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Messages - abit

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3301
Technical Support / Re: Are fees for creating UIAs burned ?
« on: January 16, 2016, 05:31:03 am »
When we create UIA we pay minimum 5k fee , I wonder if those are burnt or what?
Half of them went to your UIA's fee pool. The other half went to (system) reserved pool https://cryptofresh.com/reserve.

3302
Still no updates and the milestones have stood still...

Is it possible to vote out a worker?
Sure. Just vote against it.

3303
General Discussion / Re: Cryptofresh Block Explorer + MUSE now available
« on: January 16, 2016, 04:46:34 am »
@roadscape Is it ok to make a remark on the fee schedule page, so that people will know that canceling an order will get fully refund of fees for created the order?

3304
General Discussion / Re: Reasons for Lowering Fees
« on: January 15, 2016, 09:43:53 am »
Set a special kind of account. User pays a fee to get it similar to lifetime membership. Has extremely low fees. Only allows small transactions. That allows for micro payments. Still can be used to spam the network though.

Maybe add some kind of restriction where those type of accounts can perform more than X amount of transactions per second. 1 per second seems fine by now. Only way to spam the network would be to have 1000s of accounts of that type and have them all perform transactions at the same time but if members have to pay a fee to register then that makes the attack way way more difficult. No one will pay a fee of 5k bts or 10k bts thousands of times.

This also doesnt make life time membership obsolete since it still has more advantages like no restriction on the amount of bts per transaction, referral program, etc members could even have them both on the same account
This is interesting.

That's very interesting.
It can be easily implemented (I hope) and can be easily explained to the user.
It's perhaps not practicable.
From my personal experience, an average Joe doesn't want to pay a fee in advance if don't know how much will spend on fees in the future. People intend to spend less money now and care less about costs in the future, that's why installment loans have market.
A common user of a bank will be always charged a fee if she withdraw from other bank's ATM, but a premium user won't be charged since she has already paid a higher annual fee or similar. So rich people are more likely to pay for a premium, but actually they care less about fees in micro payments. On opposite, the ones who have more needs on micro payments are less likely to pay for a premium in advance.

3306
Technical Support / Re: On Open Ledger
« on: January 15, 2016, 12:00:30 am »
yes wallet unlocked but I keep getting this

Failed to broadcast the transaction:
Transaction was not signed. Do you have a private key? [no_signers
There is an account name left to the lock icon,  make sure it's your account, if it's not, click it and select your account. It will change if you ever clicked on someone else (from your account history or explore->accounts) before enter the trade page.

3307
中文 (Chinese) / Re: BTS2.0 代码底层类简谈.
« on: January 14, 2016, 11:49:57 pm »
唉!我是技术盲,以前写教程,都是看你们讨论,把讨论结果归纳起来,就成一篇文章了。现在你们很少集中讨论,我就跟不上了。顺便问一下,把vc++6.0的基础教程看几遍,能阅读懂bts的源代码么?
我不记得vc++6.0的基础教程里面有些什么了。你可以试试。估计有点困难。

3308
General Discussion / Re: Reasons for Lowering Fees
« on: January 14, 2016, 11:09:37 pm »
Set a special kind of account. User pays a fee to get it similar to lifetime membership. Has extremely low fees. Only allows small transactions. That allows for micro payments. Still can be used to spam the network though.

Maybe add some kind of restriction where those type of accounts can perform more than X amount of transactions per second. 1 per second seems fine by now. Only way to spam the network would be to have 1000s of accounts of that type and have them all perform transactions at the same time but if members have to pay a fee to register then that makes the attack way way more difficult. No one will pay a fee of 5k bts or 10k bts thousands of times.

This also doesnt make life time membership obsolete since it still has more advantages like no restriction on the amount of bts per transaction, referral program, etc members could even have them both on the same account
This is interesting.

3309
General Discussion / Re: Cryptofresh Block Explorer + MUSE now available
« on: January 14, 2016, 10:53:49 pm »
All memos sent to this account will now be readable on cryptofresh.  If you want to be able to read them within your wallet.  You will need to import the memo private key into your wallet.  Off of memory that is click the options button.  Cick the very bottom button, its called account management console or something like that.  Then click import key, and paste that key in.
What's the private key then?  ;)

Another issue, I suspect that once you changed memo_key, you will not be able to read the memos before the change.

3310
BitShares is about freedom .. no wait to force anyone to do anything ..

It is also a risky thing to have their assets locked away as collateral

Could we have a rule that an exchange must keep say %10 or %20 of their volume in collateral for BTAs? Just like banks have to maintain a reserve.

No one is forcing them to do anything, I believe that was just a suggestion, even if we agreed with that, it would ultimately be up to the exchanges to decide..

Still, I think it's way easier for them to have their btc for example, in a multi sig account managed by the exchanges participating. This would mean it's in everyone's interest not to mess things up and they could be easily monitored among themselves and by users too. And it's simple.

Thing is while we don't sort these kind of details first, it will be harder to get liquidity. Instead even if we manage them to join we'll most likely have a bunch of illiquid markets, plus we still have the risk factor of them going rogue.
If all exchanges put their (real) BTC in a multi-sig account, they're less likely to go rogue. They will monitor each other. And also the IOU issuer's account would be a multi-sig one which is anti-rogue.

However, although it's not hard to multi-sig a BTC account, imo it's much harder to multi-sig fiat accounts. In addition, is it possible to multi-sig accounts of LTC, DOGE and so? In the end maybe we can have a shared BTS/BTC market, but no other pairs.

Seems we're discussing a global (IOU of)BTC central bank schema.

3311
General Discussion / Re: Bitshares price discussion
« on: January 14, 2016, 11:14:13 am »
Now NXT is on fire... I wonder how long until we fall out of the top 20?

Why? That doesn't make much sense imo. It's all pumps. Guess where the volume comes from? That's right, China again.

I think the question is more like "I wonder how long ultil we get pumped?" Given the news on how the chinese markets are I wish this is a sign of more coming in. They're just pumps but hopefully they can revive the alt coin scene.

If these pumps continue until March, if we don't get one in the meanwhile, we'll get one then due to STEALTH. It's just another reason for them to pump bts.

Still, in the long run this doesn't really mean anything unless it's a sign more chinese money is coming in.

No one care about STEALTH enough to risk their money to pump it .
别渣渣了,快上车

3312
General Discussion / Re: Graphene GUI testing and feedback
« on: January 14, 2016, 11:03:00 am »
@svk @valzav are we going to be able to view markets in the webwallet without having an account? Then we can finally share links to BitShares markets and get altcoin traders interested.

As you know clicking on a market here https://bitshares.openledger.info/#/explorer/markets without an account takes you to the register page, which is dumb. It means that viral growth for BitShares is impossible.
True it's possible. The real question is when will we have it.

3313
中文 (Chinese) / Re: BTS2.0 代码底层类简谈.
« on: January 14, 2016, 11:00:23 am »
谢谢分享。

agree:你玩bts这么久还不知道代码是用什么写的?底层代码是C++,界面是reactjs

3314
Although Bitshares 2.0 already has prediction market backend, its frontend should be more developed.

We can have "Prediction Market" tab in the current wallet. But I think it would be much better to additionally have separated, simple, and light application only for prediction market. Some unrelated functions (voting, permission, explorer, trading, etc.) can be removed and the app only has transfer and prediction market functions.

What do you think?

Isn't that something to service providers who want to make a business out of Prediction Markets?

I question this too.  For example, why does the community pay for GUI development (in openledger I presume) but ccedk receive all the referral income?
ccedk doesn't receive all the referral income. Anyone can host a wallet and set up a referral system.

The community pays for the general wallet development, but anyone is welcome to take the general wallet and offer a customized version (or offer their customizations back to the general wallet if they want to share the changes and the community finds them acceptable). Both of these use cases are occurring, from what I've heard.
It's a bit off topic, but OpenLedger.info is currently the only "official" one with a link from https://bitshares.org/. To be fair, at least we need to list all alternatives on our website and/or forum, like https://bitcoin.org/en/choose-your-wallet.

By the way, our "paid" GUI development coordinator, @wmbutler, is much less active these days. See https://github.com/wmbutler?tab=activity. Should we push him a little, or vote him down?

3315
My explanation of "why" was dismissed as "Don't use big marketing paragraph when you speak to developer".
That's what I wrote above "you drawn a huge pie", yes, it looks like a drawn pie, not a real one.  ;)

Here's another way of explaining it in terms of our growing understanding of this particular exchange's Way of Thinking. I'd like to get your opinions on it before I forward it to him...

Since you are first and foremost a technical developer, why not work with us to design the world's first exchange network?
Help us optimize the design until it's too good to resist using yourself.  Here's a sample of what we've got so far: 
My question (as if I'm an exchange) would be: if you can't help us, why would we help you? Or say, they are less motivated if we say we need their help to build something, we should (be able to) say we already have something and if they join they'll be benefited (Of course they need some efforts to be able to join).

Quote
From a technical perspective, a decentralized exchange has access to the orders of all member exchanges and the ability to execute atomic trades via a single neutral trading engine resident on a shared blockchain.  Here’s the mother lode of  “simple” technical data:  http://docs.bitshares.org/bitshares/user/dex.html

As you pointed out, an exchange can emulate this using a bot talking via APIs to the trading engines of many exchanges, but race conditions and conflicts are inevitable.  On a common decentralized blockchain platform like BitShares, trades are finalized in one atomic 3-second block, no matter which exchange initiated the offer.  No race conditions are possible.

When you all place your orders under the control of the same neutral exchange engine, you get instant atomic arbitrage across all asset pairs. 

Then it gets interesting.

As an exchange you routinely issue your users what amounts to IOU-USD or IOU-BTC or IOU-DOGE “virtual-assets” to trade with on your exchange.  You take their real USD and BTC and DOGE at the door (just like always) and let them trade with your exchanges "IOU" assets like poker chips until it’s time to check out.  They trust your reputation that you will always reliably redeem their poker chips when it is time to cash out.  So your IOU assets are backed by your reputation. 
These paragraphs make sense. But maybe not so attractive.

Quote
Why not make your reputation a globally tradable commodity?  As it grows, more people prefer to hold your asset as their reserve currency.  And you earn fees every time they use your global reserve currency.

Now what if your reserve currency tokens were good in many other exchanges and you got transaction fees from everyone using your currency?  Transfers between member exchanges is a simple matter of exchanging IOU tokens, bypassing all the slow non-real-time blockchains out there.  And giving your customers another reason to do all their business with you.
These make less sense for me. It's not an exchange's core business.

Quote
As a customer, my assets can take advantage of arbitrage opportunities between member exchanges in a twinkling of an eye.  People taking the slow bot route get left in the dust or find that their assets are sitting on the wrong exchange when they need to move quickly.  Not so on the common real-time trading platform powered by BitShares.
Something wrong here. Tell these to users but not exchanges.
Cross-exchange business (or arbitrage opportunities) is not which an exchange would focus on, it's more attractive to traders.
With a shared order book there will be less arbitrage opportunities.

Quote
Thinking as an innovative developer, you have a unique opportunity to help work out the details of the world’s first network of exchanges. 

Right now, there are just two exchanges involved so far - CCEDK’s OpenLedger and BitShares DEX.  Several other small exchanges have expressed intent to join but are not yet members.  You could be the second mature exchange partner working with OpenLedger and BitShares to optimize the network interoperability to make the benefits to member exchanges more compelling and obvious. 

When we have fully optimized the design to where CCEDK and C-DEX are both happy with the increased synergistic services we can each offer our own customers, then the three of us can go rolling up all the small exchanges as new partners.  This will increase our collective apparent size, making membership more attractive to even bigger exchanges.

Like a rolling stone.

So, since you think like a developer looking for a new edge, why not work with us and help invent the only exchange network the world will ever need?  By the time the Big Exchanges wake up, they'll be asking to join us.
Yes "an innovative developer" may be attracted by these words, but a "conservative" developer would refuse them. I don't know whether you know you're talking to whom.


Here I listed some brief Q&A's, wish we can improve them together:

Questions from an exchange and answers to them:
1. I want more volume / users / profit / influence
--> shared order book

2. I don't want to send users elsewhere
--> self designed/hosted GUI (Website and/or mobile app)

3. I want more security
--> user data and trading data on blockchain, so don't need to worry about database-hack
--> (unavoidable) if host a GUI, need to make sure it's secure.

4. I want less risk
--> you don't need to issue IOUs which need to be guaranteed by yourself *ALONE*, other member exchanges will share your risk
--> (unavoidable) with BitShares you still have to manage the equities deposited by your customer

5. I want lower cost
--> less maintenance cost on market engine, databases if use BitShares blockchain and market engine

6. How to migrate to BitShares (required efforts/changes on my system)

7. The cost of migration?

8. Risks of migration?

9. Difference / Pros and cons between self-issued assets and shared assets?

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