Author Topic: NOTE value after snapshot  (Read 9412 times)

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Offline Marky0001

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NOTE value after snapshot
« on: October 08, 2015, 05:26:37 pm »
I have the feeling that NOTEs will become "worthless" after museUSD launched.

What are your thoughts on that?

Offline Shentist

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2015, 05:45:16 pm »
after the snapshot the NOTES on the BTS chain are worthless, because after this MUSE will have their own chain.

Offline Marky0001

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2015, 05:57:26 pm »
and what will happen to our notes after we imported it to MUSE?

what will those be there for?

Offline Shentist

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2015, 06:07:30 pm »
and what will happen to our notes after we imported it to MUSE?

what will those be there for?

its the the same like in the BTS chain, it is the source for everything - museUSD, artistcoins etc. how everything will work is not published, yet!

Offline Riverhead

Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2015, 06:18:58 pm »

Export your wallet on Oct 12th and you'll likely never have to fire up the BTS client again.

Offline Marky0001

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2015, 06:22:59 pm »

Export your wallet on Oct 12th and you'll likely never have to fire up the BTS client again.

?

i am serious... i have the feeling that it will be almost worthless, because no one will need notes to do business in muse.

Offline Ander

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2015, 06:29:55 pm »

Export your wallet on Oct 12th and you'll likely never have to fire up the BTS client again.

?

i am serious... i have the feeling that it will be almost worthless, because no one will need notes to do business in muse.

Then sell yours to us.
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Offline Marky0001

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2015, 06:42:58 pm »
too bad you cannot get a normal discussion, because this stupid attitude in crypto will never disappear....

i am asking about the real value of note in the muse chain.

Offline Shentist

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2015, 06:45:07 pm »
too bad you cannot get a normal discussion, because this stupid attitude in crypto will never disappear....

i am asking about the real value of note in the muse chain.

then you should not ignore my answer.

Offline tbone

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2015, 06:55:58 pm »
too bad you cannot get a normal discussion, because this stupid attitude in crypto will never disappear....

i am asking about the real value of note in the muse chain.

How do you expect to have a normal conversation if you don't ask a normal question?  Fact is, you come across as a FUD'er.  But to answer your question with another question, why on god's green earth would NOTEs become worthless?  NOTEs are the underlying currency of the MUSE blockchain atop which PeerTracks is built.  I think NOTES will have great value and in fact their value is already going up.  Now if you ask me why MUSE needs it's own blockchain, I'm not not even remotely convinced that it's necessary or the best idea.  But that's another matter.

Offline Akado

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2015, 07:00:21 pm »

Export your wallet on Oct 12th and you'll likely never have to fire up the BTS client again.

?

i am serious... i have the feeling that it will be almost worthless, because no one will need notes to do business in muse.

To vote. People think the only value those assets have is because of feature X or Y, but they forget that those assets (BTS and NOTES) are the ones which will allow you to vote and choose the future of those chains. It will represent the value of the chain itself. Now you ask, why don't people just trade artist coins with eachother, is there any use for NOTES? Well, on top of voting, assuming it will also function like BTS, NOTES will be used to back other market pegged assets of the chain, I will assume there wont be as many as in BTS obviously but at least NOTEUSD or whatever will be there. Also transactions cost fees, meaning you will have to pay with notes for those fees. It maintains the network alive. I say this assuming that since it uses graphene that some basic stuff will be the same.

If you have a little understanding of how a blockchain works or the business model of BTS and/or NOTES you should already have an idea of how NOTES have value.
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Offline Marky0001

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2015, 07:15:45 pm »
i am talking about the economical value in terms of demand and supply...

when the project launches i don't see notes being traded that heavily thus missing liquidity and volatility.

it will be most likely a token without economical purpose right? i mean if you look at it as a business you will have to increase the demand to gain more value but what will drive the demand for notes?

those votes... how much will votes play a role in the daily routine? i look at it as the backend and most of the game will happen on the top.

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2015, 07:52:06 pm »
museUSD will be backed by MUSE .. fees are payed/burned in MUSE (finally)

Thats a better value proposition than bitcoin! Satisfied?

Offline Ander

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2015, 08:06:07 pm »
museUSD will be backed by MUSE .. fees are payed/burned in MUSE (finally)

Thats a better value proposition than bitcoin! Satisfied?

This is why they have value.  They have the same purpose in MUSE as BTS does in Bitshares.

I dont think anyone is going to be buying notes in order to vote, at least that wont be their main reason.  If that was all they did they would indeed be pretty worthless.
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Offline Marky0001

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2015, 08:08:26 pm »
museUSD will be backed by MUSE .. fees are payed/burned in MUSE (finally)

Thats a better value proposition than bitcoin! Satisfied?

so do you say NOTE will become MUSE?
« Last Edit: October 08, 2015, 08:12:36 pm by Marky0001 »

Offline CryptoPrometheus

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #15 on: October 08, 2015, 08:32:06 pm »
museUSD will be backed by MUSE .. fees are payed/burned in MUSE (finally)

Thats a better value proposition than bitcoin! Satisfied?

so do you say NOTE will become MUSE?

Yes. This is how it works:

After the MUSE chain is launched, you will download and install the new MUSE wallet. Then, you will import your private keys from your BitShares wallet (which contains your NOTES). This will unlock (from the MUSE genesis block) 1 MUSE for each 1 NOTE that you own.

Then, the BitShares 1.0 blockchain will die/become irrelevant, and the NOTE UIA on this old chain will be worthless. So in a way, you are correct. The NOTE on BitShares 1.0 will be worthless, once the value is transferred to MUSE.

After this, MUSE value will likely increase, since the utility of the MUSE core asset is much greater than the utility of the NOTE on bts 1.0, which was really just a placeholder so that people could begin trading and speculating.
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Offline Marky0001

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2015, 08:52:19 pm »
museUSD will be backed by MUSE .. fees are payed/burned in MUSE (finally)

Thats a better value proposition than bitcoin! Satisfied?

so do you say NOTE will become MUSE?

Yes. This is how it works:

After the MUSE chain is launched, you will download and install the new MUSE wallet. Then, you will import your private keys from your BitShares wallet (which contains your NOTES). This will unlock (from the MUSE genesis block) 1 MUSE for each 1 NOTE that you own.

Then, the BitShares 1.0 blockchain will die/become irrelevant, and the NOTE UIA on this old chain will be worthless. So in a way, you are correct. The NOTE on BitShares 1.0 will be worthless, once the value is transferred to MUSE.

After this, MUSE value will likely increase, since the utility of the MUSE core asset is much greater than the utility of the NOTE on bts 1.0, which was really just a placeholder so that people could begin trading and speculating.

thank you!

Offline cob

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #17 on: October 08, 2015, 09:04:50 pm »
museUSD will be backed by MUSE .. fees are payed/burned in MUSE (finally)

Thats a better value proposition than bitcoin! Satisfied?

so do you say NOTE will become MUSE?

Yes. This is how it works:

After the MUSE chain is launched, you will download and install the new MUSE wallet. Then, you will import your private keys from your BitShares wallet (which contains your NOTES). This will unlock (from the MUSE genesis block) 1 MUSE for each 1 NOTE that you own.

Then, the BitShares 1.0 blockchain will die/become irrelevant, and the NOTE UIA on this old chain will be worthless. So in a way, you are correct. The NOTE on BitShares 1.0 will be worthless, once the value is transferred to MUSE.

After this, MUSE value will likely increase, since the utility of the MUSE core asset is much greater than the utility of the NOTE on bts 1.0, which was really just a placeholder so that people could begin trading and speculating.

Perfect answer right there!
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Offline tonyk

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #18 on: October 09, 2015, 03:15:41 am »
I have the feeling that NOTEs will become "worthless" after museUSD launched.

What are your thoughts on that?

I know I am changing the subject (slightly), but the decision to have museUSD will be the main contributor why the whole MUSE block chain fails.

There will be long discussions after the fact;  with 'smart' people stating their opinions "why that happen to such a great project" [of course the smarty's will be using random things observed in the meanwhile]

But you have heard it here first - it will have failed, because of the decision to have museUSD !
Other factors will work for, as well as against it, but keeping this choice is definitely the killer feature :)... literally.

10-08-2015

« Last Edit: October 09, 2015, 05:56:49 am by tonyk »
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline tbone

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #19 on: October 09, 2015, 03:45:05 am »
I have the feeling that NOTEs will become "worthless" after museUSD launched.

What are your thoughts on that?

I know I am changing the subject (slightly), but the decision to have museUSD will be the main contributor why the whole MUSE block chain fails.

There will be long discussions after the fact;  with 'smart' people stating their opinions "why that happen to such a great project" [of course the smarty's will be using random things observed in the meanwhile]

But you have heard it here first - it will have failed, because of the decision to have museUSD !
Other factors will work for, as well as against it, but keeping this choice is definitely the killer feature :)... literally.

10-08-20015

Can you explain how and why you think that will cause it to fail?  Thanks.

Offline CryptoPrometheus

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #20 on: October 09, 2015, 05:39:46 am »
I have the feeling that NOTEs will become "worthless" after museUSD launched.

What are your thoughts on that?

I know I am changing the subject (slightly), but the decision to have museUSD will be the main contributor why the whole MUSE block chain fails.

There will be long discussions after the fact;  with 'smart' people stating their opinions "why that happen to such a great project" [of course the smarty's will be using random things observed in the meanwhile]

But you have heard it here first - it will have failed, because of the decision to have museUSD !
Other factors will work for, as well as against it, but keeping this choice is definitely the killer feature :)... literally.

10-08-20015

Can you explain how and why you think that will cause it to fail?  Thanks.

A bold prediction. I too am curious what your reasons are?

10-08-20015
Does this mean that you aren't worried about a problem occuring for at least 18,000 years  :P
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Offline tonyk

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #21 on: October 09, 2015, 05:49:38 am »
I have the feeling that NOTEs will become "worthless" after museUSD launched.

What are your thoughts on that?

I know I am changing the subject (slightly), but the decision to have museUSD will be the main contributor why the whole MUSE block chain fails.

There will be long discussions after the fact;  with 'smart' people stating their opinions "why that happen to such a great project" [of course the smarty's will be using random things observed in the meanwhile]

But you have heard it here first - it will have failed, because of the decision to have museUSD !
Other factors will work for, as well as against it, but keeping this choice is definitely the killer feature :)... literally.

10-08-20015

Can you explain how and why you think that will cause it to fail?  Thanks.

Sorry to be a wet blanket.  Writing a description for this thing for general audiences is bloody hard.  There's nothing to relate it to. You either get it or  not.
 I am sorry but I do not have  time to explain.

--------------------
PS.
and yes, smartass  it is 2015 .  Like you never typed an extra character....idiots.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2015, 05:57:08 am by tonyk »
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline CryptoPrometheus

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #22 on: October 09, 2015, 07:29:24 am »
I have the feeling that NOTEs will become "worthless" after museUSD launched.

What are your thoughts on that?

I know I am changing the subject (slightly), but the decision to have museUSD will be the main contributor why the whole MUSE block chain fails.

There will be long discussions after the fact;  with 'smart' people stating their opinions "why that happen to such a great project" [of course the smarty's will be using random things observed in the meanwhile]

But you have heard it here first - it will have failed, because of the decision to have museUSD !
Other factors will work for, as well as against it, but keeping this choice is definitely the killer feature :)... literally.

10-08-20015

Can you explain how and why you think that will cause it to fail?  Thanks.

Sorry to be a wet blanket.  Writing a description for this thing for general audiences is bloody hard.  There's nothing to relate it to. You either get it or  not.
 I am sorry but I do not have  time to explain.

--------------------
PS.
and yes, smartass  it is 2015 .  Like you never typed an extra character....idiots.

Well, thank you for gracing us with a tiny bit of your lofty wisdom, and I am sorry we don't merit any more of your valuable time. While I was genuinely curious about your thoughts, I guess I am relieved now that I won't need to shoulder the painful burden of genius required to comprehend them.
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Offline liondani

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #23 on: October 09, 2015, 07:47:31 am »
I know I am changing the subject (slightly), but the decision to have museUSD will be the main contributor why the whole MUSE block chain fails.

so even if museUSD would never launched/used you still thing the MUSE block chain would fail?
Would you prefer it to coexist on bts2.0 as a token without the need of a new chain birth and all the power of our bitAssets?

Offline tonyk

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #24 on: October 09, 2015, 07:55:28 am »
I know I am changing the subject (slightly), but the decision to have museUSD will be the main contributor why the whole MUSE block chain fails.

so even if museUSD would never launched/used you still thing the MUSE block chain would fail?
Would you prefer it to coexist on bts2.0 as a token without the need of a new chain birth and all the power of our bitAssets?

No, all am saying is that museUSD is a stupidity of such a proportion, that it will lead to Muse failing not matter what else is done.
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline karnal

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #25 on: October 09, 2015, 08:12:38 am »
I know I am changing the subject (slightly), but the decision to have museUSD will be the main contributor why the whole MUSE block chain fails.

so even if museUSD would never launched/used you still thing the MUSE block chain would fail?
Would you prefer it to coexist on bts2.0 as a token without the need of a new chain birth and all the power of our bitAssets?

No, all am saying is that museUSD is a stupidity of such a proportion, that it will lead to Muse failing not matter what else is done.

Forgive the ignorance, but.

What is MuseUSD?

Offline santaclause102

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #26 on: October 09, 2015, 08:16:45 am »
I know I am changing the subject (slightly), but the decision to have museUSD will be the main contributor why the whole MUSE block chain fails.

so even if museUSD would never launched/used you still thing the MUSE block chain would fail?
Would you prefer it to coexist on bts2.0 as a token without the need of a new chain birth and all the power of our bitAssets?

No, all am saying is that museUSD is a stupidity of such a proportion, that it will lead to Muse failing not matter what else is done.
lol tony
You have the time to make bold claims and chat back and forth but not the time to summarize your argument.
In most cases: If something can not be expressed / summarized in a few sentences there often is no substance to it.

Offline xeroc

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #27 on: October 09, 2015, 08:37:45 am »
What is MuseUSD?
MuseUSD is the bitUSD in the MUSE chain backed by MUSE (sharedropped on NOTE) ... got it?

Offline Marky0001

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #28 on: October 09, 2015, 10:50:33 am »
I know I am changing the subject (slightly), but the decision to have museUSD will be the main contributor why the whole MUSE block chain fails.

so even if museUSD would never launched/used you still thing the MUSE block chain would fail?
Would you prefer it to coexist on bts2.0 as a token without the need of a new chain birth and all the power of our bitAssets?

No, all am saying is that museUSD is a stupidity of such a proportion, that it will lead to Muse failing not matter what else is done.

too bad you dont even give a Brief and logical explanation of what might hurt the Project using museUSD

Offline alt

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #29 on: October 09, 2015, 12:07:55 pm »
bitusd in BTS chain almost failure because of lack of liquility.
In my opnion, it's not a good time to separate the liquility for smart asset to multi chain.
so I don't think bitusd in MUSE can bring some advantage for now.
Instead,  bitUSD will bring  many confuse to understand and use MUSE.

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #30 on: October 09, 2015, 12:46:42 pm »
bitusd in BTS chain almost failure because of lack of liquility.
In my opnion, it's not a good time to separate the liquility for smart asset to multi chain.
so I don't think bitusd in MUSE can bring some advantage for now.
Instead,  bitUSD will bring  many confuse to understand and use MUSE.
You forget one big difference ... that is that MUSE will have peertracks actually USING(!!!) the muse_usd for their service ..
besides exchanges and gateways there is no much demand for bitUSD .. that may be different with muse_USD ..

Offline alt

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #31 on: October 09, 2015, 01:05:54 pm »
1 bitUSD worth about 1.1 USD now, without much demand for bitUSD.
so in MUSE, 1bitUSD maybe more than 1.1 USD.
yes, another big different is we'll have a new market engine, so I don't know what will happen.

what I know is the liquility is very important, and we'd better merge the liquility from multi chain if we can.
But I can't find the way. So I am just a little worry about what will happen if MUSE have it's bitUSD.

bitusd in BTS chain almost failure because of lack of liquility.
In my opnion, it's not a good time to separate the liquility for smart asset to multi chain.
so I don't think bitusd in MUSE can bring some advantage for now.
Instead,  bitUSD will bring  many confuse to understand and use MUSE.
You forget one big difference ... that is that MUSE will have peertracks actually USING(!!!) the muse_usd for their service ..
besides exchanges and gateways there is no much demand for bitUSD .. that may be different with muse_USD ..

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #32 on: October 09, 2015, 02:51:10 pm »
I thought they made changes in 2.0 that are suppose to solve or at least help the bitusd liquidity problem?

described here https://bitshares.org/technology/price-stable-cryptocurrencies/

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #33 on: October 09, 2015, 03:10:26 pm »
NOTE market will be shutdown after the snapshot and not migrated to BTS 2.0 (BM today's mumble)

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #34 on: October 09, 2015, 03:23:21 pm »
NOTE market will be shutdown after the snapshot and not migrated to BTS 2.0 (BM today's mumble)
.. instead it will be migrated to the MUSE blockchain .. so
* no NOTE in BitShares 2.0
* NOTE will be renamed to MUSE
* Muse distribution (as of BitShares 1.0 NOTE balances) will be the initial genesis block for the MUSE blockchain

Offline Riverhead

Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #35 on: October 09, 2015, 04:45:21 pm »

Export your wallet on Oct 12th and you'll likely never have to fire up the BTS client again.

?

i am serious... i have the feeling that it will be almost worthless, because no one will need notes to do business in muse.

I am serious too. Once the snapshot is taken BTS, NOTE, and anything else on the 0.9.x chain will be worthless. There may be a brief period where the chain stays alive due to some delegates continuing to run 0.9.x but unless an exchange supports the legacy pair they can't be sold.

Importing the keys you exported on the 12th to Graphene and Muse respectively is your only option.

Therefore you will likely never have to open your BTS [0.9.x] client again after exporting your keys. No attitude intended.

Offline cob

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #36 on: October 09, 2015, 05:06:44 pm »
tonyk do you have a proposed solution for a stable crypto that can be used by the music industry?

The only "solution" I see is a merger with the main BTS chain. So coding up the Automatic Royalty Payment Splitter into BTS 2.0 and having everything run on Bit_USD (collateralized by BTS)
This would be great for liquidity no doubt and make it cheaper (less nodes to pay) and grow the network effect. But there are a bunch of other problems imo.
1st We want MUSE to be a blockchain for the Music industry. Meaning a global database that finally takes care of the mess with global royalty payments and copyrights for music.
2nd have it "owned" by the music industry.  The "board of directors" aka people that have been delegated voting power (through proxy voting) should know a thing or two about that ridiculously complicated world.
3rd The business model of BTS is different. BTS has high fees and paid memberships with the referral program. It makes total sense when you are undercutting E-trade, Questrade and the like. But we are entering a different market. We want fees to be a competitive as possible in the music market. We want little Jimmy to trade his Beiber Notes with little Jenny from his mobile App without paying 20 cents or buying a lifetime membership at 80$.

What are your thoughts? A separate blockchain to me seemed like the best solution for our needs. But I'm not the smartest guy in the room by a long shot! Long long long shot :)
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Offline tonyk

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #37 on: October 09, 2015, 05:20:27 pm »
tonyk do you have a proposed solution for a stable crypto that can be used by the music industry?

The only "solution" I see is a merger with the main BTS chain. So coding up the Automatic Royalty Payment Splitter into BTS 2.0 and having everything run on Bit_USD (collateralized by BTS)
This would be great for liquidity no doubt and make it cheaper (less nodes to pay) and grow the network effect. But there are a bunch of other problems imo.
1st We want MUSE to be a blockchain for the Music industry. Meaning a global database that finally takes care of the mess with global royalty payments and copyrights for music.
2nd have it "owned" by the music industry.  The "board of directors" aka people that have been delegated voting power (through proxy voting) should know a thing or two about that ridiculously complicated world.
3rd The business model of BTS is different. BTS has high fees and paid memberships with the referral program. It makes total sense when you are undercutting E-trade, Questrade and the like. But we are entering a different market. We want fees to be a competitive as possible in the music market. We want little Jimmy to trade his Beiber Notes with little Jenny from his mobile App without paying 20 cents or buying a lifetime membership at 80$.

What are your thoughts? A separate blockchain to me seemed like the best solution for our needs. But I'm not the smartest guy in the room by a long shot! Long long long shot :)

I have thoughts...and sometimes solutions too. Unfortunately my efforts are the only ones that apparently do not deserve compensation around here...hell even the clueless traveling  *scapes got free trips for the only effort of being coooool.

So, yes for this pay I can only repeat what I said and try to earn money by using my knowledge otherwise (instead of sharing it for free) :

 
"Own,  in-house, museUSD is a suicidal decision for the MUSE blockchain."
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline CryptoPrometheus

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #38 on: October 09, 2015, 05:42:52 pm »
tonyk do you have a proposed solution for a stable crypto that can be used by the music industry?

The only "solution" I see is a merger with the main BTS chain. So coding up the Automatic Royalty Payment Splitter into BTS 2.0 and having everything run on Bit_USD (collateralized by BTS)
This would be great for liquidity no doubt and make it cheaper (less nodes to pay) and grow the network effect. But there are a bunch of other problems imo.
1st We want MUSE to be a blockchain for the Music industry. Meaning a global database that finally takes care of the mess with global royalty payments and copyrights for music.
2nd have it "owned" by the music industry.  The "board of directors" aka people that have been delegated voting power (through proxy voting) should know a thing or two about that ridiculously complicated world.
3rd The business model of BTS is different. BTS has high fees and paid memberships with the referral program. It makes total sense when you are undercutting E-trade, Questrade and the like. But we are entering a different market. We want fees to be a competitive as possible in the music market. We want little Jimmy to trade his Beiber Notes with little Jenny from his mobile App without paying 20 cents or buying a lifetime membership at 80$.

What are your thoughts? A separate blockchain to me seemed like the best solution for our needs. But I'm not the smartest guy in the room by a long shot! Long long long shot :)

I have thoughts...and sometimes solutions too. Unfortunately my efforts are the only ones that apparently do not deserve compensation around here...hell even the clueless traveling  *scapes got free trips for the only effort of being coooool.

So, yes for this pay I can only repeat what I said and try to earn money by using my knowledge otherwise (instead of sharing it for free) :

 
"Own,  in-house, museUSD is a suicidal decision for the MUSE blockchain."

Translation: Other people figured out how to game the system, and I am jealous that they got some free stuff. Since I have chosen to take this as a personal assault,  from now on I will reduce my (supposed) insights to short incomprehensible soundbites, and call people names when they dare to inquire further.

Nobody is asking you to be nice tonyk. We would be idiots to expect that.
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Offline Marky0001

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #39 on: October 09, 2015, 07:07:00 pm »
Let's see how the next months play out!

I have doubled my amount of notes that i purchased last year during the auction crowdsale over the last months.

I consider myself a serious INVESTOR that's why I asked for helpful explanations!

But telling us that basically everything is BS won't help!

I hope this project can gain some momentum!

Offline alt

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #40 on: October 10, 2015, 01:33:10 am »
smart asset like bitUSD is great but still with high risk.
another problem is the supply.

simple asset like CCEDK-USD is stable, and easy to understand.
I think trust dependency will not be a problem at music industry.

tonyk do you have a proposed solution for a stable crypto that can be used by the music industry?

The only "solution" I see is a merger with the main BTS chain. So coding up the Automatic Royalty Payment Splitter into BTS 2.0 and having everything run on Bit_USD (collateralized by BTS)
This would be great for liquidity no doubt and make it cheaper (less nodes to pay) and grow the network effect. But there are a bunch of other problems imo.
1st We want MUSE to be a blockchain for the Music industry. Meaning a global database that finally takes care of the mess with global royalty payments and copyrights for music.
2nd have it "owned" by the music industry.  The "board of directors" aka people that have been delegated voting power (through proxy voting) should know a thing or two about that ridiculously complicated world.
3rd The business model of BTS is different. BTS has high fees and paid memberships with the referral program. It makes total sense when you are undercutting E-trade, Questrade and the like. But we are entering a different market. We want fees to be a competitive as possible in the music market. We want little Jimmy to trade his Beiber Notes with little Jenny from his mobile App without paying 20 cents or buying a lifetime membership at 80$.

What are your thoughts? A separate blockchain to me seemed like the best solution for our needs. But I'm not the smartest guy in the room by a long shot! Long long long shot :)

Offline Riverhead

Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #41 on: October 10, 2015, 02:15:36 am »
I have doubled my amount of notes that i purchased last year during the auction crowdsale over the last months.

You and me both. Here's hoping it was a good play :).

I have faith in Cob because of what I've seen in the various posts and panel discussions where he's gone toe to toe with others in the space. I have faith in Eddie because he came up through the ranks and has managed to keep his hat in the ring by thinking way outside the box. I don't have a lot of exposure to the other members of the team.

At this point faith is all it is because, as Cob said earlier, the music industry is fucking nuts complicated.

Offline roadscape

Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #42 on: October 10, 2015, 02:48:47 am »
tonyk do you have a proposed solution for a stable crypto that can be used by the music industry?

The only "solution" I see is a merger with the main BTS chain. So coding up the Automatic Royalty Payment Splitter into BTS 2.0 and having everything run on Bit_USD (collateralized by BTS)
This would be great for liquidity no doubt and make it cheaper (less nodes to pay) and grow the network effect. But there are a bunch of other problems imo.
1st We want MUSE to be a blockchain for the Music industry. Meaning a global database that finally takes care of the mess with global royalty payments and copyrights for music.
2nd have it "owned" by the music industry.  The "board of directors" aka people that have been delegated voting power (through proxy voting) should know a thing or two about that ridiculously complicated world.
3rd The business model of BTS is different. BTS has high fees and paid memberships with the referral program. It makes total sense when you are undercutting E-trade, Questrade and the like. But we are entering a different market. We want fees to be a competitive as possible in the music market. We want little Jimmy to trade his Beiber Notes with little Jenny from his mobile App without paying 20 cents or buying a lifetime membership at 80$.

What are your thoughts? A separate blockchain to me seemed like the best solution for our needs. But I'm not the smartest guy in the room by a long shot! Long long long shot :)

I have thoughts...and sometimes solutions too. Unfortunately my efforts are the only ones that apparently do not deserve compensation around here...hell even the clueless traveling  *scapes got free trips for the only effort of being coooool.

So, yes for this pay I can only repeat what I said and try to earn money by using my knowledge otherwise (instead of sharing it for free) :

 
"Own,  in-house, museUSD is a suicidal decision for the MUSE blockchain."

tonyk, I used to like your posts.. they kept out the riff-raff. Now they are the riff-raff.

You're not a fan of our documentary project... ok. I don't have a problem with that.

What I do have a problem with is your endless personal attacks. It's unprofessional, toxic, malicious.... and way out of line.
http://cryptofresh.com  |  witness: roadscape

Offline woolcii

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #43 on: October 10, 2015, 03:07:32 am »
museUSD is cool

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #44 on: October 10, 2015, 04:22:55 am »

Offline Musewhale

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #45 on: October 10, 2015, 07:16:14 am »
A group of people who do not understand, and tell the experts how to do

 :P :P :P

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Offline tonyk

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #46 on: October 11, 2015, 12:59:42 am »
What are the chances that Muse can gain mass adoption faster than BitSharez?

Answer:

If MUSE USD is a bad idea then so is bitUSD and ChaseUSD and CoinbaseUSD and USD on every third party exchange, bank, or website that is used for exchange of goods and services.

 X Wrong answer.

 I am not saying all (or any) of them are good USDs...just saying that if they are, Muse USD is the worst... by a mile.

Additionally the chick will go with the hot music guy ...for the night.
Which the rich guy for the life of marriage....

But she will not on any occasion ask - "Do you happen to have your own USD"?
« Last Edit: October 11, 2015, 01:04:50 am by tonyk »
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline fuzzy

Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #47 on: October 11, 2015, 01:01:26 am »
tonyk do you have a proposed solution for a stable crypto that can be used by the music industry?

The only "solution" I see is a merger with the main BTS chain. So coding up the Automatic Royalty Payment Splitter into BTS 2.0 and having everything run on Bit_USD (collateralized by BTS)
This would be great for liquidity no doubt and make it cheaper (less nodes to pay) and grow the network effect. But there are a bunch of other problems imo.
1st We want MUSE to be a blockchain for the Music industry. Meaning a global database that finally takes care of the mess with global royalty payments and copyrights for music.
2nd have it "owned" by the music industry.  The "board of directors" aka people that have been delegated voting power (through proxy voting) should know a thing or two about that ridiculously complicated world.
3rd The business model of BTS is different. BTS has high fees and paid memberships with the referral program. It makes total sense when you are undercutting E-trade, Questrade and the like. But we are entering a different market. We want fees to be a competitive as possible in the music market. We want little Jimmy to trade his Beiber Notes with little Jenny from his mobile App without paying 20 cents or buying a lifetime membership at 80$.

What are your thoughts? A separate blockchain to me seemed like the best solution for our needs. But I'm not the smartest guy in the room by a long shot! Long long long shot :)

I have thoughts...and sometimes solutions too. Unfortunately my efforts are the only ones that apparently do not deserve compensation around here...hell even the clueless traveling  *scapes got free trips for the only effort of being coooool.

So, yes for this pay I can only repeat what I said and try to earn money by using my knowledge otherwise (instead of sharing it for free) :

 
"Own,  in-house, museUSD is a suicidal decision for the MUSE blockchain."

tonyk, I used to like your posts.. they kept out the riff-raff. Now they are the riff-raff.

You're not a fan of our documentary project... ok. I don't have a problem with that.

What I do have a problem with is your endless personal attacks. It's unprofessional, toxic, malicious.... and way out of line.

The problem is that not everyone sees value in everything.  We can have our own points of view and tony is allowed to have his.  I love our community and how it has grown though...including tony, though i do wish he would refrain from his personal attacks at times too...

What he doesnt quite understand is that many of the GOOD people who received delegate pay (including bit and roadscape) have lottle to show for it other than some money they would have had to put up for it. 

For instance beyond bitcoins delegate has not paid me, but has given the bitshares guild a great deal of value...and the delegate pay divided among ourselves and minebitshares has essentially covered minimal costs.  It is simple reality.
WhaleShares==DKP; BitShares is our Community! 
ShareBits and WhaleShares = Love :D

Offline tonyk

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #48 on: October 11, 2015, 01:10:51 am »
tonyk do you have a proposed solution for a stable crypto that can be used by the music industry?

The only "solution" I see is a merger with the main BTS chain. So coding up the Automatic Royalty Payment Splitter into BTS 2.0 and having everything run on Bit_USD (collateralized by BTS)
This would be great for liquidity no doubt and make it cheaper (less nodes to pay) and grow the network effect. But there are a bunch of other problems imo.
1st We want MUSE to be a blockchain for the Music industry. Meaning a global database that finally takes care of the mess with global royalty payments and copyrights for music.
2nd have it "owned" by the music industry.  The "board of directors" aka people that have been delegated voting power (through proxy voting) should know a thing or two about that ridiculously complicated world.
3rd The business model of BTS is different. BTS has high fees and paid memberships with the referral program. It makes total sense when you are undercutting E-trade, Questrade and the like. But we are entering a different market. We want fees to be a competitive as possible in the music market. We want little Jimmy to trade his Beiber Notes with little Jenny from his mobile App without paying 20 cents or buying a lifetime membership at 80$.

What are your thoughts? A separate blockchain to me seemed like the best solution for our needs. But I'm not the smartest guy in the room by a long shot! Long long long shot :)

I have thoughts...and sometimes solutions too. Unfortunately my efforts are the only ones that apparently do not deserve compensation around here...hell even the clueless traveling  *scapes got free trips for the only effort of being coooool.

So, yes for this pay I can only repeat what I said and try to earn money by using my knowledge otherwise (instead of sharing it for free) :

 
"Own,  in-house, museUSD is a suicidal decision for the MUSE blockchain."

tonyk, I used to like your posts.. they kept out the riff-raff. Now they are the riff-raff.

You're not a fan of our documentary project... ok. I don't have a problem with that.

What I do have a problem with is your endless personal attacks. It's unprofessional, toxic, malicious.... and way out of line.

The problem is that not everyone sees value in everything.  We can have our own points of view and tony is allowed to have his.  I love our community and how it has grown though...including tony, though i do wish he would refrain from his personal attacks at times too...

What he doesnt quite understand is that many of the GOOD people who received delegate pay (including bit and roadscape) have lottle to show for it other than some money they would have had to put up for it. 

For instance beyond bitcoins delegate has not paid me, but has given the bitshares guild a great deal of value...and the delegate pay divided among ourselves and minebitshares has essentially covered minimal costs.  It is simple reality.

Have I on any occasion said or even hinted that the money your delegate receives is a bad decision? Couse if you interpreted any post of mine like this. it was misinterpretation!

On the other hand when I believe  something is completely wrong, I find subtle and so much so, ways to point it out.


PS
From now on though, I  have no reason to not accuse you of coming to the defense of something well out of hand...just so you keep the status quo.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2015, 01:16:58 am by tonyk »
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline Marky0001

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #49 on: October 14, 2015, 04:10:48 pm »
very silent over here after the snapshot :D

Offline yellowecho

Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #50 on: October 15, 2015, 02:26:32 am »
I think the solution to MUSE_USD lies in its use.
How will users pay for MUSE? Can they use PayPal or credit card to purchase MUSE (formerly NOTES) via PeerTracks? If so wouldn't PayPal_USD ≈ CORE_USD? In my mind MUSE_USD would simply act as a basket of currencies denominated in "_USD" throughout the ecosystem.
696c6f766562726f776e696573

Offline cob

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #51 on: October 15, 2015, 03:35:43 pm »
I think the solution to MUSE_USD lies in its use.
How will users pay for MUSE? Can they use PayPal or credit card to purchase MUSE (formerly NOTES) via PeerTracks? If so wouldn't PayPal_USD ≈ CORE_USD? In my mind MUSE_USD would simply act as a basket of currencies denominated in "_USD" throughout the ecosystem.

People wishing to buy music, merch, concert tickets, tip, patron, etc. whether doing it on PeerTracks or any other website that connects to MUSE can do so using Smartcoins/MPA.

In this way, both consumers and creators (artists) do business in a currency they are used to (the USD for example)
No need to understand crypto currency, blockchain or any of that "nonesense"
Products are denominated in familiar ways (as opposed to paying 0.00017BTC for a song download) and of course they are shielded from volatility associated with crypto or stock markets.

So the muse_USD will be currency of the music industry... Collateralized by the MUSE core units.

Make sense?
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline Musewhale

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #52 on: October 16, 2015, 03:17:58 am »
I think the solution to MUSE_USD lies in its use.
How will users pay for MUSE? Can they use PayPal or credit card to purchase MUSE (formerly NOTES) via PeerTracks? If so wouldn't PayPal_USD ≈ CORE_USD? In my mind MUSE_USD would simply act as a basket of currencies denominated in "_USD" throughout the ecosystem.

People wishing to buy music, merch, concert tickets, tip, patron, etc. whether doing it on PeerTracks or any other website that connects to MUSE can do so using Smartcoins/MPA.

In this way, both consumers and creators (artists) do business in a currency they are used to (the USD for example)
No need to understand crypto currency, blockchain or any of that "nonesense"
Products are denominated in familiar ways (as opposed to paying 0.00017BTC for a song download) and of course they are shielded from volatility associated with crypto or stock markets.

So the muse_USD will be currency of the music industry... Collateralized by the MUSE core units.

Make sense?

 :P :P :P

MUSE witness:mygoodfriend     vote for me

Offline woolcii

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #53 on: October 16, 2015, 03:39:11 am »
I think the solution to MUSE_USD lies in its use.
How will users pay for MUSE? Can they use PayPal or credit card to purchase MUSE (formerly NOTES) via PeerTracks? If so wouldn't PayPal_USD ≈ CORE_USD? In my mind MUSE_USD would simply act as a basket of currencies denominated in "_USD" throughout the ecosystem.

People wishing to buy music, merch, concert tickets, tip, patron, etc. whether doing it on PeerTracks or any other website that connects to MUSE can do so using Smartcoins/MPA.

In this way, both consumers and creators (artists) do business in a currency they are used to (the USD for example)
No need to understand crypto currency, blockchain or any of that "nonesense"
Products are denominated in familiar ways (as opposed to paying 0.00017BTC for a song download) and of course they are shielded from volatility associated with crypto or stock markets.

So the muse_USD will be currency of the music industry... Collateralized by the MUSE core units.

Make sense?


cool

Offline tonyk

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #54 on: October 21, 2015, 03:42:29 am »
The RIGHT answer , was taken.

I chose the next best.  :)
« Last Edit: October 21, 2015, 03:44:22 am by tonyk »
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline Akado

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #55 on: October 23, 2015, 07:13:48 pm »
Muse actually has a chance of going viral thanks to social networks. It only takes a few people to think it's cool and it will spread, fast. They only need to think "this is the new spotify" and it will happen.
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Offline Marky0001

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #56 on: October 23, 2015, 07:29:35 pm »
the only problem is the name... i still think it will not contribute to a quick success. There is still  too much association with the famous band MUSE.

Thats why it needs a lot of press and talk to hit google top search results. Otherwise you will have a hard time exploring the project and system behind it.

Offline Stan

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Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #57 on: October 23, 2015, 07:58:05 pm »
the only problem is the name... i still think it will not contribute to a quick success. There is still  too much association with the famous band MUSE.

Thats why it needs a lot of press and talk to hit google top search results. Otherwise you will have a hard time exploring the project and system behind it.

You need to keep in mind that the underlying MUSE asset will not normally be visible to artists and fans.  Only to cryptospeculators.

Fans will use (bit)USD to purchase SnoopNotes, et. al.  And they won't even know whether the USD in their wallets is a MPA or a UIA.  Only the speculators behind the curtain will know.


So there is no confusion - and the two worlds will only meet on crypto exchanges where people are assumed to know what they are doing.  Heh.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2015, 08:10:02 pm by Stan »
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract of any kind.   These are merely my opinions which I reserve the right to change at any time.

Offline Riverhead

Re: NOTE value after snapshot
« Reply #58 on: October 24, 2015, 04:29:46 am »
...crypto exchanges where people are assumed to know what they are doing.  Heh.

Have you seen the price of BTS??

Anyway, I agree with the gist of what Cob and Stan are saying. The users will just see USD - the same ChaseUSD they see on their ATM receipts.