No one is loosing anything, there will not be any "additional" dilution and
again BitShares is not about being "fair" in your sense. It is fair in such as
every opinion is hear, weighted by its stake. That's how businesses are run!
Also, BTS is not a community token. It comes with responsibilities (such as
voting) and with profits (from burning and/or by other means)
What does this have to do with an open-source project? Do you think open source
developers only need to breath .. no food?

Yes we can do a prediction market and it might do very well, but would it be better if we had a few million to develop the best model on the market and a few million more to spend on marketing, probably.

You're suggesting building a range of sub $30 000 blockchain additions that you want our overworked developers and apathetic shareholders to manage and promote. A lot of these are unique businesses that require specialist developers and talent from that industry.

Should we dilute ourselves to make a competitor to MUSE? Or will MUSE be a superior product because they've had more money to spend on development and they have large shareholders like Cob with industry relevant experience and contacts?

FBA's allow us to attract those specifically talented people to our platform and let them keep a lot of the profits, otherwise they will go crowdfund and build a DAPP on Ethereum and we will have to compete with tiny dilution, no specific talent from that business and our lazy shareholders will then have to try manage it better than them on top of everything else they're already responsible for.

I also quite like FBA's because it lets you choose which part of the business you want to invest in the most.
For example 'The Force Awakens' is a huge box office hit, so you might wish to invest in that but then you have to buy Disney shares but Disney may be down on the year because they overpaid for sports rights. A 'Force Awakens' FBA would have let you invest in and get more exposure to the product you believed in the most. http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-12-20/star-wars-smashes-global-opening-weekend-record-over-half-billion-ticket-sales-will-

Quote from: theredpill on December 23, 2015, 05:45:59 pm

I'm the only one that think this is bad idea? I mean, I very appreciate the BM try to find a funding solution for things but this is so bad for BTS that for the first time ever I have consider moving on of this project, In the past after search all crypto projects at the time I end up here thanks of our community and values, and I would argue that FBAs are against both.

1 - Community or comum unity, our community token is BTS, creating other tokens means divide the community, make us not one set of values and goals anymore, now BTS have someone name in the chain and are in debt with then. If our value is to create a fair system, the FBA makes no sense.

2 - What the problem with dilution? - I mean, even if (is a big IF) that means a little short term drop in the price, if you are like me and really believe in the project, whats the matter? You can even buy some more at discount.

3 - Promises - Each token is like a promise, we cannot go on forever making promises upon promises to people, I understand that CNX have now little stake on the project, but this is not excuse for trying to use the BTS for making profit like that, to be honest I think is even disrespectful to old holders like me that lost more then 80% waiting things get done, now that they are, because of lack of capacity to approve things democratically, try to compromise future revenue streams like that. This smells like FED.

As an old stakeholder that sincere belief on the values of this project I urge the community to vote against this type of thing, BTS 2.0 is here and is great, now is time to democratize things, if we need funds we dilute, straightforward if we make money we burn, as one community, one token, one set of values. If you no matter who want a feature, raise the necessary approval in BTS terms, Will be my pleasure vote for you.

Let's price things in BTS not USD here please.

I would like to candidate myself as a proxy voter too, if you agree, my bts is theredpill.

What particular values do you feel are not being fulfilled?

BitShares 2.0 is a superDAC platform for multiple profitable DACs designed to attract entrepreneurs with a profit motive.  This provides a magnet to bring more resources into the ecosystem.

The first DAC built on that platform was a decentralized exchange providing a set of backbone services and utilities for other businesses to build on.

Now we are into the phase of attracting more businesses - which will pay fees to use the platform's services making that platform more valuable.  The more businesses that "lock up" BitShares in their pipelines the fewer shares in circulation and the more valuable they become.  The more businesses that stimulate transactions the more fees and liquidity the platform earns.

Meanwhile, the STEALTH and Mutual Aid Society (MAS) functions start building up the capabilities we all crave for independence from The World System.

It the ultimate system, BitShares becomes an incorruptible alternative for much of that system.  But to do that, more businesses must be inside than outside the platform.

Ultimately, Fee Backed Assets are much more interesting to investors than User Issued Assets, so there are more reasons to get an account and trade here.

So we wind up with the functional equivalent of many interoperable blockchains.

Profitable, incorruptible, interoperable businesses with low barriers to entry and shared network effect all managed by its owners in a decentralized manner - just as the original vision in Bitcoin and the Three Laws of Robotics.

So, again, What particular values do you feel are not being fulfilled?

One clear example of a good use case for an FBA would be a prediction market.

Augur raised $5.3 million to fund building and marketing their prediction market. https://sale.augur.net/
Augur have a specialist prediction market focused team of talent and entrepreneurs. http://www.augur.net/#team
Running a successful prediction market will take a lot of ongoing focus from that team.


Without FBA's

- BTS would not be able to get a miniscule fraction of that amount through dilution without crashing BTS so would struggle to compete with competitors without being able to raise funding for the PM specifically and directly.
- A prediction market would need to incentivise entrepeneurs and specialist developers, to develop market and manage the PM.  They can only be attracted and incentivised with a share of that specific business and it's revenue.

If the development is small and doesn't require a lot of ongoing management then as BTS has dilution (I'm not a fan) it should be considered but for larger projects FBA's are superior.