Proposed Allocation for Merger

[CryptoPrometheus]

Why should a transaction for a FOREX trader be effected by someone who wants to buy the latest SnoopDogg single[/li][/list]

I agree, but won't this problem be alleviated once bit assets can be used to short bts(x), and also to short each other?

[sumantso]

Well, if irational panic selling continue to drop the price, I'll be happy to buy and get a discount on BTS (taking into account I don't mind the vesting period)

If I understand correctly, even after 50% drop, you will still get more BTS by selling DNS for BTSX.

[MrJeans]

I would just like to add my 2c that I do not support the merger in its current form.

I prefer the concept of many DACs competing

The one chain to rule them all makes me cringe (and is why I would not buy into etherium)

We loose the AGS and PTS social contract which was very attractive to me

If people need to buy shares in a random company (BitsharesX) just to get exposure to possible future DACs such as MUSIC, that would not make sense

Single point of failure

Why should a transaction for a FOREX trader be effected by someone who wants to buy the latest SnoopDogg single[/li][/list]

I do however see the value in a merger, I just dont like the downsides and hope there is a way around it

[CryptoPrometheus]

Mumble anyone? We are actively chatting about these things...right now.

Fuzz, is there a link to listen to the mumble without having to install mumble client?

[fuzzy]

Mumble anyone? We are actively chatting about these things...right now.

[tonyk]

Well, if irational panic selling continue to drop the price, I'll be happy to buy and get a discount on BTS (taking into account I don't mind the vesting period)

Exactly!
No need for the change in the vesting period... Those who want liquidity will sell out of PTS/DNS and buy perfectly liquid BTSX before the snapshot!

[gamey]

You guys....  I need to log-off this train wreck for the day.

In the end I will never be too pissed because BTSX definitely gains from this and I have a large stake in BTS. However that was never my interest and I'm not sure we couldn't have just added dilution to BTSX and went from there unchanged.

I hope one guy isn't sitting somewhere whispering ideas into someone's ear and then they end up becoming self-fulfilling due to the way this forum/social hierarchy works.

[bytemaster]

Someone sold 16 BTC worth of DNS on Bter and crashed the price 50%...

Exactly... $10,000 worth of liquidity is all that was there for DNS...

[Ander]

Someone sold 16 BTC worth of DNS on Bter and crashed the price 50%...

[gamey]

A tip to anyone with PTS or DNS on exchanges (bt38 or bter):  Based on this proposed allocation, and prices right now (BTSX 6100 sat, PTS 6600 sat, DNS 200 sat), you should sell your PTS and DNS, and buy BTSX. 

I did this already.  You'll get slightly more shares in the new BTS if you do this fast before prices adjust.

Obviously, if DNS and PTS fall and BTSX rises, youll need to do some math to see if this is still the case.

Keep in mind that the "so-called" market cap on DNS and PTS is a very thin market and you are being moved to a much deeper market.  Someone looking to sell 1% of PTS would push down the price much further and thus get much less than the market cap suggests... moving them into BTSX and selling the same amount would move the price less.

It is complicated, and I don't think that anything is going to be fair to everyone.

People aren't going to keep much on crypto-exchanges to have a lot of liquidity because people with money are smart enough to not do it.

"so-called"?   If it wasn't true, why the hell is PTS so stable in price ?   You are assuming that someone is forced to sell everything at once.  I'm not sure how you measure volatility because I am not trained in such matters, but it seems to me that if what you said is true the price would be a lot more volatile.  PTS seems fairly steady, which leads me to believe there is a real market there. 

[Pheonike]

When you buy Google stock are you buying Search, Android, Driveless Cars, Chrome? No you buying it all.
When you buy Apple Stock are you buying Macs,iPhones,iTunes, iWatch? No you are buying it the all.

You are buying into the ecosystem, not an individual product.

[bytemaster]

I think that PTS and DNS should have no lockout period.  Right now, you can already sell them on the exchange.  It is unfair to lock out holders of these shares, who were already liquid at the time of the announcement.  Like, you can literally go dump them RIGHT NOW, and then not face a lockout.   (Note: I already dumped mine and bought BTSX with it, so this doesnt effect me.  But it effects others and I want to push for fairness).


I think the lockout period for AGS and VOTE shares should be 6 months.  2 years is an eternity.

It is linear... and 2 years is based upon the roadmap for all future DACs in light of DACs that are already known with a development schedule.  AGS is going from "infinity" to gradually increasing liquidity so 2 years is an improvement for them.   VOTE doesn't event trade yet and has 30% allocated to Follow My Vote + a few others... the large stakeholders of VOTE (owning up to 45%+ of VOTE have agreed to this 2 year period because they are committed long-term.

When it comes to DNS it is "self funding" and can continue on its own and attempt to compete...  why should BTSX pay more when it could simply compete for less.  It is a very fair deal for DNS which is now facing much stronger competition. 

Get VOTE so we can get their team, network effect, and buy in... AGS holders in VOTE/DNS and final snapshot are the SAME...  PTS holders are almost the same...

PTS holders who want liquidity can sell now and get a better price than vesting and those who want a deal for volunteering for vesting can get a good deal on PTS.  The market will thus set PTS price accordingly.

And of course any 3rd parties are still welcome to allocate to PTS as they see fit.   

[tonyk]

The above allocation grants this many BTS to each of the stakeholder DACs:

99 BTS per PTS
87.5 BTS per AGS
0.015 BTS per DNS (i.e.: sell now before your stake is worthless)

7%*2.5Bil/1.648Mil  is ~ 106 per PTS

Questions: Vesting period is for who? PTS/AGS/DNS/VOTE? Or just PTS/AGS? Or... other?

Shentist also mentioned this - why the incredibly low valuation for DNS? Anybody who's smart should go sell all their DNS right now because if this proposal goes through, the price of DNS will crash by almost two-thirds, or much more than that if DNS is included in the vesting thing.

Edit: People can argue about the length of the vesting period; but like Ander said, 2 years is forever in crypto. A 2-year period will utterly crush the price of PTS because people can trade them for BTSX and get liquidity, and currently BTSX and PTS give equal amounts of BTS for the value. I'd expect a 50% drop in PTS price would be mild.

0.00006*106 ~ 0.00636
 so no 50% drop expected for PTS ,IMHO.

[Frodo]

I think that PTS and DNS should have no lockout period.  Right now, you can already sell them on the exchange.  It is unfair to lock out holders of these shares, who were already liquid at the time of the announcement.  Like, you can literally go dump them RIGHT NOW, and then not face a lockout.   (Note: I already dumped mine and bought BTSX with it, so this doesnt effect me.  But it effects others and I want to push for fairness).


I think the lockout period for AGS and VOTE shares should be 6 months.  2 years is an eternity.

  Please consider this.

[gamey]

I'm not very happy about PTS not being liquid.  The vesting period needs to be a lot shorter.  PTS is getting screwed.  0

I'm not even sure marketing one big DAC is that great of an idea.  Metcalfe's or not.  We're a currency, but also DNS provider, but we do voting too !   Is this easier to market ?   How about using it?  I guess one blockchain with separate front ends ?   No one had to even mention PTS/AGS previously in marketing.  Now we have a million different things under 1 roof. 

I suppose it might be better because I don't particularly disagree with Metcalfe's/network effect but you guys better think real carefully before blindly following a law.  There is a real problem with technical people applying stuff like this and having utter faith in it but failing to see the limitations of men in some regard.

So are there going to be separate front ends ?

So how many steps have we taken backwards from a point of stability ? 

Adam Ernest now gets 1% of BTS because he did what ? 

This is sort of what I was worried about when I first read Dan's initial posting.