Author Topic: BIT20 Smartcoin, top 20 cryptos weighted index (ETF like)  (Read 18047 times)

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Offline liondani

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Wouldn't a Top 5 or 10 make more sense than 20?

At least today, we can find ~10 interesting, original, promising crypto projects.

 +5%

Offline karnal

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Wouldn't a Top 5 or 10 make more sense than 20?

At least today, we can find ~10 interesting, original, promising crypto projects.

Offline EstefanTT

Holy crap! The War of Indexes has started. Strip your rockets gentlemen, aim, charge!
Lol ;p

Bit20, the cryptocurrency index fund http://www.bittwenty.com
(BitShares French ConneXion - www.bitsharesfcx.com)

Offline yvv

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Holy crap! The War of Indexes has started. Strip your rockets gentlemen, aim, charge!


Offline Erlich Bachman

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wow, great initiative, and super easy to market !

who doesn't want a piece of the crypto action right now!

And this is the lowest risk way to play the market
You own the network, but who pays for development?

Offline EstefanTT

There is plenty of ways to weight an index. In the crypto currencies world, there will be probably, in the future, lots of indexes.

For now, I have a good one running since july 2015 and giving an acurate information about the evolution of the crypto currencies in a global way vs fiat money. I just have to make the economical input information scripts a little more reliable and create the smartcoin. It probbaly can be done in a matter of days.

I made this thread to brainstorm with this community on the index before creating it. When I see that 21xhipster rushed into creating some sort of Bit20 without understanding fully the details of it, I feel that I shouldn't have share publicly my idea about the index I was going to create.

BitShares is a free market place, everyone is free to do whatever he wants on it. I knew there were the possibility that someone could try to create an index before I do.

Anyway, from now on, I won't share any more details on the index composition and structure, nor the website and other related projects. I'll only participate to the debate and brainstorm to avoid giving to much information. The bit20 website is also disable at the moment, it will be available again soon, after I remove the sensitive information from tne public side.
First nothing was actually created yet. I've just was curious how I can use in what I invested almost two years ago :-) We have our own methodology we are working for 2 years already which was published long time ago :-) I don't understand what you are worrying about really :-)

I just expressed my concerns about the fact that it wasn't maybe a good idea to openly discuss my plan on making a crypto index on BitShares.

Competion is good and more indexes on this platform will benefit BitShares wich is the most important to me.

You'll agree with me that it's completely natural that I don't want to give more information about my project on creating a index of the top 20 crypto by MC when I see two days after I create a thread about it that someone create a >>>

"cyber•Index 20
Cyber Index. Include Top-20 assets by capitalization"


I'm sure you can understand my position.

If I may suggest, you have been working on a way to select the best crypto currencies with sophisticated process. That's an impressiv work ! You should take advantage of all this work and create a index different from what I'm doing, something based on what you have in cyber.fund. It would be great to see how our both indexes are progressing vs fiat money and vs each other !


 
Bit20, the cryptocurrency index fund http://www.bittwenty.com
(BitShares French ConneXion - www.bitsharesfcx.com)

Offline EstefanTT

A few month ago, there was a debate on the "PERCENT OFFSET OF FORCED SETTLEMENTS" and the "Max force settle vol" for BitUSD and other smartcoins. I think TCNY have done it differently that BitUSD.

Do someone have an opinion on wich kind of values would fit better to an index ?
Bit20, the cryptocurrency index fund http://www.bittwenty.com
(BitShares French ConneXion - www.bitsharesfcx.com)

Offline 21xhipster

There is plenty of ways to weight an index. In the crypto currencies world, there will be probably, in the future, lots of indexes.

For now, I have a good one running since july 2015 and giving an acurate information about the evolution of the crypto currencies in a global way vs fiat money. I just have to make the economical input information scripts a little more reliable and create the smartcoin. It probbaly can be done in a matter of days.

I made this thread to brainstorm with this community on the index before creating it. When I see that 21xhipster rushed into creating some sort of Bit20 without understanding fully the details of it, I feel that I shouldn't have share publicly my idea about the index I was going to create.

BitShares is a free market place, everyone is free to do whatever he wants on it. I knew there were the possibility that someone could try to create an index before I do.

Anyway, from now on, I won't share any more details on the index composition and structure, nor the website and other related projects. I'll only participate to the debate and brainstorm to avoid giving to much information. The bit20 website is also disable at the moment, it will be available again soon, after I remove the sensitive information from tne public side.
First nothing was actually created yet. I've just was curious how I can use in what I invested almost two years ago :-) We have our own methodology we are working for 2 years already which was published long time ago :-) I don't understand what you are worrying about really :-)
Update: BTW everything we do is fully open source and we are not worrying that somebody steal that :-) Take it, really! https://github.com/cyberFund
And I think I understand a litle deeper than you think how that index should work. Check it http://academia.edu/22691395/cyber_Rating_Crypto_Property_Evaluation
« Last Edit: March 23, 2016, 12:39:39 am by 21xhipster »
https://cyber.fund/ - Decetnralized Investment Platform

Offline EstefanTT

There is plenty of ways to weight an index. In the crypto currencies world, there will be probably, in the future, lots of indexes.

For now, I have a good one running since july 2015 and giving an acurate information about the evolution of the crypto currencies in a global way vs fiat money. I just have to make the economical input information scripts a little more reliable and create the smartcoin. It probbaly can be done in a matter of days.

I made this thread to brainstorm with this community on the index before creating it. When I see that 21xhipster rushed into creating some sort of Bit20 without understanding fully the details of it, I feel that I shouldn't have share publicly my idea about the index I was going to create.

BitShares is a free market place, everyone is free to do whatever he wants on it. I knew there were the possibility that someone could try to create an index before I do.

Anyway, from now on, I won't share any more details on the index composition and structure, nor the website and other related projects. I'll only participate to the debate and brainstorn to avoid giving to much information. The bit20 website is also disable at the moment, it will be available again soon, after I remove the sensitive information from tne public side.

Bit20, the cryptocurrency index fund http://www.bittwenty.com
(BitShares French ConneXion - www.bitsharesfcx.com)

Offline yvv

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BTW
I've create prototype asset. http://cryptofresh.com/a/CYIND.
Would like hear your recommendations how this thing can be configured for better, as to be honest I don't clearly understand all parameters behind.
I'd also like to know why I was not able to create Smartcoin wth permissions witnesses/committee permissions?

@kingslanding I like some things in Coingecko approach, guys did a huge job, but (1) lack of really meaningful assets like Factom, Synereo, Augur, etc., (2) incorrect methodology of cap calculation (like CMC, cutted Ripple, Stellar, Storj supply and as result artificial overvaluation) and (3) non natural or dumb logic of weighting. As result you can see Litecoin (which is stagnating even against USD) in the 3d place and beautiful and really growing (in terms of account and transactions) BitShares at 9th place, or Vertcoin (! what the hell) is 13 and Storj which is awesome at 25 position. You can compare Coingecko with our results if you sort by rating on https://cyber.fund and you'll see a difference.
Update:
Our rating has some obvious fuckups, but they are because of content which is in work though.

So, this is a real problem, to come up with a good methodology for index. Creating a coin after that is really trivial task.

Offline 21xhipster

BTW
I've create prototype asset. http://cryptofresh.com/a/CYIND.
Would like hear your recommendations how this thing can be configured for better, as to be honest I don't clearly understand all parameters behind.
I'd also like to know why I was not able to create Smartcoin wth permissions witnesses/committee permissions?

@kingslanding I like some things in Coingecko approach, guys did a huge job, but (1) lack of really meaningful assets like Factom, Synereo, Augur, etc., (2) incorrect methodology of cap calculation (like CMC, cutted Ripple, Stellar, Storj supply and as result artificial overvaluation) and (3) non natural or dumb logic of weighting. As result you can see Litecoin (which is stagnating even against USD) in the 3d place and beautiful and really growing (in terms of account and transactions) BitShares at 9th place, or Vertcoin (! what the hell) is 13 and Storj which is awesome at 25 position. You can compare Coingecko with our results if you sort by rating on https://cyber.fund and you'll see a difference.
Update:
Our rating has some obvious fuckups, but they are because of content which is in work though.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2016, 11:36:49 pm by 21xhipster »
https://cyber.fund/ - Decetnralized Investment Platform

Offline kingslanding

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Coingecko has an interesting mix.  Mouse over the ?'s to see explanation of each weighting.

https://www.coingecko.com/en
BTS username/address:   kingslanding9999

Offline 21xhipster

trade volume is also easily faked

thats true !

Maybe that is one more reason to use both parameters... Volume + Marketcap (with a 70%-30% weight or something like that)
we could optimally  use even  more data, to choose the top cryptos for our bit20 index but I am afraid it will get too complicated ...

a very good example of doing this "pickup"  is
https://cyber.fund/

they seem to have made a good job with "Scoring Coefficients"
https://github.com/cyberFund/cyberrating/blob/master/scoring.md

In reality they could  (@21xhipster) already use their idea and link their "cyber-fund" with a BTS created smartcoin  instead of a UIA they created using "colored coins"...
I bet they would gain much more traction from the cryptospace    ;)

My methodology is quite raw now and need to be (1) fine tuned and polished. That is iterative job. But when I started this thing the goal in fact was to design a set of criteria for any kind of indexes. I'd be happy to hear any feedback and improvements proposals. We are going (2) to switch to our personal price feeds (http://api.cyber.fund) from Coinmarketcap feeds - they are ready and wait for integration with supply info. Also there is a task (3) to get supply info (for correct weighting) for top rated systems directly from nodes and not from trusted (CMC get it from simple url from anywhere) and often incorrect sources like CMC. Once we finish this 3 tasks I think there will be a place for reliable industrial grade index like bit-20 smartcoin or cyber-20 :-) or whatever. Until this done this index would look like a toy for a sandbox. Probably we should keep things much more simple and start from what we have now. What do you think?
https://cyber.fund/ - Decetnralized Investment Platform

Offline fav

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Offline liondani

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trade volume is also easily faked

thats true !

Maybe that is one more reason to use both parameters... Volume + Marketcap (with a 70%-30% weight or something like that)
we could optimally  use even  more data, to choose the top cryptos for our bit20 index but I am afraid it will get too complicated ...

a very good example of doing this "pickup"  is
https://cyber.fund/

they seem to have made a good job with "Scoring Coefficients"
https://github.com/cyberFund/cyberrating/blob/master/scoring.md

In reality they could  (@21xhipster) already use their idea and link their "cyber-fund" with a BTS created smartcoin  instead of a UIA they created using "colored coins"...
I bet they would gain much more traction from the cryptospace    ;)
« Last Edit: March 22, 2016, 08:05:33 am by liondani »