Author Topic: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model  (Read 3475 times)

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Offline bitcrab

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recently there are a lot of price feeding relevant discussion on Chinese community and wechat groups https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=26909.0

summarizing the discussion and reviewing what happened in the market these 2 days, I suggest witnesses to adopt a new model for CNY price feeding:

suppose A = BTS price in bitCNY at DEX + bitCNY deposit fee, Bi = BTS price in CNY got from one big external exchanges.

feed max(A,B1,B2...) as the BTS price in CNY.

let me explain why suggest to do so:

there are always shorters who watch the whole market, the dept positions in DEX everyday, and they are clear about the margin called rules in DEX, so when bear comes, they begin their work: sell BTS in big quantity in centralized exchange and lower the fee price and make the big debt position margin called, and they buy the margin called orders to make profits.

surely there should be shorters exist in a healthy market, but it's not good to always encourage shorting and speed up the falling of BTS price in bear market. to cultivate the smartcoin ecosystem, it's necessary to continually optimize the rules to encourage longers and discourage shorters.

the target CR is a very good new feature to do so, but we still need more optimization.

external centralized exchange are not transparent enough, in some market like zb.com, user can borrow BTS and short, and price come from these exchanges are mostly coverted from in BTC to USDT and then CNY, the too long conversion chain involve many uncertain factors.

BTS/bitCNY pair in DEX is the BTS trading pair with highest volume on the earth, and bitCNY has a convenient channel to fiat CNY, so this price can answer exactly in  what a price people can buy/sell BTS in fiat CNY.

sometimes the price in one market can be temporarily lower or higher then other markets, if the finally adopted price  temporarily higher than the actual price, it lead to little problem, but if the finally adopted price is temporarily lower than actual price, it may lead to margin call which should not happen, this is why I suggest to feed max(A, B)

currently the fed price to DEX comes from centralized exchange, it is like the neck of DEX are grabbed by exchanges outside DEX, we should let DEX itself play more important role in price finalizing, let the longers and shorters fight in DEX, not other exchanges.

to be careful, I suggest only try this model in CNY price feeding at first.


« Last Edit: August 09, 2018, 04:52:20 pm by bitcrab »

Offline ymtt

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Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2018, 05:29:46 pm »
support

Online Thul3

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Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2018, 05:43:08 pm »
A CLEAR NO TO MARKET MANIPULATION

Offline clockwork

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Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2018, 05:58:46 pm »
recently there are a lot of price feeding relevant discussion on Chinese community and wechat groups https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=26909.0

summarizing the discussion and reviewing what happened in the market these 2 days, I suggest witnesses to adopt a new model for CNY price feeding:

suppose A = BTS price in bitCNY at DEX + bitCNY deposit fee, Bi = BTS price in CNY got from one big external exchanges.

feed max(A,B1,B2...) as the BTS price in CNY.

let me explain why suggest to do so:

there are always shorters who watch the whole market, the dept positions in DEX everyday, and they are clear about the margin called rules in DEX, so when bear comes, they begin their work: sell BTS in big quantity in centralized exchange and lower the fee price and make the big debt position margin called, and they buy the margin called orders to make profits.

surely there should be shorters exist in a healthy market, but it's not good to always encourage shorting and speed up the falling of BTS price in bear market. to cultivate the smartcoin ecosystem, it's necessary to continually optimize the rules to encourage longers and discourage shorters.

the target CR is a very good new feature to do so, but we still need more optimization.

external centralized exchange are not transparent enough, in some market like zb.com, user can borrow BTS and short, and price come from these exchanges are mostly coverted from in BTC to USDT and then CNY, the too long conversion chain involve many uncertain factors.

BTS/bitCNY pair in DEX is the BTS trading pair with highest volume on the earth, and bitCNY has a convenient channel to fiat CNY, so this price can answer exactly in  what a price people can buy/sell BTS in fiat CNY.

sometimes the price in one market can be temporarily lower or higher then other markets, if the finally adopted price  temporarily higher than the actual price, it lead to little problem, but if the finally adopted price is temporarily lower than actual price, it may lead to margin call which should not happen, this is why I suggest to feed max(A, B)

currently the fed price to DEX comes from centralized exchange, it is like the neck of DEX are grabbed by exchanges outside DEX, we should let DEX itself play more important role in price finalizing, let the longers and shorters fight in DEX, not other exchanges.

to be careful, I suggest only try this model in CNY price feeding at first.

I am confused.... external price is ALWAYS higher than the internal one (right now we have 0.83 dex market price and 0.87 feed price)

Is the deposit fee higher than 5% which would be required for this to have any effect?


Offline lovegan007

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Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2018, 06:56:59 pm »
 这样的话,假如  取几大交易 所的最高价为喂价, 假如 1为 ZB平台,2为P网,3为钱包内盘,4为 AEX,5为 火币网 6为比特儿.....取这几个大交易量平台的最高价格为 喂价值,如果拉盘只需要找这其中一个平台去拉盘就成了,你其它人或者其它平台有意见的你可以转币过来砸我不让我拉盘拉喂价。  但是如果你想砸盘砸喂价,那么你就需要把这些几个大交易平台的BTS价格都砸低到统一低的价格喂价才会是那个价,要不然其中之一 个平台的价 格没有砸下来,喂价都是取那个最高价为准。这样的结果就是拉盘只需要拉一个,砸盘你就需要砸全部的了。不然你砸的盘没用。

Offline bitcrab

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Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2018, 01:16:00 am »
I am confused.... external price is ALWAYS higher than the internal one (right now we have 0.83 dex market price and 0.87 feed price)

Is the deposit fee higher than 5% which would be required for this to have any effect?

yes, the deposit fee is required here.

Offline lucky

Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2018, 01:20:46 am »
Support to improve, let BTS can grow up!

Offline bitcrab

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Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2018, 01:21:26 am »
这样的话,假如  取几大交易 所的最高价为喂价, 假如 1为 ZB平台,2为P网,3为钱包内盘,4为 AEX,5为 火币网 6为比特儿.....取这几个大交易量平台的最高价格为 喂价值,如果拉盘只需要找这其中一个平台去拉盘就成了,你其它人或者其它平台有意见的你可以转币过来砸我不让我拉盘拉喂价。  但是如果你想砸盘砸喂价,那么你就需要把这些几个大交易平台的BTS价格都砸低到统一低的价格喂价才会是那个价,要不然其中之一 个平台的价 格没有砸下来,喂价都是取那个最高价为准。这样的结果就是拉盘只需要拉一个,砸盘你就需要砸全部的了。不然你砸的盘没用。

也不会出现这种刻意去拉盘的行为,砸盘把喂价砸下来再去吃尸体,是有超额回报的,你去把单个交易所价格拉上去,从而把喂价带上去,有什么超额回报?无非是给别人套利创造机会。之所以要取最高价,只是为了安全,为了防守。

Offline ebit

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Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2018, 01:44:17 am »
support .good idea. let's do it this way.

Offline xiangxn

Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2018, 01:50:41 am »
应该是外盘取平均,与内盘取最大,看内盘深度,如果到达某个理想深度,就取消外盘喂价
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Offline ebit

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Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2018, 01:59:01 am »
这样的话,假如  取几大交易 所的最高价为喂价, 假如 1为 ZB平台,2为P网,3为钱包内盘,4为 AEX,5为 火币网 6为比特儿.....取这几个大交易量平台的最高价格为 喂价值,如果拉盘只需要找这其中一个平台去拉盘就成了,你其它人或者其它平台有意见的你可以转币过来砸我不让我拉盘拉喂价。  但是如果你想砸盘砸喂价,那么你就需要把这些几个大交易平台的BTS价格都砸低到统一低的价格喂价才会是那个价,要不然其中之一 个平台的价 格没有砸下来,喂价都是取那个最高价为准。这样的结果就是拉盘只需要拉一个,砸盘你就需要砸全部的了。不然你砸的盘没用。

也不会出现这种刻意去拉盘的行为,砸盘把喂价砸下来再去吃尸体,是有超额回报的,你去把单个交易所价格拉上去,从而把喂价带上去,有什么超额回报?无非是给别人套利创造机会。之所以要取最高价,只是为了安全,为了防守。

这个方案只在bitcny上测试,不推广至bitusd 。即使有风险,也是规模可控的。如果恶庄强行拉盘bts到100元,套现bitcny。内盘机器人们也可也跟风操作将套现的bitcny挂买单,一步步实现真拉盘。

Offline bitcrab

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Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2018, 02:07:07 am »
应该是外盘取平均,与内盘取最大,看内盘深度,如果到达某个理想深度,就取消外盘喂价

这样也可以,核心就是让暴力砸盘拉低喂价吃尸体的做法不再行得通。

Offline ebit

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Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2018, 02:12:38 am »
应该是外盘取平均,与内盘取最大,看内盘深度,如果到达某个理想深度,就取消外盘喂价

这样也可以,核心就是让暴力砸盘拉低喂价吃尸体的做法不再行得通。

这个太激进,不适合bitcny,可以拿bitjpy测试。

Online Thul3

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Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2018, 02:47:22 am »
@ebit why did you approved creating assets on commitee account when Ratio was so low  ?
Shouldn't you be the one holding the terms of WP up ?

Offline pluswave

Re: suggestion to witnesses on "the highest one" CNY price feeding model
« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2018, 02:53:41 am »
the max price algorithm is for "BTS price", so if apply, should be applied to ALL smart coins. otherwise there should be enough gap (for price feed) between CNY and other smart coins. 

if apply to CNY only, will make bitCNY much cheaper according to real currencies.
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