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Messages - nmywn

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136
General Discussion / Re: Brainstorm - Bit20 MSSR / margin call
« on: January 15, 2017, 12:56:09 pm »
Little update: I was able to borrow  BTWTY with real min collateral ratio. SQP  *  MCR  requirement sits at GUI level.
Just edit this line:
https://github.com/cryptonomex/graphene-ui/blob/master/web/app/components/Modal/BorrowModal.jsx#L191


137
General Discussion / Re: Brainstorm - Bit20 MSSR / margin call
« on: January 14, 2017, 06:17:29 pm »

Those facts come from my margin call experiment:

I confirm that I was still NOT margin called at 176% of collateralization.
Once at 175% I was margin called.
I could not borrow BTWTY with less than 192.5% of collateralization.

So ok.
 
Quote from: EstefanTT
Are you sure that the margin call is not  triggered simply when collateral reach MCR * Price feed ? So currently 175% of the price feed.

I've done calculations based at real numbers in GUI margin dialog box. I Did it under false assumption that docs can be outdated, but working product for sure not. Also ignored fact that dialog box works as described  in outdated docs. In that case:

There is actually no point to require minimum 192% (MCR*MSSR) starting collateral anymore. Before change in shorting rules (with old rules which are given in documentation) it did make sense, because margin call could be triggered at this threshold. Now minimum collateral can be set to MCR.

I must totally agree.

138
General Discussion / Re: Brainstorm - Bit20 MSSR / margin call
« on: January 13, 2017, 12:07:38 am »

If I set the MSSR at 140% and keep the MCR at 175% :

1) The minimum collateral to borrow a BTWTY will be at 245% ( 140 * 175 ) ?
2) Is there a way to avoid asking for so much collateral ?
3) The margin call will be triggered at 175% of the price  ?
4) I won't trigger any margin call by increasing the MSSR because they will be triggered at 175% of the price feed ?
5) Once someone has less than 175% collateral, he will be margin call and its order will sit at 140% of the price feed ?
6) The price at which the margin call order sit in the market move with the price feed ?
//Current situation
The minimum collateral (which is amount of BTS): Feed price * (1.1 *1.75) * DEBT .
Shorter's  ammount of BTS in deposit must be higher than that. Otherwise margin call is triggered for him.
This means If you w'ont trigger any margin calls your (newX  * newY) outcome can't be higher than current (1.1 *1.75). Increasing "1.1" while decreasing "1.75" looks like the only option.  In other hand, MCR can't go to low if market is unstable and illiquid. Something for something, not much place for changes.

Your margin call trigger price:  COLLATERAL  /  DEBT / (1.1 * 1.75)          //not displayed in dialog box, I think it should be.
current margin call order price: 1.1 * Feed price                                      // current yellow order price, if happen
Your margin call order price:  1.1 * Your margin call trigger price               // your yellow order price in the future.

COLLATERAL is  ammount of deposited BTS

You can check those equations by playing with BTWTY Margin  dialog box.

139
General Discussion / Re: btsbots wallet release v0.0.1
« on: January 11, 2017, 02:17:44 pm »
I need a bot that can use Poloniex as current price source. How i can do that?

140
Meta / Re: What happened to trading discussion?
« on: January 10, 2017, 06:45:44 pm »

141
General Discussion / Re: Any non spam posts I should read here?
« on: January 10, 2017, 06:42:33 pm »
Hi [member=1532]mf-tzo[/member] . Every now and then I wonder about brownies too. I have a fair few of them, but am not hodling my breath expecting anything to come from them. Sometimes I wonder if I would even find out if [member=5]bytemaster[/member] did decide to do something with them. He's not posted on this forum since May, and I'm not interested in Steem...
I wish there were an alert I could sign up to in case there's any brownie news/action.

By the way, if I wanted to keep up to date with what Dan Larimer is up to nowadays, is it the Stem platform I'd need to go to? Does he still blog?

Yeah... He's pumping his next project over there.  Something about Universal Basic Income.  The lemmings are eating it up.

Do you have a link? I'd love to read that. Pretty sure I predicted he'd be on to a new project right about now.
Maybe this one
https://steemit.com/blockchain/@dantheman/a-better-approach-to-turing-complete-smart-contracts

142
General Discussion / Re: Brainstorm - Bit20 MSSR / margin call
« on: January 07, 2017, 04:42:25 pm »
I understand it this way:
SQP ( Squeeze protection price) is 10%, force buying back discount range.
At 175% collateral x 1.1(SQP) =192% to feed price, marging call trigers buying back in 175-192% range, meaning, if for instance in bitBTC market:
BTS/bitBTC feed price is 250,000 or bitBTC/BTS is 0.00000400, everyone who owns 1 bitBTC needs to lock 250,000x192%=480,000 colateral.
If it doesn't have enough , then it is forced to buy back bitBTC in price range of 1.1x250,000=275,000 - 250,000 BTS/bitBTC
or 0.000003636-0.00000400 bitBTC/BTS price range.
As feed price moves down, SQP moves with it through order book.
Yeah, me too.

So in case BTWTY, something extreme like this would do the job:
 SQP aka MSSR  = 1.5
MCR = 1.1 (or even lower)
It will force shorters to cover called positions at whatever price market offer up to 1.5 * feed price.
What if market selling higher than 1.5*feed? It's mean SQP is to low and ASSET is no longer covered, because margin calls cannot be executed.
In my opinion SQP is the thing to mess around.

Edit: This may not work. MCR should not be set lower than MSSR, because in this case the situation is possible when there is not enough collateral to buy margin call order at SQP price. Correct me if I am wrong.
Just thinking.
SQP  must be higher  than average  market  price/feed price ratio -  it is a must  to  execute margin calls.
MCR  can take a role of buffor only if first condition is meet. Otherwise it's  useless. Collateral sits there but can't be really used.
For USD or CNY condition  price / feed < SQP is true

I can't see why MCR can't be lower than SQP.
Lets assume:
my position: 1 ASSET at feed price = 100 BTS
market price: 140 BTS
SQP: 2
MCR: 1
CR= SQP * MCR = 2

So margin call triggers at feed price = 100
I have 200 BTS in colateral deposit. Enough to make an order that will be executed.

But it would maybe inflate market price even more as nothing prevents from manipulation against shorters.

This is how I understand the documentation with the current parameters:

MCR = Minimum Collateral Ration = 175%
MSSR = Maximum Short Squeeze Ratio = 110% (SQPR in the doc)
PF = Price Feed
CR = Collateral Ratio
  • You can NOT open a short position with a CR inferior to 192.5% (1.1 * 175%)
  • You get margin called when your CR goes to 175%
  • Your margin call will sit at 110% of the PF
^Correct me if I'm wrong


I think you're wrong. Margin call wil trigger if your collateral < 192.5% - that's why you cannot open position.


143
General Discussion / Re: Brainstorm - Bit20 MSSR / margin call
« on: January 06, 2017, 03:56:28 pm »
I suppose that the  current "yellow" order will stay in orderbook even if  SQP will change. Just guessing.
What is wrong with conclusion that BTWTY is currently in the ongoing black swan event.

I mean, some conditions is meet and without intervention there is 50% chance  for black swan. that is pretty high.
Why conditions is meet: Because market settings were not adequate to market conditions
How to get out of troubles: If ( settings changes will not affect previous orders ), then
                                                                  market intervention and change settings
                                                      else
                                                                   change settings


One last edit while I'm thinking more about:
  I don't understand why holders aren't selling? Holders belive that price will go up, but if this happen they get rect by black swan and as long as i know we don't have mechanism (yet) to cover holders even at loos. So while price of ASSET is rising, after black swan they get nothing or better to say minus 100%.

144
General Discussion / Re: Brainstorm - Bit20 MSSR / margin call
« on: January 06, 2017, 01:58:49 pm »
I understand it this way:
SQP ( Squeeze protection price) is 10%, force buying back discount range.
At 175% collateral x 1.1(SQP) =192% to feed price, marging call trigers buying back in 175-192% range, meaning, if for instance in bitBTC market:
BTS/bitBTC feed price is 250,000 or bitBTC/BTS is 0.00000400, everyone who owns 1 bitBTC needs to lock 250,000x192%=480,000 colateral.
If it doesn't have enough , then it is forced to buy back bitBTC in price range of 1.1x250,000=275,000 - 250,000 BTS/bitBTC
or 0.000003636-0.00000400 bitBTC/BTS price range.
As feed price moves down, SQP moves with it through order book.
Yeah, me too.

So in case BTWTY, something extreme like this would do the job:
 SQP aka MSSR  = 1.5
MCR = 1.1 (or even lower)
It will force shorters to cover called positions at whatever price market offer up to 1.5 * feed price.
What if market selling higher than 1.5*feed? It's mean SQP is to low and ASSET is no longer covered, because margin calls cannot be executed.
In my opinion SQP is the thing to mess around.

145
Your account name (nickname) is your "deposit" address.

147
General Discussion / Re: Brainstorm - Bit20 MSSR / margin call
« on: January 05, 2017, 08:08:26 pm »
And if condition for margin call is met, it does not take the best sell offer event if there is liquidity. I have a hard time to understand why is it done this way.
but in docs:
 The squeeze protection price acts as a price ceiling, meaning the forced margin order will not execute at a very high price in an illiquid market.

148
General Discussion / Re: btsbots wallet release v0.0.1
« on: January 04, 2017, 04:23:42 pm »
Great news.

149
General Discussion / Re: The War on Cash is Over, They Won!
« on: January 04, 2017, 04:01:53 pm »
Read the same article this morning, what are these politicians thinking?  When are the next elections in Greece?

Who is going to stop them from imposing a new tax in every fiat transfer from and to bitcoin exchanges? with cash banned in a few years isn't it game over for crypto?  Add to that that all the population will be trained in the use of plastic money which is orders of magnitute easier to use than any crypto out there. I wish I'm wrong but I can't see anything good out of this.
Hopfully in the near future you can easily put youy cryto on a plastic card and spend it that way. For now it would be a good idea to get all the cryto you can afford. Also find ways to get paid in crypto.
[/quote]

People will need a tool that allow making business out of government view. I'm not talking only about criminals. Many people just can't even afford to pay taxes, they'll need new cash or their low living standard must go even lower. They can't go back to barter.

150
General Discussion / Re: The War on Cash is Over, They Won!
« on: January 03, 2017, 09:27:16 pm »
Great News. Right in time to support Bitcoin pump.

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