Author Topic: Your opinion on Bytemaster  (Read 3212 times)

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tarantulaz

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Your opinion on Bytemaster
« on: August 23, 2016, 07:58:37 pm »
Hello everyone!

I'd like to have people's opinion on Bytemaster. Not what he achieved in BitShares, but things that people really thought were wrong or even scummy.
I am here for events that people actually thought that were not just wrong, but had bad intentions behind them. I've come to the conclusion that Bytemaster is creating scams either purposely or by accident. I am leaning more on the accidental side, because he is very incompetent. I understand that many people will be furious for my claims, but I couldn't care less.

When I started in crypto, I viewed most crypto communities as those amazing places where people go and try to create something amazing with the best intentions. With time I learned that there are indeed many many people who are decent, but there are many scammers and people that are there to get rich quickly. But that's not the main problem of the crypto communities. The main problem is that very very few people are actually economists or top developers, yet everyone seems to know what they are doing when nobody actually does.

If I could compare the Bitshares community with a guy, in order to express in a better how I view it, that would be Fuzzy. Fuzzy is an amazing and genuinely nice person, however there are many times that when I hear him talk I think in my head : this guy has no idea of what he is talking about. He can't be that dumb, can he?

Back to the first point. BM's work in both BitShares and Steem, the way he left Bitshares and the Steem 'solo-mining' make me really doubt him as a person. Stealth, Merger, BitAssets are some of the things that I've found really doggy, but as I've been following the community only for the last 7-8 months, I would like some deeper information about him.

Offline MisO69

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2016, 08:20:25 pm »
I have been lurking here since the beginning.

To me, Dan comes across as a nice, honest and hard working guy. He continued to work on BTS even when the pay was minuscule to non existent. He did that for us, gave us 2.0 and then moved on to make some money with steemit. Good on him. I hope he does well.

As for the steemit launch I am butthurt that I couldn't mine some free money for myself. yes. Like you I am butthurt about this... ouch.





Offline tbone

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2016, 10:18:52 pm »
Hello everyone!

I'd like to have people's opinion on Bytemaster. Not what he achieved in BitShares, but things that people really thought were wrong or even scummy.
I am here for events that people actually thought that were not just wrong, but had bad intentions behind them. I've come to the conclusion that Bytemaster is creating scams either purposely or by accident. I am leaning more on the accidental side, because he is very incompetent. I understand that many people will be furious for my claims, but I couldn't care less.

When I started in crypto, I viewed most crypto communities as those amazing places where people go and try to create something amazing with the best intentions. With time I learned that there are indeed many many people who are decent, but there are many scammers and people that are there to get rich quickly. But that's not the main problem of the crypto communities. The main problem is that very very few people are actually economists or top developers, yet everyone seems to know what they are doing when nobody actually does.

If I could compare the Bitshares community with a guy, in order to express in a better how I view it, that would be Fuzzy. Fuzzy is an amazing and genuinely nice person, however there are many times that when I hear him talk I think in my head : this guy has no idea of what he is talking about. He can't be that dumb, can he?

Back to the first point. BM's work in both BitShares and Steem, the way he left Bitshares and the Steem 'solo-mining' make me really doubt him as a person. Stealth, Merger, BitAssets are some of the things that I've found really doggy, but as I've been following the community only for the last 7-8 months, I would like some deeper information about him.

Are you Tone Vays?  What an idiot.  lol

Offline mcoin

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2016, 12:05:05 am »
He did not honor his own social contract to sharedrop steem on PTS and AGS holders, and for that I have less trust than I did before. However, I remain a big admirer of his technical talents and efforts.

Offline nomoreheroes7

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2016, 12:09:02 am »
My opinion of Bytemaster is currently on hold...depends on how the rest of the year plays out.

 :P

Offline hammurabi

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2016, 12:34:53 am »
Dan is very fluent on economics. His ideas are usually ahead of time. Remember the very first whitepaper on DACs? He recognized quickly how blockchain technology can be used for so much more than mere money. And he quickly created a transparent plan how to pull it off.

He managed to create the idea, form legal framework for it, build up a team and deliver the perfectly working platform.
His work is a 99,99% success. Unfortunately for us this great accomplishment have not translated into shiny coins, yet.
Probably due to bitcoin winter at this time. Maybe this summer will be different. :P

Hopefully it will get traction, we will get rich and accusations stops from happening.

Compare Dan's work with Ethereum Foundation's for example. They were much luckier with timing (after bitcoin winter). They started later, incorporated Dan's ideas for free and with loud campaign how revolutionary the change of one letter from The DAC to The DAO can be they siphoned almost 150m usd for the effort.
While The DAO was a complete fiasco BitShares DACS works and are super fast and stable.
Still not seeing any difference?!

« Last Edit: August 24, 2016, 12:50:24 am by hammurabi »

Offline KenMonkey

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2016, 01:52:34 am »
Dan is very fluent on economics. His ideas are usually ahead of time. Remember the very first whitepaper on DACs? He recognized quickly how blockchain technology can be used for so much more than mere money. And he quickly created a transparent plan how to pull it off.

He managed to create the idea, form legal framework for it, build up a team and deliver the perfectly working platform.
His work is a 99,99% success. Unfortunately for us this great accomplishment have not translated into shiny coins, yet.
Probably due to bitcoin winter at this time. Maybe this summer will be different. :P

Hopefully it will get traction, we will get rich and accusations stops from happening.

Compare Dan's work with Ethereum Foundation's for example. They were much luckier with timing (after bitcoin winter). They started later, incorporated Dan's ideas for free and with loud campaign how revolutionary the change of one letter from The DAC to The DAO can be they siphoned almost 150m usd for the effort.
While The DAO was a complete fiasco BitShares DACS works and are super fast and stable.
Still not seeing any difference?!

yeaaah bashing Dan is easy cause he's kinda a nerd. But actually BTS is superb. This is why satoshi went dark after creating bitcoin. Dan gave us bitshares 2.0 with all the cool customizable UIAs and MPAs, the exchange, ect like satoshi gave us the blockchain. The difference is we now know who and where he is so he has to face all this haranguing and "scam-calling".  lol. Satoshi's a genius. (so's Dan).

I can't wait to see the further adoption of BTS: crowdfunding, BlockPay, Peerplays, Cadastral (what?), OpenLedger, FreedomLedger it's a growing beast and as soon as people realize it's all built on BTS the luckier they will be. (I'm going to be watching V for Vendetta and watching the world change on Nov. 5, my fav holiday, oh damn I'm in England now, that means people actually do celebrate Nov. 5! cool.)
« Last Edit: August 24, 2016, 01:57:06 am by KenMonkey »

Offline Ben Mason

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2016, 08:17:34 am »
Hello everyone!

I'd like to have people's opinion on Bytemaster. Not what he achieved in BitShares, but things that people really thought were wrong or even scummy.
I am here for events that people actually thought that were not just wrong, but had bad intentions behind them. I've come to the conclusion that Bytemaster is creating scams either purposely or by accident. I am leaning more on the accidental side, because he is very incompetent. I understand that many people will be furious for my claims, but I couldn't care less.

When I started in crypto, I viewed most crypto communities as those amazing places where people go and try to create something amazing with the best intentions. With time I learned that there are indeed many many people who are decent, but there are many scammers and people that are there to get rich quickly. But that's not the main problem of the crypto communities. The main problem is that very very few people are actually economists or top developers, yet everyone seems to know what they are doing when nobody actually does.

If I could compare the Bitshares community with a guy, in order to express in a better how I view it, that would be Fuzzy. Fuzzy is an amazing and genuinely nice person, however there are many times that when I hear him talk I think in my head : this guy has no idea of what he is talking about. He can't be that dumb, can he?

Back to the first point. BM's work in both BitShares and Steem, the way he left Bitshares and the Steem 'solo-mining' make me really doubt him as a person. Stealth, Merger, BitAssets are some of the things that I've found really doggy, but as I've been following the community only for the last 7-8 months, I would like some deeper information about him.

What for tarantulaz?  Trying to play on the darker side of human nature, to stir up resentment and get some dirt so you can make money out of posting it on Steemit?  Surely you must know everything you need to in order to build a case against Dan, you seem so certain of your opinions.  Why would you need help to prove your smears? 

The only one behaving in a 'scummy' way is you buddy.  What have you built?  What do you stand for?  Fuzzy and Dan know more about integrity and what blockchain tech can accomplish than you ever will.  Everyone makes mistakes, me, you, everyone.  Not everyone puts themselves out there and tries to accomplish something great.  Failure does not equal betrayal.....only fools would allow themselves to be seduced into thinking like that.  Good luck with your fishing.

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2016, 09:40:22 am »
you tried OP, you tried.
Join us on Telegram: https://t.me/btstalk

tarantulaz

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2016, 11:40:32 am »
Hello everyone!

I'd like to have people's opinion on Bytemaster. Not what he achieved in BitShares, but things that people really thought were wrong or even scummy.
I am here for events that people actually thought that were not just wrong, but had bad intentions behind them. I've come to the conclusion that Bytemaster is creating scams either purposely or by accident. I am leaning more on the accidental side, because he is very incompetent. I understand that many people will be furious for my claims, but I couldn't care less.

When I started in crypto, I viewed most crypto communities as those amazing places where people go and try to create something amazing with the best intentions. With time I learned that there are indeed many many people who are decent, but there are many scammers and people that are there to get rich quickly. But that's not the main problem of the crypto communities. The main problem is that very very few people are actually economists or top developers, yet everyone seems to know what they are doing when nobody actually does.

If I could compare the Bitshares community with a guy, in order to express in a better how I view it, that would be Fuzzy. Fuzzy is an amazing and genuinely nice person, however there are many times that when I hear him talk I think in my head : this guy has no idea of what he is talking about. He can't be that dumb, can he?

Back to the first point. BM's work in both BitShares and Steem, the way he left Bitshares and the Steem 'solo-mining' make me really doubt him as a person. Stealth, Merger, BitAssets are some of the things that I've found really doggy, but as I've been following the community only for the last 7-8 months, I would like some deeper information about him.

What for tarantulaz?  Trying to play on the darker side of human nature, to stir up resentment and get some dirt so you can make money out of posting it on Steemit?  Surely you must know everything you need to in order to build a case against Dan, you seem so certain of your opinions.  Why would you need help to prove your smears? 

The only one behaving in a 'scummy' way is you buddy.  What have you built?  What do you stand for?  Fuzzy and Dan know more about integrity and what blockchain tech can accomplish than you ever will.  Everyone makes mistakes, me, you, everyone.  Not everyone puts themselves out there and tries to accomplish something great.  Failure does not equal betrayal.....only fools would allow themselves to be seduced into thinking like that.  Good luck with your fishing.

I would have liked to know how deep your knowledge of economics is. What has he build? He has build bullshit. Look at the Bitshares market cap. Nobody fully understands what a scam dynamically pegged assets are. But let's assume they are not a scam. They just make no freaking sense, but because they seem to work a small scale, people think that they could work on a larger scale too.

No I am not tone vays, but I am planning on getting him and 1-2 more people, with proper understanding of economics and analyze all the negatives or the scummy/ponzi aspects of steem and bitshares. This way the Bitshares community will at least either be able to disband and go do something better and more productive, or actually fully understand their mistakes and make Bitshares great. By the way, I never said anything bad about fuzzy's integrity. The fact that he has no idea about what he is doing or talking about, has nothing to do with him as a human being. I am thinking in the same way about BM, but with time this view has been fading.

You must have really liked the merger, the bitAssets that lock BTS and raise their value while you dump them to people who think they are stable, the famous stealth feature that ended up as steem when he said that to nobody, when he solo mined steem and relaunched steem so that he could get all the power for himself (regardless of if he deserved the power or not), the waste of 5M USD in creating Bitshares the way it is now, so that he could take the technology and build steem, the referral program which is totally irrelevant to a blockchain, but relevant to a ponzi/scam as it was trying to bring people in and burn so that the stakeholders could profit, the famous liquidity and parking rewards that would tax the current shareholders so that they could incentivise people to buy BTS and keep the scam going and so on.

[member=11011]tonyk[/member] would you be interested in an interview/group chat/podcast whatever with tone vays, me and maybe 1-2 more people? I know you've posted a lot, but I would like to ask you to give me a detailed kind of timeline/review of all the bad/crazy things you've observed, mainly by Bytemaster.

Offline chryspano

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2016, 11:59:46 am »
Hello everyone!

I'd like to have people's opinion on Bytemaster. Not what he achieved in BitShares, but things that people really thought were wrong or even scummy.
I am here for events that people actually thought that were not just wrong, but had bad intentions behind them. I've come to the conclusion that Bytemaster is creating scams either purposely or by accident. I am leaning more on the accidental side, because he is very incompetent. I understand that many people will be furious for my claims, but I couldn't care less.

When I started in crypto, I viewed most crypto communities as those amazing places where people go and try to create something amazing with the best intentions. With time I learned that there are indeed many many people who are decent, but there are many scammers and people that are there to get rich quickly. But that's not the main problem of the crypto communities. The main problem is that very very few people are actually economists or top developers, yet everyone seems to know what they are doing when nobody actually does.

If I could compare the Bitshares community with a guy, in order to express in a better how I view it, that would be Fuzzy. Fuzzy is an amazing and genuinely nice person, however there are many times that when I hear him talk I think in my head : this guy has no idea of what he is talking about. He can't be that dumb, can he?

Back to the first point. BM's work in both BitShares and Steem, the way he left Bitshares and the Steem 'solo-mining' make me really doubt him as a person. Stealth, Merger, BitAssets are some of the things that I've found really doggy, but as I've been following the community only for the last 7-8 months, I would like some deeper information about him.

What for tarantulaz?  Trying to play on the darker side of human nature, to stir up resentment and get some dirt so you can make money out of posting it on Steemit?  Surely you must know everything you need to in order to build a case against Dan, you seem so certain of your opinions.  Why would you need help to prove your smears? 

The only one behaving in a 'scummy' way is you buddy.  What have you built?  What do you stand for?  Fuzzy and Dan know more about integrity and what blockchain tech can accomplish than you ever will.  Everyone makes mistakes, me, you, everyone.  Not everyone puts themselves out there and tries to accomplish something great.  Failure does not equal betrayal.....only fools would allow themselves to be seduced into thinking like that.  Good luck with your fishing.

I would have liked to know how deep your knowledge of economics is. What has he build? He has build bullshit. Look at the Bitshares market cap. Nobody fully understands what a scam dynamically pegged assets are. But let's assume they are not a scam. They just make no freaking sense, but because they seem to work a small scale, people think that they could work on a larger scale too.

No I am not tone vays, but I am planning on getting him and 1-2 more people, with proper understanding of economics and analyze all the negatives or the scummy/ponzi aspects of steem and bitshares. This way the Bitshares community will at least either be able to disband and go do something better and more productive, or actually fully understand their mistakes and make Bitshares great. By the way, I never said anything bad about fuzzy's integrity. The fact that he has no idea about what he is doing or talking about, has nothing to do with him as a human being. I am thinking in the same way about BM, but with time this view has been fading.

You must have really liked the merger, the bitAssets that lock BTS and raise their value while you dump them to people who think they are stable, the famous stealth feature that ended up as steem when he said that to nobody, when he solo mined steem and relaunched steem so that he could get all the power for himself (regardless of if he deserved the power or not), the waste of 5M USD in creating Bitshares the way it is now, so that he could take the technology and build steem, the referral program which is totally irrelevant to a blockchain, but relevant to a ponzi/scam as it was trying to bring people in and burn so that the stakeholders could profit, the famous liquidity and parking rewards that would tax the current shareholders so that they could incentivise people to buy BTS and keep the scam going and so on.

[member=11011]tonyk[/member] would you be interested in an interview/group chat/podcast whatever with tone vays, me and maybe 1-2 more people? I know you've posted a lot, but I would like to ask you to give me a detailed kind of timeline/review of all the bad/crazy things you've observed, mainly by Bytemaster.


LOL

Offline Ben Mason

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2016, 12:49:20 pm »
Hello everyone!

I'd like to have people's opinion on Bytemaster. Not what he achieved in BitShares, but things that people really thought were wrong or even scummy.
I am here for events that people actually thought that were not just wrong, but had bad intentions behind them. I've come to the conclusion that Bytemaster is creating scams either purposely or by accident. I am leaning more on the accidental side, because he is very incompetent. I understand that many people will be furious for my claims, but I couldn't care less.

When I started in crypto, I viewed most crypto communities as those amazing places where people go and try to create something amazing with the best intentions. With time I learned that there are indeed many many people who are decent, but there are many scammers and people that are there to get rich quickly. But that's not the main problem of the crypto communities. The main problem is that very very few people are actually economists or top developers, yet everyone seems to know what they are doing when nobody actually does.

If I could compare the Bitshares community with a guy, in order to express in a better how I view it, that would be Fuzzy. Fuzzy is an amazing and genuinely nice person, however there are many times that when I hear him talk I think in my head : this guy has no idea of what he is talking about. He can't be that dumb, can he?

Back to the first point. BM's work in both BitShares and Steem, the way he left Bitshares and the Steem 'solo-mining' make me really doubt him as a person. Stealth, Merger, BitAssets are some of the things that I've found really doggy, but as I've been following the community only for the last 7-8 months, I would like some deeper information about him.

What for tarantulaz?  Trying to play on the darker side of human nature, to stir up resentment and get some dirt so you can make money out of posting it on Steemit?  Surely you must know everything you need to in order to build a case against Dan, you seem so certain of your opinions.  Why would you need help to prove your smears? 

The only one behaving in a 'scummy' way is you buddy.  What have you built?  What do you stand for?  Fuzzy and Dan know more about integrity and what blockchain tech can accomplish than you ever will.  Everyone makes mistakes, me, you, everyone.  Not everyone puts themselves out there and tries to accomplish something great.  Failure does not equal betrayal.....only fools would allow themselves to be seduced into thinking like that.  Good luck with your fishing.

I would have liked to know how deep your knowledge of economics is. What has he build? He has build bullshit. Look at the Bitshares market cap. Nobody fully understands what a scam dynamically pegged assets are. But let's assume they are not a scam. They just make no freaking sense, but because they seem to work a small scale, people think that they could work on a larger scale too.

No I am not tone vays, but I am planning on getting him and 1-2 more people, with proper understanding of economics and analyze all the negatives or the scummy/ponzi aspects of steem and bitshares. This way the Bitshares community will at least either be able to disband and go do something better and more productive, or actually fully understand their mistakes and make Bitshares great. By the way, I never said anything bad about fuzzy's integrity. The fact that he has no idea about what he is doing or talking about, has nothing to do with him as a human being. I am thinking in the same way about BM, but with time this view has been fading.

You must have really liked the merger, the bitAssets that lock BTS and raise their value while you dump them to people who think they are stable, the famous stealth feature that ended up as steem when he said that to nobody, when he solo mined steem and relaunched steem so that he could get all the power for himself (regardless of if he deserved the power or not), the waste of 5M USD in creating Bitshares the way it is now, so that he could take the technology and build steem, the referral program which is totally irrelevant to a blockchain, but relevant to a ponzi/scam as it was trying to bring people in and burn so that the stakeholders could profit, the famous liquidity and parking rewards that would tax the current shareholders so that they could incentivise people to buy BTS and keep the scam going and so on.

[member=11011]tonyk[/member] would you be interested in an interview/group chat/podcast whatever with tone vays, me and maybe 1-2 more people? I know you've posted a lot, but I would like to ask you to give me a detailed kind of timeline/review of all the bad/crazy things you've observed, mainly by Bytemaster.
People can work things out for themselves without your help.  They can go through publicly available information objectively rather than embark upon some kind of mad witch hunt.  They can read the Steem whitepaper and compare it with what is actually happening.  No-one is forced to participate.  They can use the Bitshares DEX and see if it offers them something valuable.

I haven't liked the effects of every decision made by the development team, but I understand how they arrived at most of the major ones that affected me.  I understand that sometimes it can appear that there are no good solutions and you have to pick the best of a bad bunch.  That's not to say they made the right decisions for me every time, they didn't.  The biggest issue in the past has always been the challenge to communicate effectively with everyone....but that is extremely challenging for many reasons and I believe they did their best.

I don't understand why you need other people to validate your opinions?  If you are unsure of where your conviction comes from, why have you formed so firm an opinion in the first place?  Why not ask Dan or Ned to answer some questions for you?  Is it because you want to know the answers you're likely to get before you get them?

I don't understand why you are even on Steemit or Bitsharestalk if you are so sure both projects are either an accidental or intentional scam.  Is it possible to have an accidental scam?  Whatever your reasons, I doubt anything I can say will give you pause as you seem to be on a mission.



Offline lil_jay890

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2016, 01:57:19 pm »
I think Dan is a brilliant guy.  The products that the he has brought to the blockchain are innovative and disruptive.  While I think steem has some major flaws that will hinder it's growth, it still is a disruptive idea.

Dan also seems to have a good morale compass as he does seem to be trying to make society better.  The issue that I have had with Dan is that he isn't the kindest to his early investors and shareholders.  The other thing that got me is that early this year he said his new years resolution was to be a better leader for bitshares, but he ended up leaving a few months later after developing steem.  Also he championed sharedropping for years, then the first product he developed he abandoned the sharedropping philosophy.  The people who invested with Invictus and Dan early on were the ones who were really hurt by his attitude towards investors.  Many believed in Dan's vision, but ran out of capital to invest in his "next" project. 

The other issue I have was that Dan said the bitshares worker program was broken and it was impossible to attain consistent funding.  He never even created a worker proposal to try to prove his position.  How can you say something doesn't work if you never even try it?  I think Xeroc, Dan Notenstein and SVK have proven that the worker program does work.

Bottom line is I think Dan is a brilliant guy in many respects.  He just needs some improvement with investor relations, which could be handled by a completely different person in order for him to focus on what he excels at.  I believe if he improved his investor relationship skills, he could reach his goals much faster.

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2016, 03:20:21 pm »

People can work things out for themselves without your help.  They can go through publicly available information objectively rather than embark upon some kind of mad witch hunt.  They can read the Steem whitepaper and compare it with what is actually happening.  No-one is forced to participate.  They can use the Bitshares DEX and see if it offers them something valuable.

I haven't liked the effects of every decision made by the development team, but I understand how they arrived at most of the major ones that affected me.  I understand that sometimes it can appear that there are no good solutions and you have to pick the best of a bad bunch.  That's not to say they made the right decisions for me every time, they didn't.  The biggest issue in the past has always been the challenge to communicate effectively with everyone....but that is extremely challenging for many reasons and I believe they did their best.

I don't understand why you need other people to validate your opinions?  If you are unsure of where your conviction comes from, why have you formed so firm an opinion in the first place?  Why not ask Dan or Ned to answer some questions for you?  Is it because you want to know the answers you're likely to get before you get them?

I don't understand why you are even on Steemit or Bitsharestalk if you are so sure both projects are either an accidental or intentional scam.  Is it possible to have an accidental scam?  Whatever your reasons, I doubt anything I can say will give you pause as you seem to be on a mission.

I was in the community because I liked the spirit and because I was new. I started believing all Bytemaster said, as he is clever and he made a lot of sense. But that sounded good to my old self, when I had no idea about finances and was here because of the good spirit, plus the speculation. Later on, I started finding things that really didn't make sense and that resembled a scam. I started realising that something was wrong with the way BM left. I've listened to every Beyond Bitcoin Podcast for the last 5-6 months and I was thinking : wow this is amazing.

I am not an expert, so I need people to help me document all the things that are wrong. Plus my writing and presenting skills are not the best, so I need help in order to complete the work. What really made me start thinking further was some chats I read about the Onecoin scam and how people can't see it. I was the same with BitShares and Steem. Bitshares mainly. I was fighting everyone that was showing me what was wrong or that was saying bad things about Bytemaster. Look at my previous posts if you don't believe me. People mature and see more things. I am just trying to help the people that were in the same position as I was. It hit me hard when I started realising all the negatives and I understand that people are getting defensive. If you are caught in a good scam and you are both financially and emotionally depended, it is really hard to change your mind. Think of people with thousands invested, but who have also spend 2-3 good years of their lives in this project, while Bytemaster was slowly abandoning the ship.

It is possible. Because Bytemaster and the community were thinking of what they could do to increase the market cap or bring new users in, without even actually understanding Bitshares and having 100% sure that it is safe. We want to bring more users in a PoS chain (which is not safe), even if DPoS is superior. We have only 26% of the people voting and most of these people are not experts. Almost nobody is an expert, but because people's opinion here matter due to voting, everyone things they are experts. Let's do this, let's do that. Let's get people to use our products, that are not fucking viable and that we neglect everything that could go wrong.

tarantulaz

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #14 on: August 24, 2016, 03:29:00 pm »
I think Dan is a brilliant guy.  The products that the he has brought to the blockchain are innovative and disruptive.  While I think steem has some major flaws that will hinder it's growth, it still is a disruptive idea.

Dan also seems to have a good morale compass as he does seem to be trying to make society better.  The issue that I have had with Dan is that he isn't the kindest to his early investors and shareholders.  The other thing that got me is that early this year he said his new years resolution was to be a better leader for bitshares, but he ended up leaving a few months later after developing steem.  Also he championed sharedropping for years, then the first product he developed he abandoned the sharedropping philosophy.  The people who invested with Invictus and Dan early on were the ones who were really hurt by his attitude towards investors.  Many believed in Dan's vision, but ran out of capital to invest in his "next" project. 

The other issue I have was that Dan said the bitshares worker program was broken and it was impossible to attain consistent funding.  He never even created a worker proposal to try to prove his position.  How can you say something doesn't work if you never even try it?  I think Xeroc, Dan Notenstein and SVK have proven that the worker program does work.

Bottom line is I think Dan is a brilliant guy in many respects.  He just needs some improvement with investor relations, which could be handled by a completely different person in order for him to focus on what he excels at.  I believe if he improved his investor relationship skills, he could reach his goals much faster.

Thanks for your decent reply and for answering my question. What I didn't get across very well was that I never said that Bytemaster isn't intelligent. There is a difference between being intelligent, with not actually having the knowledge to design specific systems or being a good scammer. I observed behaviours that were unethical in many aspects. That has nothing to do with someone having good views on the world or being intelligent.

There are way too many people, almost every human being that says he is going to do something, but does something else. I.e religious people, like Dan used to be, might preach about peace, love etc but they end up hating and killing more people than the rest. Dan might wanted to do something, but his personality wasn't letting him do these things.

Anyways, any more information on why he let the initial investors down or how he spend the 5M USD?

Offline Ben Mason

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #15 on: August 24, 2016, 04:22:34 pm »

People can work things out for themselves without your help.  They can go through publicly available information objectively rather than embark upon some kind of mad witch hunt.  They can read the Steem whitepaper and compare it with what is actually happening.  No-one is forced to participate.  They can use the Bitshares DEX and see if it offers them something valuable.

I haven't liked the effects of every decision made by the development team, but I understand how they arrived at most of the major ones that affected me.  I understand that sometimes it can appear that there are no good solutions and you have to pick the best of a bad bunch.  That's not to say they made the right decisions for me every time, they didn't.  The biggest issue in the past has always been the challenge to communicate effectively with everyone....but that is extremely challenging for many reasons and I believe they did their best.

I don't understand why you need other people to validate your opinions?  If you are unsure of where your conviction comes from, why have you formed so firm an opinion in the first place?  Why not ask Dan or Ned to answer some questions for you?  Is it because you want to know the answers you're likely to get before you get them?

I don't understand why you are even on Steemit or Bitsharestalk if you are so sure both projects are either an accidental or intentional scam.  Is it possible to have an accidental scam?  Whatever your reasons, I doubt anything I can say will give you pause as you seem to be on a mission.

I was in the community because I liked the spirit and because I was new. I started believing all Bytemaster said, as he is clever and he made a lot of sense. But that sounded good to my old self, when I had no idea about finances and was here because of the good spirit, plus the speculation. Later on, I started finding things that really didn't make sense and that resembled a scam. I started realising that something was wrong with the way BM left. I've listened to every Beyond Bitcoin Podcast for the last 5-6 months and I was thinking : wow this is amazing.

I am not an expert, so I need people to help me document all the things that are wrong. Plus my writing and presenting skills are not the best, so I need help in order to complete the work. What really made me start thinking further was some chats I read about the Onecoin scam and how people can't see it. I was the same with BitShares and Steem. Bitshares mainly. I was fighting everyone that was showing me what was wrong or that was saying bad things about Bytemaster. Look at my previous posts if you don't believe me. People mature and see more things. I am just trying to help the people that were in the same position as I was. It hit me hard when I started realising all the negatives and I understand that people are getting defensive. If you are caught in a good scam and you are both financially and emotionally depended, it is really hard to change your mind. Think of people with thousands invested, but who have also spend 2-3 good years of their lives in this project, while Bytemaster was slowly abandoning the ship.

It is possible. Because Bytemaster and the community were thinking of what they could do to increase the market cap or bring new users in, without even actually understanding Bitshares and having 100% sure that it is safe. We want to bring more users in a PoS chain (which is not safe), even if DPoS is superior. We have only 26% of the people voting and most of these people are not experts. Almost nobody is an expert, but because people's opinion here matter due to voting, everyone things they are experts. Let's do this, let's do that. Let's get people to use our products, that are not fucking viable and that we neglect everything that could go wrong.

I give up.  There is so much wrong with your objectivity, I half believe you are joking.  I'll just say this, you clearly feel you've been let down by Dan but equally clear is the fact that you don't understand why or how.  Looking to others to validate your seething emotions does nobody any good, including you.  If you are doing it for others, thank you but no thank you.  Everyone is more than capable of investigating things for themselves (assuming that the code is benign.)

Offline KenMonkey

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #16 on: August 24, 2016, 07:38:31 pm »
He was not under any obligation to give steem to bitshares holders. Don't be sad about it. Anyone could have bought steem when it was 15-20c

tarantulaz

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2016, 03:55:51 pm »

I give up.  There is so much wrong with your objectivity, I half believe you are joking.  I'll just say this, you clearly feel you've been let down by Dan but equally clear is the fact that you don't understand why or how.  Looking to others to validate your seething emotions does nobody any good, including you.  If you are doing it for others, thank you but no thank you.  Everyone is more than capable of investigating things for themselves (assuming that the code is benign.)

My objectivity is wrong. OK. I clearly feel let down because of what? I am not really invested in Bitshares and never had anything else other than a tiny amount. I know that many people won't listen, because their money and time is at stake. Same goes for you. My objectivity is wrong, but yours is right. You have no right on being objective. 1000 posts. This is a hell lot of time with the scammers to make you objective. Fact is that I don't know your status in the community and your relationship with BM and Bitshares, so I can't judge you as a person, but your objectivity is non-existent.

I wanna create a full report and see if Bytemaster is actually a scammer or incompetent. He is one or the other, that's for sure. Telling me not to investigate sounds very suspicious. It is so stupid to tell someone not to investigate when he has detected a potential scam (Steem) and let the victims, maybe, investigate themselves. What a fucking joke. If you don't appreciate it, I don't care. 10 others might do and that's fine with me.

Again, I see Bytemaster leaving the community as good thing. Probably an amazing thing. I don't see Bitshares as having any success in the near future, especially when LN and Omni/Counterparty combine. But if there is a chance for Bitshares to succeed is now.

Offline chryspano

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2016, 07:47:55 pm »


LOL 2.0

Offline tonyk

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Re: Your opinion on Bytemaster
« Reply #19 on: August 26, 2016, 08:20:39 pm »

[member=11011]tonyk[/member] would you be interested in an interview/group chat/podcast whatever with tone vays, me and maybe 1-2 more people? I know you've posted a lot, but I would like to ask you to give me a detailed kind of timeline/review of all the bad/crazy things you've observed, mainly by Bytemaster.

I am not completely sure it was not a misspell ...but if not sure.

PS
Hope this does not sound reverseflash,
but I do fell ,I know I know bytemaster aka @theman a touch more than his own psychiatrist and or mother by now....
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.