Author Topic: Honoring AGS  (Read 4605 times)

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Offline AdamBLevine

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #15 on: May 23, 2014, 06:23:10 pm »
Very cool! Good job. Thoughts:
...
3) Not honoring AGS
 

#3 - please consider AGS! It makes the difference between begrudging and enthusiastic support from the bitshares community. I think the community support may be worth taking 1/4th of the planned dev premine.

It is funny how smart people like Nicokai ( **toast**) can easily be lead into wrong thought process and believes.

Here is the simple truth:
Invictus came and said –“The social consensus is AGS should be honored at least 10%”
-First it is not a social consensus it is just private party saying something (i.e. there is no consensus)

-Second it is pretty contradictory/illogical statement – donate X amount to us/me, and expect somebody else to give you shares for this gesture.

-Third, I3 took the AGS money and said they will use it to develop the DAC industry, instead later on they said – “Now that we have the money, we will keep them AS A BACK UP for our salaries for 12 mo.” Even that in those 12 mo. the donor/investors expect(ed) a lot of DACs coming and producing money for those developers salaries…

-Forth, The only logical reason left  to honor AGS holders is for marketing purposes. But this audience is already reached by honoring PTS. There is a very small % of people donating to AGS only through BTC. More than 90% of AGS donors do it through some combination of BTC and PTS (The only notable exception I am aware of is Agent86 who does not have PTS account..., but then again I do not think Agent86 is a real person but rather a second  internet/forum handle  for a real person)

yep, it hasn't ever made sense to honor the social contract as currently defined and so in practice we see they don't.  Hopefully this will change once DPOS comes out since thats a wholly new underlying tech, but even then since its open source we're relying on the good will of project catalysts to honor it.   

This is one of the reasons it was so important to build the Bitshares community on these forums, but in practice we've seen activity go down over time so the reason to honor it now is even less than it was four months ago.
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Offline bitmeat

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #16 on: May 23, 2014, 06:31:30 pm »
I think I3 can easily fix that by changing the social contract so that AGS holders get an "option to buy at X price" that way there is incentive to honor the AGS as well as incentive for I3 to support development of the tech. So far Ethereum seems to be closest to what I would expect from a platform, minus the premine they allocated for themselves.

Offline JoeyD

Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #17 on: May 23, 2014, 06:33:06 pm »
Very cool! Good job. Thoughts:
...
3) Not honoring AGS
 

#3 - please consider AGS! It makes the difference between begrudging and enthusiastic support from the bitshares community. I think the community support may be worth taking 1/4th of the planned dev premine.

It is funny how smart people like Nicokai ( **toast**) can easily be lead into wrong thought process and believes.

Here is the simple truth:
Invictus came and said –“The social consensus is AGS should be honored at least 10%”
-First it is not a social consensus it is just private party saying something (i.e. there is no consensus)

-Second it is pretty contradictory/illogical statement – donate X amount to us/me, and expect somebody else to give you shares for this gesture.

-Third, I3 took the AGS money and said they will use it to develop the DAC industry, instead later on they said – “Now that we have the money, we will keep them AS A BACK UP for our salaries for 12 mo.” Even that in those 12 mo. the donor/investors expect(ed) a lot of DACs coming and producing money for those developers salaries…

-Forth, The only logical reason left  to honor AGS holders is for marketing purposes. But this audience is already reached by honoring PTS. There is a very small % of people donating to AGS only through BTC. More than 90% of AGS donors do it through some combination of BTC and PTS (The only notable exception I am aware of is Agent86 who does not have PTS account..., but then again I do not think Agent86 is a real person but rather a second  internet/forum handle  for a real person)

How did you come to that conclusion about the 90% AGS donators having as much if not more PTS? Not that I'm particularly notable, but I invested through AGS with btc because I thought btc would keep it's value more than PTS and did not see how buying PTS would help pay for development in any way. I do have a pts-wallet and some pts though, but not nearly as much as in ags.

While I agree with your assessment that you can't force people to issue shares, just looking at the 15% pts community response, I'd venture to guess that not honoring ags may not be the best marketing move ever and that looks an awful lot like a social discontentment/consensus contract to me. In the short term I don't see much wriggling room for dac-share-issuers.

Offline xeroc

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #18 on: May 23, 2014, 06:39:25 pm »
Plus .. we as a community can copy-cat each dac that does not honor the social contract and do better ... starting of with a much larger community ... and this community IS large
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Offline AdamBLevine

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #19 on: May 23, 2014, 06:41:09 pm »
and this community IS large

Quote
Most Online Today: 117. Most Online Ever: 373 (December 05, 2013, 11:28:00 PM) [/color] 
« Last Edit: May 23, 2014, 06:43:12 pm by AdamBLevine »
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Offline xeroc

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #20 on: May 23, 2014, 06:42:59 pm »
and this community IS large

Quote
Most Online Today: 117. Most Online Ever: 373 (December 05, 2013, 11:28:00 PM) [/color]
saying? Oh wait .. there still is a read-only mode for unregistered .. is it?
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Offline Amazon

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #21 on: May 23, 2014, 06:48:26 pm »
and this community IS large

Quote
Most Online Today: 117. Most Online Ever: 373 (December 05, 2013, 11:28:00 PM) [/color]
saying? Oh wait .. there still is a read-only mode for unregistered .. is it?

I think the guest number has been count into the "online number".
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Offline xeroc

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #22 on: May 23, 2014, 06:50:11 pm »
Too bad .. so there are only 373 of us .. This probably will never work :-(
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Offline AdamBLevine

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #23 on: May 23, 2014, 06:50:49 pm »
Yeah its usually like 50/50 guests/registered users

I'm just saying, don't kid yourself - Compared to other communities out there PTS and AGS are very very centralized, most of all with Invictus holding hundreds of thousands of protoshares.
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Offline xeroc

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #24 on: May 23, 2014, 06:53:28 pm »
can you remember when nxt was in this IPO stage. .. i am sure you remember .. what was the difference ... isnt nxt only 6 months old by now?
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Offline santaclause102

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #25 on: May 23, 2014, 06:53:39 pm »
afaik it is the biggest community behind btt. Just compare forum stats...

Offline xeroc

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #26 on: May 23, 2014, 06:56:06 pm »
unfortunatelly it does not break down to a forum. Afaik the nxtforum was launch a couple weeka ago .. for that, they are pretty big
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Offline santaclause102

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #27 on: May 23, 2014, 06:59:49 pm »
the nxt forum is running since march... I compared it today. Bitshares has more new registered members per day on average.

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #28 on: May 23, 2014, 07:00:56 pm »
Ok .. good to hear
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Offline Amazon

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Re: Honoring AGS
« Reply #29 on: May 23, 2014, 07:06:56 pm »
the nxt forum is running since march... I compared it today. Bitshares has more new registered members per day on average.

Unfortunately, most new registered members are just spam/bots recently. And I have been busy banning those IP.
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