Author Topic: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%  (Read 7385 times)

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Offline abit

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #45 on: November 14, 2017, 10:14:05 pm »
The peg at your ramp (or whoever runs it) is off because deposit and withdrawal volumes are different. This has nothing to do with price feed or fairness. And anyway, you should not address the problems of your ramp by screwing up a committee token. Issue your own token and do whatever you want with it.
This is an even deeper issue.
Deposit and withdrawal volumes are different (actually at this moment more people want to deposit with fiat but less want to withdraw), means there are more demands than supply, in order to maintain the peg we should provide more supply, so it's fair to bias to shorters.
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Offline yvv

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #46 on: November 14, 2017, 10:46:29 pm »
The peg at your ramp (or whoever runs it) is off because deposit and withdrawal volumes are different. This has nothing to do with price feed or fairness. And anyway, you should not address the problems of your ramp by screwing up a committee token. Issue your own token and do whatever you want with it.
This is an even deeper issue.
Deposit and withdrawal volumes are different (actually at this moment more people want to deposit with fiat but less want to withdraw), means there are more demands than supply, in order to maintain the peg we should provide more supply, so it's fair to bias to shorters.

There is enough of supply of bitCNY, you can buy it at discount rate at DEX. The problem with your ramp is that it has a broken arbitrage loop, you should close it.

What are you trying to do instead is making the peg closer at one market by breaking it worse at another market.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 11:01:55 pm by yvv »

Offline abit

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #47 on: November 14, 2017, 11:09:28 pm »
The peg at your ramp (or whoever runs it) is off because deposit and withdrawal volumes are different. This has nothing to do with price feed or fairness. And anyway, you should not address the problems of your ramp by screwing up a committee token. Issue your own token and do whatever you want with it.
This is an even deeper issue.
Deposit and withdrawal volumes are different (actually at this moment more people want to deposit with fiat but less want to withdraw), means there are more demands than supply, in order to maintain the peg we should provide more supply, so it's fair to bias to shorters.

There is enough of supply of bitCNY, you can buy it at discount rate at DEX. The problem with your ramp is that it has a broken loop, you should close it.

What are you trying to do instead is making the peg closer at one market by breaking it worse at another market.
Fiat ramps are important to get mass adoption. I'm shocked that you think it should be closed. Without mass adoption, bitAssets are only toys. Without mass adoption, BTS won't worth much.

Actually the feed issue has nothing to do with the ramps. I'd admit some of my previous arguments are focused on the wrong way. 1% premium is not big a deal.

The certainty to be able to buy cheap bitCNY directly from the Dex (at market price) then settle the bought bitCNY for more BTS via force settlement (at feed price) is just wrong, which means the price feed provided by witnesses is incorrect, is away from the market price. Even if the ramp is closed, the price feed issue is still there. This issue has been with us for quite some days, it's serious so need to be addressed.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 11:12:13 pm by abit »
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Offline yvv

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #48 on: November 14, 2017, 11:31:22 pm »
The peg at your ramp (or whoever runs it) is off because deposit and withdrawal volumes are different. This has nothing to do with price feed or fairness. And anyway, you should not address the problems of your ramp by screwing up a committee token. Issue your own token and do whatever you want with it.
This is an even deeper issue.
Deposit and withdrawal volumes are different (actually at this moment more people want to deposit with fiat but less want to withdraw), means there are more demands than supply, in order to maintain the peg we should provide more supply, so it's fair to bias to shorters.

There is enough of supply of bitCNY, you can buy it at discount rate at DEX. The problem with your ramp is that it has a broken loop, you should close it.

What are you trying to do instead is making the peg closer at one market by breaking it worse at another market.
Fiat ramps are important to get mass adoption. I'm shocked that you think it should be closed.

Dude, can you read english words? I am talking about closing the broken arbitrage loop, not about closing your ramp. I know how important are fiat ramps.

Offline yvv

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #49 on: November 15, 2017, 03:42:24 am »
By the way, I can't try you magicwallet because I can't read Chinese, but I feel that this is an awesome project. The problem which you have with peg offset is natural, because you will always have disbalance between deposits/withdrawals, you just need to think out the best solution for it without rush. Do it right and you'll be the kings.

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #50 on: November 15, 2017, 08:01:40 am »
Argument is good, but please focuse the problem,  the BTS in Poloniex was a "Stand-alone game" now, BTS can't Deposit and Withdraw for days, the feed price from the Poloniex has no any reference value.

So, we have four solutions: 
1. Contact with the Poloniex to open Deposit and Withdraw  BTS asap;
2. Kick out the Poloniex from the feed price asap;
3. Raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5% for now;
4. Do nothing on the sidelines, seeing the BTS to die slowly.

Which you can do? to do it now.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2017, 08:11:07 am by binggo »

Offline fav

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #51 on: November 15, 2017, 08:06:24 am »
Argument is good, but please focuse the problem,  the BTS in Poloniex was a "Stand-alone game" now, BTS can't Deposit and Withdraw for days, the feed price from the Poloniex has no any reference value.

So, we have four solutions: 
1. Cotanct with the Poloniex to open Deposit and Withdraw  BTS asap;
2. Kick out the Poloniex from the feed price asap;
3. Raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5% for now;
4. Do nothing on the sidelines, seeing the BTS to die slowly.

Which you can do? to do it now.

only reasonable solution is asking witnesses to fix their feeds. that's what they get paid for
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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #52 on: November 15, 2017, 08:57:47 am »
Argument is good, but please focuse the problem,  the BTS in Poloniex was a "Stand-alone game" now, BTS can't Deposit and Withdraw for days, the feed price from the Poloniex has no any reference value.

So, we have four solutions: 
1. Cotanct with the Poloniex to open Deposit and Withdraw  BTS asap;
2. Kick out the Poloniex from the feed price asap;
3. Raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5% for now;
4. Do nothing on the sidelines, seeing the BTS to die slowly.

Which you can do? to do it now.

only reasonable solution is asking witnesses to fix their feeds. that's what they get paid for

So, now we need to know how? when? who to do this?
how to make sure all the witnesses fix their feeds? :( :( :(

Offline guan1990

Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #53 on: November 15, 2017, 09:23:46 am »
Argument is good, but please focuse the problem,  the BTS in Poloniex was a "Stand-alone game" now, BTS can't Deposit and Withdraw for days, the feed price from the Poloniex has no any reference value.

So, we have four solutions: 
1. Cotanct with the Poloniex to open Deposit and Withdraw  BTS asap;
2. Kick out the Poloniex from the feed price asap;
3. Raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5% for now;
4. Do nothing on the sidelines, seeing the BTS to die slowly.

Which you can do? to do it now.

only reasonable solution is asking witnesses to fix their feeds. that's what they get paid for


please read my post on  38# to  see  if witnesses  can do it.It's  profitable by harming  the  CNY market  through   setting   low feeding  prices .We  should  admit that  the Poloniex price is not  real  market demand price(I  call BTSs which can be circulated  are True BTSs and polo's BTSs are fake BTSs).The  scene  is much  alike   some  institutions  removed  Okcoin's BTC price in the BTC  index when  the  CN  gov.  forced  okcoin to  forbidden  the withdraw of BTCs.

Offline 天籁

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #54 on: November 15, 2017, 09:31:18 am »
Congratulation! +5%

binggo

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #55 on: November 15, 2017, 09:39:56 am »
Argument is good, but please focuse the problem,  the BTS in Poloniex was a "Stand-alone game" now, BTS can't Deposit and Withdraw for days, the feed price from the Poloniex has no any reference value.

So, we have four solutions: 
1. Cotanct with the Poloniex to open Deposit and Withdraw  BTS asap;
2. Kick out the Poloniex from the feed price asap;
3. Raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5% for now;
4. Do nothing on the sidelines, seeing the BTS to die slowly.

Which you can do? to do it now.

only reasonable solution is asking witnesses to fix their feeds. that's what they get paid for


please read my post on  38# to  see  if witnesses  can do it.It's  profitable by harming  the  CNY market  through   setting   low feeding  prices .We  should  admit that  the Poloniex price is not  real  market demand price(I  call BTSs which can be circulated  are True BTSs and polo's BTSs are fake BTSs).The  scene  is much  alike   some  institutions  removed  Okcoin's BTC price in the BTC  index when  the  CN  gov.  forced  okcoin to  forbidden  the withdraw of BTCs.

Yes, we need someone to do these, but no one do, only argument, not give a solution. This is not good for bts.
we need talk, think , solve these problems, make the BTS more strong, more powerful, more more influential in the world.
BM have left BTS, but the soul of the bts can't vanish.
We need to read again what BM said:" WHAT BTS IS?"

Offline mf-tzo

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #56 on: November 15, 2017, 10:46:59 am »
I am curious how witnesses get their feeds... The only centralized exchange trading bts is poloniex and  AEX.
Normally the feed should be according to the weighted volume of each exchange including the internal DEX trading. I hope you do this.

Now that Poloniex has issues with bts withdrawals and deposits I believe feed SHOULD NOT take into account at all the price from Poloniex until the issue is resolved. If you guys take feeds from Polo now then this is extremely dangerous!!!

I can not comment on AEX yet..

Feed should be endogenous and not exogenous now until polo fix its problems and should be based from the internal DEX trading imho..

In regards to this proposal I have not decided if it should have been approved but my initial thought says that force settlement should not have been raised by 5% and instead the feed should have been adjusted accordingly..

Finally, does anyone has an update of what is the status with Polo and when the issue is expected to be resolved?
 

binggo

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #57 on: November 15, 2017, 11:39:35 am »
I am curious how witnesses get their feeds... The only centralized exchange trading bts is poloniex and  AEX.
Normally the feed should be according to the weighted volume of each exchange including the internal DEX trading. I hope you do this.

Now that Poloniex has issues with bts withdrawals and deposits I believe feed SHOULD NOT take into account at all the price from Poloniex until the issue is resolved. If you guys take feeds from Polo now then this is extremely dangerous!!!

I can not comment on AEX yet..

Feed should be endogenous and not exogenous now until polo fix its problems and should be based from the internal DEX trading imho..

In regards to this proposal I have not decided if it should have been approved but my initial thought says that force settlement should not have been raised by 5% and instead the feed should have been adjusted accordingly..

Finally, does anyone has an update of what is the status with Polo and when the issue is expected to be resolved?

5% is only for BITCNY, and a temporary expedient.
Some problems maybe solved in one week, one month or one year, no one knows.
There have an opportunity for BTS in China, we must catch the opportunity in the hand asap,
but the internal DEX (BITCNY) was harming by the wrong feed price(Poloniex), we must do somthing to stop this situation, not only for BITCNY, but for the BTS.
In the future, i belive we will find a better way to solve this problem.

Offline abit

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Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #58 on: November 15, 2017, 12:05:52 pm »
It's really not easy to always find a "correct" price.

While Poloniex disabled BTS deposit/withdrawal, it still has the biggest trading volume. I guess many traders there just don't care about deposit/withdrawal. Other exchanges which have listed BTS, except the DEX it self, are either unable to get data or has too low influence:

* AEX.com: witnesses were are able to fetch price data. However, earlier today aex.com added a javascript redirection to it's API, now even coinmarketcap.com is unable to fetch price from it, I guess witnesses are unable to get their data as well (at least I am). Due to the unstable API, it's not guaranteed that we can always get the data.
* EXX.com: no public API to get price data so far. Low volume.
* LBANK.info: the API works, but the market depth is very thin, volume is apparently manipulated.
* Bitcoin Indonesia (bitcoin.co.id): low volume.
* Livecoin.net: low volume.

In the meanwhile, as of writing, BTC price trading in BTS:OPEN.BTC pair is even lower than Poloniex.

Markets with low volume or low depth are easier to be manipulated.

//Update: I forgot zb.com. will update about the status soon.

//Update 2: API of zb.com is working, their have BTS/USDT and BTS/BTC markets, as of writing the USDT market has better volume. However, I heard it's unable to withdraw USDT right now, so the price is not as reliable as well.

//Update 3:
coinegg.com: is live and the API is working, but volume is low.
xbrick.io: looks like the markets are not live yet.

//Update 4: aex API seems recovered.

//Update 5: another exchange, big.one, low volume
« Last Edit: November 15, 2017, 06:39:06 pm by abit »
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Offline guan1990

Re: plan to raise the bitCNY force settlement offset to 5%
« Reply #59 on: November 15, 2017, 12:45:34 pm »
I am curious how witnesses get their feeds... The only centralized exchange trading bts is poloniex and  AEX.
Normally the feed should be according to the weighted volume of each exchange including the internal DEX trading. I hope you do this.

Now that Poloniex has issues with bts withdrawals and deposits I believe feed SHOULD NOT take into account at all the price from Poloniex until the issue is resolved. If you guys take feeds from Polo now then this is extremely dangerous!!!

I can not comment on AEX yet..

Feed should be endogenous and not exogenous now until polo fix its problems and should be based from the internal DEX trading imho..

In regards to this proposal I have not decided if it should have been approved but my initial thought says that force settlement should not have been raised by 5% and instead the feed should have been adjusted accordingly..

Finally, does anyone has an update of what is the status with Polo and when the issue is expected to be resolved?


Not only  aex,but  also  zb.com,it's  former  Chbtc.com.Zb.com  is  leading  all  the market in  BTS  price because it  keeps   RMB   deposit  channel in  a  delicate way.There are  also  some small exchanges like coinegg.com(former jubi.com) and  xbrick.io (former  19800.com) which have a  place to  trade  BTSs.