Author Topic: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network  (Read 34816 times)

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Offline Akado

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #135 on: June 26, 2015, 08:41:06 pm »
Looks like the banx.io trading volume issue was resolved, based on the thread Dave linked. 

I think this thread shows that crypto enthusiasts are not a trusting lot (we trust in MATH!), and that when different communities begin to interact, they need to vet each other first!  Hopefully there are no hard feelings. :)

In crypto everyone's guilty unless proven otherwise.
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Offline Ander

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #136 on: June 26, 2015, 08:47:38 pm »
Looks like the banx.io trading volume issue was resolved, based on the thread Dave linked. 

I think this thread shows that crypto enthusiasts are not a trusting lot (we trust in MATH!), and that when different communities begin to interact, they need to vet each other first!  Hopefully there are no hard feelings. :)

In crypto everyone's guilty unless proven otherwise.

Yep,
"Everything is a scam unless I own some, in which case its going to the moon" - All cryptocurrency holders.
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Tuck Fheman

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #137 on: June 26, 2015, 09:12:07 pm »
In crypto everyone's guilty unless proven otherwise.

Good one NSA!

If you're not NSA, prove it.  :P

Offline EvilDave

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #138 on: June 26, 2015, 09:14:48 pm »
Looks like the banx.io trading volume issue was resolved, based on the thread Dave linked. 

I think this thread shows that crypto enthusiasts are not a trusting lot (we trust in MATH!), and that when different communities begin to interact, they need to vet each other first!  Hopefully there are no hard feelings. :)

Yep...much vetting....which is what brings me here.

I still have a few questions, so lets start with establishing a baseline we can all agree on:

For reasons unknown, Banx.io was reporting a trade volume on the BANX<>BTC market to CMC that was 4 -5 times greater than the actual trading on Banx.io.
It got reported to everyone concerned by poloscarted and myself, and after a few days, the issue was tracked down and corrected.

We all happy with this version of events ?

So here are the follow-up questions:

How did the problem/issue happen ?
Did someone deliberately code it in ? Make a coding error ? CMC mistake ?
How long was the error in place ?
Did it affect BANX listings on sites other than CMC ? (Should have checked this myself, but lazy)
Why did no-one else notice such an obvious issue ? (I'm not the smartest cookie in the box, but this was pretty simple)
Did anyone from BTS do any form of due diligence on Banx.io before the {ANN} ?

However it happened, this incorrect reporting of trade volume could only be beneficial to Banxshares, and so it's very easy to conclude that this could be a deliberate attempt to manipulate CMC and give BANX a boost.
Deliberate or not, the fact that no-one from BTS picked up on the inflated trading figures during the due diligence process with Banxshares also doesn't look good.
We are talking about the only BANX market here. How quickly do you think a mistake in the opposite direction would have been noticed and corrected ?

That, for me,  is the crux of the problem: why did no-one from BANX or BTS notice and correct this, until pushed by myself and poloscarted ?

(back in hour or so, got RL stuff going on...)

Nxt....it's so damn good.

Offline BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode

Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #139 on: June 26, 2015, 10:52:57 pm »
Looks like the banx.io trading volume issue was resolved, based on the thread Dave linked. 

I think this thread shows that crypto enthusiasts are not a trusting lot (we trust in MATH!), and that when different communities begin to interact, they need to vet each other first!  Hopefully there are no hard feelings. :)

Yep...much vetting....which is what brings me here.

I still have a few questions, so lets start with establishing a baseline we can all agree on:

For reasons unknown, Banx.io was reporting a trade volume on the BANX<>BTC market to CMC that was 4 -5 times greater than the actual trading on Banx.io.
It got reported to everyone concerned by poloscarted and myself, and after a few days, the issue was tracked down and corrected.

We all happy with this version of events ?

So here are the follow-up questions:

How did the problem/issue happen ?
Did someone deliberately code it in ? Make a coding error ? CMC mistake ?
How long was the error in place ?
Did it affect BANX listings on sites other than CMC ? (Should have checked this myself, but lazy)
Why did no-one else notice such an obvious issue ? (I'm not the smartest cookie in the box, but this was pretty simple)
Did anyone from BTS do any form of due diligence on Banx.io before the {ANN} ?

However it happened, this incorrect reporting of trade volume could only be beneficial to Banxshares, and so it's very easy to conclude that this could be a deliberate attempt to manipulate CMC and give BANX a boost.
Deliberate or not, the fact that no-one from BTS picked up on the inflated trading figures during the due diligence process with Banxshares also doesn't look good.
We are talking about the only BANX market here. How quickly do you think a mistake in the opposite direction would have been noticed and corrected ?

That, for me,  is the crux of the problem: why did no-one from BANX or BTS notice and correct this, until pushed by myself and poloscarted ?

(back in hour or so, got RL stuff going on...)

We have already established in other discussions that it is not, and should not be our place to judge who uses the BTS system. BTS is not the crypto police. Nor should we be. Should Cisco be put on trial for allowing packets of child porn to pass through its routers? Your reasoning suggests yes, it should.

I understand this probably is just due to a lack of understanding on the nature of the relationship between bts and banx, so please don't think I am trying to make you sound foolish. It's just to clarify using a comparison that is easy to understand and conclude with. You are not alone in your questions regarding vetting. Many here had similar misunderstandings about the roll we play here with Banx. It's taken some time for some to come around to understanding that we simply should not be acting in that capacity within the UIA system. The community can respond as they wish in their business dealings with whom ever should come here. As you can see, Mark has gained some fans among this community already, and others not so much. That's how it is in a shareocracy.

As to the rest of your questions.. I can't offer any insights to any of those other than to continue to ask questions until you get answers. The right questions get the right answers, and it sounds like you asked some reasonable ones.
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Offline EvilDave

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #140 on: June 27, 2015, 12:14:44 am »
Yeah, the difficulties of running a decentralised, neutral blockhain, and of 'policing' 3rd party users of that blockchain aren't entirely unfamiliar to me....:

https://nxtforum.org/assets-board/%28ann%29-whitegoldshares-business-plan-nov-17th-2014-%28wgs%29/
https://nxtforum.org/assets-board/%28ann%29-%28ach%29-altcoin-herald-now-available-as-an-asset/

Read these two threads and beware.....
Nxt....it's so damn good.

Offline ByronP

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #141 on: June 27, 2015, 01:51:24 am »
Looks like the banx.io trading volume issue was resolved, based on the thread Dave linked. 

I think this thread shows that crypto enthusiasts are not a trusting lot (we trust in MATH!), and that when different communities begin to interact, they need to vet each other first!  Hopefully there are no hard feelings. :)

Yep...much vetting....which is what brings me here.

I still have a few questions, so lets start with establishing a baseline we can all agree on:

For reasons unknown, Banx.io was reporting a trade volume on the BANX<>BTC market to CMC that was 4 -5 times greater than the actual trading on Banx.io.
It got reported to everyone concerned by poloscarted and myself, and after a few days, the issue was tracked down and corrected.

We all happy with this version of events ?

So here are the follow-up questions:

How did the problem/issue happen ?
Did someone deliberately code it in ? Make a coding error ? CMC mistake ?
How long was the error in place ?
Did it affect BANX listings on sites other than CMC ? (Should have checked this myself, but lazy)
Why did no-one else notice such an obvious issue ? (I'm not the smartest cookie in the box, but this was pretty simple)
Did anyone from BTS do any form of due diligence on Banx.io before the {ANN} ?

However it happened, this incorrect reporting of trade volume could only be beneficial to Banxshares, and so it's very easy to conclude that this could be a deliberate attempt to manipulate CMC and give BANX a boost.
Deliberate or not, the fact that no-one from BTS picked up on the inflated trading figures during the due diligence process with Banxshares also doesn't look good.
We are talking about the only BANX market here. How quickly do you think a mistake in the opposite direction would have been noticed and corrected ?

That, for me,  is the crux of the problem: why did no-one from BANX or BTS notice and correct this, until pushed by myself and poloscarted ?

(back in hour or so, got RL stuff going on...)

This was an error on my part that I believe was introduced when I made a bunch of changes to support the http api. This bug affected more than just BANX Shares and was a miscalculation in the way data was being cached. Once I was made aware of the problem I resolved it in a timely fashion! I don't know what other course of action you would like to see however I do make mistakes as I am human. As per why no one picked up on it earlier the best answer I can give from an internal standpoint is that i don't really look at data from 3rd party sites as it's not usually on my agenda unless there is a specific need.

I hope that helps answer your questions.

Offline Permie

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #142 on: June 27, 2015, 11:14:00 am »
We have already established in other discussions that it is not, and should not be our place to judge who uses the BTS system. BTS is not the crypto police. Nor should we be. Should Cisco be put on trial for allowing packets of child porn to pass through its routers? Your reasoning suggests yes, it should.

I understand this probably is just due to a lack of understanding on the nature of the relationship between bts and banx, so please don't think I am trying to make you sound foolish. It's just to clarify using a comparison that is easy to understand and conclude with. You are not alone in your questions regarding vetting. Many here had similar misunderstandings about the roll we play here with Banx. It's taken some time for some to come around to understanding that we simply should not be acting in that capacity within the UIA system. The community can respond as they wish in their business dealings with whom ever should come here. As you can see, Mark has gained some fans among this community already, and others not so much. That's how it is in a shareocracy.

As to the rest of your questions.. I can't offer any insights to any of those other than to continue to ask questions until you get answers. The right questions get the right answers, and it sounds like you asked some reasonable ones.
+5% +5% +5%

Scammers gonna scam.
Any company/person who uses the services that bts provides is free to do whatever they wish within the bounds of the constitution.
BitShares is a permissionless system and should always stay that way.

IMO These discussions/due diligence should be taking place in the specific organizations community. If you as a concerned bts member decide to visit these forums and do some investigative journalism and uncover some secrets that bts members would benefit from knowing then by all means get going, a worker proposal or a delegate position might be right for you.
Shunning and shaming have long been known to be some of the most effective methods of regulation.

We should encourage a culture of due diligence on new bts services (UIA, PMPA etc), incentivize members to conduct investigative journalism and publicly name and shame scammers, wrongdoers and liars in any easy to search format, so everyone has easy access to information.
There is no physical authority over others in this system. The way to manage the ecosystem is to hurt the profits and reputation of those acting against the social consensus.

I really appreciate what you're doing Evil Dave - members need people like you.
I just don't think this is the place - we want yet to be initiated businesses to see a welcoming and encouraging community when they have a quick look at what on earth 'BitShares' is. The pioneering companies like CCEDK and Banx are demonstrating to onlookers how they could do it too. Explanations are all well and good but that leaves alot to interpretation.
We need case studies!

"Oh it looks so easy to integrate, everyone is so helpful and I can cut costs and increase my profits" they'll say, to the now-wealthy members ;)

I'm not sure I agree with the sentiment that members should view all newcomers with distrust until proven otherwise.
Nobody is forcing you to use their particular asset.
You wouldn't complain if a new website was registered and it didn't meet your standards of data security. You'd just ignore it.
Every new business running on the BitShares network brings value.

Being welcoming to all might get us a few more scammers, but the overall number of businesses using bts services will also increase. So the percentage of scammers to legit may even decrease (less scammers per good business, with more businesses overall)

BitShares carries a message of freedom and I think the community should embody that too.
JonnyBitcoin votes for liquidity and simplicity. Make him your proxy?
BTSDEX.COM

Offline MarkLyford

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #143 on: June 27, 2015, 11:26:57 am »
We have already established in other discussions that it is not, and should not be our place to judge who uses the BTS system. BTS is not the crypto police. Nor should we be. Should Cisco be put on trial for allowing packets of child porn to pass through its routers? Your reasoning suggests yes, it should.

I understand this probably is just due to a lack of understanding on the nature of the relationship between bts and banx, so please don't think I am trying to make you sound foolish. It's just to clarify using a comparison that is easy to understand and conclude with. You are not alone in your questions regarding vetting. Many here had similar misunderstandings about the roll we play here with Banx. It's taken some time for some to come around to understanding that we simply should not be acting in that capacity within the UIA system. The community can respond as they wish in their business dealings with whom ever should come here. As you can see, Mark has gained some fans among this community already, and others not so much. That's how it is in a shareocracy.

As to the rest of your questions.. I can't offer any insights to any of those other than to continue to ask questions until you get answers. The right questions get the right answers, and it sounds like you asked some reasonable ones.
+5% +5% +5%

Scammers gonna scam.
Any company/person who uses the services that bts provides is free to do whatever they wish within the bounds of the constitution.
BitShares is a permissionless system and should always stay that way.

IMO These discussions/due diligence should be taking place in the specific organizations community. If you as a concerned bts member decide to visit these forums and do some investigative journalism and uncover some secrets that bts members would benefit from knowing then by all means get going, a worker proposal or a delegate position might be right for you.
Shunning and shaming have long been known to be some of the most effective methods of regulation.

We should encourage a culture of due diligence on new bts services (UIA, PMPA etc), incentivize members to conduct investigative journalism and publicly name and shame scammers, wrongdoers and liars in any easy to search format, so everyone has easy access to information.
There is no physical authority over others in this system. The way to manage the ecosystem is to hurt the profits and reputation of those acting against the social consensus.

I really appreciate what you're doing Evil Dave - members need people like you.
I just don't think this is the place - we want yet to be initiated businesses to see a welcoming and encouraging community when they have a quick look at what on earth 'BitShares' is. The pioneering companies like CCEDK and Banx are demonstrating to onlookers how they could do it too. Explanations are all well and good but that leaves alot to interpretation.
We need case studies!

"Oh it looks so easy to integrate, everyone is so helpful and I can cut costs and increase my profits" they'll say, to the now-wealthy members ;)

I'm not sure I agree with the sentiment that members should view all newcomers with distrust until proven otherwise.
Nobody is forcing you to use their particular asset.
You wouldn't complain if a new website was registered and it didn't meet your standards of data security. You'd just ignore it.
Every new business running on the BitShares network brings value.

Being welcoming to all might get us a few more scammers, but the overall number of businesses using bts services will also increase. So the percentage of scammers to legit may even decrease (less scammers per good business, with more businesses overall)

BitShares carries a message of freedom and I think the community should embody that too.


I completely agree. Everyone has a choice to use or not use a particular business or asset running on the BTC system it's down to personal preference. I realise some will like me on here and some won't and thats fine. Its the sign of someone more interesting than 'normal' that splits peoples opinions ;)

Regarding the welcoming side of your comments I agree. This community needs to be more welcoming and demonstrate people are welcome here. Like it's been said before there is  and should be no regulations in place preventing people and companies from using this technology. It comes down to the individual then to decide if they get involved on a case by case basis.

Thanks again Permie for you constructive comments.
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Offline Permie

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #144 on: June 27, 2015, 12:18:39 pm »
I am considering a delegate bid with the aim of solving these problems

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,17212.0.html

Quote
Identify business use-cases such as gold dealing, couponing, prediction markets, decentralized banking services and produce industry-specific and easy to understand Prospectus' outlining how and why to integrate with BitShares.

I will strive to use these materials to target and close existing businesses and walk them through the set-up, in public on the forums.
These use-cases will then be incorporated into industry specific prospecti.
I envision that 3 use cases for each industry will be sufficient that there will no longer be a need for public walkthroughs.
By that point, the prospectus will contain all necessary information and proven-claims of profit increases and cost reductions due to BitShares integration of competiors in the industry.

If this progresses I would be very interested in documenting Banx as one of the first case studies of coin transference to BitShares.

Is this something you would be interested in, Mark?
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Offline cass

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #145 on: June 28, 2015, 03:19:27 pm »
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,17226.0.html

hey tried to seperate  last discussion from this thread, hope this was in you interest also.. pls let me know if there is better title you want me add!

[member=21490]Thom[/member] [member=36434]Permie[/member]  - pls feel free to change update add like you want.. just tried to clean it up here a bit .. so thread is'n "hijacked" anymore.

Thx for you understanding
c
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Offline EvilDave

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #146 on: June 28, 2015, 05:54:19 pm »
***cut bits***

I still have a few questions, so lets start with establishing a baseline we can all agree on:

For reasons unknown, Banx.io was reporting a trade volume on the BANX<>BTC market to CMC that was 4 -5 times greater than the actual trading on Banx.io.
It got reported to everyone concerned by poloscarted and myself, and after a few days, the issue was tracked down and corrected.

We all happy with this version of events ?

So here are the follow-up questions:

How did the problem/issue happen ?
This got answered:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1091855.msg11724045#msg11724045

Did someone deliberately code it in ? Make a coding error ? CMC mistake ?
How long was the error in place ?
Did it affect BANX listings on sites other than CMC ? (Should have checked this myself, but lazy)
Why did no-one else notice such an obvious issue ? (I'm not the smartest cookie in the box, but this was pretty simple)

Did anyone from BTS do any form of due diligence on Banx.io before the {ANN} ?
Apparently there was no form of due diligence, so fair enough.

***cut more***

So, yeah, some of my questions got answers, and I'm not going to hold my breath waiting for the remainder.

 
Nxt....it's so damn good.

Offline Thom

Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #147 on: June 28, 2015, 08:41:56 pm »
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,17226.0.html

hey tried to seperate  last discussion from this thread, hope this was in you interest also.. pls let me know if there is better title you want me add!

[member=21490]Thom[/member] [member=36434]Permie[/member]  - pls feel free to change update add like you want.. just tried to clean it up here a bit .. so thread is'n "hijacked" anymore.

Thx for you understanding
c

NP cass, good call.
Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere - MLK |  Verbaltech2 Witness Reports: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,23902.0.html

Offline ZoeHart

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #148 on: June 29, 2015, 02:25:05 pm »
Hi All,  I'm Zoe, Mark Lyford's PA.  Just a brief introduction to say 'Hello' and should you have any marketing or admin queries, consider me the first point of contact and please do not hesitate to get in touch, via email at '[email protected]', or skype at 'zoehartuk' .  I will do everything I can to help you.  Kind regards.

Offline Ben Mason

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Re: [ANN] BANX Capital Joins BitShares Exchange Network
« Reply #149 on: June 29, 2015, 02:29:11 pm »
Hey Zoe, welcome!  It's great to have you aboard!