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Topics - sfinder

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31
中文 (Chinese) / 第8轮测试中包含的锚定货币资产由人民币和港币
« on: July 08, 2014, 10:10:15 pm »
第8轮测试中包含的锚定货币资产由人民币和港币

Code: [Select]
ID    SYMBOL NAME                    DESCRIPTION                                     ISSUER                          ISSUED    SUPPLY                     
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
18    AUD    Australian Dollar       1 Australian dollar                             GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 AUD                 
4     BTC    Bitcoin                 1 bitcoin                                       GENESIS                         N/A       0.00000000 BTC             
16    CAD    Canadian Dollar         1 Canadian dollar                               GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 CAD                 
17    CHF    Swiss Franc             1 Swiss franc                                   GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 CHF                 
14    CNY    Chinese Yuan            1 Chinese yuan                                  GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 CNY                 
21    EUR    Euro                    1 euro                                          GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 EUR                 
19    GBP    Pound sterling          1 pound sterling                                GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 GBP                 
7     GLD    Gold                    1 troy ounce .999 fine gold                     GENESIS                         N/A       0.000000 GLD               
10    HKD    Hong Kong Dollar        1 Hong Kong dollar                              GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 HKD                 
20    JPY    Japanese Yen            1 Japanese yen                                  GENESIS                         N/A       0.00 JPY                   
3     LTC    Litecoin                1 litecoin                                      GENESIS                         N/A       0.00000000 LTC             
15    MXN    Mexican Peso            1 Mexican peso                                  GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 MXN                 
13    NZD    New Zealand Dollar      1 New Zealand dollar                            GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 NZD                 
2     PPC    Peercoin                1 peercoin                                      GENESIS                         N/A       0.00000000 PPC             
1     WTF    BitShares WTF           Speaks for itself.                              vikram                          0.00 %    0. WTF                     
11    RUB    Russian Ruble           1 Russian ruble                                 GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 RUB                 
12    SEK    Swedish Krona           1 Swedish krona                                 GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 SEK                 
9     SGD    Singapore Dollar        1 Singapore dollar                              GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 SGD                 
6     SLV    Silver                  1 troy ounce .999 fine silver                   GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 SLV                 
8     TRY    Turkish Lira            1 Turkish lira                                  GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 TRY                 
22    USD    United States Dollar    1 United States dollar                          GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 USD                 
1     WTF    BitShares WTF           Speaks for itself.                              vikram                          0.00 %    0. WTF                     
5     WTI    Light Sweet Crude Oil   1 barrel light sweet crude oil                  GENESIS                         N/A       0.0000 WTI                 
0     XTS    BitShares XTS           Stake in future BitShares X chains              GENESIS                         N/A       1,999,539,144.17440 XTS   

32
中文 (Chinese) / 刚刚生产出1百万嫩模，要的贴地址跟贴-增送100平方Pan币和100粒伟哥
« on: July 01, 2014, 11:44:08 pm »
刚刚生产出1百万嫩模，要的贴地址跟贴---增送100平方Pan币和100粒伟哥 :P :P :P

33
General Discussion / Two suggestions from Chinese community based on the result of DPOS testing
« on: June 30, 2014, 04:16:12 pm »
hi BM, I am passing 2 suggestions from Chinese community based on the result of DPOS testing. please let me know if you need more detail information.

The first suggestion is to allow 2-10 delegates to race for the same block and the fastest one produce the block.

the 2nd suggestion is  to use    "EPaxos" for helping to resolve our forking issues due to limited bandwidth and slow hardware performance of our delegates .









Quote from: sfinder on June 29, 2014, 07:49:25 pm
Hi BM  and Toast ,

2 programers from Chinese community would like to make a suggestion for you to use    "EPaxos" for helping to resolve our forking issues due to limited bandwidth and slow hardware performance of our delegates .
   
https://github.com/efficient/epaxos

Iulian Moraru, David G. Andersen -- Carnegie Mellon University

Quote


EPaxos
What is EPaxos?

EPaxos is an efficient, leaderless replication protocol. The name stands for Egalitarian Paxos -- EPaxos is based on the Paxos consensus algorithm. As such, it can tolerate up to F concurrent replica failures with 2F+1 total replicas.
How does EPaxos differ from Paxos and other Paxos variants?

To function effectively as a replication protocol, Paxos has to rely on a stable leader replica (this optimization is known as Multi-Paxos). The leader can become a bottleneck for performance: it has to handle more messages than the other replicas, and remote clients have to contact the leader, thus experiencing higher latency. Other Paxos variants either also rely on a stable leader, or have a pre-established scheme that allows different replicas to take turns in proposing commands (such as Mencius). This latter scheme suffers from tight coupling of the performance of the system from that of every replica -- i.e., the system runs at the speed of the slowest replica.

EPaxos is an efficient, leaderless protocol. It provides strong consistency with optimal wide-area latency, perfect load-balancing across replicas (both in the local and the wide area), and constant availability for up to F failures. EPaxos also decouples the performance of the slowest replicas from that of the fastest, so it can better tolerate slow replicas than previous protocols.
How does EPaxos work?

We have an SOSP 2013 paper that describes EPaxos in detail.

A simpler, more straightforward explanation is coming here soon.
What is in this repository?

This repository contains the Go implementations of:

    Egalitarian Paxos (EPaxos), a new distributed consensus algorithm based on Paxos EPaxos achieves three goals: (1) availability without interruption as long as a simple majority of replicas are reachable---its availability is not interrupted when replicas crash or fail to respond; (2) uniform load balancing across all replicas---no replicas experience higher load because they have special roles; and (3) optimal commit latency in the wide-area when tolerating one and two failures, under realistic conditions. Egalitarian Paxos is to our knowledge the first distributed consensus protocol to achieve all of these goals efficiently: requiring only a simple majority of replicas to be non-faulty, using a number of messages linear in the number of replicas to choose a command, and committing commands after just one communication round (one round trip) in the common case or after at most two rounds in any case.

    (classic) Paxos

    Mencius

    Generalized Paxos

The struct marshaling and unmarshaling code was generated automatically using the tool available at: https://code.google.com/p/gobin-codegen/

The repository also contains a machine-readable (and model-checkable) specification of EPaxos in TLA+.

AUTHORS:

Iulian Moraru, David G. Andersen -- Carnegie Mellon University

Michael Kaminsky -- Intel Labs


Quote from: sfinder on June 29, 2014, 07:41:00 pm
EPAXOS 作者是Toast学校的。
Quote from: sudo on June 29, 2014, 07:28:43 pm
Quote from: chono on June 29, 2014, 07:27:45 am
Quote from: planetlife on June 28, 2014, 09:22:26 am
硬件不足，软件补。赞赏这个设计，目前的网络体系架构并不适合网络货币的需求，需要在软件上做补偿设计。

是啊，这两天看了EPAXOS算法，这货=DPOS+现在BM正在搞得代表之间协议啊。如果BM能完成的质量高可以，还是分叉严重的话谁能帮忙给BM推荐参考一下这算法？哪位大侠能直接跟BM沟通。
https://github.com/efficient/epaxos

转hackfisher 或直接pm bm吧

34
中文 (Chinese) / 最新的代码好像导致更多的分叉:'(:'(:'(:'(:'(:'(:'(
« on: June 28, 2014, 03:33:23 pm »
最新的代码好像导致更多的分叉，正在咨询BM是何原因 :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

Quote from: sfinder on June 28, 2014, 03:25:55 pm
hi BM /Toast, it seems like we are getting more forks after updating to the latest code yesterday  afternoon

Code: [Select]
blockchain_list_forks
   FORKED BLOCK              FORKING BLOCK ID              SIGNING DELEGATE      TXN COUNT      SIZE           TIMESTAMP   LATENCY   VALID    IN CURRENT CHAIN
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
            864
     89b52d9ac95e7ee016734305259527f054d26ca5                 happyshares-1            336    113415 2014-06-27T15:36:00     44280     YES                  NO
     4f472992ee890c60a2c89c40218da56868caf0fe                      vikram10            701    236420 2014-06-27T15:34:00     44402     YES                 YES
           1103
     fb9f387deaf9ed3a1a5a53236274ba719dd9055b                        xeldal            453    123451 2014-06-28T03:54:00       329     YES                  NO
     67dff03d9521e6d372e221692b5f19cd4260dcf1                        init90            227     67929 2014-06-28T03:52:00       452     YES                 YES
           1108
     616e017c53ca4befdd24a282192df22b6283693f                      vikram13           1144    291631 2014-06-28T04:20:00        16     YES                  NO
     8ac169e53738dae9ddfbb43424b29296b0575ca1                      liondani            913    235960 2014-06-28T04:18:00       570     YES                 YES
           1115
     d1a38602399daa0d366e28edf2696f7530b31100                 happyshares-4           1148    284243 2014-06-28T04:44:00        16     YES                  NO
     a43af78b073e53f283dee293b31633c2004e223f                        init61            688    173383 2014-06-28T04:40:00       291     YES                 YES
           1123
     14ff28cdd33514410dcea5c3a9cc508a8e04e703                        init89            231     64014 2014-06-28T05:04:00      1089     YES                 YES
     c81d3f28db2ca2d269cad844f4b87feefdcab5fb                      immortal           1152    285975 2014-06-28T05:12:00       609     N/A                  NO
     e8732693f0526896ec10559df47cbaf5e14b31ed                       vikram8           1311    321030 2014-06-28T05:20:00        20     YES                  NO
           1131
     3adee3f1fd609937989adccc9c5470e2aa5eaa82                       vikram9            656    172679 2014-06-28T05:40:00         7     YES                  NO
     80ee1188e414746ae6f10f74b82a3d88fc5df892                        init81            310     99277 2014-06-28T05:36:00       649     YES                 YES
           1136
     a0f3afce3c4354fa0a7e6eba241168ff90e27e7e                         betax            896    222839 2014-06-28T06:00:00       168     YES                 YES
     aff922036637dcc9c27648d36367fc5b460c779e                        init95            773    193196 2014-06-28T05:58:00       294     N/A                  NO
           1138
     304957a0768387f528ae493be97aed27e253286b                         angel              6      1628 2014-06-28T06:10:00         1     YES                 YES
     ae52ffa21d54a1ad9b92fb6ee59a049387e17ea3                        init79              6      1628 2014-06-28T06:06:00       272     N/A                  NO
           1147
     88682e1965c2f7ba9dc9dc336bab57895ac5f709               emski-delegate3            631    164254 2014-06-28T06:34:00         6     YES                 YES
     de0ade654c71107078b037eac6748a1d1c185a93                        init65            407    110270 2014-06-28T06:32:00      1215     N/A                  NO
           1148
     8831747e945cc57f22f6aedca29cdf7913dc8401                  delegate-alt            218     70289 2014-06-28T06:36:00       968     YES                 YES
     47690a8bc1cd907424c1ac1f4f3f1021bfe50873                        init11            664    177775 2014-06-28T06:40:00       735     N/A                  NO
           1151
     a971dbd589e3799da0f7f5bf993b6f07d1b04ba2                        init10            546    176889 2014-06-28T07:04:00        22     YES                  NO
     71a6697cbe78c6e83c921a3eff202373765e6b68                       vikram6            673    216328 2014-06-28T07:06:00         6     YES                 YES
           1156
     44c79784dbef7e89d7ceda866cddf799837483ce              xeroc-delegate-1            669    168612 2014-06-28T07:20:00        75     YES                  NO
     a40c3f48ca3b071dd83055f99455e4a9c8e7b8ff                        init57            225     61608 2014-06-28T07:16:00       320     YES                 YES
           1161
     ec8f4046295f50a23c6503890bc24c72f50a5655                       calyau3           1070    268037 2014-06-28T07:42:00        16     N/A                  NO
     bc672f8e93c8aa27c8b7953724bb3d4db19d10ce                      liondani            888    224463 2014-06-28T07:40:00       271     N/A                  NO
     b0426f91a29ef1f7c4da24ac983ca3b74e4c89f8                 harvey-needle            660    169515 2014-06-28T07:38:00         4     YES                 YES
           1166
     4a2156bc973e992442bb6285f4645215490d4be1                      vikram15            672    168759 2014-06-28T07:56:00         4     YES                 YES
     6d09c928b18229278909a7b4bbf3767689641295                         init8            446    114293 2014-06-28T07:54:00       135     N/A                  NO
           1171
     79105f2a1ddc7695e9cb2b5eea927d2d036048d6                        init73            224     60503 2014-06-28T08:10:00        69     YES                 YES
     41fd2217122b0d943a8f4a72e31206bc3f97ff02              xeroc-delegate-4            314     77969 2014-06-28T08:12:00         5     N/A                  NO
           1173
     98c308e4108b5a2964093fd7bc2377af53610d4a                        init68            218     71921 2014-06-28T08:20:00       255     YES                 YES
     95ab7e9b77330a1d172c13f348ed69a9f8bf5b6f               delegate-dorian            444    146643 2014-06-28T08:22:00       138     N/A                  NO
           1179
     c2244ac6d276f3d6320fbd39cc00313a740a22a6                        init98            221     72932 2014-06-28T08:38:00       219     YES                  NO
     1aa4f527a2a6141ac0d09021642584e52968bb44                       vikram8            639    179334 2014-06-28T08:42:00         5     YES                 YES
           1181
     d427edc72da6f72eb3f20dbc6b3a0a3e46b94236                      vikram10            893    235172 2014-06-28T08:52:00         5     YES                  NO
     e65be99f820e0ff7389cef1f348ed92dd2e9dd13                        init58            221     73220 2014-06-28T08:46:00       717     YES                 YES
           1190
     00f3141fd8a79efc80b39837e3fac13009d2bfe9             delegate-watchman              0       182 2014-06-28T09:16:00       388     YES                 YES
     00c20f132f144bee63d7c3ef25551dafd7306494                        init95            670    168373 2014-06-28T09:20:00       152     N/A                  NO
           1201
     2c909280bef4a08abb699515f633336db6edc31e               emski-delegate3            454    116413 2014-06-28T09:56:00         3     YES                  NO
     ec8382ecd53ed2ad37f239db6a98d558f5a8156f                        init65            228     61947 2014-06-28T09:54:00       776     YES                 YES
           1210
     f8f7988944b479db4c497af0dfe892a10a5ec541                       vikram1            452    114875 2014-06-28T10:36:00         3     YES                 YES
     f8dbd96b9fe9f2e14b0b17dd59e6c21586aa103e                        init55            226     60409 2014-06-28T10:34:00       650     YES                  NO
           1216
     bc2ea6241587200b567f5809119c11d8ab59c440                      vikram13            452    123707 2014-06-28T11:02:00         3     YES                 YES
     d267d9df53906b6da3f8118897c2894cdc0c4cfd                       calyau1            461    125876 2014-06-28T11:04:00        37     N/A                  NO
           1221
     c13abd5a45e5f4b59706c2201c3423a2a495446a                      liondani            452    123227 2014-06-28T11:30:00        13     YES                  NO
     82d7732b6afd6eb1057fdfc93a2d3a1ebc2adf26                        init76            225     68424 2014-06-28T11:28:00      1384     YES                 YES
           1233
     b3c0ce4b7ad39a65ba012e2c97b6380c5a1d0391                         init6           1317    323148 2014-06-28T12:24:00         8     YES                 YES
     f9c3c8f212e3b8ce93ac379e44272bf60626173f                  delegate-alt              0       182 2014-06-28T12:22:00       140     N/A                  NO
           1234
     38066a8353acb855c2a39f56cb932b0f0c730993                       vikram3            929    264776 2014-06-28T12:30:00         6     YES                  NO
     102ec2f390021b8e7fb6acc0a958f6d2fcf24c4d                        init96            488    136799 2014-06-28T12:26:00       623     YES                 YES
           1248
     9ff5330f1bbc8502f26fd44e8f6a4b502f7612a2                        init92            809    227680 2014-06-28T13:20:00       152     YES                 YES
     610638d917efa67a86f2b79ff9d8376789fefe88                 harvey-dragon              1       423 2014-06-28T13:22:00        38     N/A                  NO
           1250
     ff8680efc5d90113b39cc0bdacf32e492c8ddcb0                       vikram6           1106    299561 2014-06-28T13:34:00         7     YES                  NO
     22cae81b3e31d1c294b1757c9d2f97fbd36b2437                        init57            929    258440 2014-06-28T13:32:00       466     YES                 YES
           1253
     9a9fa55626f52df1da7d14a5553420ec56614888                       calyau2             14      4900 2014-06-28T13:44:00        16     YES                 YES
     9119f68765f5fa53e4379bed4178ac6a42777f1a                        init85            226     75481 2014-06-28T13:42:00       137     N/A                  NO
           1255
     b260f2468b13536452fd2552f28bb08f7ef3f6d7                        init68            888    214767 2014-06-28T13:50:00        84     YES                 YES
     6f636f0a942b72083211fd252c51eb8a9af00ac5                        lexx-1              1       423 2014-06-28T14:00:00        12     N/A                  NO
           1257
     11b130dd65d55f7a07aaaccb65a802b061c5731b                 happyshares-5           1264    310279 2014-06-28T14:10:00        23     YES                 YES
     ea1a90d77ee6ee1ecde8b3448615d906271688ed                        init55            386    101753 2014-06-28T13:56:00      1694     N/A                  NO
           1263
     a4a95ae2d4725c5b65b9ad2f37fecb8bfb68ba66             harvey-oathkeeper            366     88389 2014-06-28T14:38:00        22     N/A                  NO
     080183fbc2e084b51904a15f8e4d55091bfc830b                       bdnoble            366     88389 2014-06-28T14:36:00       143     N/A                  NO
     4b18426b05036c3f7bd1176e33545212443380e8                        init73            444    113619 2014-06-28T14:32:00       379     YES                 YES
           1264
     11d76d91ad3dcdb2cc0200675996b4e440ec4bd3                    dele-puppy            186     55665 2014-06-28T14:40:00       304     YES                 YES
     f62b98810e16c36ead8b9bbde26f00222907bac4                        init80           1108    277867 2014-06-28T14:42:00       187     N/A                  NO
           1267
     a0da497aec33161be05f3c75c6bfe8509374b8b9                      liondani            374    111725 2014-06-28T14:52:00        14     YES                  NO
     e58172c32505da4d3bfee6aefd0f92766c0ceebe                        init76            244     79243 2014-06-28T14:50:00       908     YES                 YES
           1272
     7b192ed1ffd904278dd29820be344746b8179dfe                        bts102              0       182 2014-06-28T15:16:00       279     N/A                  NO
     7714d30b50aa2ddf14091ffd879daf7e20dc1885                delegate-baozi              0       182 2014-06-28T15:14:00       400     N/A                  NO
     981d950eb747b0a9ba561171f403d25cd9b077b4                         init5           1241    319136 2014-06-28T15:18:00         8     YES                 YES


it does show smaller latency by using the latest code..

Code: [Select]
   1248           2014-06-28T13:18:00                                                          chinese              0     182             0       1
      1249           2014-06-28T13:20:00                                                           init92            809  227680         100.6     152
      1250           2014-06-28T13:26:00                                                             sexy            370   89353            37       1
Quote from: bytemaster on June 28, 2014, 01:48:17 pm

Quote from: liondani on June 28, 2014, 01:10:39 pm
Code: [Select]
liondani (unlocked) >>> blockchain_get_delegate_block_stats liondani
[[
    912,{
      "missed": false,
      "latency": 1
    }
  ],[
    977,{
      "missed": false,
      "latency": 1
    }
  ],[
    1044,{
      "missed": false,
      "latency": 1
    }
  ],[
    1112,{
      "missed": false,
      "latency": 1
    }
  ],[
    1163,{
      "missed": true,
      "latency": null
    }
  ],[
    1165,{
      "missed": true,
      "latency": null
    }
  ],[
    1223,{
      "missed": true,
      "latency": null
    }
  ]
]


what means:  "latency": null     ???

If you never got a block then we have no way to calc latency


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

35
中文 (Chinese) / 这个币nodeCoin居然有法币的网关，关注一下。。。
« on: June 28, 2014, 04:56:42 am »
这个币nodeCoin居然有法币的网关，关注一下。。。

http://s12.postimg.org/xz7sggnzh/info_2.png

nxtl.eu/forum/discussion/2/next-coin-lite-officiall-topic-fair-distribution

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=590421.msg6920094#msg6920094

36
中文 (Chinese) / 老外对bitshares比较温和中肯的评价，有兴趣用谷歌翻译看
« on: June 27, 2014, 08:15:50 pm »
老外对bitshares比较温和中肯的评价，有兴趣用谷歌翻译看。

其实不仅仅是中文社区发现BM的饼，英文社区的虚拟币资深从业人员也对他的饼有意见，老外认为3i作对了唯一一件事就是把投资者给不负责任的锁住了，让投资者没有任何选择，只能和3i共命运

所以XTS出来后的价格还是主要靠中文社区来支撑。中文社区没有信心了，这个项目就基本玩完了

Quote from: tonyk on June 25, 2014, 02:12:33 pm
Quote from: AdamBLevine on June 25, 2014, 01:25:36 pm
Quote from: tonyk on June 25, 2014, 02:47:19 am
Quote from: AdamBLevine on June 25, 2014, 02:40:35 am
Quote
-Appearing on the 3rd day and saying – 'Sorry for the delay, I was drunk from the IPO party 3 days ago';
.....this is really a point you want to hang your hat on?   Things are confusing in early days, I would assume you'd be sympathetic.

I am really sympathetic – I have my share of drinking problems… I can only imagine how drunk will I get when I have scammed people for 10 Mil and have to do no work for it… really drunk like 3 day total obliviation…
You realize that unless you're closely paying attention, most people in the crypto space think Bitshares is an out and out scam, right?  It's just blowing my mind you can be so blind to the irony.

Let me show you what Invictus looks like from the outside, this was in the swarm skype chat.   


Quote
[6/24/2014 10:06:03 AM] Niceplum: Adam B. Levine, I spent 20+ hrs researching bitshares, its a ponzi
[6/24/2014 10:06:08 AM] Adam B. Levine: it's really not
[6/24/2014 10:06:08 AM] Adam B. Levine: lol
[6/24/2014 10:06:12 AM] Joel Dietz (SWARM Agent X) : it's a bad joke wishing that it was a ponzi
[6/24/2014 10:06:13 AM] Niceplum: time will tell
[6/24/2014 10:06:17 AM] Adam B. Levine: I would agree with Joel
[6/24/2014 10:06:30 AM] Niceplum: how does it expect to give people back more money
[6/24/2014 10:06:32 AM] Niceplum: if they buy BitUSD
[6/24/2014 10:06:35 AM] Niceplum: and then convert back
[6/24/2014 10:06:47 AM] Adam B. Levine: that's not the majority of the bitshares project
[6/24/2014 10:06:59 AM] Adam B. Levine: the interesting part is the underlying technology they've reinvented
[6/24/2014 10:07:02 AM] Niceplum: no, but that is a ponzi
[6/24/2014 10:07:07 AM] Adam B. Levine: no, that is a confidence game
[6/24/2014 10:07:12 AM | Edited 10:07:14 AM] Adam B. Levine: a ponzi implies there is a guy named ponzi
[6/24/2014 10:07:14 AM] Niceplum: which technology?
[6/24/2014 10:07:20 AM] Adam B. Levine: delegated proof of stake
[6/24/2014 10:07:23 AM] Niceplum: where
[6/24/2014 10:07:26 AM] Adam B. Levine: they're on alpha chain 5
[6/24/2014 10:07:32 AM] Niceplum: source?
[6/24/2014 10:07:38 AM] Adam B. Levine: bitsharestalk.com
[6/24/2014 10:07:41 AM] Adam B. Levine: good luck
[6/24/2014 10:07:44 AM] Adam B. Levine: :)
[6/24/2014 10:07:48 AM] Niceplum: actual source?
[6/24/2014 10:07:51 AM] Niceplum: is it on there
[6/24/2014 10:07:55 AM] Adam B. Levine: yeah hang on
[6/24/2014 10:08:40 AM] Adam B. Levine: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=5250.0
[6/24/2014 10:09:45 AM] Adam B. Levine: both NXT and Bitshares are really attacking confirmation times, which things like msc and xcp demonstrate are quite long in the bitcoin paradigm where blocks occasionally take an hour
[6/24/2014 10:09:58 AM] Adam B. Levine: it didnt used to matter
[6/24/2014 10:10:16 AM] Adam B. Levine: but now when actions are only as granular as how long it takes for it to be included in a block, suddenly it's a lifetime
[6/24/2014 10:10:43 AM] Niceplum: BitShares isn't a cryptocurrency though, how is it possible to compare them
[6/24/2014 10:10:50 AM] Adam B. Levine: how can you say that?
[6/24/2014 10:11:16 AM] Niceplum: because the whitepaper defines it as a decentralized for-profit bank?
[6/24/2014 10:11:33 AM | Edited 10:11:39 AM] Adam B. Levine: that's like saying bitcoin isn't a cryptocurrency because its whitepaper defines it as decentralized cash
[6/24/2014 10:11:50 AM] orperelman: lol
[6/24/2014 10:11:52 AM] Adam B. Levine: cryptocurrency is a broad categorical classificaiton having to do with how the network actually works, not what it calls itself
[6/24/2014 10:12:08 AM] Niceplum: well then its not decentralized cash
[6/24/2014 10:12:28 AM] Adam B. Levine: it's a token that can be transmitted irrevocably to any network connected terminal
[6/24/2014 10:12:37 AM] Adam B. Levine: call it what you, that's a token and tokens are cryptocurrencies
[6/24/2014 10:12:48 AM] Niceplum: irrevocably? but isn't that against the idea of TaPOS
[6/24/2014 10:12:52 AM] Adam B. Levine: unless you're talking about the kind you hold in your hand
[6/24/2014 10:12:56 AM] Niceplum: where people vote whats valid and not
[6/24/2014 10:12:58 AM] Adam B. Levine: TaPOS was thrown out
[6/24/2014 10:13:07 AM] Adam B. Levine: :)
[6/24/2014 10:13:12 AM] Adam B. Levine: this is DPOS
[6/24/2014 10:13:18 AM] Niceplum: DPOS?
[6/24/2014 10:13:21 AM] Adam B. Levine: TaPOS was (Transactions as Proof of Stake)
[6/24/2014 10:13:28 AM] Adam B. Levine: DPOS is Delegated Proof of Stake
[6/24/2014 10:13:36 AM] Niceplum: which means?
[6/24/2014 10:13:43 AM] Adam B. Levine: Feel free to read up on it
[6/24/2014 10:13:52 AM] Adam B. Levine: github link is in the thread linked earlier
[6/24/2014 10:13:55 AM] Niceplum: its not transparent forging is it
[6/24/2014 10:14:00 AM] Adam B. Levine: it seems similar
[6/24/2014 10:14:20 AM] Adam B. Levine: but its not based on your stake, its based on the stake people throw behind you based on transparent performance
[6/24/2014 10:14:52 AM] Adam B. Levine: votes are cast automatically I believe for the best performing delegates judged by transaction inclusion rate, long term consistency, etc
[6/24/2014 10:15:03 AM] Adam B. Levine: but i am not an expert on this at all
[6/24/2014 10:15:32 AM] Niceplum: massive house of cards
[6/24/2014 10:15:43 AM] Adam B. Levine: just a guy who has been watching and talking with and yelling at the larimer folks to know they might look like a ponzi, but really they're just engineers who have no desire or ability to control optics
[6/24/2014 10:16:05 AM] Adam B. Levine: you're making me want to defend them just because I don't think you actually know what you're talking about, and that's odd because I"m quite annoyed with them.
[6/24/2014 10:16:21 AM] Adam B. Levine: if you have specific complaints please make them, don't just throw mud
[6/24/2014 10:17:31 AM] Niceplum: it cannot remain decentralized indefinitely, but I'll leave it to someone more technically knowledgable to argument that
[6/24/2014 10:18:04 AM] Niceplum: brb
[6/24/2014 10:18:32 AM] Adam B. Levine: happy to chat with you seperately, I really don't get how you can say definitive things like "cannot" when that's true of ANY of these protocols, they can all be modified should the need be there so again it's like saying it's not cryptocurrency.  Why this over all others?
[6/24/2014 10:18:45 AM] Adam B. Levine: ;)
[6/24/2014 10:18:52 AM] Adam B. Levine: Incidentally your interview is running on Saturday
[6/24/2014 10:24:03 AM] Michael Sullivan: Are delegates secure?
[6/24/2014 10:25:45 AM] Michael Sullivan: Bitshares may finally be on right track, hard to know. But yeah it's been frustrating trying to keep up with the dev and tech branding over the past year.
[6/24/2014 10:31:16 AM | Edited 10:31:21 AM] Adam B. Levine: I've got a technical friend looking at the delegate requirements right now, I might wind up being the face of a few while he runs the technical stuff on the backend.    It's an interesting approach, complete transparency does in fact make it quite hard to cheat
[6/24/2014 10:31:27 AM] Adam B. Levine: (for more than one instance)
[6/24/2014 10:36:20 AM] Niceplum: isn't the whole result of proof of stake that the rich get richer?
[6/24/2014 10:38:08 AM] Janislav: it is not different than with bitcoin. rich people buy a lot of miners and get richer
[6/24/2014 10:39:23 AM] Adam B. Levine: right, the problem isn't how you get your resources but rather that some people have more resources than others
[6/24/2014 10:39:43 AM] Adam B. Levine: This is another thing invictus tried to address, Protoshares was supposed to be CPU minable only and worked best on CPUs
[6/24/2014 10:39:57 AM] Adam B. Levine: problem is, someone with money can just rent a bunch of servers from amazon by the hour and min/max, just like with any other way
[6/24/2014 10:40:08 AM] Adam B. Levine: So the problem is that "stake" is capital-scalable, rather than human-scalable
[6/24/2014 10:40:46 AM] Adam B. Levine: really what we want is as broad an even a distribution on a human level as possible, but there's no proof-of-unique-human yet that's easy and cheap and pervasive, so here we are
[6/24/2014 10:43:23 AM] Niceplum: well, it will require some form of reputation system which assumes a consensus
[6/24/2014 10:43:38 AM] Adam B. Levine: yep, so it won't happen
[6/24/2014 10:43:50 AM] Niceplum: exactly
[6/24/2014 10:43:59 AM] Adam B. Levine: thus, everybody does everything - Many of us watch them all, and whatever works we'll cannabilize

I'm clearly your enemy, and invictus is doing a fantastic job.


1. Good - if you really have said what this text says you have said.

2. For those people I cannot say much
 – ‘It is ponzi, cause I say it is ponzi.’
 -  ‘It is not currency’ - which is problem how?.... and the rest of the nonsense objections that you yourself have answered pretty well.

I3 needs better PR – ooh ye I agree with this wholeheartedly!

3.All of the above being said explain the benefits of posting great conclusions about how I3 is the big bad wolf from an argument between somebody how is not part of I3 for more than 6 mo. and somebody who has never been part of it?

Quote from: AdamBLevine on June 25, 2014, 02:53:12 pm
Quote from: xeroc on June 25, 2014, 01:49:07 pm
Quote from: AdamBLevine on June 25, 2014, 01:25:36 pm
I'm clearly your enemy, and invictus is doing a fantastic job.
Still you are educating others about our goals and techniques .. and you are doing great explaining it!

Unfortunately those guys seem to have no interest in constructive feedback .. otherwise they would join the discussion over here and not on a private skype chat.

Maybe one more thing: they issue with stake in several other systems (best example is NXT) is that the stakes are not fairly distributed .. sure bitshares stakes are also not fairly distributed (i guess) but your surely agree that we have a much wider distribution of stake than any other proof-of-stake crypto such as peercoin/blackcoin/darkcoin and others.
That's maybe one of the big advantages we have over here.

BTW. we have initiated contact with freenode admins to recover the already registered #bitshares channel ..

Why would groups like swarm come to bitshares when others have a working product, right now, that don't demand 20% of their money supply before the community will  "support" them.     Why would they want to visit these confusing, hostile forums when they could save themselves the trouble and bang their head against a more conveniently located brick wall

Bitshares is one of the smallest 2.0 communities, do you notice how when 30 people join to complain about their investment taking an extra 200% of the timeline that was sold to them it's a big deal?  That's because there are less than two hundred active members on the forum, and the ones that are left are the TRUE BELIEVERS.    Invictus did one thing "right", they locked people in so as they make bad choices there is no way for their investors to escape them. 

I'm an industry evangelist.  I want all the 2.0 protocols to succeed.  Why are you arguing with me?  Because you backed what turned out to be a very risky horse.  I'm sorry about that, we all believed in Daniels vision in the beginning.

Quote from: AdamBLevine on June 25, 2014, 03:28:54 pm
Quote from: xeroc on June 25, 2014, 03:14:52 pm
I still do believe

It's obvious you believe, the question is can you articulate your belief or do you just believe whatever words come out of his mouth?   I can't even tell what the vision is any more, it was clear to me in the beginning.  Help me understand.

37
中文 (Chinese) / 看目前开发进度，真得不知道跨链交易要到猴年马月才能实现。
« on: June 27, 2014, 01:43:16 pm »
BTSX 的跨链交易一定要尽快实现，否则ME，music，DNS，彩票这些bitshares自己的Da'c 财产也都要通过锚定后在btsx上交易，真是太麻烦了。如果跨链交易实现了，用户只要用bitusd直接购买这些资产。看目前开发进度，真得不知道跨链交易要到猴年马月才能实现。

欢迎大家一起讨论讨论

38
General Discussion / very professional newsletter from NEM community
« on: June 25, 2014, 04:05:41 am »
please take a look. it is a growing community and I would expect our community has a monthly newsletter like this +5% +5% +5% +5%
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B1tPv9Udd9qBOE1uQ2x0VW5wejQ/edit

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B1tPv9Udd9qBOE1uQ2x0VW5wejQ/edit

39
中文 (Chinese) / NoirShares转为POS挖矿 -性质和PTS类似
« on: June 24, 2014, 01:48:19 am »

今日 NRS(NoirShare) 开发团队的主要成员 Barwizi 在 BTT 论坛上宣布即将为 NRS 带来一个钱包硬分叉更新，把 NRS 从 PoW 带入 PoS 时代，并把精力集中到 DACs 开发上。同时 Barwizi 在另一个帖子中提到目前原来两个 DAC 应用在开发中，其中一个很快可以发布。
 
钱包硬分叉帖翻译如下：
 
 NoirShares 执行一次强制更新。
 
本次更新包括几个小修复，一些安全检查，但是最重要的是，它从第 50000 个区块起停止 PoW 。最初我们申明说一起会有 500 万的 PoW 产出，但是我们决定这个数量可以通过 PoS 达到。在目前我发布这个帖子的时候，大概呀 250 万的产出了。我们相信这已经是足够多的 PoW 的产出了，而且分布得也很好。
 
最大的好处是，我们转向了更“绿色”的方案，这意味着钱包不再需要太多维护。这也让我们开发团队可以把精力转移出来，集中精力做 DAS 和 DAC 项目上——这是目前最紧迫的。
 
如果给你们带来了不便，我们非常遗憾。从我们的角度看，这是一个谨慎的行动。

Quote from: Nrsinv on June 23, 2014, 04:24:51 pm
Quote from: barwizi on June 23, 2014, 07:11:04 am
Hello all,

The group has decided to push a Mandatory Update for NoirShares.

The updates includes a few minor touch ups and security check, but most importantly, it HALTS PoW at block 50000. The initial statement stated  5 million PoW but we have decided this number is better reached through PoS, at time of posting there are roughly 2.5 million in existence. We believe this is sufficient PoW and the spread is good.

The key advantages are that w move to the "green" solution quickly, meaning the wallet needs very little maintenance. It also leaves our dev team free to fully pursue our second DAS/DAC, which is imminent.

We apologize for any who feel inconvenienced, but from our point of view, this is the most prudent course of action.

Below are the links for the new wallets, The Mac wallet will be made available shortly.


Windows Zip
Windows exe

For Linux and other derivatiives of the unix system, please use our source code from our git here Source Code

repost

40
中文 (Chinese) / 3i利用大家对DAC认识的不对等成功地欺骗了228的投资者
« on: June 23, 2014, 02:34:38 pm »
大家自己去琢磨吧!
目前投资者最大的敌人是3i本身，因为一旦和投资者意见相左最先山寨自己的恰恰是3i自己

41
General Discussion / stan， please read this thread from chinese board.
« on: June 23, 2014, 05:25:20 am »
main idea is you need to learn how to comfort investor by not dumping them all the  new ideas
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=5217.0


i got the 2nd one in english , please read

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=5206.msg68781#msg68781

42
中文 (Chinese) / AGS/PTS投资者联盟（先占个位置，具体如何实施慢慢想）
« on: June 23, 2014, 04:34:15 am »
投资者联盟的目的是抵制一些我们看得不爽的DAC，保护投资者利益，包括没有给我们满意数量的3I开发的DAC。

至于具体如何操作，大家慢慢商议

43
中文 (Chinese) / 看了BM最新的帖子，我有上当受骗的感觉。他意图改变bitsharesX的总股量。
« on: June 22, 2014, 11:29:35 pm »
看了BM最新的帖子，我有上当受骗的感觉。他意图改变bitsharesX的总股量。在他提出的Targeted Growth模式下，初期PTS/AGS投资者将由目前100%的持股降到20%，其它80%将分给前100的代表。已经有老外在喷他的这个意图了。当然这个意图能很快扩大BTS影响，把代表变相为pow币的矿工，但对初期投资者好像很不地道。

Quote from: bytemaster on June 22, 2014, 10:08:42 pm
The maximum share supply is dictated by the largest power of 10 less than 2^63 which is 1 Quadrillian.   1,000,000,000,000,000
The initial share supply was selected to be 10,000,000,000,000 in satoshies... 1% of the maximum supply.
The initial share precision was selected to be 1,000,000.

This makes representation of the initial share supply to be:

10,000,000.000000 or 10 million

There are several potential dilution strategies:
1) Deflation (delegates paid a fraction of fees)
2) Steady State (delegates paid 100% of fees)
3) Steady Pay (minimal dilution) (delegates receive pay equal to the minimum transaction fees in a full block regardless of actual transaction fees.
4) Targeted Growth  (delegates paid X% of the difference between current shares and maximum shares at any given point in time.

Under the Targeted Growth model I would suggest that the Initial Shares equal 20% of the Maximum Shares so that AGS/PTS holders are never diluted beyond 20%. 

Code: [Select]
Initial Share Supply          200,000,000.000000
Maximum Share Supply        1,000,000,000.000000
First Year Delegate Pay:      160,000,000.000000  (~1,600,000 per delegate on average (0.44%))
End First Year Total Supply   360,000,000.000000
Second Year Delegate Pay:     128,000,000.000000  (~1,280,000 per delegate on average (0.26%))
End Second Year Total Supply  488,000,000.000000

After 10 years the supply will be 860,000,000.00000

Under these plans, the price of a "share" when the market cap equals bitcoin would be ~5% of bitcoins share price or less.  We can adjust the precision as necessary.  I could see starting out with 20 billion and having 4 decimal places, this would cause the shares to be priced around $1 at bitcoins market cap.   

These are just ideas.

44
General Discussion / Stan , could you please make any comment for this post regarding snapshots?
« on: June 22, 2014, 04:43:35 pm »
BM posted following post last night. look like there will be no more snapshot before AGS ending at day 200.

I found ME is about ready to lunch while doing XTS testing.  will you agree with BM that there is no more snapshot from now to Day 200?

Quote from: bytemaster on June 21, 2014, 10:23:59 pm

There will only be 2 snapshots for AGS... Feb 28th and Day 200.   Everything except BTS XT should honor AGS from Day 200.

45
中文 (Chinese) / 测试发现： 目前ME的功能的确已经开发好了
« on: June 20, 2014, 08:44:57 pm »
测试发现： 目前ME的功能的确已经开发好了，应该测试完XTS推出后就能马上发布ME

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