Keyhotee Status Update

[dannotestein]

Listen, if you guys could just pick a date, commit to that date, and release on that date. I wouldn't even want a status update. Also I never even wanted daily status updates. That's something that the CEO OF THE COMPANY asked you to do in public, and not only you refused, you are arguing with your investors on WHY YOU FEEL you shouldn't do it.

So, you don't think it's reasonable for me to explain why I disagree with generating daily status reports or to propose an alternate method of delivering this information? Invictus isn't a dictatorship. We debate issues like this, then move ahead. Unlike most companies, we don't do it behind closed doors, we do it here on the forums, so that others have a chance to at least contribute their opinions. I apologize to anyone who's upset that I didn't register my disagreement on this issue earlier, but I hope I've provided a solution to this issue that should work for those who want daily information about Keyhotee and those who don't. I'm sure I'm not going to make you happy, but it's pretty clear from your 3 posts so far to bitshares.org that you're not a supporter of bitshares, and I personally believe that you're actively working against our success.

As far as dates go for a release of Keyhotee with a blockchain attached, there's two separate issues that will dictate the release date: when we've collected all the Keyhotee Founder Id registrations we think we're can reasonably collect and when the software has a reasonable set of initial features and sufficient stability. The first issue is somewhat outside of our complete control, of course, although the alpha releases we put out do affect it. Right now our goal is release the blockchain version of Keyhotee by the end of February, but I'm certainly not promising that date, it's just my best estimate with the current information I have. Initial releases of software aren't like follow-on releases: after you've released a stable product, it's typically not so difficult to estimate the impact of incremental changes to the product, but in the initial stages of new software it's possible to overlook major issues that delay releases.

[James212]

[ppimp]

Finally you guys are asking to be a DAC or corporation, so you need to start acting like it. YOu have millions of dollars in investor funds. This isn't a fun open-source side project.

Furthermore, Dan you have likened yourself and organization to Apple, or what Apple has done. And you call Invictus a corporation. Imagine if Apple had the same debacle with a release of one of their flagship products.

No one is asking you to get things in early or fast or whatever. You guys chose New Years Eve. What i'm asking you is whatever time you need take it. But you need to be consistent and professional, and the way you are running the keyhotee release (your first product) is far from it...

[ppimp]

Adam hits the nail on the head.
Taking 5 minutes out of your day and giving everyone one an update is extremely easy to do, and as you can tell goes along way. Keep in mind, Invictus has FAILED to deliver on their commitment and time frame. Why else do you think we ware asking?

Listen, if you guys could just pick a date, commit to that date, and release on that date. I wouldn't even want a status update. Also I never even wanted daily status updates. That's something that the CEO OF THE COMPANY asked you to do in public, and not only you refused, you are arguing with your investors on WHY YOU FEEL you shouldn't do it.

How do I have faith in such a company? Couple that with the fact that you are not the only game in town now. That's why I brought up the other alt-technologies. Mastercoin already has a DATE for distributed exchange (bitshares) and a website with a countdown clock. Whats the date for bitshares release I have no idea?

Again I was very very bullish on Invictus because the idea's Dan espoused (especially on LTB) at the time, was much earlier and advanced than anyone else. Unfortunately they were not able to deliver.

I suggest you all come up with a date of a release, a formal plan on communication, and stick to it like a professional organization.

Thanks

[dannotestein]

Thanks for the update. Another suggestion on build releases would be to have the most recent version/build/platform with the released date linked in the OP.

I plan to do that soon actually, I just want to make this a "staged" release. In other words, first I just post here, where the most intrepid will download, then if we don't get a barrage of error reports, I'll add a link to the original posting.

[CryptoN8]

Thanks for the update. Another suggestion on build releases would be to have the most recent version/build/platform with the released date linked in the OP. It makes it much easier to find and not have to dig through pages or be sent to another site. Keep up the great work, this is very exciting stuff.

[AdamBLevine]

I'm not sure how everyone else receives messages on the forum, but every time I post to a topic, afterwards I get a message in my email box every time someone else posts to that topic.

Ideally, I'd like my posts to trigger emails to people when I've actually posted something of reasonable significance, like "we've found a serious bug alpha testers should be aware of" or "we've got a new release for testing" or even "the schedule for delivery has changed". In other words, I want to reserve this thread for more substantial announcements that are of interest to all Keyhotee fans and should probably trigger some action on their part.

I understand that there are people who actually want to know on a day-to-day basis what's changed in the software. To meet this desire, I've modified the original head post for this thread with useful links to the commit repo (a modified form of toast's suggestion). The data there gets updated on a daily basis (or rather, as soon as a change is made) and it's all done automatically as changes are made to the code.

You realize the only issue is that daily updates were explicitly promised and then routinely and repeatedly not delivered with no explanation?

[dannotestein]

I'm not sure how everyone else receives messages on the forum, but every time I post to a topic, afterwards I get a message in my email box every time someone else posts to that topic.

Ideally, I'd like my posts to trigger emails to people when I've actually posted something of reasonable significance, like "we've found a serious bug alpha testers should be aware of" or "we've got a new release for testing" or even "the schedule for delivery has changed". In other words, I want to reserve this thread for more substantial announcements that are of interest to all Keyhotee fans and should probably trigger some action on their part.

I understand that there are people who actually want to know on a day-to-day basis what's changed in the software. To meet this desire, I've modified the original head post for this thread with useful links to the commit repo (a modified form of toast's suggestion). The data there gets updated on a daily basis (or rather, as soon as a change is made) and it's all done automatically as changes are made to the code.

[toast]

Dan/Bytemaster asked for me to do daily updates, but I don't really see the point, nor is it obvious to me how to translate detailed bugs addressed on a daily basis into a digestible form. If you want daily updates, here's the best place:

The point is that you were asked in public to do it, and then you didn't.    It goes to further reinforce the impression that Bytemaster has no real ability to make any commitments even over the short term because his employees do not follow his instructions.   

As a project lead, when you tell people you'll do something and then don't do it, they stop believing you when you say you'll do something.  You are training Invictus investors to not trust invictus.  When Bytemaster requests something, either do it or to lodge your complaint early so the situation can be corrected, your decision to just not has obvious and predictable consequences.   

If I were you, I'd say "January 31st - Fixing Bugs today, dealing with a bad one in linux dependencies.  Looking like we're on schedule to have the latest version out in a week barring show-stopping bugs"

Thats it

Two sentences per day, I now have some idea what's happening and I know that the schedule has not changed.  It also fulfills what Bytemaster publicly committed to.

It may be sufficient to just post this link to this thread every day, and some days you will naturally want to say more
https://github.com/InvictusInnovations/keyhotee/commits/master

[valtr]

I was able to run Keyhotee on Ubuntu 12.04 64 bit and 13.10 64 bit.

[AdamBLevine]

Dan/Bytemaster asked for me to do daily updates, but I don't really see the point, nor is it obvious to me how to translate detailed bugs addressed on a daily basis into a digestible form. If you want daily updates, here's the best place:

The point is that you were asked in public to do it, and then you didn't.    It goes to further reinforce the impression that Bytemaster has no real ability to make any commitments even over the short term because his employees do not follow his instructions.   

As a project lead, when you tell people you'll do something and then don't do it, they stop believing you when you say you'll do something.  You are training Invictus investors to not trust invictus.  When Bytemaster requests something, either do it or to lodge your complaint early so the situation can be corrected, your decision to just not has obvious and predictable consequences.   

If I were you, I'd say "January 31st - Fixing Bugs today, dealing with a bad one in linux dependencies.  Looking like we're on schedule to have the latest version out in a week barring show-stopping bugs"

Thats it

Two sentences per day, I now have some idea what's happening and I know that the schedule has not changed.  It also fulfills what Bytemaster publicly committed to.

[dannotestein]

Keyhotee Alpha 3 release for Linux is here: http://invictus.io/keyhotee.php
We're still working to make it compatible with more versions of Linux, so please let us know if it doesn't run on your system.

[bytemaster]

I use to be a Invictus investor and very bullish on the PTS shares, but I recently pulled out with the steep decline in PTS price coupled with the confusion around AngelShares and not knowing which I should be holding on to. I am still very interested in seeing you succeed and and be first to deploy but honestly there is a lot more competition from Nxt, MasterCoin, Ethereum.

Its not exactly the thread to discuss this, but it's coming out with the frustration on failing to deliver on Keyhotee, and as I check back what I am seeing.

There is still issues with Keyhotee that I find unacceptable if Invictus wants to be competitive, reputable organization:

• Dan/Bytemaster mentioned they aim for daily status updates 7 days ago. They missed 6 out of 7 of those daily status updates.
  
• What about the Keyhotee Windows build?
• The download for alpha keyhotee is not working. I clicked the .zip file on the first page of this thread and it goes to 404 Error not found...

Can you please fix these and be more transparent in communication, and delivery. Thanks.

From what I see the download of Keyhotee from the website is working just fine, if this thread is out of date then I am sure a mod can fix it.   

Everyone knew we were at the conference in Miami and we posted every day from the event, of course you cannot expect new software development from me during that time.

[Pocket Sand]

I use to be a Invictus investor and very bullish on the PTS shares, but I recently pulled out with the steep decline in PTS price coupled with the confusion around AngelShares and not knowing which I should be holding on to. I am still very interested in seeing you succeed and and be first to deploy but honestly there is a lot more competition from Nxt, MasterCoin, Ethereum.

Its not exactly the thread to discuss this, but it's coming out with the frustration on failing to deliver on Keyhotee, and as I check back what I am seeing.

There is still issues with Keyhotee that I find unacceptable if Invictus wants to be competitive, reputable organization:

• Dan/Bytemaster mentioned they aim for daily status updates 7 days ago. They missed 6 out of 7 of those daily status updates.
  
• What about the Keyhotee Windows build?
• The download for alpha keyhotee is not working. I clicked the .zip file on the first page of this thread and it goes to 404 Error not found...

Can you please fix these and be more transparent in communication, and delivery. Thanks.

Sorry what has ethereum actually delivered thus far that you're crediting being first to deploy/more efficient dev? Also mastercoin has had a lot more money for a lot longer of a time and still has yet to have a solid release, nxt is an interesting concept but they have not yet delivered on many promises.Dan has already established an alpha release for bitshares and keyhotee, while moved back, is still scheduled to be released soon.

[dannotestein]

• Dan/Bytemaster mentioned they aim for daily status updates 7 days ago. They missed 6 out of 7 of those daily status updates.
  
• What about the Keyhotee Windows build?
• The download for alpha keyhotee is not working. I clicked the .zip file on the first page of this thread and it goes to 404 Error not found...

Dan/Bytemaster asked for me to do daily updates, but I don't really see the point, nor is it obvious to me how to translate detailed bugs addressed on a daily basis into a digestible form. If you want daily updates, here's the best place:

https://github.com/InvictusInnovations/keyhotee/issues?state=open

We're using github to track every bug fix and feature being added. Ideally, I think a written update should be delivered about once a week.

We're planning to release a new Linux and Windows version within the next day or three, depending on how the static build for Linux goes tomorrow. The hold up, as I mentioned a few posts above is that we've kept finding additional dependencies that we don't want to rely on in the base Linux system (today, we ended up adding libssl as a static lib to avoid that dependency). I think we're done at this point, so probably the release will be late tomorrow.

As far as the link being broken, I've got no idea about that personally, but I'd guess it has something to do with the fact that the web site is in progress of being updated/moved. For sure, we'll have new links soon anyways, so it's probably not worth downloading the old alpha at this point.