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Messages - santaclause102

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2431
BitShares PTS / Re: What is ProtoShares?
« on: January 12, 2014, 09:45:48 am »
What is happening to the value of this protoshares??? Keeps on going DOWN? When will be the new DACS release? Before was 1 Protoshare = 1 bitshare, Now what is this angelshares  ?  50% angelshares + 50 % protoshares = bitshares ???? Please clarify.

Don't worry. Before it was 1 Protoshare -> 1 Bitshare (BEXshare) but there will be 10 times as many bitshares as there will be protoshares. So 10% was planned. Now it is 50% (1 Protoshares -> 5 Bitshares).
And the price is going down due to a temporary technicality: It is more efficient to buy Angelshares with Bitcoin so people sell their Protoshares for Bitcoin.... 

2432
BitShares PTS / Re: What is ProtoShares?
« on: January 11, 2014, 07:14:07 pm »
I want to make sure I understand everything fully....

A 3rd Party developer of a POS DAC would waive the money he would get from a presale (to the degree he gives tokens to PTS holders) for the advantage of attention and support by a diversified crowd (PTS holders).  Is that right?

Would the following summary be comprehensive?

Quote
All PTS holders together get at least 10% of each DAC (precisely 10% of the tokens (coins) the DAC uses) Invictus will ever release (with Bitshares it will be 50%). This 10% slice will be proportional in distribution to the distribution of PTS. Apart from that other developers can do the same and give a certain percentage of their coins to PTS holders. The advantage for them would be that the DAC they release will immediately have the attention of all the PTS holders. And every person that owns a coin has an incentive to promote it or contribute to its development in whatever way so that the price of the coins this person owns increases. This audience (PTS holders) in addition is one that understands the potential and functioning of DACs well - it's an advantage to have such an initial user base instead of random miners. This is perfect for Proof of Work based DACs. Proof of stake DACs are missing out on the initial funding they would get... But they can waive a part of it to still have the support and attention from PTS holders. Furthermore DACs of non invictus developers will give the full 10% or more of their DAC tokens to PTS holders if Invictus assists the development or if the DAC is build based on Invictus

2433
General Discussion / Re: Introduction to BitShares - Video
« on: January 11, 2014, 04:28:21 pm »
Just found this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8ZJ3xTDwbI
I think it is more credible when the person that knows the system best speaks of it. Better than a random women that is not bad at presenting it but doesn't shine either....

2434
Imo some of the "Bountiful Bounties" are set far to high with tasks that take a good programmer some hours of work and that will earn him bounties like "100PTS". So either these bounties are overvalued, or PTS are highly undervalued as payment for bounties. This is surely also contributing to falling PTS/BTC value (and buy volume). On some of the last days where the "Trading Volume" was around 40.000$ in 24h, 6-10% of the whole PTS trading volume was ME spending all my BTC in PTS on Cryptsy lol. I just did not want to let the price fall under 0.017 BTC  :(...and I failed, it's at 0.0168 now.
I would review some of the bounties and lower the reward...

I agree that PTS is undervalued when you look at the bounties being provided. When you are paying in PTS not only you are giving them away at 0.017BTC a pop, you are also giving away all the future shares.

I would prefer bounties to be paid out in BTC coz we all beleive that PTS will rise against BTC. Also, more PTS with I3 would mean more BTS available for funding future projects (though personally I would prefer if the BTS generated from Angel PTS were distributed amongst PTS holders).

Here is an arguments for paying bounties in PTS: The bounty winner will keep some of the PTS which makes him a promoter of this project.

2435
General Discussion / Re: How do you predict bitshares catching on?
« on: January 11, 2014, 03:23:16 am »
Hi delulo I agree with most things you wrote especially about forming useful partnerships at the early stages.

Who uses Proof of burn?

Counterparty (XCP) They released a working (but buggy) smart property system out of the blue in the new year with NO funding. They're now issuing their currency but they're using 'proof of burn', so to receive XCP you send BTC to an un-owned address. They've also remained anonymous I think. Pretty impressive stuff, very 'Satoshi-esque'

Thanks. Do you know if they use the bitcoin blockchain?

2436
If one wants to use the least amount of words to explain Protoshares (PTS) my take would be this:

All PTS holders together get at least 10% of each DAC (precisely 10% of the tokens (coins) the DAC uses) Invictus will ever release (with Bitshares it will be 50%). This 10% slice will be proportional in distribution to the distribution of PTS. Apart from that other developers can do the same and give a certain percentage of their coins to PTS holders. The advantage for them would be that the DAC they release will immediately have the attention of all the PTS holders. And every person that owns a coin has an incentive to promote it or contribute to its development in whatever way so that the price of the coins this person owns increases. This audience (PTS holders) in addition is one that understands the potential and functioning of DACs well - it's an advantage to have such an initial user base instead of random miners. This is perfect for Proof of Work based DACs. Proof of stake DACs are missing out on the initial funding they would get... But they can waive a part of it to still have the support and attention from PTS holders. Furthermore DACs of non invictus developers will give the full 10% or more of their DAC tokens to PTS holders if Invictus assists the development or if the DAC is build based on Invictus Software/DACs. Did I miss something?   

Actually it's gotten quite a few words :D But I think it is at least easy to understand...

2437
General Discussion / Re: Is bounty way for development a good way?
« on: January 10, 2014, 11:39:28 pm »
...it would also be possible to announce every single bounty on bitcointalk. Advantage would be: More attention. Disadvantage might be that people at bitcointalk don't like it when their forum is "hijacked". What do you think?

I think we could ask them for advertising space and thus pay for the use of their services?

you mean pay the bitcointalk forum for a child board?  :o

Pay them for Ads that link to this forum rather than Ads that link to Butterfly Labs or other mining vendors?

It might be worth trying. Generally I think such advertisement only gets your attention if you know the brand anyway. I perceive most of the ads just as colored bars. But it could work with I3. The words Bitshare and Bounty in a blueish color scheme should work. Linking to a forum page where the intentions (getting bounties done, finding talent) and the referral bounty is explained. Also a good place to present I3 as moving forward, well funded etc. It shouldn't cost much anyway...

What could be done anyway is to post each bounty as an answer to my topic. I would relinquish the ref. bounties of course :) This way the post stays up always... Do topics get pushed also by editing? They could be edited to push...

I addition I would post some of the most important and best paid bounties on Bitcoin Forum > Bitcoin > Project Development to attract attention and also refer to other bounties at the bottom of the post. The text would just have to be copy pasted from the bitshares forum...

2438
General Discussion / Re: The BitShares Brand
« on: January 10, 2014, 11:13:56 pm »
I think that makes a lot of sense and is perfectly sound.

But consider that Bitcoin (or BITCOIN respectively) being referred as a generic term for all crypto currencies comes from Bitcoin being the de facto standard. There was no marketing that implemented that...

The challenge here is to on the one hand not confuse the average user with 5 different meanings of the same word (Bitshares) but at the same time implement what you just presented. The first thing has no. 1 priority short to medium term. The latter might evolve a bit on its own if bitshares de facto grows to where it would earn to be referred as the standard in crypto equity.

The conclusion would be: Follow your hidden agenda of Bitshares' perception ex- or implicitly as long as it doesn't confuse people and deter anyone from using it. 

2439
General Discussion / Re: Is bounty way for development a good way?
« on: January 10, 2014, 08:14:40 pm »
...it would also be possible to announce every single bounty on bitcointalk. Advantage would be: More attention. Disadvantage might be that people at bitcointalk don't like it when their forum is "hijacked". What do you think?

I think we could ask them for advertising space and thus pay for the use of their services?

you mean pay the bitcointalk forum for a child board?  :o

2440
General Discussion / Re: Is bounty way for development a good way?
« on: January 10, 2014, 06:54:32 pm »
...it would also be possible to announce every single bounty on bitcointalk. Advantage would be: More attention. Disadvantage might be that people at bitcointalk don't like it when their forum is "hijacked". What do you think?

2441
General Discussion / Re: Is bounty way for development a good way?
« on: January 10, 2014, 06:34:54 pm »
I did some advertisement on bitcointalk of I3 bounties in general, see https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=408981.msg4433910#msg4433910
Hope this is sound as it is...

2442
So does this bounty include the wording for the website (respectively for all the websites) as well? And the team would have to organize the texting as well as the web design? And the bounty is given as a whole to the person or team that delivers a website with text that is ready to be released? And then the team has to arrange itself how the bounty is split up? Or is it just the graphic design and the structure of the website (and its sub-sites)?

2443
This has potential. 

So the Invictus site starts with the movement while a BitShares site introduces a cross-tradable product line and other sites hit the visitor with just the business interface of each of the individual DACs?

So each site focuses on the interests and needs of a particular type of visitor rather than hitting everybody with every idea in parallel?

If you are coming to the Invictus site, you are interested in the problems we are addressing and the underpinning solutions we are pursuing.

If you are at the BitShares site, you are interested in investing, speculating and trading crypto-equities or at least learning all about the value propositions of the variety we sponsor.

If you are at the Lucky Robot Casino site, you just want to play bingo and don't care that it is run by BitShares, LKS?

Cross links tie them all together near the bottom.

plus a short explanation at the bottom or a link that directs you to a place where it is explained how everything is linked together. To make the user see that everything is transparent and that the different sites are there to simplify the explanation and not there to disguise something by making it difficult to see how everything is linked

2444
BitShares PTS / Re: Exchanges
« on: January 10, 2014, 12:30:34 am »
The google translator German is horrible!! Better keep it in English for the German audience. The people that would buy PTS speak enough English to get it... Its seems super cheap and like collecting money for a ponzi this way! Its a grammatical disaster and you don't really get what PTS/i3 is about...
Haha just realized that are some dutch parts as well :)

2445
General Discussion / Re: How do you predict bitshares catching on?
« on: January 09, 2014, 11:32:11 pm »
I would expect users to migrate through existing services once a solid foundation of trust is established. There will be no overnight transition but we will first see the ever growing crypto-community first to adopt. Every second, a new business accepts BTC. See this overstock post highlighting BTS practicality. https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=2115.0

The whole industry is growing rapidly.

 There has already been high level discussion indicating the current foreign exchange market outdated, due for redesign. The problem is nobody knows how.
The global financial/network system is evolving in many ways. Invictus are light years ahead.

Once Bitshares becomes officially announced, things will really heat up. Just through current AGS price you can gauge a decent perspective. Right now I would say BTS are underground. The world knows of the bitcoin and some litecoin but no bitshare. True that only a small fraction of the crypto-community is aware. In 6 months it will be a whole new world.
 

Possibly within this period a number of large exchanges will be offering crypto-fiat (cryptsy is not far off). Although this will not be the only direct input, it will certainly benefit all cryptos. Perhaps Invictus have something up the sleeve? I do not fully understand the plans but I can piece enough together to know I need AGS/PTS.

At first I would imagine an illiquid market. One where a few G's or BTC's could wash the market in any desired direction. Just like some micro alts at the moment. I wouldn't think it long until the market establishes a true price. It will certainly be interesting.

I agree Invictus is ahead in conceptual thinking about the potential of the DAC the industry. But that is NOT enough. I am also trying to establish a company/service that is, like bitshares/DACs/bitcoin, much about the network and its effect. And apart from the capability of doing something (the technology) you need to burn a lot of money (branding, marketing, running without profit for long) to get the mass needed to get an even a bigger mass and therefore massive profits. So I suggest to look for a partner with reputation in the financial industry or any kind of reputation and money, especially because this is open source and anyone else with more money to burn and a known reputation in the financial industry could take your software and do it. Now this is a good moment because no code has been released that would be sufficient to just copy and re-brand. Is that actually true?

Is is possible with only ripple to get ripple for fiat. As far as I understand ripple you would have to have your bank use ripple too. Is that right? For mainstream adaption direct fiat<->BTS exchange is a must.

In the end, for mainstream adaption, you might need some money and backing form people well respected in the financial industry (e.g. some VC company specialized in the financial sector or a partner bank or so) to gain a reputation in the financial industry and get media coverage. Keep in mind that even if the future of banking and trading goes without trust, right now trust and reputation is everything or a least a lot. Also ripple has gotten most of its media coverage through google ventures funding. I know that the words bank and old money are ideological daemons in the crypto community and I am not a big fan either but that doesnt matter. Do you really believe the old money/financial industry will just let you pass? As soon as they realize this is the future a battle will begin and it will be fought with all cruelty needed. Its I3 with the advantages experience in the field and being first against big rebrand company/bank with the advantages money and reputation in mainstream society (mainstream is what matters for success obviously). I like being romantic about taking your rights back and conquering corrupted institutions and this will actually work regarding privacy with keyhotee and DACs providing all kinds if services but when you enter an extreeemly well established market you need to play by the rules of war (in a certain respect; play by rules doesn't mean you obey!) You need to play out your advantages and partner up to compensate for your weaknesses. Just don't make the mistake to not prepare for the fight and the realities of it.

Maybe its not that extreme :) but the more valid your concept is and the more success you have the more will this play a role. Prepare! Finding a good team fast that can keep up with the success and the demand is a point of failure and a well known partner with an established recruiting mechanisms and lots of connections is crucial here as well. 

When I think Bitshares, I should thinking - 'Well funded, proven track record, simple, clear, exciting, user-friendly' as opposed to how I think Bitshares/AGS may now appear to newbies which is 'exciting, interesting' but also 'slightly confusing, muddled, complicated, lagging behind'
That is a good summary of what it should look like marketing wise and what it appears atm

I would also employ the services of a professional marketing/branding company if the funds were available.

You could get this for free by telling the branding company to get PTS worth the increase of PTS that goes along with thier branding efforts. You could arrange something like: The branding company gets 10% (or whatever) of the profit from value increase of all PTS I3 owns for the time of one year. Big corporations make (or at least they should) the variable compensation of CEOs (that among other things depends on the increase of the share price) depending on how the company's share developed compared to an index. You could do the same and make the payout depending on a comparison with the top 10 Crypto Currencies.
I will share some more thoughts on a branding strategy soon...

I think the approach of focusing on one asset first makes sense.

Who uses Proof of burn?

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