Author Topic: Operation DarkMarket  (Read 12805 times)

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Offline Method-X

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Operation Darkmarket: +5%

Ah. I like "Operation DarkMarket" more than DarkNet.

Offline merivercap

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Operation Darkmarket: +5%
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Offline jz831

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Here's the problem:

http://www.businessinsider.com/r-florida-man-gets-nine-years-prison-in-new-jersey-over-global-poison-plot-2015-2

I don't see how your given ricin example applies to the topic at hand.  We cannot control what people do with the tools they are given, or have access to. Apples/Oranges.

I infer the stated intention of #OperationDarkNet and enabling an escrow service seems noble and made with honest foresight, to offer a win/win solution to an existing issue.  You submitting a Breaking Bad coffee sweetener story - seems like asking what's the price of beans in China, i.e. it seems non-sequitur and unrelated.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2015, 05:20:19 am by jz831 »
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Offline oldman

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let's not forget for one moment that darknet commerce includes weapons, prostitution, child porn and basically everything humanity has declared unfit for public consumption)

Do people actually think this!!?? Wow, no wonder there's such a knee jerk reaction to DarkNet adoption. Evolution and Agora are the two largest dark markets and you absolutely can't get child porn or prostitutes on them. If they did, nobody in their right mind would go near them. Dark markets are about open access to drugs.

I highly recommend you download Tor and go here: http://k5zq47j6wd3wdvjq.onion/login - sign up and see for yourself what dark markets are about. I know for a fact you're a big supporter of OpenBazaar. The only difference between OB and Evolution is the former is decentralized while the latter isn't. That's it.

Here's the problem:

http://www.businessinsider.com/r-florida-man-gets-nine-years-prison-in-new-jersey-over-global-poison-plot-2015-2

Offline nomoreheroes7

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 +5% for drugs and gambling. There really is no greater way to fuel organic growth than through these avenues, and thus they should be of huge focus. I can't wait until the day the first market/gambling site implements BitUSD. We need to make this happen.

Debauchery FTW.

Offline Empirical1.2

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This is a great idea. Silkroad single-handedly made Bitcoin popular in the early days. But Bitcoin is obviously not a good choice with escrow and value fluctuation.

Yes, the reality is that this and gambling, (which accounted for circa 50% of Bitcoin use up till last year) is what bootstrapped Bitcoin. BitAssets are superior for both use cases.


« Last Edit: February 18, 2015, 02:40:26 pm by Empirical1.2 »
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Offline Akado

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It would create one of the first cases, if not the first, case of 'real life usability'. It would have practical use. People already trade it and store it but this would actually make everyone see how the tech works and more importantly, that it does indeed work and that it has use. Most people won't bother searching more about bitshares, however, if they can actually see it working through the darknet, they would probably use it.

Not to mention the free marketing from bitcoin news websites and magazines.
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Offline kokojie

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This is a great idea. Silkroad single-handedly made Bitcoin popular in the early days. But Bitcoin is obviously not a good choice with escrow and value fluctuation.

Offline xeroc

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Btw .. noone can prevent anyone from doing business with bitshares. ... :D

Also, with bitshares there is no "official" ..

The arm of the law is long.

If we were at $1-10/BTS with a legal delegate and some global momentum, I would give Bitshares fighting odds.

Right now the entire project could be crushed by a couple of gov goons and a court order.

Let's get through learning to crawl before we start talking about running...
I agree .. but it seems I didn't make my point clear:
In BitShares there is no leader that you have to ask for permission to do anything on or with the blockchain ..
In some cases you might need to ask the shareholders .. but still .. the core of my post was:
Just fu*** DO it!

Disclaimer: That statement is true in general and not for darknet specifically ..

That was den technical point of view ..
from a salesman point of view it might be a good idea to get into darknet but it may also not be.. I don't know ..

Offline hpenvy2

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http://www.wired.com/2014/04/dark-wallet/

Different opinions, even in the Bitcoin space.

Offline cn-members

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Bitcoin can used in dark market too , no one can prevent that from happening .

But it's also important to notice that no one in the Bitcoin public faces advocate the dark market use .

So if one of our delegates advocate this , I don't know how I would make this a big story if I'm a competitor of Bitshares .
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Offline Method-X

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let's not forget for one moment that darknet commerce includes weapons, prostitution, child porn and basically everything humanity has declared unfit for public consumption)

Do people actually think this!!?? Wow, no wonder there's such a knee jerk reaction to DarkNet adoption. Evolution and Agora are the two largest dark markets and you absolutely can't get child porn or prostitutes on them. If they did, nobody in their right mind would go near them. Dark markets are about open access to drugs.

I highly recommend you download Tor and go here: http://k5zq47j6wd3wdvjq.onion/login - sign up and see for yourself what dark markets are about. I know for a fact you're a big supporter of OpenBazaar. The only difference between OB and Evolution is the former is decentralized while the latter isn't. That's it.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2015, 07:35:47 am by Method-X »

Offline yellowecho

Careful what you wish for.

I think Nurse Mary J would be good place to start...

Yes, very low hanging, lucrative fruit upon which to feed for the growth we require to become big and strong enough to tackle bigger things.

Seeking to openly support illegal commerce in controlled substances is perhaps not the most well-considered strategy for a fledgling technology.

However, the use case for drugs, porn and gambling is undeniable.

So why not go after the legal drug market in Colorado etc., where they are openly seeking banking solutions, and strike out into porn and gambling?

Seems to be a lot of low fruit before we need to knock boots with the dark side.

I understand what you're saying but what is your practical strategy for achieving this? It's one thing to say "go after marijuana dispensaries" and another thing entirely to lay out a blueprint that will make it happen. There are certain prerequisites needing fulfillment before we can effectively move to larger markets. For example, bitUSD liquidity is a BIG obstacle holding back functionality. We have to be realistic about where our technology is currently useful vs. where it will be useful in the future. Building momentum and network effect means starting small and probably in areas most would consider politically incorrect. Bitcoin would have died in obscurity if it weren't for the original Silk Road; indeed dark markets remain Bitcoins primary use case outside speculative investing.

From darkness cometh light.

I'm not sure the strategy/blueprint for the legitimate controlled substance market is any different than the strategy for the illegitimate controlled substance market; the target demographic is similar but on a smaller scale. The real difference is the risk proposition.

Both the darknets and med pot have a banking problem for which bitUSD is a near-perfect solution. However, aiding, abetting and otherwise enabling darknet commerce (and while I agree 100% on generic medication, let's not forget for one moment that darknet commerce includes weapons, prostitution, child porn and basically everything humanity has declared unfit for public consumption) creates a huge tail risk for the entire Bitshares ecosystem.

The medical pot industry, on the other hand, is quasi-legal and organized to the point of attempting to form a legitimate credit union. Aiding med pot commerce carries far less risk of being associated with dealers, pimps and pedophiles. Additionally, the amount of money floating around med pot, as well as the astronomical growth rate of the industry, makes the risk/reward ratio very attractive.

A similar case could be made for the porn and gambling industries. The low fees and instant confirmation of bitUSD is absolutely perfect for cam girls, custom porn, single serving sales, betting, poker, blackjack, etc. etc.

As to a blue print I would suggest:

- Finding a willing advocate on the ground in Colorado, preferably someone involved in the credit union project or a community/forum leader with good rep, and pay them a stipend from the delegate pool to lobby for bitUSD adoption from within the community.

- Put ads on every medical pot forum - growers, retailers, users.

- Systematically target retailers for bitUSD integration. This is cold call work - literally call them up, ask for the owner and give them an elevator pitch. Email them a starter pack with a few bitUSD and point them to the BTS store to try it out.

- Have the advocate attend industry events, meets, etc. and hand out flyers. Work towards setting up a booth.

- Have the advocate visit retailers and ask to pay with bitUSD.

Etc.

For porn, get a delegate whose only job is to hit up cam girls and porn production companies. Pay cam girls in bitUSD. Order some custom porn. It's a tight industry and word will spread fast. Folks will only need to use bitUSD once to be sold, and they will tell their friends...

If we got med pot and even a small fraction of the porn industry on board Bitshares would have a moon run, at which point delegate pay would be enough to really put some muscle behind the marketing machine.

TL;DR:

1. Med pot

2. Porn

3. Mainstream

Wasn't there a discussion a long time ago about using bitUSD giftcards as a means of achieving users?  Why not approach these dispensaries about using bitUSD powered giftcards? 

We could also get a delegate elected to launch a wallet designed with this purpose in mind... but marketed differently so the BTS brand isn't directly associated.
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Offline oldman

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Btw .. noone can prevent anyone from doing business with bitshares. ... :D

Also, with bitshares there is no "official" ..

The arm of the law is long.

If we were at $1-10/BTS with a legal delegate and some global momentum, I would give Bitshares fighting odds.

Right now the entire project could be crushed by a couple of gov goons and a court order.

Let's get through learning to crawl before we start talking about running...

Offline oldman

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Careful what you wish for.

I think Nurse Mary J would be good place to start...

Yes, very low hanging, lucrative fruit upon which to feed for the growth we require to become big and strong enough to tackle bigger things.

Seeking to openly support illegal commerce in controlled substances is perhaps not the most well-considered strategy for a fledgling technology.

However, the use case for drugs, porn and gambling is undeniable.

So why not go after the legal drug market in Colorado etc., where they are openly seeking banking solutions, and strike out into porn and gambling?

Seems to be a lot of low fruit before we need to knock boots with the dark side.

I understand what you're saying but what is your practical strategy for achieving this? It's one thing to say "go after marijuana dispensaries" and another thing entirely to lay out a blueprint that will make it happen. There are certain prerequisites needing fulfillment before we can effectively move to larger markets. For example, bitUSD liquidity is a BIG obstacle holding back functionality. We have to be realistic about where our technology is currently useful vs. where it will be useful in the future. Building momentum and network effect means starting small and probably in areas most would consider politically incorrect. Bitcoin would have died in obscurity if it weren't for the original Silk Road; indeed dark markets remain Bitcoins primary use case outside speculative investing.

From darkness cometh light.

I'm not sure the strategy/blueprint for the legitimate controlled substance market is any different than the strategy for the illegitimate controlled substance market; the target demographic is similar but on a smaller scale. The real difference is the risk proposition.

Both the darknets and med pot have a banking problem for which bitUSD is a near-perfect solution. However, aiding, abetting and otherwise enabling darknet commerce (and while I agree 100% on generic medication, let's not forget for one moment that darknet commerce includes weapons, prostitution, child porn and basically everything humanity has declared unfit for public consumption) creates a huge tail risk for the entire Bitshares ecosystem.

The medical pot industry, on the other hand, is quasi-legal and organized to the point of attempting to form a legitimate credit union. Aiding med pot commerce carries far less risk of being associated with dealers, pimps and pedophiles. Additionally, the amount of money floating around med pot, as well as the astronomical growth rate of the industry, makes the risk/reward ratio very attractive.

A similar case could be made for the porn and gambling industries. The low fees and instant confirmation of bitUSD is absolutely perfect for cam girls, custom porn, single serving sales, betting, poker, blackjack, etc. etc.

As to a blue print I would suggest:

- Finding a willing advocate on the ground in Colorado, preferably someone involved in the credit union project or a community/forum leader with good rep, and pay them a stipend from the delegate pool to lobby for bitUSD adoption from within the community.

- Put ads on every medical pot forum - growers, retailers, users.

- Systematically target retailers for bitUSD integration. This is cold call work - literally call them up, ask for the owner and give them an elevator pitch. Email them a starter pack with a few bitUSD and point them to the BTS store to try it out.

- Have the advocate attend industry events, meets, etc. and hand out flyers. Work towards setting up a booth.

- Have the advocate visit retailers and ask to pay with bitUSD.

Etc.

For porn, get a delegate whose only job is to hit up cam girls and porn production companies. Pay cam girls in bitUSD. Order some custom porn. It's a tight industry and word will spread fast. Folks will only need to use bitUSD once to be sold, and they will tell their friends...

If we got med pot and even a small fraction of the porn industry on board Bitshares would have a moon run, at which point delegate pay would be enough to really put some muscle behind the marketing machine.

TL;DR:

1. Med pot

2. Porn

3. Mainstream