Author Topic: How much is a new user worth?  (Read 55829 times)

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Offline warpio

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I don't like this focus on marketing. It makes it seem like the BTSX team is desperate for money.

We should be focused entirely on making the system as robust and bug-free as possible. If the pegged assets system works as intended, then the market will speak for itself and users will come on of their own accord.. Trying to draw in new users with big promises should not be a priority, and it makes this whole thing look scammy...

Offline GaltReport

The "no dilution" folks aren't jumping ship. They just want to see this proposal limited to a hard and fast number. Because they're right; BTSX is supposed to decrease, not increase. I think this dilution will be very limited in scope, but it does need to be defined/capped.

And anybody who is smart will stick with BTSX, not AcmeFork DAC, since AcmeFork DAC will be too rigid. It will not have the business development potential that will now be possible with BTSX. We just need to see a capped limit on the dilution.

 +5%

Edit: and "Dance with the BM that brought you"...
« Last Edit: October 05, 2014, 02:01:18 pm by GaltReport »

Offline James212

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Let bytemaster decide what is the best solution. If you start a voting, half of the people will have no clue what they are doing. I only trust bytemaster. He brought us here and is the captain.
 

I completely agree with this.  But do you understand that this proves DPOS is not viable as a self-sufficient system for intelligent consensus?

I don't think it means that at all.  I think it mean that some people are more equipped to make business decisions than others.  Though we each have our talents, sometimes there are just too many cooks in the kitchen. 
BTS: theangelwaveproject

Offline James212

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Let bytemaster decide what is the best solution. If you start a voting, half of the people will have no clue what they are doing. I only trust bytemaster. He brought us here and is the captain.
 

 +5%
BTS: theangelwaveproject

Offline Gentso1

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The strategy in general is old hat. It will mostly attract frugal people trying to penny pinch. These kind of give-aways were unique 10 years ago when PayPal did it... not so much anymore. I see this as basically airdropping BitUSD on a strategically poor demographic. There are WAY better places to seed BitUSD. Example: Airdrop BitUSD on the OpenBazaar community (after integrating BitUSD into their code). This way it'll be spent within a community that will genuinely benefit from a non-volatile crypto and it has a good potential of spreading to other markets after OB success.  We get to piggyback on OB publicity, real demand is created for BitUSD, important eyes are on OB, the PEG is enforced through increased volume, etc, etc etc. See this post.



Aaack!  My apologies.  I accidentally hit "modify" not "quote" and messed up this post. 
Context is preserved in subsequent posts.
Stan
I have to differ from you here. OB will naturally want to use bitUSD for one reason and thats profit. As soon as a mechrant or buyer gets burned by the falling price of whatever their payment option of choice is they are going to look to stability and they will have bitUSD. Nothing is worse then a merchant counting his profit only to see a market flash crash or a buyer who jumps over the hurdles of turning fiat digital only to find that his purchase is 50$ but he chose to buy (fill in btc or any alt) and whoops I only now have 48$.

I think you are 100% on point that we should be all over OB but I don't think we need to give and or really market to them because they are going to want that stability.

Actually their will be one thing we need to provide and thats depth if we can give them a bank card to go with it great but at the very least we need a 100k(higher the better) buy wall at .96 cents or higher(closer to 1:1 the better) and they will come all on their on.

I was asked a question when talking to a friend(no crypto back round) if he would use a system that gave him a bank card and some free money and he didn't care about titan,bitUSD, or any of the really cool features  all he wanted to know is

How much do I have to deposit to open the account and how much do I get?
Where is the card accepted like visa, mastercard etc?
Will it work at atm's?

I think the average consumer isn't going to care and really are going to just want to know the above. Most people just want things to work and thats it......

With the current bleed down in BTC this would be a very opportune time for I3 to do some marketing to OB devs and OB supporters.

Imagine if OB was running on BTC and merchant holdings dropped 50% over a few months? Wow.

This is a simple as:

1. Talk to OB devs

2. Push code

3. News release

100% agree
I really do think it will be as simple as your 3 steps above, I know OB needs multi-sig support which the platform support's but has not implemented.

38PTSWarrior

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I just hope the people know what they are suggesting. I have no clue what would be good or bad. There could be users who have bad intentions or something else. I don't know.

Offline vegolino

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Let bytemaster decide what is the best solution. If you start a voting, half of the people will have no clue what they are doing. I only trust bytemaster. He brought us here and is the captain.
 
  +5%
I agree with you 100%, but it seems there is a number of people who disagree and TonyK thinks it is about 50% split. I think that those that disagree are heard much more than those who agree. Why do we need to guess when we have technology to tell us accurate numbers.

Offline blahblah7up

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Let bytemaster decide what is the best solution. If you start a voting, half of the people will have no clue what they are doing. I only trust bytemaster. He brought us here and is the captain.
 

I completely agree with this.  But do you understand that this proves DPOS is not viable as a self-sufficient system for intelligent consensus?

38PTSWarrior

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Let bytemaster decide what is the best solution. If you start a voting, half of the people will have no clue what they are doing. I only trust bytemaster. He brought us here and is the captain.
 

Offline vegolino

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Would it be possible to for shareholders to vote with their stake on dilution so we can see is it 50% & 50% split or maybe not? If we can vote for delegates with our stakes why not for something as important as this.

Offline donkeypong

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The "no dilution" folks aren't jumping ship. They just want to see this proposal limited to a hard and fast number. Because they're right; BTSX is supposed to decrease, not increase. I think this dilution will be very limited in scope, but it does need to be defined/capped.

And anybody who is smart will stick with BTSX, not AcmeFork DAC, since AcmeFork DAC will be too rigid. It will not have the business development potential that will now be possible with BTSX. We just need to see a capped limit on the dilution.

Offline tonyk

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  This drives me crazy...

Almost 50& 50 % split on what is best...

And if we have 2 chains, (each with one of those decision)... the 'no dilution guys' will jump ship the second they see the other chain expanding at 2x rate...

Is anybody has any ideas how to do both on one chain???
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline speedy

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If we inflate the share supply then BTSX is no-longer a dividend yielding asset.

I was always of the opinion that if you have a useful product combined with a decreasing share supply through destroyed transaction fees, then users would naturally be drawn in.

This plan is a U-turn and has already caused a drop in confidence in the system IMHO. The commitment to decreasing share supply should be sacrosanct.

Offline Thom

Folks are getting a bit short-sighted here.

The problem with diluting is that it sets precedent.

Diluting under the wise and benign rule of BM seems like a good idea because it satisfies short-term greed with no perceived downside.

Bitshares just prints some money to boost the economy.

Sound familiar?

Dilution, inflation, debasement... whatever you want to call it, the end result is always the same.

I state categorically that I3 and the Bitshares community have a moral imperative not to inflate/dilute/debase the share supply.

Doing so is akin to voting to be infected by a disease that will slowly kill BTSX.

A few will get wealthy in the short term, the masses will suffer in the long term.

We do not want to become the US Gov.

I3 has ample development funds that if spent wisely will get Bitshares to critical mass.

They need to get the client/trading platform sorted, phone apps pushed out, fiat gateways in place.

Then do a simple marketing campaign to the crypto crowd and perhaps a non-crypto-but-tech-savvy demographic (ie. Gen X/Y).

This should cause the market cap to increase substantially.

At that point, once the 'hey look at us' marketing is exhausted, they could consider using a referral system or other shenanigans to engage other demographics.

Low hanging fruit first.

I'm no financial genius, but I've been around long enough to see nothing good come from manipulating the money supply (or share supply) as oldman points out here. I think we have enough examples of inflation being a bad thing, not as sure about shares of stock in companies.

The difficult part of knowing how much money to print is having a good understanding of the volume of goods & services traded with that money. That's a bit of a catch 22, b/c that "model"  doesn't accommodate new wealth created which necessitates expanding the money supply to prevent deflation. That's where the difficult effort is, anticipating future growth or contraction.
Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere - MLK |  Verbaltech2 Witness Reports: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,23902.0.html

Offline oldman

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The strategy in general is old hat. It will mostly attract frugal people trying to penny pinch. These kind of give-aways were unique 10 years ago when PayPal did it... not so much anymore. I see this as basically airdropping BitUSD on a strategically poor demographic. There are WAY better places to seed BitUSD. Example: Airdrop BitUSD on the OpenBazaar community (after integrating BitUSD into their code). This way it'll be spent within a community that will genuinely benefit from a non-volatile crypto and it has a good potential of spreading to other markets after OB success.  We get to piggyback on OB publicity, real demand is created for BitUSD, important eyes are on OB, the PEG is enforced through increased volume, etc, etc etc. See this post.



Aaack!  My apologies.  I accidentally hit "modify" not "quote" and messed up this post. 
Context is preserved in subsequent posts.
Stan
I have to differ from you here. OB will naturally want to use bitUSD for one reason and thats profit. As soon as a mechrant or buyer gets burned by the falling price of whatever their payment option of choice is they are going to look to stability and they will have bitUSD. Nothing is worse then a merchant counting his profit only to see a market flash crash or a buyer who jumps over the hurdles of turning fiat digital only to find that his purchase is 50$ but he chose to buy (fill in btc or any alt) and whoops I only now have 48$.

I think you are 100% on point that we should be all over OB but I don't think we need to give and or really market to them because they are going to want that stability.

Actually their will be one thing we need to provide and thats depth if we can give them a bank card to go with it great but at the very least we need a 100k(higher the better) buy wall at .96 cents or higher(closer to 1:1 the better) and they will come all on their on.

I was asked a question when talking to a friend(no crypto back round) if he would use a system that gave him a bank card and some free money and he didn't care about titan,bitUSD, or any of the really cool features  all he wanted to know is

How much do I have to deposit to open the account and how much do I get?
Where is the card accepted like visa, mastercard etc?
Will it work at atm's?

I think the average consumer isn't going to care and really are going to just want to know the above. Most people just want things to work and thats it......

With the current bleed down in BTC this would be a very opportune time for I3 to do some marketing to OB devs and OB supporters.

Imagine if OB was running on BTC and merchant holdings dropped 50% over a few months? Wow.

This is a simple as:

1. Talk to OB devs

2. Push code

3. News release