Author Topic: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!  (Read 94562 times)

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Offline Method-X

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Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #60 on: September 08, 2014, 01:47:46 am »

So basically this is the best thing ever? If I can be the test sample as a layman // the future average user...this is incredible.

I can put some savings stash in bitUSD and convert to physical fiat if I ever wanted to and be gaining 5-10% per year?

Yup. Since the exchange is decentralized and autonomous, most fees are given to BitAsset holders. So the actual interest rate is variable and could potentially be more than 10% depending on trading activity.

Offline liondani

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Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #61 on: September 08, 2014, 02:50:17 am »
would it be better that the system quit/cancel automaticaly market orders that are for example more than 4 months old, since it could be trapped collateral from users they could not cancel their orders due the current buggy software (?)

Offline jsidhu

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Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #62 on: September 08, 2014, 06:40:45 am »
I originally posted this in the bitUSD interest announcement but it's better suited here :) .


Why not just buy bitUSD on the open market so your BTSX isn't held up?
Going short/long at the same time is equivalent to holding BTSX with an option to double your stake at todays prices at any time.

I'm clearly missing something here. Someone help me fill in the blanks.

1) I short 100 bitUSD which at current $0.031 peg(ish) would be ~3225.82 BTSX
2) Someone takes the other side so now there's an extra 100 bitUSD supply and I have about 6451.61 BTSX tied up in collateral
3) Fast forward to Dec. 1st, 2014 when BTSX/bitUSD is 1/1 ( :D  Hush, it's my hypothetical example)
4) I buy 100 bitUSD for 100 BTSX and cover my order, releasing the 6451.61 BTSX back into my account.

Is it the case that of the 6451.61 BTSX half of it came from selling the original 100 bitUSD and therefore is profit (minus the 100 BTSX I had to spend to buy the bitUSD to cover)?

If I bought my own short wouldn't I just be breaking even?

There should be fees associated with shorting depending on  how far away from the peg it is (bitUSD to $1 USD)... anything above I think yea you would break-even (incentive to short) and anything below you would pay a fee and would not break-even in btsx terms (incentive to buy). Ofcourse you would profit if btsx rises, and lose if btsx falls from initial price.

The fee would be a market derived value and you won't know it until the time you want to execute the short trade.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2014, 06:51:55 am by jsidhu »
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Offline Maximus0352

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Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #63 on: September 08, 2014, 08:51:51 am »
Question:

If I have btc and I happy with the value of approximately 480.00 +/- USD per btc, can I purchase BTSX > then transfer BTSX to my wallet > then purchase BitUSD and store the value in the exchange and retain my approximately 480.00 USD? Rather than sell my BTC on coinbase or elsewhere and convert it to fiat and store it in a bank?  What are the advantages or disadvantages if this is how it would work.

Thanks!

Absolutely! On Bter.com you can actually move directly from BTC -> BitUSD.

If you can't trade directly from BTC to BitUSD, like you said, you can go from BTC -> BTSX -> move to wallet/exchange app -> trade to BitUSD.

Your $480 will be "locked in" even if BTSX goes down in value.

I don't know if you've heard about the announcement but starting this Wednesday, holders of BitUSD (and any other BitAsset) will be paid interest on their holdings. You'll be sheltered from the volatility of cryptocurrencies and you'll still be making about 5 - 10% interest per year. So moving your BTC into BitUSD will be considerably more profitable than keeping it on an exchange or in a local bank.

BitGLD and BitSLV will launch in the near future so putting your funds in gold and silver will be another option for you to consider. :D

Since Wednesday will be a big day for bitUSD, folks should move their BTSX into bitUSD and sell at the appropriate time? I'm guessing BTSX may drop off because of big bitUSD buys.

Offline vegolino

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Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #64 on: September 08, 2014, 12:03:00 pm »
I originally posted this in the bitUSD interest announcement but it's better suited here :) .


Why not just buy bitUSD on the open market so your BTSX isn't held up?
Going short/long at the same time is equivalent to holding BTSX with an option to double your stake at todays prices at any time.

I'm clearly missing something here. Someone help me fill in the blanks.

1) I short 100 bitUSD which at current $0.031 peg(ish) would be ~3225.82 BTSX
2) Someone takes the other side so now there's an extra 100 bitUSD supply and I have about 6451.61 BTSX tied up in collateral
3) Fast forward to Dec. 1st, 2014 when BTSX/bitUSD is 1/1 ( :D  Hush, it's my hypothetical example)
4) I buy 100 bitUSD for 100 BTSX and cover my order, releasing the 6451.61 BTSX back into my account.

Is it the case that of the 6451.61 BTSX half of it came from selling the original 100 bitUSD and therefore is profit (minus the 100 BTSX I had to spend to buy the bitUSD to cover)?

If I bought my own short wouldn't I just be breaking even?

Hi guys,

I just would like to say that I have same problem of understanding this, specially this statement
Quote
"Going short/long at the same time is equivalent to holding BTSX with an option to double your stake at todays prices at any time."
The way I understand this statement is if I have 100000BTSX and split it 50% in BTSX short and 50% buy bitUSD long then in some time in the future I should be able to double my original 100000BTSX. It would be really great if somebody who has better understanding of  this to try to explain it to some of us who don't get it.

Regards  :)

Offline Markus

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Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #65 on: September 08, 2014, 01:31:26 pm »
Hi guys,

I just would like to say that I have same problem of understanding this, specially this statement
"Going short/long at the same time is equivalent to holding BTSX with an option to double your stake at todays prices at any time."
The way I understand this statement is if I have 100000BTSX and split it 50% in BTSX short and 50% buy bitUSD long then in some time in the future I should be able to double my original 100000BTSX. It would be really great if somebody who has better understanding of  this to try to explain it to some of us who don't get it.

Regards  :)
I don't think anybody understood that one - it's been totally ignored in the original thread.
Normally BM's arguments are fairly reasonable. But then he was sick over the weekend. ;)

edit: he seems to be explaining something related here:
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=8521.msg110787#msg110787
« Last Edit: September 08, 2014, 01:46:41 pm by Markus »

Offline Riverhead

Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #66 on: September 08, 2014, 01:33:42 pm »
Hi guys,

I just would like to say that I have same problem of understanding this, specially this statement
"Going short/long at the same time is equivalent to holding BTSX with an option to double your stake at todays prices at any time."
The way I understand this statement is if I have 100000BTSX and split it 50% in BTSX short and 50% buy bitUSD long then in some time in the future I should be able to double my original 100000BTSX. It would be really great if somebody who has better understanding of  this to try to explain it to some of us who don't get it.

Regards  :)
I don't think anybody understood that one - it's been totally ignored in the original thread.
Normally BM's arguments are fairly reasonable. But then he was sick over the weekend. ;)


He explained it once six or seven months ago when this was all just pie in the sky. I'll see if I can dig it out...but it didn't make sense to me then either :)

Offline tonyk

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Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #67 on: September 08, 2014, 02:03:01 pm »
Hi guys,

I just would like to say that I have same problem of understanding this, specially this statement
"Going short/long at the same time is equivalent to holding BTSX with an option to double your stake at todays prices at any time."
The way I understand this statement is if I have 100000BTSX and split it 50% in BTSX short and 50% buy bitUSD long then in some time in the future I should be able to double my original 100000BTSX. It would be really great if somebody who has better understanding of  this to try to explain it to some of us who don't get it.

Regards  :)
I don't think anybody understood that one - it's been totally ignored in the original thread.
Normally BM's arguments are fairly reasonable. But then he was sick over the weekend. ;)


He explained it once six or seven months ago when this was all just pie in the sky. I'll see if I can dig it out...but it didn't make sense to me then either :)

Not the clearest statement of all times but,
Generally one can collect interest on bitUSD without taking the position really.Going as far as calling it doubling your position is stretching it a bit.
At the time you collect the interest on bitUSD you also can fully benefit if BTSX go up in value.
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

merockstar

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Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #68 on: September 08, 2014, 03:18:40 pm »
Here's a stupid question:

Say I wanna buy a little bit of bitUSD right. I go to my market screen, I look at the asks/shorts.

The first two orders I see are for 1000 dollars (about 27,000 btsx) worth of bitUSD.

Now that's a little more than I would like to buy, I was thinking about a hundred or two hundred btsx worth would be nice.

If I want the order to fill instantly I would have to either buy 1000 dollars worth, or wait until those shorts get ate up, wouldn't I?

Offline robrigo

Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #69 on: September 08, 2014, 03:20:33 pm »
Here's a stupid question:

Say I wanna buy a little bit of bitUSD right. I go to my market screen, I look at the asks/shorts.

The first two orders I see are for 1000 dollars (about 27,000 btsx) worth of bitUSD.

Now that's a little more than I would like to buy, I was thinking about a hundred or two hundred btsx worth would be nice.

If I want the order to fill instantly I would have to either buy 1000 dollars worth, or wait until those shorts get ate up, wouldn't I?

I think your order would be completed and their sell order partially filled if you set the price slightly above their ask.

merockstar

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Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #70 on: September 08, 2014, 03:25:16 pm »
Here's a stupid question:

Say I wanna buy a little bit of bitUSD right. I go to my market screen, I look at the asks/shorts.

The first two orders I see are for 1000 dollars (about 27,000 btsx) worth of bitUSD.

Now that's a little more than I would like to buy, I was thinking about a hundred or two hundred btsx worth would be nice.

If I want the order to fill instantly I would have to either buy 1000 dollars worth, or wait until those shorts get ate up, wouldn't I?

I think your order would be completed and their sell order partially filled if you set the price slightly above their ask.

Reason I ask is because I tried shorting a little the other day, and found that the short wouldn't happen instantly unless I matched the full amount of the highest bid (more than I wanted to short, so I didn't try), so I assumed that meant no partial orders. Maybe I was just hitting the mechanism the prevents shorting bitUSD below the peg though?

edit: just tried bidding a little higher than the highest bid. Partial buy not taking.

edit again: tried making a partial bid on the lowest short, that's not happening either. partial bids must not work.

edit again: tried making a smaller buy order that wasn't at the top of the short/ask list, and it worked instantly! guess that answers that, you must fill an entire order, and not do a partial. but it doesn't have to be at the best price.

final edit: now if I could just figure out how to short instantly.

final final edit: shorting instantly seems to be working just fine now, just gotta match it to a bid.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2014, 05:54:26 pm by merockstar »

Offline Riverhead

Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #71 on: September 08, 2014, 03:31:29 pm »
Hi guys,

I just would like to say that I have same problem of understanding this, specially this statement
"Going short/long at the same time is equivalent to holding BTSX with an option to double your stake at todays prices at any time."
The way I understand this statement is if I have 100000BTSX and split it 50% in BTSX short and 50% buy bitUSD long then in some time in the future I should be able to double my original 100000BTSX. It would be really great if somebody who has better understanding of  this to try to explain it to some of us who don't get it.

Regards  :)
I don't think anybody understood that one - it's been totally ignored in the original thread.
Normally BM's arguments are fairly reasonable. But then he was sick over the weekend. ;)


He explained it once six or seven months ago when this was all just pie in the sky. I'll see if I can dig it out...but it didn't make sense to me then either :)

Not the clearest statement of all times but,
Generally one can collect interest on bitUSD without taking the position really.Going as far as calling it doubling your position is stretching it a bit.
At the time you collect the interest on bitUSD you also can fully benefit if BTSX go up in value.


So let me see if I get this now:
1) Short bitUSD into existence and have 2x the value in BTSX set aside as collateral.
2) Buy your short and hold the bitUSD to collect interest.
3) After a period of time cover your short, get your BTSX back and keep the interest as profit.


I guess the risk is if BTSX goes down you could get called.

Offline jsidhu

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Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #72 on: September 08, 2014, 03:55:57 pm »
hmm I would think your position is closed once you buy your short isnt that essentially what happens when you want to settle your position to collect the margin?
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Offline Riverhead

Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #73 on: September 08, 2014, 03:58:54 pm »
hmm I would think your position is closed once you buy your short isnt that essentially what happens when you want to settle your position to collect the margin?


Poor choice of words on my part. I meant buy bitUSD equal to that of your short so you have it ready at today's prices for when you want to cover and you'll be collecting interest on it. It's a double bet that BTSX is going to rise versus bitUSD.

Offline xeroc

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Re: !!! Stupid Questions Thread !!!
« Reply #74 on: September 08, 2014, 03:59:10 pm »
hmm I would think your position is closed once you buy your short isnt that essentially what happens when you want to settle your position to collect the margin?
Due to TITAN, the blockchain cannot know that it is you who just bought bitUSD to close the short position .. thats why you need to
1) buy yout bitUSD
2) cover your position
in two separated steps .. (both with the usual transaction fee)

//edit: maybe I misinterpreted the quote above
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