Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.

Messages - bytemaster

Pages: 1 ... 648 649 650 651 652 653 654 [655] 656
General Discussion / Re: The future
« on: November 04, 2013, 03:22:51 pm »
To write here I need:

  • a Internet connection via ISP (authorized by state)
  • resolve the domain name using a hierarchical system (DNS)
  • connect to this server, which is run by humans and is at a given site

Today, we depend on central authorities to communicate through this forum. Tomorrow... Who knows?

If you saw my video introducing Keyhotee you would know my plans for most of that.

1) DomainShares will pair IP + Name + PublicKey for replacement of DNS and Certificate Authorities.  Names will be auction and DomainShares will pay dividends... New article coming soon.
2) Decentralized Forum based upon Keyhotee Mail and replicated everywhere on the internet...
3) The whole ISP thing... that is a bit more difficult but at one point I was thinking of satellites funded by crypto-currencies along with for-profit mesh network nodes...

We will get there, just need time and money.

I like a more subtle website look.  The wood background seems 'heavy'

Marketplace / Re: $500 Bounty - Keyhotee Splash Screen & Icon
« on: November 04, 2013, 03:17:58 pm »
I love it!   I am thinking the background image would be nice to have separate from the Logo + KEYHOTEE as a watermark for various UI elements.

BitShares PTS / Re: Momentum Proof-of-Work Information Thread
« on: November 04, 2013, 09:14:43 am »
I have been able to run the POW on a machine with 2GB of RAM installed. 

Marketplace / Re: $500 Bounty - Keyhotee Splash Screen & Icon
« on: November 04, 2013, 09:05:43 am »
I like the reference!   Good thinking!

BitShares PTS / Re: Mining Begins November 5, 08:08:08 UTC
« on: November 04, 2013, 08:47:57 am »
To prevent cheating we have not yet set the nonce for the genesis block which we just started mining 5 minutes ago.   A single computer should take 5 to 16 hours to mine the genesis block so will not be able to release the Windows binaries until we have the genesis nonce discovered.   We will be posting the binaries for download by all about 30 minutes before the genesis block time.   

We will arrange for multiple download locations to handle the load as we expect there to be 100+ people waiting to download.

Anyone interested in the Linux build should fetch from github now and get the code compiled.  Once compiled you will be able to fetch the proper nonce at the same time the binaries are posted and thus build a working client.

There is a bug that will cause the client to Crash if you try to run it too soon.  So the code actually will not be usable (without hacks) until the genesis block time.

BitShares PTS / ProtoShares Mining Schedule
« on: November 04, 2013, 07:19:00 am »

This chart shows how the money supply will change by week.  This is a 5% reduction in mining reward every week with a maximum supply a little over 2 million in 2 years.  This schedule was chosen because ProtoShares is not a currency play but a speculation play on the future value of BitShares and BitShares should be fully developed and deployed within 6 months to 1 year.   Therefore mining is meant to encourage early adoption.

The BitShares money supply will be about 20 million so ProtoShares represents at most 10% of the eventual BitShare money supply.  BitShares will be mined over about 10 years. 

General Discussion / What is the market-cap of ProtoShares?
« on: November 04, 2013, 06:49:18 am »
Since mining of ProtoShares will begin on November 5th, I thought it would be fitting to open a discussion about what the value of a ProtoShare will be and what methods can we use to estimate its value.

For starters I would like to dispense with the notion of a ProtoShare having any value without reference to the total supply of ProtoShares.   The real question is what is the value of 100% of all ProtoShares and then deriving the value of a single ProtoShare relative to the supply.   This process is very much like pricing the IPO of a new company and estimating the market cap.    Generally speaking you want to compare a company to other companies its industry and then adjust the valuation based upon relative competitive advantages each company has.

In the crypto-currency market place you would have to compare ProtoShares to other DACs such as BItcoin, Litecoin, Peercoin, Namecoin, and Primecoin.   For a complete list of other players in the market you can visit

A brief overview of the market shows that Feathercoin is worth about $1.7 Million dollars and offers little more than marketing and perhaps checking-point compared to the competition.  I feel this is a good baseline value that puts a floor on the value of ProtoShares because ProtoShares has several major competitive advantages over all other altcoins:

1) Entirely new proof of work that is better suited at achieving the goal of Litecoin that Scrypt (which is also used by Feathercoin)
2) ProtoShares comes with a social contract that bakes in the future value of all the features of BitShares
3) BitShares has the potential to provide much more value to the market than Bitcoin.

Now that we have established the baseline value we can compare it to the next contender, Primecoin with a $2 Million dollar market cap.   Primecoin has the competitive edge of a proof-of-work that is somewhat socially beneficial and is therefore a good point of comparison as the the only other proof-of-work system aside from SHA256 and Scrypt on the market.  If that was all that ProtoShares had to offer then Primecoin would be a good point of comparison.

The next point of comparison is Namecoin valued at $4 million dollars.  Namecoin is the first non-currency oriented DAC and as such provides potential utility beyond competing to be the next reserve currency.   The mere potential that Namecoin could eventually replace DNS systems is enough to justify its $4 million dollar market cap.   This shows that non-currency DACs have a baseline value of around $4 million even in the face of significant weaknesses in the pricing structure of domains and squatting prevention.   A crypto-currency that provided the services of Namecoin with a proof-of-work like Scrypt or Primecoin could have more value.  I would estimate that such a combination could have a value near $8 million.  Unfortunately ProtoShares does not yet implement these potential features and therefore the value must be discounted based upon risk of implementation and time value of money.   Even so, the feature set and value proposition of BitShares far exceeds that of Namecoin so it is hard to say what the value could be.

The next major coin is Peercoin which is a combination proof-of-work, proof-of-steak system that is also competing against Bitcoin and Litecoin to be the next generation currency.  It is up at $8.4 million dollars despite being a latecomer to the market based solely on its enhanced protection against certain classes of attack.    The Momentum proof-of-work might keep mining power decentralized enough to provide similar protections in the eyes of the market. 

So far if you compare ProtoShares to existing crypto-currencies there is easily potential justification for a $8 million dollar valuation right out the door.   But comparing ProtoShares to other crypto-currencies alone is not looking at the big picture.   What is the value of a crypto-currency that can be pegged to gold or silver while remaining decentralized and trustless?    What is the value of a way to securely store dollars and receive a positive return on investment without counter-party risk?    Well, the investors in Invictus Innovations felt that it was worth investing $600,000 dollars to build the system even with no pre-mining.    Without pre-mining the investors in Invictus Innovations are on near-equal footing with everyone else in terms of acquiring BitShares or ProtoShares and therefore that $600,000 investment in a venture that could see only the ability to acquire 1% or less of the BitShare supply could easily be counted as a bid that would value ProtoShares at $60 million dollars.  This would put it on par with Litecoin even before the first line of code was written.   It is critical to realize that Invictus Innovations doesn't get to spend $600,000 on mining hardware because we have salaries, bounties, and other business expenses to pay with that money which has to fund our company for almost a year.   In fact, the investment of $600,000 is spread out over 9 months and therefore our cash flow as a company is limited.   In order to have the opportunity to invest in 1% of BitShares someone had to pay to develop it without pre-mining and thus that 1% will cost $600,000 to acquire.   

So what is a ProtoShare worth?   Eventually it could be worth more than Bitcoin, but starting November 5th the market will get to price ProtoShares and we will soon find out!

What are your thoughts?   How much are you investing in mining? 


I am just looking for the main page layout to be designed.  Not every sub page.

Ok I will up the bounty to 5btc.

How much do you think a fair bounty would be?

Marketplace / Re: $500 Bounty - Keyhotee Splash Screen & Icon
« on: November 03, 2013, 09:47:17 pm »
I agree, lets get some options on the table and I will update all bounty threads to use those colors.

General Discussion / $5000 Bounty - Momentum Proof-of-Work Hacking [PAID]
« on: November 03, 2013, 09:28:00 pm »
I am looking for algorithmic weaknesses in the Momentum Proof of Work: 

If you can identify an alternative algorithm for solving the proof of work that does not require the target RAM and yet is able to find hashes at a rate greater than  MomentumAlgoHashRate / (TARGET_RAM_USE/ALT_RAM_USE)  then you could win this bounty.

For example:  Suppose momentum as specked requires about 1 GB of RAM for maximum performance and produces hashes at 1hz.   If you design an algorithm that only requires 1 MB of RAM and can find hashes at .001 hz then you win because you will have proven that computational complexity is linear with RAM use rather than non-linear like I believe the problem calls for.   
      I paid out a tip for showing this property doesn't quite hold as I thought, but this was more a weakness in my devising an effective / objective measure for determining whether or not momentum is "broken' or 'hacked'. 

My original phrasing of this bounty on Bitcoin talk was:

One goal is to produce an implementation of this proof of work system that negates the algorithmic advantage given to the use of memory and allows much faster solutions.  If you are able to convince me this proof-of-work is no better than Scrypt then you will win the 30 btc bounty.   The objective proof that someone has convinced me will be whether or not I use momentum for BitShares.  I have far more on the line for choosing a bad proof of work than not paying this out.

At the time of the original post 30 BTC was $5000... so I will keep it at $5000.   

Note:  Now that protoshares has been launched based upon Momentum the bounty is much higher if you can implement it and gain a massive mining advantage and then sell the resulting ProtoShares.   Then after you have earned enough profit that way you can share your approach with the community to get another $5000.

Variables I reserve the right to change while still calling it momentum:
  • BirthdayHash Function.
  • Nonce Search Space.
  • Target Memory Usage.

Best of luck to you all!

BitShares PTS / Re: Best mining hardware
« on: November 03, 2013, 09:13:33 pm »
Right now you can compile the latest ProtoShares from source from here:

The Genesis block and other settings are not final yet, but we should have binaries posted on tomorrow for Windows.   There are bounties for OS X binaries.

BitShares PTS / Re: Momentum Proof-of-Work Information Thread
« on: November 03, 2013, 09:11:32 pm »
Some recent thoughts on Momentum Proof-of-Work

FreeTrade @ bitcointalk and I have picked the following parameters for ProtoShares:

Max Nonce:                      2^26
Birthday Hash Bits:           50
Birthday Hash Algorithm:  sha512( (nonce-nonce%8) + seed)[nonce%8] >> 14
Average Number of Birthday Matches Found per Nonce Search Space:  1-2
Minimum Memory Required to Search Space:  12 * 2^26 = 768MB
Hashtable Memory Overhead Factor 2x: 1.5 GB 

Given these settings and FreeTrade's best implementation so far it takes about 10 seconds per search to find about 2 birthday matches.

In the future I think I would make the following changes to prevent botnets.

1) Minimum Memory Required to Search Space:  8 GB
2) Modify Birthday Hash Algorithm to generate 20 birthdays per SHA512 instead of just 8

Given these changes there is nothing preventing the average man from mining provided he outfit his machine with 16 GB of RAM which is fairly common, but most machines that are part of a botnet are older machines with insufficient RAM.  This should also serve to enhance the degree to which the algorithm is resistant to ASICS.   

Anyone planning on mining BitShares will want to make sure their mining machines are upgradable to 16 GB of RAM. 

Pages: 1 ... 648 649 650 651 652 653 654 [655] 656