? I want BItShares to stay as far away from itBit as possible.
I consider working with itBit to be the equivalent to working with the FED, or Rockefeller or Rothchild -- the elite, who have enslaved us and wish to maintain their control over us.
For any of you that have not looked into the movers & shakers of itBit I encourage you to do so. They are people who are NOT friends to the BitShares mission.
WE MUST NOT LET THAT HAPPEN!!!!!!

Exactly. itBit = Bilderberg, same thing.
 
I feel Dan and Stan's heads are in the right place. I've heard nothing from them, heading up most of the core devs too, that would indicate that they have any intent on exposing our services to such regulation. If we continue to decentralize, we become completely impervious to attack.
 
I know so many of us want direct onramps with fiat, but as soon as we open that door, watch those parasitic bats come flying in. They are not welcome in OUR new world (order?).
 
Bank to kraken to bitcoin to metaexchange has been working for me just fine thanx. For me, it's worth the extra effort.
kenCode - Let's Agorise the world!

Tuck Fheman

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This speculation is ridiculous. No one gets arrested for simply writing software.

I'm pretty sure one of Barrett Brown's charges was for posting a link. So, not so ridiculous after all?

If you piss off a government, you could get picked up for just about any law you violate (pssst, there are a lot of them), and as we know, every law is enforced by a fine, which is enforced by jail, which is enforced by physical aggression that escalates up to murder.

So, be careful out there!


Tuck Fheman

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Put in all the regulatory features in to the blockchain, and someone can file to be an official gateway/asset issuer ( like itBit did in bitcoin http://www.coindesk.com/itbit-25-million-series-a/) using bitshares as an alternative trading system (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_trading_system). That will make marketcap explode, as it is decentralized and removes this legal liability. That is WAY cheaper (and will make money) compared to destroying bitshares market cap and paying legal defense fees.

Good points.


jakub

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Damn I sure hope BitShares doesn't grow into itBit!!!!! Can you say elite takeover? I want BItShares to stay as far away from itBit as possible.
I consider working with itBit to be the equivalent to working with the FED, or Rockefeller or Rothchild -- the elite, who have enslaved us and wish to maintain their control over us.
For any of you that have not looked into the movers & shakers of itBit I encourage you to do so. They are people who are NOT friends to the BitShares mission.
WE MUST NOT LET THAT HAPPEN!!!!!!

Exactly. itBit = Bilderberg, same thing.
 
I feel Dan and Stan's heads are in the right place. I've heard nothing from them, heading up most of the core devs too, that would indicate that they have any intent on exposing our services to such regulation. If we continue to decentralize, we become completely impervious to attack.
 
I know so many of us want direct onramps with fiat, but as soon as we open that door, watch those parasitic bats come flying in. They are not welcome in OUR new world (order?).
 
Bank to kraken to bitcoin to metaexchange has been working for me just fine thanx. For me, it's worth the extra effort.

You got it all wrong. This kind of thinking leads to nowhere.

itBit is good news because it means BTC (and the whole blockchain concept) starts being recognized by the big fish as something valuable and potentially profitable.
And to have mass adoption BitShares needs to function within the legal framework and be easy to use - otherwise it will continue to be niche as it is now.

 

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