Author Topic: I need help trying to convince a friend to consider supporting Bitshares.  (Read 5438 times)

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clout

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Bitshares solves all the inherent problems of bitcoin:

- slow transactions per second when compared to a major payment processor like visa (7 tps vs 10,000 tps)
- wallets are machine readable not human readable (as a result something like 5% of btc have been irrevocably lost)
- transactions are not anonymous
- distribution model is inflationary, even if the argument can be made that the inflation has been priced in
- price volatility (obviously this is the biggest deterrent when it comes to adoption as a major currency)
- security of the network cost anywhere from $500 million to $1 billion annually depending on the bitcoin market capitalization
- control of the network is proportional to hashing power not proportional to you relative bitcoin holdings
- centralization of hashing power under the control of a single mining pool

How Bitshares solves these issues:

- DPOS reduces block production to 15-30 seconds and since computational resources are used for the purpose of transaction propagation and confirmation rather than pointless computational work, DPOS blockchains can scale to the transaction load of visa
- Bitshares uses accounts that can be registered on the blockchain. Users no longer need to send money to an alpha numeric string that can be miscopied. Instead you send money as easily you would send an email and in the exact same fashion. It is very difficult to send to a wrong account. You can still send to public keys but its unnecessary and adds little advantage
- Bitshares uses TITAN which automates the creation of stealth address using an accounts registered public key. No need for mixing or "masternodes." All transactions are inherently anonymous without the user needing to do anything
- Bitshares is a 100% proof of stake system so all the shares are pre-allocated and there is no need for the dilution of stake
- Bitshares X is a bank that allows people to hold deposits in whatever asset they want. This system allows investors with a higher risk tolerance to collateralize and trade virtual assets, to ensure that users who simply want to use crypto currencies as a stable medium of exchange can do so without risk due to the volatility of the networks main equity/currency. (That is to say that if you put $100 in the network your deposit always redeemable for $100 worth of bitshares, as a result of the free market peg of bitUSD to real USD)
- The cost of securing the network is simply a fraction of the transaction fees accumulated by the network. Transaction fees are destroyed which acts as an implicit dividend to holders of bitshares and makes Bitshares truly deflationary.
- Delegates compete for votes and the top 101 delegates produce blocks. The job of a delegate is simple include as many valid transactions
in your given block and sign a single block. If a delegate signs multiple blocks they are immediately fired. If a delegate blocks transactions they will be voted out of office. Each round delegates are randomly assigned a block to produce thereby making it that much harder to coordinate a sustained attack on the network without 51% of the shares.
- Shareholder votes are proportionate to the relative number of shares they own. The DAC is completely shareholder run

Bitshares solves all the problems of bitcoin and does not overcomplicate things in the way that Ethereum does. When you view these crypto currencies networks through metaphor of a company you realize how misinformed people are about how these networks should be designed.  It is imperative that the developers of a crypto currency network have a solid understanding of economics and I believe that Dan Larimer and his team have the best economic perspective  in the crypto currency space. To be honest if you truly evaluate the fundamentals ethereum is just not even comparable, both as a crypto network and as an investment. People need to stop buying into hype and do the necessary research before they invest.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2014, 09:57:44 pm by clout »

Offline Empirical1

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Bitshares solves all the inherent problems of bitcoin:

- slow transactions per second when compared to a major payment processor like visa (7 tps vs 10,000 tps)
- wallets are machine readable not human readable (as a result something like 5% of btc have been irrevocably lost)
- transactions are not anonymous
- distribution model is inflationary, even if the argument can be made that the inflation has been priced in
- price volatility (obviously this is the biggest deterrent when it comes to adoption as a major currency)
- security of the network cost anywhere from $500 million to $1 billion annually depending on the bitcoin market capitalization
- control of the network is proportional to hashing power not proportional to you relative bitcoin holdings
- centralization of hashing power under the control of a single mining pool

How Bitshares solves these issues:

- DPOS reduces block production to 15-30 seconds and since computational resources are used for the purpose of transaction propagation and confirmation rather than pointless computational work, DPOS blockchains can scale to the transaction load of visa
- Bitshares uses accounts that can be registered on the blockchain. Users no longer need to send money to an alpha numeric string that can be miscopied. Instead you send money as easily you would send an email and in the exact same fashion. It is very difficult to send to a wrong account. You can still send to public keys but its unnecessary and adds little advantage
- Bitshares uses TITAN which automates the creation of stealth address using an accounts registered public key. No need for mixing or "masternodes." All transactions are inherently anonymous without the user needing to do anything
- Bitshares is a 100% proof of stake system so all the shares are pre-allocated and there is no need for the dilution of stake
- Bitshares X is a bank that allows people to hold deposits in whatever asset they want. This system allows investors with a higher risk tolerance to collateralize and trade virtual assets, to ensure that users who simply want to use crypto currencies as a stable medium of exchange can do so without risk due to the volatility of the networks main equity/currency. (That is to say that if you put $100 in the network your deposit always redeemable for $100 worth of bitshares, as a result of the free market peg of bitUSD to real USD)
- The cost of securing the network is simply a fraction of the transaction fees accumulated by the network. Transaction fees are destroyed which acts as an implicit dividend to holders of bitshares and makes Bitshares truly deflationary.
- Delegates compete for votes and the top 101 delegates produce blocks. The job of a delegate is simple include as many valid transactions
in your given block and sign a single block. If a delegate signs multiple blocks they are immediately fired. If a delegate blocks transactions they will be voted out of office. Each round delegates are randomly assigned a block to produce thereby making it that much harder to coordinate a sustained attack on the network without 51% of the shares.
- Shareholder votes are proportionate to the relative number of shares they own. The DAC is completely shareholder run

Bitshares solves all the problems of bitcoin and does not overcomplicate things in the way that Ethereum does. When you view these crypto currencies networks through metaphor of a company you realize how misinformed people are about how these networks should be designed.  It is imperative that the developers of a crypto currency network have a solid understanding of economics and I believe that Dan Larimer and his team have the best economic perspective  in the crypto currency space. To be honest if you truly evaluate the fundamentals ethereum is just not even comparable, both as a crypto network and as an investment. People need to stop buying into hype and do the necessary research before they invest.

 +5% FANTASTIC POST  :)

Can anyone explain or point to a good post explaining why DPOS is better than NXT POS?


Offline tonyk

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Can anyone explain or point to a good post explaining why DPOS is better than NXT POS?


Knowing the order of the block producers makes it faster  +

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=4677.msg60191#msg60191
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline Empirical1

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Can anyone explain or point to a good post explaining why DPOS is better than NXT POS?


Knowing the order of the block producers makes it faster  +

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=4677.msg60191#msg60191

On their website they say

Quote
Nxt Transparent Forging will allow Nxt to approach Visa/Mastercard rates of transactions. This is possible with Nxt because the transparency provided in the protocol will allow each user's client to determine which node will generate the next block. Other nodes can then send their transactions directly to that node. This also allows additional fees to be realized for immediate, priority transactions.

Their other advantages

Quote
An equally important feature of Nxt Transparent Forging is a security mechanism to prevent forked chains from being forged by high-stake nodes. This prevents against even a 90% majority owner of all Nxt branching out and forcing a fork.

Quote
The Nxt Alias System translates alphaneumeric text into almost anything: Nxt account addresses, email addresses, URLs, phone numbers, SKU codes, and more.
The Nxt Alias System has the ability to function as a Decentralized DNS system, and adds additional possibilities for mapping short names to other entities.

Quote
Nxt Arbitrary Messaging is a feature that Nxt users to send messages to each other through the decentralized network. Nxt Arbitrary Messaging can be used to send simple text, but it can also be used to build complex file-sharing services and other decentralized applications.

Quote
Nxt is "forged" with a small program that can be installed on a regular computer. It is "forging" for transaction of currency that already exists and does not require the extensive mining systems of Proof of Work currencies like Bitcoin and altcoins. The power efficiency of using an average PC makes Nxt more friendly to the environment.

Nxt Account Leasing allows an account to lease its forging power to another account for a fixed period of time. There is no requirement to send coins anywhere allowing for the creation of secure forging pools.

1. I think our website looks better but they clearly communicate their advantages on their homepage which is maybe something we should do.

Any other big advantages of DPOS vs. POS besides speed? - Which might not be that much of an advantage if they can really approach Visa transaction rates too. 

« Last Edit: June 23, 2014, 11:07:06 pm by Empirical1 »

Offline liondani

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 +5% +5% +5% +5% +5%

to clout   

Offline PotatoPeeler

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This thread has been most fantastic.  It really is hard for me to defend Bitshares when I can not speak with any authority towards Etherium. Review sites often will have a feature grid.  I often see it in advertising.  This is so you can compare and contrast to make an informed decision.  There is much information to take in from this thread. I think I'll email my friend to read this.

Thank you to everyone who has responded so far.

PS. I like Etherium but that doesnt mean I don't love Bitshares more !!!! 

merockstar

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I'd suggest focusing on the advantages and impressive features of your system rather than focusing on what makes all its competitors bad.  That just looks defensive.

IMO if Bytemaster succeeds we'll have very very fast reliable transactions at a very low cost, the advantages of the blockchain without many of the costs.

It is fairly compelling, but it all hinges on Bytemasters ability to bring a new paradigm into reality.    Ya'll should really focus on what you're doing rather than what everybody else is doing wrong, that's not a contest you want to get into right now lol.

I think marketing anything requires communicating both your own strengths as well as the weaknesses of your competitor/s.

It is dangerous and uneceesary to point out competitors weakness. If you successfully communicate your own strengths your audience will know your competitors weaknesses without you directly bringing attention to them.

The strategy has occasionally succeeded - but more often failed.

http://www.cbc.ca/undertheinfluence/season-3/2014/06/14/when-brands-mock-other-brands-1/

I agree, mudslinging only works in presidential campaigns. We should be painting bitshares as a plausible alternative.

Offline gamey

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Slinging mud is not the same thing as comparing 2 possibilities.

Any developer interested in a DAE or any business interested in hiring I3/others to implement a DAC will need this sort of information.

If you want Bitshares to succeed, you need to start getting developers on board.  This starts with developer's understanding the pros/cons of the different approaches of Bitshares vs. Etherium.  If you wait for them to hear about Bitshares via created DACs then they may already be too committed to existing projects to change course.

Comparisons can be anywhere from "mocking" to a straight forward unbiased comparison.  There is a lot of gray area.  I remember when I was first trying to determine which of the 2 I wanted to be involved with.  I found a few broad bits of information but it was hard to do a direct comparison of the 2 technologies.

Lots of developers may not even go this far.  They may just fall for the hype.  Thats why information is needed.

editted to remove reference to narcissism. :)
« Last Edit: June 24, 2014, 04:34:55 am by gamey »
I speak for myself and only myself.

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@clout: pm me your PTS address .. you need to receive a tip for this grandiose post!

@all others .. it's our duty to spread the words .. let's go viral!
Give BitShares a try! Use the http://testnet.bitshares.eu provided by http://bitshares.eu powered by ChainSquad GmbH

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Can I copy that post (+layouting) to the bitShares wiki?
Give BitShares a try! Use the http://testnet.bitshares.eu provided by http://bitshares.eu powered by ChainSquad GmbH

Offline toast

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Can I copy that post (+layouting) to the bitShares wiki?

OMG YES
Do not use this post as information for making any important decisions. The only agreements I ever make are informal and non-binding. Take the same precautions as when dealing with a compromised account, scammer, sockpuppet, etc.

Offline Amazon

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Good job clout +5%
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Offline metalallen

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Bitshares solves all the inherent problems of bitcoin:

- slow transactions per second when compared to a major payment processor like visa (7 tps vs 10,000 tps)
- wallets are machine readable not human readable (as a result something like 5% of btc have been irrevocably lost)
- transactions are not anonymous
- distribution model is inflationary, even if the argument can be made that the inflation has been priced in
- price volatility (obviously this is the biggest deterrent when it comes to adoption as a major currency)
- security of the network cost anywhere from $500 million to $1 billion annually depending on the bitcoin market capitalization
- control of the network is proportional to hashing power not proportional to you relative bitcoin holdings
- centralization of hashing power under the control of a single mining pool

How Bitshares solves these issues:

- DPOS reduces block production to 15-30 seconds and since computational resources are used for the purpose of transaction propagation and confirmation rather than pointless computational work, DPOS blockchains can scale to the transaction load of visa
- Bitshares uses accounts that can be registered on the blockchain. Users no longer need to send money to an alpha numeric string that can be miscopied. Instead you send money as easily you would send an email and in the exact same fashion. It is very difficult to send to a wrong account. You can still send to public keys but its unnecessary and adds little advantage
- Bitshares uses TITAN which automates the creation of stealth address using an accounts registered public key. No need for mixing or "masternodes." All transactions are inherently anonymous without the user needing to do anything
- Bitshares is a 100% proof of stake system so all the shares are pre-allocated and there is no need for the dilution of stake
- Bitshares X is a bank that allows people to hold deposits in whatever asset they want. This system allows investors with a higher risk tolerance to collateralize and trade virtual assets, to ensure that users who simply want to use crypto currencies as a stable medium of exchange can do so without risk due to the volatility of the networks main equity/currency. (That is to say that if you put $100 in the network your deposit always redeemable for $100 worth of bitshares, as a result of the free market peg of bitUSD to real USD)
- The cost of securing the network is simply a fraction of the transaction fees accumulated by the network. Transaction fees are destroyed which acts as an implicit dividend to holders of bitshares and makes Bitshares truly deflationary.
- Delegates compete for votes and the top 101 delegates produce blocks. The job of a delegate is simple include as many valid transactions
in your given block and sign a single block. If a delegate signs multiple blocks they are immediately fired. If a delegate blocks transactions they will be voted out of office. Each round delegates are randomly assigned a block to produce thereby making it that much harder to coordinate a sustained attack on the network without 51% of the shares.
- Shareholder votes are proportionate to the relative number of shares they own. The DAC is completely shareholder run

Bitshares solves all the problems of bitcoin and does not overcomplicate things in the way that Ethereum does. When you view these crypto currencies networks through metaphor of a company you realize how misinformed people are about how these networks should be designed.  It is imperative that the developers of a crypto currency network have a solid understanding of economics and I believe that Dan Larimer and his team have the best economic perspective  in the crypto currency space. To be honest if you truly evaluate the fundamentals ethereum is just not even comparable, both as a crypto network and as an investment. People need to stop buying into hype and do the necessary research before they invest.

I translated this into Chinese. Hopefully it will help newbies in China to see the whole picture.
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=5290.0
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Offline mint chocolate chip

clout your explanation is superb.

Offline Overthetop

Great post.  :)
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